And there are very valid reasons those publishers don't want to fund these endeavors. None of that qualifies a cautious wait and see attitude about these developers' ability to deliver, quite the contrary. And it certainly doesn't mean we should give them carte blanche regarding monetization and marketing tactics.
Had the CoE team approached a traditional, reputable publisher and pitched this idea and timeline, how do you honestly think that would've went down?
I think we can agree they probably wouldn't get far with a traditional publisher because there is no proven market for their chosen mechanics.
I am not suggesting carte blanche. I just don't like what I see as a vendetta from some posters. Their monetisation is far better than loot boxes or what have you in some very successful games. Most of the criticism of the sale of titles etc is speculation as to its long term effects. It might turn out bad but it is not a given. That is what annoys me the most, the extreme reactions. Everything is a total disaster, complete failure or idiocy. And no explanation is every allowed to mitigate the negative in any way.
I would suggest childishness of behalf of those that don' allow constructive criticism of their comments. Seems very much "my way is right and you are wrong".
At the moment the devs have made mistakes, yes but other studios do too, the only difference is they don' admit them or hide them with their lack of transparency.
With Coe only time will tell and I think it's time people laid off the insults and waited to see what happens
OK Ordanska.. you can suggest childishness. I suggest it's realism.
No, he's right it's childishness, and to the extreme degree. It's not too different than picking on the smaller kids in your neighborhood just because you know you can do it with impunity.
Acting like a giant dick in the name of "realism" doesn't absolve a person of that behavior.
Only if you think reality and facts are childish. It's a valid worldview as childishness is at least partially subjective, but I'd say clinging to unrealistic hopes and dreams is more childish.
As it relates to this thread... the facts are the numbers. The subjectiveness is whether a spike in money the first week or two of a "sale" including the $10 buy a vote tokens is a long term uptick or an anomoly. There is no debate the "Funding continues the grow ". It's almost impossible for it not to grow. The question is whether the pace will match the need. Remember, he was supposed to have found a large investor by now. The Kickstarter was just seed money. That's not my plan but what they said. With no investor, how much must be raised to deliver on all their promises by the new ETD of the end of 2019? How much have they burned and how much is left? How much do they need for the first year of operating as everyone who paid in advance has at least one spark and potentially many...
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
And there are very valid reasons those publishers don't want to fund these endeavors. None of that qualifies a cautious wait and see attitude about these developers' ability to deliver, quite the contrary. And it certainly doesn't mean we should give them carte blanche regarding monetization and marketing tactics.
Had the CoE team approached a traditional, reputable publisher and pitched this idea and timeline, how do you honestly think that would've went down?
I think we can agree they probably wouldn't get far with a traditional publisher because there is no proven market for their chosen mechanics.
I am not suggesting carte blanche. I just don't like what I see as a vendetta from some posters. Their monetisation is far better than loot boxes or what have you in some very successful games. Most of the criticism of the sale of titles etc is speculation as to its long term effects. It might turn out bad but it is not a given. That is what annoys me the most, the extreme reactions. Everything is a total disaster, complete failure or idiocy. And no explanation is every allowed to mitigate the negative in any way.
I would suggest childishness of behalf of those that don' allow constructive criticism of their comments. Seems very much "my way is right and you are wrong".
At the moment the devs have made mistakes, yes but other studios do too, the only difference is they don' admit them or hide them with their lack of transparency.
With Coe only time will tell and I think it's time people laid off the insults and waited to see what happens
OK Ordanska.. you can suggest childishness. I suggest it's realism.
No, he's right it's childishness, and to the extreme degree. It's not too different than picking on the smaller kids in your neighborhood just because you know you can do it with impunity.
Acting like a giant dick in the name of "realism" doesn't absolve a person of that behavior.
Only if you think reality and facts are childish. It's a valid worldview as childishness is at least partially subjective, but I'd say clinging to unrealistic hopes and dreams is more childish.
As it relates to this thread... the facts are the numbers. The subjectiveness is whether a spike in money the first week or two of a "sale" including the $10 buy a vote tokens is a long term uptick or an anomoly. There is no debate the "Funding continues the grow ". It's almost impossible for it not to grow. The question is whether the pace will match the need. Remember, he was supposed to have found a large investor by now. The Kickstarter was just seed money. That's not my plan but what they said. With no investor, how much must be raised to deliver on all their promises by the new ETD of the end of 2019? How much have they burned and how much is left? How much do they need for the first year of operating as everyone who paid in advance has at least one spark and potentially many...
Well We have proven already how some people's reality and and facts vary depending how often they are proven wrong with actual facts.
You are right on one thing there, the spike in sales coincided with the free elyrian kingdom contest. But then who wouldn't want to attempt to win a $10,000 kingdom package or a $5,000 duke package.
I think funding will continue but your also right they need to find an investor, but then again for all we know they might have already found an investor, just because they havent told us doesn't mean they haven't got one.
And there are very valid reasons those publishers don't want to fund these endeavors. None of that qualifies a cautious wait and see attitude about these developers' ability to deliver, quite the contrary. And it certainly doesn't mean we should give them carte blanche regarding monetization and marketing tactics.
Had the CoE team approached a traditional, reputable publisher and pitched this idea and timeline, how do you honestly think that would've went down?
I think we can agree they probably wouldn't get far with a traditional publisher because there is no proven market for their chosen mechanics.
I am not suggesting carte blanche. I just don't like what I see as a vendetta from some posters. Their monetisation is far better than loot boxes or what have you in some very successful games. Most of the criticism of the sale of titles etc is speculation as to its long term effects. It might turn out bad but it is not a given. That is what annoys me the most, the extreme reactions. Everything is a total disaster, complete failure or idiocy. And no explanation is every allowed to mitigate the negative in any way.
I would suggest childishness of behalf of those that don' allow constructive criticism of their comments. Seems very much "my way is right and you are wrong".
At the moment the devs have made mistakes, yes but other studios do too, the only difference is they don' admit them or hide them with their lack of transparency.
With Coe only time will tell and I think it's time people laid off the insults and waited to see what happens
OK Ordanska.. you can suggest childishness. I suggest it's realism.
No, he's right it's childishness, and to the extreme degree. It's not too different than picking on the smaller kids in your neighborhood just because you know you can do it with impunity.
Acting like a giant dick in the name of "realism" doesn't absolve a person of that behavior.
Only if you think reality and facts are childish. It's a valid worldview as childishness is at least partially subjective, but I'd say clinging to unrealistic hopes and dreams is more childish.
As it relates to this thread... the facts are the numbers. The subjectiveness is whether a spike in money the first week or two of a "sale" including the $10 buy a vote tokens is a long term uptick or an anomoly. There is no debate the "Funding continues the grow ". It's almost impossible for it not to grow. The question is whether the pace will match the need. Remember, he was supposed to have found a large investor by now. The Kickstarter was just seed money. That's not my plan but what they said. With no investor, how much must be raised to deliver on all their promises by the new ETD of the end of 2019? How much have they burned and how much is left? How much do they need for the first year of operating as everyone who paid in advance has at least one spark and potentially many...
Well We have proven already how some people's reality and and facts vary depending how often they are proven wrong with actual facts.
You are right on one thing there, the spike in sales coincided with the free elyrian kingdom contest. But then who wouldn't want to attempt to win a $10,000 kingdom package or a $5,000 duke package.
I think funding will continue but your also right they need to find an investor, but then again for all we know they might have already found an investor, just because they havent told us doesn't mean they haven't got one.
See... we can agree!
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
There is no way in hell they can build the game they are advertising for a mere few million,they WILL need outside big money investors. So this leads me to think they already have or will have investors,meaning the money grab from the lowly gamer was nothing more than a scam/exploit to get free money from NAIVE gamer's,knowing full well they had their own money already and never needed the gamer's money.
This is the problem i have always had with this crowd funding idea,NOBODY knows the possibilities behind scamming the gamer,either short term or long term.
The whole idea of crowd funding was the gamer would fund the game and imo should be rewarded fair value,the same as an outside investor.An investor is just a person like you or me,they have no right to more value than we the gamer. So from the developer's eyes,they see the gamer as SUCKERS,they treat as less worth than a real person...an investor,obviously forgetting that YOU the gamer is also an investor.
Now on the flip side,if YOU the gamer are NOT really the ones/money that are building the game,then the developer has flat out LIED and should give all of the money back to the gamer's. Thing is thew wording,do they ever actually say you as a gamer are investing or own anything,NOPE,instead they pretend to be selling you something,you receive your purchase everything is all good. So the REALITY is that modern devs are NOT running crowd funding,they are running cash shops for games that are not even a game yet.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Well Kickstarter is not selling/buying its donations and tbh I am happy to donate money to a game i really want to get made in the hope it makes it there.
We Kickstarter is not selling/buying its donations and tbh I am happy to donate money to a game i really want to get made in the hope it makes it there.
Well looks like you might want to.prepare to dig a bit deeper if you really want this game to release.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Didn't Caspian say that even if they failed in their mission, it doesn't mean that their efforts didn't make an impact on the MMO industry in terms of imaginative and revolutionary concept?
If my recollection is correct of the above, then i think that would have said it all on his outlook for CoE
Didn't Caspian say that even if they failed in their mission, it doesn't mean that their efforts didn't make an impact on the MMO industry in terms of imaginative and revolutionary concept?
If my recollection is correct of the above, then i think that would have said it all on his outlook for CoE
Might we be related?
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
So clearly you guys have to say other than the game is not released yet. Just the usual smart ass internet cynicism.
I remember quite clearly one of the major criticism was that they did not have enough money. Yet when they find a way to raise more the criticism turns to 'how' they have raised the money. lol
So clearly you guys have to say other than the game is not released yet. Just the usual smart ass internet cynicism.
I remember quite clearly one of the major criticism was that they did not have enough money. Yet when they find a way to raise more the criticism turns to 'how' they have raised the money. lol
Even some of the high-tier people in the CoE forums have called their recent moves as cash grabs.
I think everyone would like to see a game like CoE come to fruition, but I don't think it'll come from these guys.
So clearly you guys have to say other than the game is not released yet. Just the usual smart ass internet cynicism.
I remember quite clearly one of the major criticism was that they did not have enough money. Yet when they find a way to raise more the criticism turns to 'how' they have raised the money. lol
Well, on the plus side they aren't selling loot boxes or new space ships so there is that in their favor.
On a more serious note, with their ambitious designs (and schedule delays) they are going to have to employ a variety of "creative" techniques to keep the money flowing in.
Let's just hope it doesn't come down to selling Caspian's blood.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
So clearly you guys have to say other than the game is not released yet. Just the usual smart ass internet cynicism.
I remember quite clearly one of the major criticism was that they did not have enough money. Yet when they find a way to raise more the criticism turns to 'how' they have raised the money. lol
You ignore the fact that the money was supposed to come from an investor. Supporters were supposed to provide the seed money. And yes, the how definitely matters. The ends don’t always justify the means. Thus dubious cash raising schemes like paying $10 for each vote for a king, paying $10 for a token to make your town better, paying $10 for a token to make your guild better are what development hinges on.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Guy makes great points, but nothing different than what's been discussed
Love the way he points out the insanity of the OPC concept. This has always been one of the points that I think will cause the most backlash by the diehards. They are absolutely SOLD on this concept that their characters will live on and function with incredible AI when they logoff. IMHA when they see the reality and how it gets exploited by certain folks looking for jollies... they are going to turn on SBS like a wolfpack.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Comments
As it relates to this thread... the facts are the numbers. The subjectiveness is whether a spike in money the first week or two of a "sale" including the $10 buy a vote tokens is a long term uptick or an anomoly. There is no debate the "Funding continues the grow ". It's almost impossible for it not to grow. The question is whether the pace will match the need. Remember, he was supposed to have found a large investor by now. The Kickstarter was just seed money. That's not my plan but what they said. With no investor, how much must be raised to deliver on all their promises by the new ETD of the end of 2019? How much have they burned and how much is left? How much do they need for the first year of operating as everyone who paid in advance has at least one spark and potentially many...
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
You are right on one thing there, the spike in sales coincided with the free elyrian kingdom contest. But then who wouldn't want to attempt to win a $10,000 kingdom package or a $5,000 duke package.
I think funding will continue but your also right they need to find an investor, but then again for all we know they might have already found an investor, just because they havent told us doesn't mean they haven't got one.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
So this leads me to think they already have or will have investors,meaning the money grab from the lowly gamer was nothing more than a scam/exploit to get free money from NAIVE gamer's,knowing full well they had their own money already and never needed the gamer's money.
This is the problem i have always had with this crowd funding idea,NOBODY knows the possibilities behind scamming the gamer,either short term or long term.
The whole idea of crowd funding was the gamer would fund the game and imo should be rewarded fair value,the same as an outside investor.An investor is just a person like you or me,they have no right to more value than we the gamer.
So from the developer's eyes,they see the gamer as SUCKERS,they treat as less worth than a real person...an investor,obviously forgetting that YOU the gamer is also an investor.
Now on the flip side,if YOU the gamer are NOT really the ones/money that are building the game,then the developer has flat out LIED and should give all of the money back to the gamer's.
Thing is thew wording,do they ever actually say you as a gamer are investing or own anything,NOPE,instead they pretend to be selling you something,you receive your purchase everything is all good.
So the REALITY is that modern devs are NOT running crowd funding,they are running cash shops for games that are not even a game yet.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
How about we pencil you in for a grand?
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Id also expect a huge chunk of ownership.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
The only visible progress so far is in the area of fundraising...
If my recollection is correct of the above, then i think that would have said it all on his outlook for CoE
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
I remember quite clearly one of the major criticism was that they did not have enough money. Yet when they find a way to raise more the criticism turns to 'how' they have raised the money. lol
Even some of the high-tier people in the CoE forums have called their recent moves as cash grabs.
I think everyone would like to see a game like CoE come to fruition, but I don't think it'll come from these guys.
On a more serious note, with their ambitious designs (and schedule delays) they are going to have to employ a variety of "creative" techniques to keep the money flowing in.
Let's just hope it doesn't come down to selling Caspian's blood.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Guy makes great points, but nothing different from than what's been discussed
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018