Feel free to go read your posts again. Proof is right there. Constantly insinuating nefarious intent when it is clearly not the case.
So you have zero to support your personal attack. I see. Having a negative opinion of a game or company and discussing their failures is not slander. Let's stick to discussing the game shall we?
Personally I can't wait until the Elyria Mud release date comes!
So basically you are retracting your claim that the developers are dishonest and incompetent?
That's not what I said. I said they either knowingly said incorrect things or were incompetent. Not both. I think I previously said that I think it's the latter. Just incompetence.
Of course, there's also always the possibility that they were both anyways. The two aren't mutually exclusive, after all.
Feel free to go read your posts again. Proof is right there. Constantly insinuating nefarious intent when it is clearly not the case.
So you have zero to support your personal attack. I see. Having a negative opinion of a game or company and discussing their failures is not slander. Let's stick to discussing the game shall we?
Personally I can't wait until the Elyria Mud release date comes!
So basically you are retracting your claim that the developers are dishonest and incompetent?
That's not what I said. I said they either knowingly said incorrect things or were incompetent. Not both. I think I previously said that I think it's the latter. Just incompetence.
Of course, there's also always the possibility that they were both anyways. The two aren't mutually exclusive, after all.
True... but in my eyes if you miss your 18 month ETA by at least 12 months that's incompetence. And no that's not slander.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Feel free to go read your posts again. Proof is right there. Constantly insinuating nefarious intent when it is clearly not the case.
So you have zero to support your personal attack. I see. Having a negative opinion of a game or company and discussing their failures is not slander. Let's stick to discussing the game shall we?
Personally I can't wait until the Elyria Mud release date comes!
So basically you are retracting your claim that the developers are dishonest and incompetent?
That's not what I said. I said they either knowingly said incorrect things or were incompetent. Not both. I think I previously said that I think it's the latter. Just incompetence.
Of course, there's also always the possibility that they were both anyways. The two aren't mutually exclusive, after all.
True... but in my eyes if you miss your 18 month ETA by at least 12 months that's incompetence. And no that's not slander.
I'd call it more of an error in judgement as they pointed to miscalculating the amount of time get hire new resources and get them up to speed.
A good project manager knows this and many would likely agree management rarely comprehends this point, almost always misjudging the time and effort to secure good help.
MJ did it for CU, took several years and opening a branch in Seattle to find the talent he needed.
Saying someone is incompetent is more or less stating they never did, nor ever will be able to accomplish a task.
You might be able to infer from the first failure they may never be able to competently plan and stick to a schedule, but in this regard Caspian joins a long line of software devs including MJ, Richard, and Chris to name a few.
Now Richard's competency to deliver a good game, particularly SotA is definitely called into question at this point.
For Chris Roberts his competency to actually ship a released game is in question particularly with SQ42 which there's no valid reason I can see not to have delivered by now other than not properly directing his vast resources to make it happen.
Mark J, no free ride here, I know about all of the challenges thus far, but they should all be resolved so no good excuse to not have a fairly solid delivery timeline after 4 years, and certainly a date for CB1. (Same goes for SC and the long overdue 3.0 alpha version.)
So Caspian gets a break for now, at least from me but 2 years from now if still not released or at a published delivery date then his competence will be called into question.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I said the same thing to MJ. Sorry, but either you knew your estimate was off by a huge amount and chose to say otherwise, or you didn't know which is incompetent. Someone can be incompetent and still eventually finish a task. I like these synonyms:
inept, unskillful, unskilled, inexpert, amateurish, unprofessional, bungling, blundering, clumsy, substandard, inferior, ineffective, deficient, inefficient, ineffectual, wanting, lacking, leaving much to be desired
I think most of those apply.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
I said the same thing to MJ. Sorry, but either you knew your estimate was off by a huge amount and chose to say otherwise, or you didn't know which is incompetent. Someone can be incompetent and still eventually finish a task. I like these synonyms:
inept, unskillful, unskilled, inexpert, amateurish, unprofessional, bungling, blundering, clumsy, substandard, inferior, ineffective, deficient, inefficient, ineffectual, wanting, lacking, leaving much to be desired
I said the same thing to MJ. Sorry, but either you knew your estimate was off by a huge amount and chose to say otherwise, or you didn't know which is incompetent. Someone can be incompetent and still eventually finish a task. I like these synonyms:
inept, unskillful, unskilled, inexpert, amateurish, unprofessional, bungling, blundering, clumsy, substandard, inferior, ineffective, deficient, inefficient, ineffectual, wanting, lacking, leaving much to be desired
I think most of those apply.
you left out Feckless..............
Damn... I'm incompetent too... but I'm not asking people to give me millions of dollars based on that
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
MadFrenchie said: If you're going to solicit funds from a group of folks who are not trained to properly consider your project, extra care should be taken
The one that needs to take extra care is you - your money, your responsibility. You feel some information is missing? No problem, don't pledge.
You are still deliberately ignoring that you are not an investor nor consumer, you are a donor therefore devs owe you nothing.
More apropos, a legal requirement to provide more than marketing to consumers considering supporting the project. If you're going to solicit funds from a group of folks who are not trained to properly consider your project, extra care should be taken to make pertinent information clear and consistent. Craz mentioned nutrition information earlier in the thread; it's the same principle. General consumers aren't nutritionists; so we provide an easy to understand chart to present the information in a way that's useful to the consumer. General consumers also aren't project managers or software developers. A framework to provide a more realistic view of the project's viability and estimated timeline is a great place to start.
It would also provide the developers a concrete goal to work towards (and be held accountable to). No more nebulous "well now you guys want us to do this, so that takes more time!" Additions to the original scope can and should be something that's focused on after the original vision is completed for backers to assess the desire to even fund additions to the project. Paid DLCs during crowdfunded development comes to mind.
As badly as you and some others seem to want to convince us that holding developers responsible for their own words and actions is a witch hunt, it's really just not.
And you absolutely did say gamers aren't analyzing the decision on a risk vs. reward basis, it's in the quote I included in my post.
My exact words were: "The gamer is not basing his decision on an analysis of risk vs return, or at least their tolerance for risk is very high." I qualified that statement with the last bit.
It actually has nothing to do with not wanting to hold developers responsible. I just get annoyed with the the wild insinuations by some.
By all means advocate for a different structure for crowdfunding.
I said the same thing to MJ. Sorry, but either you knew your estimate was off by a huge amount and chose to say otherwise, or you didn't know which is incompetent. Someone can be incompetent and still eventually finish a task. I like these synonyms:
inept, unskillful, unskilled, inexpert, amateurish, unprofessional, bungling, blundering, clumsy, substandard, inferior, ineffective, deficient, inefficient, ineffectual, wanting, lacking, leaving much to be desired
I think most of those apply.
They provided adequate reason for at least part of the delay.
Comments
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
A good project manager knows this and many would likely agree management rarely comprehends this point, almost always misjudging the time and effort to secure good help.
MJ did it for CU, took several years and opening a branch in Seattle to find the talent he needed.
Saying someone is incompetent is more or less stating they never did, nor ever will be able to accomplish a task.
You might be able to infer from the first failure they may never be able to competently plan and stick to a schedule, but in this regard Caspian joins a long line of software devs including MJ, Richard, and Chris to name a few.
Now Richard's competency to deliver a good game, particularly SotA is definitely called into question at this point.
For Chris Roberts his competency to actually ship a released game is in question particularly with SQ42 which there's no valid reason I can see not to have delivered by now other than not properly directing his vast resources to make it happen.
Mark J, no free ride here, I know about all of the challenges thus far, but they should all be resolved so no good excuse to not have a fairly solid delivery timeline after 4 years, and certainly a date for CB1. (Same goes for SC and the long overdue 3.0 alpha version.)
So Caspian gets a break for now, at least from me but 2 years from now if still not released or at a published delivery date then his competence will be called into question.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
substandard, inferior, ineffective, deficient, inefficient, ineffectual, wanting, lacking, leaving much to be desired
I think most of those apply.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
You are still deliberately ignoring that you are not an investor nor consumer, you are a donor therefore devs owe you nothing.
It actually has nothing to do with not wanting to hold developers responsible. I just get annoyed with the the wild insinuations by some.
By all means advocate for a different structure for crowdfunding.