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GW2 is the most fun (FOR ME) max level themepark MMO out there
TheScavenger
Member EpicPosts: 3,321
in Guild Wars 2
First, I actually enjoyed City of Heroes just as much...unlike GW2, CoH was fun the whole game from early to end "level".
However, unlike many MMOs...GW2 is the most fun max level themepark MMO currently out. In WoW, by far the most fun I had was from level 1-110...at 110...suddenly it felt like I was a rat in a maze getting the next (very slightly) bigger piece of cheese and then put back at the start to do it again. However, WoW is amazingly fun to level in, because the story and zones are so amazing.
That is unlike GW2. In GW2, I played (casually, so I was only level 50 or so) for a month and was bored as hell. I kept playing because my real life friend was playing, but...when I was level 39 or 40 (forgot exactly), he used his level 80 boost from HoT expansion. The game again got boring. My friend stopped playing too about 4 months ago, but that isn't because he dislikes the game but because he is in the process of moving so hasn't had PC internet to play (only a mobile phone and a laptop, but his laptop is really old).
However, I bought HoT 3 months ago, after not playing GW2 since my friend played. I used my boost...and wow did the entire game change. I can go EVERYWHERE in the game, so I can do anything I feel like...almost like an open world (not sandbox mind you) style game. I can do any quests, the story, the HoT zones are amazing (to me they are) and even after 3 months the HoT zones still look beautiful. Literally I can never level another character again without boosting it, because the early levels are so boring.
However I think its because you progress so little in terms of skills and character development (have to wait so many levels just to train your first ability to use besides the weapon abilities)...and you are so limited in what you can do early on. Sure in WoW its limiting at level 1, but you progress fast (a lot faster than GW2), and you get rewarded with so many abilities as you level...almost every level is either an ability or talent point. GW2 is not like that at all.
So actually spending (at the time I think it was 50 dollars, its only 30 dollars now) improved GW2 for me by 100%. Before it was boring as hell, now its the most fun I've had in an MMO in a long time. And I've been playing heavily every day for the past 3 months. Its one of the very few I've personally played where the "end level" is actually more fun (or just as level) as the end level is. I don't feel the need to grind or anything, but I can do anything I want at level 80 and I can do so much stories and everything else. The only other MMO I had this much fun in was City of Heroes, but that game was fun from 1 to the end.
And also yes, while I'm not progressing anymore in terms of new abilities ( except masteries/hero points etc)...the game goes from extremely limited to what you can do, to a TON of fun. And I love the HoT areas. Something about leveling in GW2 is boring as hell to me, and while I'm still doing events and what not...I like being able to go everywhere and do anything I want, and experience the story (which you almost can't do leveling, because it gates the story every 10 hours). The complete opposite of WoW where leveling is most fun and endgame is super boring lol.
Did anyone else have the same experience? Or had that same experience in other themepark MMOs? I think the only other one I can kinda think of (but I didn't really like it personally) is FFXIV is extremely boring to level (mostly cause the zones suck and heavily instanced/railroaded designs, and early on combat is slow as hell), but the new expansion area is actually a lot more fun than the base game and the game opens a lot with much better combat as your character develops. But I couldn't get into it even though I gave it a really good chance.
However, unlike many MMOs...GW2 is the most fun max level themepark MMO currently out. In WoW, by far the most fun I had was from level 1-110...at 110...suddenly it felt like I was a rat in a maze getting the next (very slightly) bigger piece of cheese and then put back at the start to do it again. However, WoW is amazingly fun to level in, because the story and zones are so amazing.
That is unlike GW2. In GW2, I played (casually, so I was only level 50 or so) for a month and was bored as hell. I kept playing because my real life friend was playing, but...when I was level 39 or 40 (forgot exactly), he used his level 80 boost from HoT expansion. The game again got boring. My friend stopped playing too about 4 months ago, but that isn't because he dislikes the game but because he is in the process of moving so hasn't had PC internet to play (only a mobile phone and a laptop, but his laptop is really old).
However, I bought HoT 3 months ago, after not playing GW2 since my friend played. I used my boost...and wow did the entire game change. I can go EVERYWHERE in the game, so I can do anything I feel like...almost like an open world (not sandbox mind you) style game. I can do any quests, the story, the HoT zones are amazing (to me they are) and even after 3 months the HoT zones still look beautiful. Literally I can never level another character again without boosting it, because the early levels are so boring.
However I think its because you progress so little in terms of skills and character development (have to wait so many levels just to train your first ability to use besides the weapon abilities)...and you are so limited in what you can do early on. Sure in WoW its limiting at level 1, but you progress fast (a lot faster than GW2), and you get rewarded with so many abilities as you level...almost every level is either an ability or talent point. GW2 is not like that at all.
So actually spending (at the time I think it was 50 dollars, its only 30 dollars now) improved GW2 for me by 100%. Before it was boring as hell, now its the most fun I've had in an MMO in a long time. And I've been playing heavily every day for the past 3 months. Its one of the very few I've personally played where the "end level" is actually more fun (or just as level) as the end level is. I don't feel the need to grind or anything, but I can do anything I want at level 80 and I can do so much stories and everything else. The only other MMO I had this much fun in was City of Heroes, but that game was fun from 1 to the end.
And also yes, while I'm not progressing anymore in terms of new abilities ( except masteries/hero points etc)...the game goes from extremely limited to what you can do, to a TON of fun. And I love the HoT areas. Something about leveling in GW2 is boring as hell to me, and while I'm still doing events and what not...I like being able to go everywhere and do anything I want, and experience the story (which you almost can't do leveling, because it gates the story every 10 hours). The complete opposite of WoW where leveling is most fun and endgame is super boring lol.
Did anyone else have the same experience? Or had that same experience in other themepark MMOs? I think the only other one I can kinda think of (but I didn't really like it personally) is FFXIV is extremely boring to level (mostly cause the zones suck and heavily instanced/railroaded designs, and early on combat is slow as hell), but the new expansion area is actually a lot more fun than the base game and the game opens a lot with much better combat as your character develops. But I couldn't get into it even though I gave it a really good chance.
My Skyrim, Fallout 4, Starbound and WoW + other game mods at MODDB:
https://www.moddb.com/mods/skyrim-anime-overhaul
Comments
I think the other part of it I find is the grind. I don't like grinding at all as I find it pretty much like a rat in a maze to get cheese...I don't feel grinding is good quality content and feel its very lazy design. And leveling in GW2 feels like a lot of grinding (a lot more than leveling in WoW) to get new abilities or anything new at all. And grinding 10 levels to see new story.
Sure I'm doing the same thing at "endgame"...events and what not. But now I have the option to do whatever I want, when I want without worrying about grinding to progress or see content (like the story).
Where as, at end game in WoW is a TON of grind (that is all there is in Legion) so it loses all the fun for me...and "endgame" in GW2 the grind completely goes away (well masteries/hero points, but I never focus on those as I just run into them as I explore the world and do events, they show up on the map and some of them are actually FUN to do as some are in hard to get areas).
So I think a big part I find is grinding in games is boring as hell, so when I skip the grind in GW2 (it feels like grind to me, because I want to do the whole story in one go, not wait every 10 levels...or go to any zone I want...) the game became vastly more fun. Where as, leveling in WoW is very fast paced, exciting, and you keep progressing really fast so there is kinda a grind, but not boring at all compared to endgame to get a slightly better item over and over.
With that said...there is Elder Scrolls Online. Forgot about One Tamriel. You can literally do anything and go anywhere, no matter what level you are. All the DLC you can do, everything. One Tamriel is amazing, but I'm currently into GW2 for past few months.
My Skyrim, Fallout 4, Starbound and WoW + other game mods at MODDB:
https://www.moddb.com/mods/skyrim-anime-overhaul
i actually just re-purchased ESO gold edition with the DLC's and have begun leveling a new character. i HATED eso when it launched, but now since One Tamriel, the game is fantastic. being able to go level where i want on a less linear path is much more fun. the game is ALL quests, and i enjoy the lore, if you are a lore kinda person....there's nothing better than ESO. i'm sure a lot of people just skip all of the quest dialogue, but i enjoy it as it's all voiced over and well done, with lots of cool stories along the way. it certainly makes the game feel less of a boring grind when you are questing and learning about the world during your travels.....makes it much more like an actual adventure.
At release, you got your first ability really early on...and you didn't need to "unlock" features of the game by getting to a certain level. And you could train skills really early by getting hero points and what not...but that was completely changed.
ESO is really amazing though and your post really makes me want to play it again. But I personally try to stick to one "big" MMO at a time, but I'll definitely play ESO once I eventually run out of things to do (or get bored) of GW2...since GW2 the updates are kinda slow to happen, so eventually I'll see everything I personally want to see in GW2 till the next update. ESO definitely got way better in One Tamriel and I do LOVE lore and quests.
My Skyrim, Fallout 4, Starbound and WoW + other game mods at MODDB:
https://www.moddb.com/mods/skyrim-anime-overhaul
Why do we continue to have folks with this mind set?
Each of the games being described has content, story, lore, levels to gain, skills/abilities to unlock... character development. Also, they have introduced ways to level faster so you can get to max level too.
If you feel lazy and don't feel like leveling from 1 to max lvl you choose the convenience route.
Character progression is a grind, but it can still be fun.
In WoW, from the very first level you gain you get new abilities. You get new items, and from level 1-110 every item you get is unique from the previous one.
In EVE, the "grind" is raising skills, but that is done over time and you are free to do anything you want
In FFXIV, characters develop really fast as they level and you get progressively better fast. I just really dislike the very linear instance zones till the expansion area
In GW2...you don't get your first ability (not weapon skills, but actual ability you train) until level 20...maybe its 10, I forgot as its been a while since I was that low. As a necromancer, I had to wait for ages to get my first minion. Either way, you learn skills very slowly outside of the weapon stuff. On top of that, features are locked out until you get to X level (like you have to be a certain level to even GET hero points...that wasn't like it at release). And entire features are locked out by levels. But the thing is, your actual character progresses so slow compared to FFXIV/WoW in my examples.
You even can't keep doing the story until you earn 10 levels to continue forward. Yes WoW you have to be a certain level to do higher level quests, but there are so many quests and stories to do non-stop all the way to the end.
GW2 character progression is a boring as hell grind (FOR ME) because of that. However at level 80, none of that is even an issue.
Also as I said, in GW2 at release...the leveling was very different. It was faster, and far more fun than it is now. I got my first minion at level 2 or maybe it was 4...either way, far faster than currently. And features weren't locked out by level, and it felt a lot more open and "free" when leveling.
In any case...I've been having a ton of fun without worrying about all that grind since I've been level 80. 3 months of pure fun
My Skyrim, Fallout 4, Starbound and WoW + other game mods at MODDB:
https://www.moddb.com/mods/skyrim-anime-overhaul
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As some have mentioned here I think the game was way more fun to level at launch than it is now but for me not because you have to unlock things, you didn't have to unlock zones before but you needed to wait your character to reach the right level to go there which has the same effect. The thing is that now all low level areas are completely empty. Nobody there, where it used to be full of new players grinding and learning.
Now the thing that changed most for me, and I didn't like it at all and slowly is forcing me to stop playing, is the format of new maps. All maps in HoT are maze like. It is the opposite to what I like. I love open maps, open spaces where you can go anywhere you put your eyes on, but all the new zones are like a labyrinth where paths are not clear and you need search your for a way all the time. That annoys me so much I have stopped playing those maps. I still like dungeons, Fractals and PVP but the open PVE died for me, I just can't stand HoT new zones.
But:
- Character progression feels very diluted. As if its stretched over way too many levels.
- Combat is boring for me because of a few combining factors :
- I don't mind small action bars (I loved GW1 after all), but there are just too few skills in the end to chose from.
- The combat is this weird hybrid form of action and tabbased. But it plays like a tab based MMO because of the dodge restrictions and the many home seeking skills. Making the dodging out of red zones just feel like a gimmick.
- Zergs! Omg, I hate these with a passion. At first they can be convenient, but at some point you realise that major encounters in open world come down to AOE'ing the shit out of it as part of a zerg.
The way combat works and how unnecessary those 80 levels feel, makes the game quite boring for me. I just could not stomach leveling a 2nd toon because of this.Then Arenanet completely deviated from the original game concept (manifesto) during development, and this did not help either. But still, I expected to grown used to the changes, but I got bored because of character progression and combat before that.
I have leveled about 8 characters to max level (but got a boost to 20 or 30 on some). I don't think it is boring but the weird changes to how slow you gain abilities together with several difficulty nerfs makes it so-so.
Personally do I think they can revamp it to be far more fun, why not giving us a second campaign like Factions for next expansion and put higher difficulty on it? If it is too hard you can still level in the old zones while people who want a bit more challenge can run the new content.
That said, I'm looking forward to riding my new mounts around in Tyria. I will be mostly staying away from HoT and PoF, just going there to get Elites and mounts then back to the original content, which I have enjoyed since the game started.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Even Wow tend to add higher difficulty in the new expansion, you need some challenging content besides raiding in a MMO and there is plenty of easy content in the game.
You enjoy easier content and that is fine but I want it tougher so leave something for me as well. But they can and probably will nerf HoT soon, it needs to be done when most players move to the new expansion.
I have DEFINITELY become more of casual gamer in the past few years now moving into my 30's. I don't want to be stressed out when playing video games, as they are one of my primary relaxing pastimes. To each his own though, I know people who find the extreme annoying difficulties of said games to be relaxing in their own ways, to me they are not.
When it comes to challenges I prefer the kind of challenges that require teamplay stratagem. Typically only seen in online shooter type games, or MMOs when they are brand spankin new. Once a strat has been figured out in any kind of single player game or MMO, it's plastered all over the interwebs and it's no longer a challenge. Even Dark Souls players can just go look at a guide and from that point the game boils down to just how well you can dodge/attack in sequence.
What I seen so far is at least very good but then have I just been in the first zone and tried the raptor mount for a few hours to test the difficulty, zone layout and the feel of the expansion.
The difficulty is generally relatively hard if you solo but average if you run with others or play in group.
And Elona is beutiful...
Doing low lvl maps now, boosted my ele to lvl 80 with the free boost. Only I have no idea how to unlock tempest -_-
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When you play an FPS and you are going through the story, is that grind? When you play a game like Fallout, is that grind? When you play a RTS like WC or SC, you need to progress. Is that grind?
It sounds to me like games aren't for you. If there was no progression there would be no game!
Here is a link to a game with no (in your words) 'grind'... exactly.
I enjoy some easy content. When ESO first came out is was a challenge and I was disappointed when I returned and it was so easy doing a lot of the content. Now you can get sets just from doing certain quest lines no real need for crafting them. It depends on the game.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey