all that Blizzard did was copy and pasted ideas and techniques from other games, pity they overlook SWG(pre-cu) the greatest combat system ever, and then they slapped on a super easy user-system so anyone could jump in and play. And thats why so many people play. Not to mention WoW emulates a single player game in the fact that it doesn't have anymore player community than a single player with online features has. The only thing WoW did right was the easy playing factor(if they're goal was to make money), i just hope that not all games will follow this, i prefer playing games that are a challenge, i'd rather not have a 'I win' button that you spam
Blizzard has already stated that they wanted to make a game that was easy for people to "get into" without having any MMO experience. On top of that, they have said that they were not trying to reinvent the wheel but wanted to take mmo conventions, analyze them and then make them more stratightforward and understandable.
And all companies want to make money. You don't make money you don't have jobs, you can't continue to make the products you want to make.
Last I looked, there were no non profit game companies (that I know of).
The issue that WoW has is that it is too easy to get to "end game" for people who actively play a lot. Because of this you ended up with the whole "raid" issue. When a game is more PvE based it is hard to keep up with new and interesting content.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
If this game and/or it's interface is a "cousin of WOW's" it has already turned me off. WOW is the worst thing ever to happen to MMO's. So far no game has done MMORPG as good as (let alone better than) DAOC IMO.
I'm curious, as devoted MMO players, what do you guys think it will take to bring a game to the next level? What IS the next level? And, finally, has the over popularity of the ultra dumbed down WOW permenantly gimped the wonderful world of MMO's?
I don't see any problem with various mmos using similar User Interfaces. It benefits everyone if you can easily get over the simple things like "how do I move my character, where should I look for combat keys and inventory slots and options menus...etc."
I think where each game can distinguish itself is:
The world and its story. Are there varying landmasses and terrains that add to the story and make combat more interesting and challenging?
Do you have freedom to choose your own path through the game or are you stuck along a "rail".
Are there a variety of ways you can gain experience and success in your chosen class/profession?
Is there a good balance between solo, small group and large group play?
Are there alternatives to combat that are fun and useful?
If there is a crafting system in game, can you be a dedicated crafter who can either make better or more unique items than can be had from loot? Is there a mechanism in place for you to offer your goods and services at a fair price that does not force you to always sell at a loss of your own time, cost and effort? Is creativity rewarded?
Are guilds supported in such a way that they can effectively communicate as a group to people offline as well as online? Are there guild halls where people can easily drop off items and resources for other guild members to help members of all levels?
Just a note on WOW and EQ2: I'm trying them both, but it is a struggle. They are very cute, but seem saccharine looks wise which is in direct contrast to the deeper than the deepest gutter mentality evident in WOW's ooc. Good Grief! I'm going to force myself to get to a level 20 in each, just to be fair in my appraisal, because I agree you don't generally see the real game till then (pretty large design flaw), but yech they are both maddening.
After all that years i play mmorpg and kind of rpg game, only thing i can say, its most of them are same and made without new idea. Personnaly i played Wow, the graphics and gameplay are good,but after some day of playing u realise you waste your time. Soo much game base himself on rpg and cant even respect the theme. Wow are an adventure game and are far then a rpg. Have u ever tried to do rpg in rpg server? What a suprise when people say to you u idiot cause you acting like a role and no one playing a role on server. Wow have nothing more then a beautiful graphic, everything else are like any other mmorpg i played before. Wow are dangerous for young people. I tried Dongeon&Dragon, same thing no one playing a role. Dongeon&dragon, i cant beleive the creator of role-playing make a game like other game, where no dm present and no interactive history, no role-playing. I personnaly thing mmorpg are under bad evolution and will be bored in some.
From what I have seen from the LOTRO comunity they are huge into roleplaying. So I think there will be servers where people will be in character, maby not 100% of the time but 90% and the last 10% will be in pm's. That is just my opion cuz I see tons of RP groups on other LOTRO boards.
they are not emulating wow, in fact i don't think there is a mmorpg out there that emulates wow, all mmorpg's are similar, nothing you can do about it, grinding, questing, leveling, gaining skills, these are what makes a mmorpg playable, how else you gonna keep few hundred thousand or million people busy till expansion ?
the difference between the mmorpgs is what makes each one unique.
SWG - housing, great character customisation, housing / cities, entertainers ( unussual class ), AWSOME crafting system etc ..
DDO - ingame voice, excellent skill system, OUT OF THIS WORLD combat system, excellent LFG system etc ..
WoW - easy to play, designed in such a way that 90% of players don't even have ball hairs yet... and unfortunetly they out number the older players by 10 000 to 1 .. thus 6.9 million players are under 14 years old and 100k middle aged players.
Lotro will most likely have grinding, questing, dungeons run etc just like all the others. it is features like MPVP and the ability to form bands ( buy instruments and sit in a group and chill while playing tunes ), HUGE continents to explore, unique monsters from the books, excellent story line and such that will set it apart from others. I just really hope we don't get alot of children spamming the channels with crap ... that killed wow for me ...
anyway, i am open minded and will not put the game down before i have tried it like most idiots do ... i hope they make a success of it.
they are not emulating wow, in fact i don't think there is a mmorpg out there that emulates wow, all mmorpg's are similar, nothing you can do about it, grinding, questing, leveling, gaining skills, these are what makes a mmorpg playable, how else you gonna keep few hundred thousand or million people busy till expansion ? the difference between the mmorpgs is what makes each one unique. SWG - housing, great character customisation, housing / cities, entertainers ( unussual class ), AWSOME crafting system etc .. DDO - ingame voice, excellent skill system, OUT OF THIS WORLD combat system, excellent LFG system etc .. WoW - easy to play, designed in such a way that 90% of players don't even have ball hairs yet... and unfortunetly they out number the older players by 10 000 to 1 .. thus 6.9 million players are under 14 years old and 100k middle aged players. Lotro will most likely have grinding, questing, dungeons run etc just like all the others. it is features like MPVP and the ability to form bands ( buy instruments and sit in a group and chill while playing tunes ), HUGE continents to explore, unique monsters from the books, excellent story line and such that will set it apart from others. I just really hope we don't get alot of children spamming the channels with crap ... that killed wow for me ... anyway, i am open minded and will not put the game down before i have tried it like most idiots do ... i hope they make a success of it.
DDO
Gameplay - Linerar; wait at tavern, go on quest, loot and sell. Nothing else to do.
Social Panel - Actually cause lag because it takes a while to load on the names in.
Combat system is horrible because it bugged. (The dice will not appear at times and other players have noted this too.) and the cpu A.I is random.
Skill - Most of the skills except Haggle only work in dungeons. Jump and Tumble can be used outside a dungeon, but have no affect.
First off to the OP - your using the alias 'Gallant', my former alias being Ghallant from back in the day, oh yes I was quite the asshole. So - choose your alias wisely next time because the name Ghallant still stirs up some issues.
they are not emulating wow, in fact i don't think there is a mmorpg out there that emulates wow, all mmorpg's are similar, nothing you can do about it, grinding, questing, leveling, gaining skills, these are what makes a mmorpg playable, how else you gonna keep few hundred thousand or million people busy till expansion ? the difference between the mmorpgs is what makes each one unique. SWG - housing, great character customisation, housing / cities, entertainers ( unussual class ), AWSOME crafting system etc .. DDO - ingame voice, excellent skill system, OUT OF THIS WORLD combat system, excellent LFG system etc .. WoW - easy to play, designed in such a way that 90% of players don't even have ball hairs yet... and unfortunetly they out number the older players by 10 000 to 1 .. thus 6.9 million players are under 14 years old and 100k middle aged players. Lotro will most likely have grinding, questing, dungeons run etc just like all the others. it is features like MPVP and the ability to form bands ( buy instruments and sit in a group and chill while playing tunes ), HUGE continents to explore, unique monsters from the books, excellent story line and such that will set it apart from others. I just really hope we don't get alot of children spamming the channels with crap ... that killed wow for me ... anyway, i am open minded and will not put the game down before i have tried it like most idiots do ... i hope they make a success of it.
they are not emulating wow, in fact i don't think there is a mmorpg out there that emulates wow, all mmorpg's are similar, nothing you can do about it, grinding, questing, leveling, gaining skills, these are what makes a mmorpg playable, how else you gonna keep few hundred thousand or million people busy till expansion ? the difference between the mmorpgs is what makes each one unique. SWG - housing, great character customisation, housing / cities, entertainers ( unussual class ), AWSOME crafting system etc .. DDO - ingame voice, excellent skill system, OUT OF THIS WORLD combat system, excellent LFG system etc .. WoW - easy to play, designed in such a way that 90% of players don't even have ball hairs yet... and unfortunetly they out number the older players by 10 000 to 1 .. thus 6.9 million players are under 14 years old and 100k middle aged players. Lotro will most likely have grinding, questing, dungeons run etc just like all the others. it is features like MPVP and the ability to form bands ( buy instruments and sit in a group and chill while playing tunes ), HUGE continents to explore, unique monsters from the books, excellent story line and such that will set it apart from others. I just really hope we don't get alot of children spamming the channels with crap ... that killed wow for me ... anyway, i am open minded and will not put the game down before i have tried it like most idiots do ... i hope they make a success of it.
Where do you get those statistics from? sterotyping by ppls actions is where LOL but yea wow is full of n00bs ignore them and and LOTRO hehe
Owner/Admin of GodlessGamer.com - Gaming news and reviews for the godless.
ROFL, not playing a game because the interface looks like something from another game? You do realize that 5 days after release there will be websites up all over the place with dozens of mods for customizing the UI if not completely changing it? I don't even remember what WoW and EQ2s default UIs looked like, and I'm sure I'll forget what Vanguard's UI looks like soon enough. It'll likely be no different for LotR.
People love to look at WoW as the Be all and End all of gaming. It's not. It wasn't a horrible game, it wasn't a great game. What it was was a new game that has, if nothing else, infused the gaming community with new blood. Yeah, yeah, yeah, they may be Disney Gamers in what used to be a R world, but some of these Disney Gamers have gone out to other games. And most of these Disney Gamers are hooked on MMOs now. It's just a matter of getting them to grow up into other games, and game developers are drooling over that. So if borrowing from the interface basics that WoW borrowed from every other game out there is part of "breakin' 'em in" so be it. Baby steps. It'll be a huge enough leap forward if we get MMOs that...oh, I don't know...EVOLVE somehow instead of sitting there saying "do this quest and this quest and then you're max level! Now go here and here and you've got all the cool stuff! Congrats, you pushed the I WIN button, go reroll!" {See EQ2, WoW}.
~~~~~~~~~ Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do.
I agree with eschient on this one, I played WoW for about a week and I got really bored, the graphics are good and all but its the fact its just so easy. But as eschient said the playerbase is moving onto new MMO's and well hopefully growing up at the same time. The problem I forsee is some of the players are going from WoW into a hardcore Korean grindfest of a MMO. The difference is huge from being able to get end-game in a few weeks of play on WoW to spending a few weeks to get a level on some Korean MMO's.
But lets take that out of the equation, so the now MMO addicted 13 year old kid who drewls over elves or something decides to go to I dont know lets say FF11. Now he/she has to actually work for the levels, spend time interacting with other players, learn how to stand on their own two feet when it comes to quests. Thats the make or break point, is he/she a true MMO gamer will he/she love the challenge or will he/she flame the game to all his/her friends cry about how hard it is and go back to WoW and create yet another character.
Or then theres the mystical third option, they go to programming websites and bug everybody about making their own MMORPG, or they get some weak arsed too like RealCrafter and make another WoW clone.
Comments
Blizzard has already stated that they wanted to make a game that was easy for people to "get into" without having any MMO experience. On top of that, they have said that they were not trying to reinvent the wheel but wanted to take mmo conventions, analyze them and then make them more stratightforward and understandable.
And all companies want to make money. You don't make money you don't have jobs, you can't continue to make the products you want to make.
Last I looked, there were no non profit game companies (that I know of).
The issue that WoW has is that it is too easy to get to "end game" for people who actively play a lot. Because of this you ended up with the whole "raid" issue. When a game is more PvE based it is hard to keep up with new and interesting content.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
I don't see any problem with various mmos using similar User Interfaces. It benefits everyone if you can easily get over the simple things like "how do I move my character, where should I look for combat keys and inventory slots and options menus...etc."
I think where each game can distinguish itself is:
The world and its story. Are there varying landmasses and terrains that add to the story and make combat more interesting and challenging?
Do you have freedom to choose your own path through the game or are you stuck along a "rail".
Are there a variety of ways you can gain experience and success in your chosen class/profession?
Is there a good balance between solo, small group and large group play?
Are there alternatives to combat that are fun and useful?
If there is a crafting system in game, can you be a dedicated crafter who can either make better or more unique items than can be had from loot? Is there a mechanism in place for you to offer your goods and services at a fair price that does not force you to always sell at a loss of your own time, cost and effort? Is creativity rewarded?
Are guilds supported in such a way that they can effectively communicate as a group to people offline as well as online? Are there guild halls where people can easily drop off items and resources for other guild members to help members of all levels?
Just a note on WOW and EQ2: I'm trying them both, but it is a struggle. They are very cute, but seem saccharine looks wise which is in direct contrast to the deeper than the deepest gutter mentality evident in WOW's ooc. Good Grief! I'm going to force myself to get to a level 20 in each, just to be fair in my appraisal, because I agree you don't generally see the real game till then (pretty large design flaw), but yech they are both maddening.
After all that years i play mmorpg and kind of rpg game, only thing i can say, its most of them are same and made without new idea. Personnaly i played Wow, the graphics and gameplay are good,but after some day of playing u realise you waste your time. Soo much game base himself on rpg and cant even respect the theme. Wow are an adventure game and are far then a rpg. Have u ever tried to do rpg in rpg server? What a suprise when people say to you u idiot cause you acting like a role and no one playing a role on server. Wow have nothing more then a beautiful graphic, everything else are like any other mmorpg i played before. Wow are dangerous for young people. I tried Dongeon&Dragon, same thing no one playing a role. Dongeon&dragon, i cant beleive the creator of role-playing make a game like other game, where no dm present and no interactive history, no role-playing. I personnaly thing mmorpg are under bad evolution and will be bored in some.
they are not emulating wow, in fact i don't think there is a mmorpg out there that emulates wow, all mmorpg's are similar, nothing you can do about it, grinding, questing, leveling, gaining skills, these are what makes a mmorpg playable, how else you gonna keep few hundred thousand or million people busy till expansion ?
the difference between the mmorpgs is what makes each one unique.
SWG - housing, great character customisation, housing / cities, entertainers ( unussual class ), AWSOME crafting system etc ..
DDO - ingame voice, excellent skill system, OUT OF THIS WORLD combat system, excellent LFG system etc ..
WoW - easy to play, designed in such a way that 90% of players don't even have ball hairs yet... and unfortunetly they out number the older players by 10 000 to 1 .. thus 6.9 million players are under 14 years old and 100k middle aged players.
Lotro will most likely have grinding, questing, dungeons run etc just like all the others. it is features like MPVP and the ability to form bands ( buy instruments and sit in a group and chill while playing tunes ), HUGE continents to explore, unique monsters from the books, excellent story line and such that will set it apart from others. I just really hope we don't get alot of children spamming the channels with crap ... that killed wow for me ...
anyway, i am open minded and will not put the game down before i have tried it like most idiots do ... i hope they make a success of it.
Gameplay - Linerar; wait at tavern, go on quest, loot and sell. Nothing else to do.
Social Panel - Actually cause lag because it takes a while to load on the names in.
Combat system is horrible because it bugged. (The dice will not appear at times and other players have noted this too.) and the cpu A.I is random.
Skill - Most of the skills except Haggle only work in dungeons. Jump and Tumble can be used outside a dungeon, but have no affect.
Owner/Admin of GodlessGamer.com - Gaming news and reviews for the godless.
ROFL, not playing a game because the interface looks like something from another game? You do realize that 5 days after release there will be websites up all over the place with dozens of mods for customizing the UI if not completely changing it? I don't even remember what WoW and EQ2s default UIs looked like, and I'm sure I'll forget what Vanguard's UI looks like soon enough. It'll likely be no different for LotR.
People love to look at WoW as the Be all and End all of gaming. It's not. It wasn't a horrible game, it wasn't a great game. What it was was a new game that has, if nothing else, infused the gaming community with new blood. Yeah, yeah, yeah, they may be Disney Gamers in what used to be a R world, but some of these Disney Gamers have gone out to other games. And most of these Disney Gamers are hooked on MMOs now. It's just a matter of getting them to grow up into other games, and game developers are drooling over that. So if borrowing from the interface basics that WoW borrowed from every other game out there is part of "breakin' 'em in" so be it. Baby steps. It'll be a huge enough leap forward if we get MMOs that...oh, I don't know...EVOLVE somehow instead of sitting there saying "do this quest and this quest and then you're max level! Now go here and here and you've got all the cool stuff! Congrats, you pushed the I WIN button, go reroll!" {See EQ2, WoW}.
~~~~~~~~~
Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do.
I agree with eschient on this one, I played WoW for about a week and I got really bored, the graphics are good and all but its the fact its just so easy. But as eschient said the playerbase is moving onto new MMO's and well hopefully growing up at the same time. The problem I forsee is some of the players are going from WoW into a hardcore Korean grindfest of a MMO. The difference is huge from being able to get end-game in a few weeks of play on WoW to spending a few weeks to get a level on some Korean MMO's.
But lets take that out of the equation, so the now MMO addicted 13 year old kid who drewls over elves or something decides to go to I dont know lets say FF11. Now he/she has to actually work for the levels, spend time interacting with other players, learn how to stand on their own two feet when it comes to quests. Thats the make or break point, is he/she a true MMO gamer will he/she love the challenge or will he/she flame the game to all his/her friends cry about how hard it is and go back to WoW and create yet another character.
Or then theres the mystical third option, they go to programming websites and bug everybody about making their own MMORPG, or they get some weak arsed too like RealCrafter and make another WoW clone.
Well thats just my 2 cents on the matter
There is no light without dark..