Not hyped at all. Very disappointing, no new pvp content, no new wvw content, and the specializations, oh boy this will be horrible. Since the same guys that were responsible for HoT are responsible for PoF expect the power creep to be as ridiculous as it was previous, expect zero balancing and the same bullshit fotm meta we "enjoyed" since HoT. The new maps look decent, i have to give them that and mounts yeah wow what a unique feature for an mmorpg.....
Not hyped at all. Very disappointing, no new pvp content, no new wvw content, and the specializations, oh boy this will be horrible. Since the same guys that were responsible for HoT are responsible for PoF expect the power creep to be as ridiculous as it was previous, expect zero balancing and the same bullshit fotm meta we "enjoyed" since HoT. The new maps look decent, i have to give them that and mounts yeah wow what a unique feature for an mmorpg.....
New PvP and WvW content comes with updates outside of expansions, not with expansions. In fact, on the GW2 forums WvW and PvP changes were announced for the 8 of august (IIRC).
The unique thing about the mounts is not the mounts themselves but that each mount has unique abilities that allow it to get to specific places. One mount is required to jump over large gaps, another to high places and so on. It's for that horizontal progression / metrovania-style thing.
As for the power of these elite specs compared to HoT elite specs, I'll take a wait-and-see approach. I was a bit disappointed that HoT's elite specs turned out to be stronger than the core specs. But if they manage to make the PoF specs of similar power but with different niches then I'm going to be happy.
i really liked the reveal.. it wasn't this long dragged out boring mess that they did with HoT. also it looks like my condi rev is finally getting an elite that might actually be useful to me. and some of the other class elites looks quite interesting aswell.
RIP HoT specs. Hope nobody enjoyed playing them because they will never be viable again, just like vanilla specs. Gotta make way for the latest P2W cash grab specs.
Of course the new elite specs will be more powerful. Otherwise why would someone pick them? There are so many play styles atm that you would pick up a different class instead.
An expansion will never be p2w.
What you mean is that if there were no new elite specs and/or if those new elite specs weren't more powerful, PvPers would have no reason to buy the new expansion.
Keep dreaming. A company will not continue to develop a game or a game mode without expecting revenue.
It is not like the PvP community is bringing more players to GW2 to justify not buying new expansions.
If it wasn't elite specs it would be new maps, or tournaments only for the new expansion, or rewards only for the new expansion, or new overpowered classes only for the new expansion, etc.
Currently playing: GW2 Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
I don't understand where the pay2win thing comes in here. Even if it was who cares? The only time I spend money on this game these days is with expansions; I better be getting something for my money.
RIP HoT specs. Hope nobody enjoyed playing them because they will never be viable again, just like vanilla specs. Gotta make way for the latest P2W cash grab specs.
Caffynated - Some of the preview build videos that have been posted online (namely Wooden Potatoes' Aftershow) noted that some of the Elite Specs had certain traits nerfed to prevent overlap. It has been stated before by ANet that Elite Specs are SUPPOSED to be both more powerful and more specialized than the base class (hence "ELITE" spec).
Anyone expecting Elite Specs to be balanced against the Core specs will probably be disappointed (especially since the "Core" game can only be bought with HoT or PoF, you can only get "Base" game via F2P now).
Point is, some of the early builds have already shown the HoT and PoF elite specs being balanced against each other in those preview game builds.
While I mainly play thief I can't say my DPS changed that much, the only major improvement I got was 4 dodges which is good but nowhere near twice the damage. Yet I can't say killing people in PvP got that much harder so either are you wrong and the improvement is way smaller or most people can't play those builds (or every time I do WvW I run into noobs out of extreme "luck").
In Wows case at least all my friends who still play all buy the expansion, the problem with GW2 feels more that HoT was not a really good expansion so many skipped it. That people who pay the game as F2P get less powerful is not that strange, in many games you can't even equip the best items (I am looking on you, EQ2) and that hurts a lot.
A F2P person with ascended gear is still close to the speciality classes, have a bunch in my guild and they do their parts in dungeons and fractals just as anyone else. It might take a little more skill to pull it off but they are certainly not worthless or counted as half a player.
All that said, they do need to balance the new classes with the old ones because it would be pretty boring if everyone you run with that can afford it use the new build.
People in games like Wow (or any other MMO that raises the levelcap) do run things in the old content even if they are at a higher level since they play on the same server even if they have access to more content. They might not raid the old expansion but few people bother with that anyways, serious raiders always have the latest expansion. Being for instance lvl 105 in a lvl 100 zones are not uncommon even if the people who don't own the expansion can just be lvl 100 (or whatever lvl, just an example) so I don't think your argument is right.
Unless a game actually moves you to a new server when you buy the expansion this will happen in any game that releases an expansion. The difference in GW2 is that you still can wear gear with maxed stats.
I don't know how much simpler I can put this.
Even after nearly 2 years of balance patches, there are still no competitive PvP builds that don't use an Elite Specialization.
Before HoT, staff ele was pretty much the number one DPS build in the game. It's now not even top 10 and brings none of the support or survivability that the higher DPS builds above it have.
If you don't see the difference in elite and non-elite specs, then you're just not very knowledgeable/experienced and your opinions don't count for that much.
Way to ignore the more important thing about expansions pay2win but whatever. If the difference would be so huge I would die far more often. The only of the new classes that make a big difference is the necro one.
My 2 daggers still do the about same DPS and people still go down easily unless they get in a stun on me. The 2 pistols nerf is really the one thing slowing me down a bit when I switch out for a while. Unless I suddenly started to play twice as well the HoT builds are not as powerful as you think.
The druid is annoying when I jump more then one player though but not for it's DPS. The difference could be larger in PvE but it matters less there and I don't really care as long as I do my part and we complete whatever we do.
See, you're probably playing a Dagger/Dagger power build, so yeah, if you're thinking a daredevil with dagger dagger power is the same as before you're not sacrificing or gaining much damage.
But staff daredevil in PvP is one of the most ridiculous damage dealers in the game and was one of the metas. So was a Condi-Dagger/Dagger evasion build. Both were insanely tough to beat. Hands down you could barely touch them when played properly. Regular D/D builds don't even register on the same scale as those hokey elite builds, that generally revolved around 1 mechanic that required daredevil.
It was like that for the majority of classes. Dragon Hunter? Traps were the pinnacle of PvP, EVEN if you went burn guard, traps were utilized. Scrapper? Way more sustain and damage output across the board, with the only other viable engineer build being a condition dual pistols build and that was tough to sustain due to the increase in condi clears after HoT.
Elite specs were far and away the meta across the board.
RIP HoT specs. Hope nobody enjoyed playing them because they will never be viable again, just like vanilla specs. Gotta make way for the latest P2W cash grab specs.
Caffynated - Some of the preview build videos that have been posted online (namely Wooden Potatoes' Aftershow) noted that some of the Elite Specs had certain traits nerfed to prevent overlap. It has been stated before by ANet that Elite Specs are SUPPOSED to be both more powerful and more specialized than the base class (hence "ELITE" spec).
Anyone expecting Elite Specs to be balanced against the Core specs will probably be disappointed (especially since the "Core" game can only be bought with HoT or PoF, you can only get "Base" game via F2P now).
Point is, some of the early builds have already shown the HoT and PoF elite specs being balanced against each other in those preview game builds.
Actually they said the the exact opposite. "Elite" was just the phrase they chose and they intended them to be sidegrades.
Saying anything else is complete revisionist history.
Instead of level progression, they went with skill progression. Same as ESO and CP. Now they will also add mount leveling in addition to glider leveling.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Have they changed the one thing that made me quit GW2 shortly after playing HoT - the idea that I have to find a group and zerg down mobs to get points so I could use the new elite spec (and the glider). Vanilla is solo friendly, and fun. Then you enter the HoT maps and suddenly you're expected to group up or have nothing to do. If the new areas in this expansion yet again want to force me to group up they can keep the expansion. I won't come back.
It is true @ LilithM that when HoT was released mobs were "overtuned" and some easily 1 shot players.
However, as much as the DEVs tried on the forums to reason with the community about allowing a more hardcore approach to the game, everyone kept complaining raging and some quit - so eventually mobs were nerfed to the ground.
Path of Fire will be the same. No matter what unique concepts this expansion will bring, players will start complaining and kitten their way into ruining everything all over again.
"This is too hard! Change it!" will again be the common forum motto and after a few months we'll see the expansion changed drastically, without a doubt.
I have ordered the Ultimate edition of the PoF and I'm waiting patiently while wondering about mounts and how impactful they'll be gameplay-wise. I don't like mounts and I have no interest in them. I hope there will be some choice in this regard.
So are they even bothering with balance at this point or are they just adding a new OP specialization that pretty much puts you in a box for the expansion?
From what I've read and experienced, you either used the Elite Specialization in HoT or you got laughed out of the game.
The base professions are worthless now? Did HoT's Elite Specs get boxed up for the OP of the Path of Fire Elite Specs?
The game has never been more balanced then now actually and you don't need to run the Elite Specs unless you want to run raids last I checked and even then it's all depends what your group role is supposed to be.
PoF Elite Spec are quite focused and I don't think they are for "everyone" either.
Necro/Guardian: both are getting group support focused specs.
Warrior: Spellbreaker is a PvP specs mostly
Thief: group PvP specs going by what I've seen of the skills and traits (the rooting might be a PITA in any game mode though)
Mesmer: a DPS spec (about time, it's the worst at DPS currently) Engineer: a power PvE melee DPS spec that doesn't relies on switching kits (rejoice, unless its damage is shit and playing keyboard piano condi Engineer is still better)
Ranger: a spec for people who hates the pet
Revenant: a ranged condi DPS spec (I think, I haven't seen skill tooltips for it yet)
Elementalist: my condolence to Ele players, you have 40 new weapons skills to learn and memorize...
the new elementalist spec is awesome , mixing elements is COOL AF! , plus SWORD! finally
tons of melee specs tho the only classes that got ranged weapons are Revenant (short bow) and Thief Rifle ....
RIP HoT specs. Hope nobody enjoyed playing them because they will never be viable again, just like vanilla specs. Gotta make way for the latest P2W cash grab specs.
Caffynated - Some of the preview build videos that have been posted online (namely Wooden Potatoes' Aftershow) noted that some of the Elite Specs had certain traits nerfed to prevent overlap. It has been stated before by ANet that Elite Specs are SUPPOSED to be both more powerful and more specialized than the base class (hence "ELITE" spec).
Anyone expecting Elite Specs to be balanced against the Core specs will probably be disappointed (especially since the "Core" game can only be bought with HoT or PoF, you can only get "Base" game via F2P now).
Point is, some of the early builds have already shown the HoT and PoF elite specs being balanced against each other in those preview game builds.
Actually they said the the exact opposite. "Elite" was just the phrase they chose and they intended them to be sidegrades.
Saying anything else is complete revisionist history.
Elite specs were meant to be a sidegrade. I suppose it could be said that they were to be better at a specific focused task at the expense of not being better at stuff outside that, but they weren't supposed to completely supersede the base class.
You are correct. However, I see the issue with the new philosophy becoming less significant with each expansion, so long as elite specs are balanced against eachother. I look forward to seeing the meta implications when these new especs come in.
I bought the game for the WvW. I was hoping for something akin to DAOC. Instead I got "matches" that last for a few days. That drove me away. (sigh) Guess I'll just keep waiting for CAMELOT UNCHAINED.
See, you're probably playing a Dagger/Dagger power build, so yeah, if you're thinking a daredevil with dagger dagger power is the same as before you're not sacrificing or gaining much damage.
But staff daredevil in PvP is one of the most ridiculous damage dealers in the game and was one of the metas. So was a Condi-Dagger/Dagger evasion build. Both were insanely tough to beat. Hands down you could barely touch them when played properly. Regular D/D builds don't even register on the same scale as those hokey elite builds, that generally revolved around 1 mechanic that required daredevil.
It was like that for the majority of classes. Dragon Hunter? Traps were the pinnacle of PvP, EVEN if you went burn guard, traps were utilized. Scrapper? Way more sustain and damage output across the board, with the only other viable engineer build being a condition dual pistols build and that was tough to sustain due to the increase in condi clears after HoT.
Elite specs were far and away the meta across the board.
Something like that but not copied and paste from a forum yes. The staff does more damage but for some reason it just wont work for me, the daggers fit my playstyle far better and frankly do I kill staff wielding daredevils 8 times out of 10 1 on 1 anyways.
Still, the only class I tend to have issues with is the necro for some reason even if all classes are dangerous with a good player. The daredevils usually can't handle the dodging right for some reason so they are not as big issue usually.
I am not saying the elite classes ain't more powerful then the old ones, just that they ain't so more powerful as some here think. Those 2 extra dodges comes in handy though.
So free weekend starts tomorrow. Anyone else planning to go dino riding?
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
See, you're probably playing a Dagger/Dagger power build, so yeah, if you're thinking a daredevil with dagger dagger power is the same as before you're not sacrificing or gaining much damage.
But staff daredevil in PvP is one of the most ridiculous damage dealers in the game and was one of the metas. So was a Condi-Dagger/Dagger evasion build. Both were insanely tough to beat. Hands down you could barely touch them when played properly. Regular D/D builds don't even register on the same scale as those hokey elite builds, that generally revolved around 1 mechanic that required daredevil.
It was like that for the majority of classes. Dragon Hunter? Traps were the pinnacle of PvP, EVEN if you went burn guard, traps were utilized. Scrapper? Way more sustain and damage output across the board, with the only other viable engineer build being a condition dual pistols build and that was tough to sustain due to the increase in condi clears after HoT.
Elite specs were far and away the meta across the board.
Something like that but not copied and paste from a forum yes. The staff does more damage but for some reason it just wont work for me, the daggers fit my playstyle far better and frankly do I kill staff wielding daredevils 8 times out of 10 1 on 1 anyways.
Still, the only class I tend to have issues with is the necro for some reason even if all classes are dangerous with a good player. The daredevils usually can't handle the dodging right for some reason so they are not as big issue usually.
I am not saying the elite classes ain't more powerful then the old ones, just that they ain't so more powerful as some here think. Those 2 extra dodges comes in handy though.
Well, usually the staff daredevils are weak against stealth and burst. they are made as evasion heavy classes so you playing a D/D stealth thief you have the advantage. But when you take into consideration group dynamics, a staff daredevil is extremely strong against groups trying to hold a point. Evasion condi thieves are too, and the condi thieves actually are strong against stealth builds as many use traps which are kind of OP and can stack conditions quickly, and non-daredevil stealth thieves are usually not condi clear heavy.
As for the elite classes being "not much more powerful" it really depends on the class. I don't know if I'll come back for this next set of builds. I haven't played GW2 in a while now. I am interested to see what they did to my engineer.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
I wish they would release more elite specs at once. The situation will be much better now that it's not a simple "take it or don't" but I feel like they haven't really taken advantage of that opportunity.
Comments
The unique thing about the mounts is not the mounts themselves but that each mount has unique abilities that allow it to get to specific places. One mount is required to jump over large gaps, another to high places and so on. It's for that horizontal progression / metrovania-style thing.
As for the power of these elite specs compared to HoT elite specs, I'll take a wait-and-see approach. I was a bit disappointed that HoT's elite specs turned out to be stronger than the core specs. But if they manage to make the PoF specs of similar power but with different niches then I'm going to be happy.
I had fun once, it was terrible.
Of course the new elite specs will be more powerful. Otherwise why would someone pick them? There are so many play styles atm that you would pick up a different class instead.
An expansion will never be p2w.
What you mean is that if there were no new elite specs and/or if those new elite specs weren't more powerful, PvPers would have no reason to buy the new expansion.
Keep dreaming. A company will not continue to develop a game or a game mode without expecting revenue.
It is not like the PvP community is bringing more players to GW2 to justify not buying new expansions.
If it wasn't elite specs it would be new maps, or tournaments only for the new expansion, or rewards only for the new expansion, or new overpowered classes only for the new expansion, etc.
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
Caffynated - Some of the preview build videos that have been posted online (namely Wooden Potatoes' Aftershow) noted that some of the Elite Specs had certain traits nerfed to prevent overlap. It has been stated before by ANet that Elite Specs are SUPPOSED to be both more powerful and more specialized than the base class (hence "ELITE" spec).
Anyone expecting Elite Specs to be balanced against the Core specs will probably be disappointed (especially since the "Core" game can only be bought with HoT or PoF, you can only get "Base" game via F2P now).
Point is, some of the early builds have already shown the HoT and PoF elite specs being balanced against each other in those preview game builds.
But staff daredevil in PvP is one of the most ridiculous damage dealers in the game and was one of the metas. So was a Condi-Dagger/Dagger evasion build. Both were insanely tough to beat. Hands down you could barely touch them when played properly. Regular D/D builds don't even register on the same scale as those hokey elite builds, that generally revolved around 1 mechanic that required daredevil.
It was like that for the majority of classes. Dragon Hunter? Traps were the pinnacle of PvP, EVEN if you went burn guard, traps were utilized. Scrapper? Way more sustain and damage output across the board, with the only other viable engineer build being a condition dual pistols build and that was tough to sustain due to the increase in condi clears after HoT.
Elite specs were far and away the meta across the board.
Saying anything else is complete revisionist history.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
It is true @ LilithM that when HoT was released mobs were "overtuned" and some easily 1 shot players.
However, as much as the DEVs tried on the forums to reason with the community about allowing a more hardcore approach to the game, everyone kept complaining raging and some quit - so eventually mobs were nerfed to the ground.
Path of Fire will be the same. No matter what unique concepts this expansion will bring, players will start complaining and kitten their way into ruining everything all over again.
"This is too hard! Change it!" will again be the common forum motto and after a few months we'll see the expansion changed drastically, without a doubt.
I have ordered the Ultimate edition of the PoF and I'm waiting patiently while wondering about mounts and how impactful they'll be gameplay-wise. I don't like mounts and I have no interest in them. I hope there will be some choice in this regard.
the new elementalist spec is awesome , mixing elements is COOL AF! , plus SWORD! finally
tons of melee specs tho the only classes that got ranged weapons are Revenant (short bow) and Thief Rifle ....
Still, the only class I tend to have issues with is the necro for some reason even if all classes are dangerous with a good player. The daredevils usually can't handle the dodging right for some reason so they are not as big issue usually.
I am not saying the elite classes ain't more powerful then the old ones, just that they ain't so more powerful as some here think. Those 2 extra dodges comes in handy though.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
As for the elite classes being "not much more powerful" it really depends on the class. I don't know if I'll come back for this next set of builds. I haven't played GW2 in a while now. I am interested to see what they did to my engineer.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey