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Official forums are out of control

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  • AmjocoAmjoco Layton, UTPosts: 4,777Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Mtibbs1989
    Originally posted by evilized
    Free to play crowd, is it any wonder?

    More like the current cesspool of people brooding hate in the gaming community today. This attitude exists regardless of payment model.

    I totally agree. Please send me back to around 1997! I loved it when gaming was just for nerds with pocket protectors, and broken black rim glasses. This is just out of control anymore.

    Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.

  • Asm0deusAsm0deus BaatorPosts: 1,112Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by evilized
    Internet crowd, is it any wonder?

    Fixed that for ya!

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  • rodingorodingo Posts: 2,346Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by rodingo
    Originally posted by fivoroth
    Typical "freeloader" comments. These people have jobs and are so busy and can't afford 9 bucks a month. Really? That's like 1-2 pints of beer!

    Exactly.  Maybe they feel the beer is the worth price but not the game.  I can think of quite a few games that I would rather spend the money on piss beer than waste it on a sub.  It's all about perceived value and right now even Keystone is more worthy of my money than any sub based MMO. 

    So the game is worthy of your time, but not your money?

    Got it.

    No. You don't "got it".  It's not worthy of my time either.  No where did I say it was.

    "If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor

  • Bad.dogBad.dog Belleville, ONPosts: 1,108Member
    Originally posted by rodingo
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by rodingo
    Originally posted by fivoroth
    Typical "freeloader" comments. These people have jobs and are so busy and can't afford 9 bucks a month. Really? That's like 1-2 pints of beer!

    Exactly.  Maybe they feel the beer is the worth price but not the game.  I can think of quite a few games that I would rather spend the money on piss beer than waste it on a sub.  It's all about perceived value and right now even Keystone is more worthy of my money than any sub based MMO. 

    So the game is worthy of your time, but not your money?

    Got it.

    No. You don't "got it".  It's not worthy of my time either.  No where did I say it was.

    Well this is a great chance for you to run along then ....if it's not worth your time or your money then it's also not worth your opinion

  • rodingorodingo Posts: 2,346Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Bad.dog
    Originally posted by rodingo
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by rodingo
    Originally posted by fivoroth
    Typical "freeloader" comments. These people have jobs and are so busy and can't afford 9 bucks a month. Really? That's like 1-2 pints of beer!

    Exactly.  Maybe they feel the beer is the worth price but not the game.  I can think of quite a few games that I would rather spend the money on piss beer than waste it on a sub.  It's all about perceived value and right now even Keystone is more worthy of my money than any sub based MMO. 

    So the game is worthy of your time, but not your money?

    Got it.

    No. You don't "got it".  It's not worthy of my time either.  No where did I say it was.

    Well this is a great chance for you to run along then ....if it's not worth your time or your money then it's also not worth your opinion

    Last I checked this is a discussion forum.  If you don't like who posts or how they post then I suggest you either block them or make your own website with forums and moderate it how you see fit.

    edit: BTW, I already had "ran along", but you unknowingly invited me back with your snide remark.

    "If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor

  • Charlie.CheswickCharlie.Cheswick Manhattan, NYPosts: 247Member Uncommon

    So let me get this straight. This hyperbolic thread references some hyperbolic posts in a few hyperbolic threads on a f2p game's forums?

    Impossible!

    May I have my cigarettes, please, Miss Ratched?

  • saurus123saurus123 nonePosts: 568Member Uncommon

    if the company doesnt care about free players then soon you will play an empty game

     

    happening all the time in games with VIP systems

    one of them is age of wushu

    just few players left that spend alot of money on the game, the gold sellers and bots

    free players left the game already

  • goboygogoboygo Posts: 790Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by saurus123

    if the company doesnt care about free players then soon you will play an empty game

     

    happening all the time in games with VIP systems

    one of them is age of wushu

    just few players left that spend alot of money on the game, the gold sellers and bots

    free players left the game already

    I think its allot simpler that that, if all the want to play for free players left and nobody wants to pay to play your game, then well guess what ITS A GAME NOT WORTH PAYING FOR.

    Its really as simple as that.

    "Fighting Internet stupidity one post at at time"
  • maccarthur2004maccarthur2004 SPosts: 510Member
    Originally posted by LacedOpium
    Originally posted by grimal

    I wasn't aware that SWTOR did not allow posts for nonsubscribers;  I look at their forums from time to time but never post there (I will check though now since I have stopped my sub).

    Two questions:

    1) If F2P MMO  ==  trashy forums....what is the answer?  I haven't looked recently but is this common amongst any other F2P mmos (EQ1, Marvel, APB)?  If so, what do they do?  Limit the forum to sub or an elevated status level?

    2) If F2P != trashy forums....why on this one?  Is it really because people are that upset?  Or is it due to a certain crowd being drawn to this title??  If so, what do they do?  If they start a massive wave of post deletions, I'm sure the crowd will flock to other sites complaining of it.  Or do they wipe at launch and limit thereafter?

     

    Please do not turn this into a free to play vs sub flame war. 

     

    F2P +  AAA + PvP + OW +  Popular + Hype + Quality Game = Garbage Community

    WoW isn't F2P and hasn't OW FFA PVP, but still has the worst comunity of all mmos.

     

    "What we are aiming in ArcheAge is to let the players feel the true fun of MMORPG by forming a community like real life by interacting with other players, whether it be conflict or cooperation." (Jake Song)

    image
  • GhabboGhabbo Buenos AiresPosts: 251Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by maccarthur2004
    Originally posted by LacedOpium
    Originally posted by grimal

    I wasn't aware that SWTOR did not allow posts for nonsubscribers;  I look at their forums from time to time but never post there (I will check though now since I have stopped my sub).

    Two questions:

    1) If F2P MMO  ==  trashy forums....what is the answer?  I haven't looked recently but is this common amongst any other F2P mmos (EQ1, Marvel, APB)?  If so, what do they do?  Limit the forum to sub or an elevated status level?

    2) If F2P != trashy forums....why on this one?  Is it really because people are that upset?  Or is it due to a certain crowd being drawn to this title??  If so, what do they do?  If they start a massive wave of post deletions, I'm sure the crowd will flock to other sites complaining of it.  Or do they wipe at launch and limit thereafter?

     

    Please do not turn this into a free to play vs sub flame war. 

     

    F2P +  AAA + PvP + OW +  Popular + Hype + Quality Game = Garbage Community

    WoW isn't F2P and hasn't OW FFA PVP, but still has the worst comunity of all mmos.

     

    It's been a while since I don't play WoW, but I'm pretty sure MMOs "community quality" became gradually normalized throughout the years. There are some exceptions though.

     

     

  • fearufearu Your mom's pantiesPosts: 142Member Uncommon

    AA has been far too over-hyped and now that lots more people are trying it in the so called "Beta" tests they are finding themselves majorly disappointed at what they are presented with. They are then heading to the forums to vent and like usual the diehard fans can't help but vehemently defend the game, producing the poop-cycle you see on the official forums.

     

     

  • grimalgrimal Stamford, CTPosts: 2,873Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Pepeq
    Originally posted by grimal

    I wasn't aware that SWTOR did not allow posts for nonsubscribers;  I look at their forums from time to time but never post there (I will check though now since I have stopped my sub).

    Two questions:

    1) If F2P MMO  ==  trashy forums....what is the answer?  I haven't looked recently but is this common amongst any other F2P mmos (EQ1, Marvel, APB)?  If so, what do they do?  Limit the forum to sub or an elevated status level?

    2) If F2P != trashy forums....why on this one?  Is it really because people are that upset?  Or is it due to a certain crowd being drawn to this title??  If so, what do they do?  If they start a massive wave of post deletions, I'm sure the crowd will flock to other sites complaining of it.  Or do they wipe at launch and limit thereafter?

     

    Please do not turn this into a free to play vs sub flame war. 

    They're likely to wipe the forums for launch since its all beta related now anyways.

    Since the game is F2P, you're giving access to people who might not actually even be playing the game.  This is something that subscription based games can filter out... no active sub, no forum privileges.  Doesn't really stop the vile... paying customers can be just as bad.  Ultimately you need moderated forums... which they currently really don't moderate.  But if you moderate, you also tend to drive the course of the discussion in your favor.

    People already flock to other sites to post their opinions... you see it here everyday... including this post itself... we're discussing forum moderation at a developer's website on another website.  Should it not happen at the place in which the discussion is most relevant?  But to do so would be to enter into the arena, and the assumption is, you're not going to be immediately beheaded here where it is an absolute certainty to occur there.

    I think if you consider the people who are playing the game and who never even once post on forums such as these are the very people you seek to have a discussion with, it seems odd that you would even expect anything less than what you observe at the other forums.  They aren't the people you wish to enter into a discussion with, unless arguments and whatnot are what you seek.

    You take moderation out of the Blizzard forums, it will quickly turn into a cesspool.  You allow anyone to post there, it's an absolute certainty.  Again, the preponderance of the playerbase has never once visited their forums.  The ones that do complain about the game to the same extent as they would here... only a ban hammer is levied above their heads to keep them in check.

    So what's the best way for future companies going the f2p route to handle this?   If I'm a paying subscriber and the forums are constantly flooded with garbage like that, I'd be angry.  Yet as a f2p player, I would like the ability to ask questions or speak about the game on the forums.

    i know blizzard at one time considered using real names to show in account posts.  I'm wondering if something along those lines is a better solution or just too drastic.

  • Bad.dogBad.dog Belleville, ONPosts: 1,108Member

    So what's the best way for future companies going the f2p route to handle this?   If I'm a paying subscriber and the forums are constantly flooded with garbage like that, I'd be angry.  Yet as a f2p player, I would like the ability to ask questions or speak about the game on the forums.

    As always in life it only takes a few real asshats to cause a lot of grief for a great number of reasonable folks

  • Drunk-fuDrunk-fu MucsajröcsögePosts: 129Member

    Those who say wow has the worst community, have obviously never played Aion.

    But to be honest, whatever game you may play, the assoles will always find  you.

    It really is just the law of large numbers. The more player there is, the more asshole you'll find.

    And people who aren't satisfied with something,  are the ones who tend to be the louder.

    Why most people goes to a forum is, they either have a question or a complaint.

    You don't visit the forums to say how your day was.

    Though this shouldn't mean that people have to act like 10y/o laptop gangstas.

    They do it because most people who will read/comment on your topic will most likely be the ones who are complaining.

    I do belive this is partly Trion's fault. Because they advertise their product as F2P.

    Sure you aren't forced to cough up the cash, to get to were you want faster.

    And this is where the players are wrong. Because they see this as a limitation on their gaming experience, rather than an extra for P2P players.

    My personal opinion is that, people shouldn't just torrent games.

    Then get upset if they have to pay for something, and there is no backdoor to avoid it.

    I think it is very simple, if you want to play with a game, you have to play by the rules they set for you.

    If you don't agree with the rules,  then don't  play it, but trying to force your own rules, opinion on a company is just... sorry... but retarded. And this is the qq we see on the official forum.

    Im sorry if my opinion hurt any of the above mentioned assholes.

    And sorry for my poor English knowledge, as i learnt it from games.

  • AsariashaAsariasha Somewhere inPosts: 218Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by grimal
    Originally posted by Pepeq
    Originally posted by grimal

    I wasn't aware that SWTOR did not allow posts for nonsubscribers;  I look at their forums from time to time but never post there (I will check though now since I have stopped my sub).

    Two questions:

    1) If F2P MMO  ==  trashy forums....what is the answer?  I haven't looked recently but is this common amongst any other F2P mmos (EQ1, Marvel, APB)?  If so, what do they do?  Limit the forum to sub or an elevated status level?

    2) If F2P != trashy forums....why on this one?  Is it really because people are that upset?  Or is it due to a certain crowd being drawn to this title??  If so, what do they do?  If they start a massive wave of post deletions, I'm sure the crowd will flock to other sites complaining of it.  Or do they wipe at launch and limit thereafter?

     

    Please do not turn this into a free to play vs sub flame war. 

    They're likely to wipe the forums for launch since its all beta related now anyways.

    Since the game is F2P, you're giving access to people who might not actually even be playing the game.  This is something that subscription based games can filter out... no active sub, no forum privileges.  Doesn't really stop the vile... paying customers can be just as bad.  Ultimately you need moderated forums... which they currently really don't moderate.  But if you moderate, you also tend to drive the course of the discussion in your favor.

    People already flock to other sites to post their opinions... you see it here everyday... including this post itself... we're discussing forum moderation at a developer's website on another website.  Should it not happen at the place in which the discussion is most relevant?  But to do so would be to enter into the arena, and the assumption is, you're not going to be immediately beheaded here where it is an absolute certainty to occur there.

    I think if you consider the people who are playing the game and who never even once post on forums such as these are the very people you seek to have a discussion with, it seems odd that you would even expect anything less than what you observe at the other forums.  They aren't the people you wish to enter into a discussion with, unless arguments and whatnot are what you seek.

    You take moderation out of the Blizzard forums, it will quickly turn into a cesspool.  You allow anyone to post there, it's an absolute certainty.  Again, the preponderance of the playerbase has never once visited their forums.  The ones that do complain about the game to the same extent as they would here... only a ban hammer is levied above their heads to keep them in check.

    So what's the best way for future companies going the f2p route to handle this?   If I'm a paying subscriber and the forums are constantly flooded with garbage like that, I'd be angry.  Yet as a f2p player, I would like the ability to ask questions or speak about the game on the forums.

    i know blizzard at one time considered using real names to show in account posts.  I'm wondering if something along those lines is a better solution or just too drastic.

     

    The problem with today's free-2-play players is that they firmly believe that the customer is always right. But back when this phrase was formed, customer meant paying customer. This and the anonymity of the internet given, you are facing players that act like emotionally disturbed children.

    The customer is worth everything and nothing. Especially in free-2-play games. Without them there wouldn't be a business. But if you see it from an economic stand point and calculate the average revenue per user which ranges in free-2-play titles somewhere between € 1.00 - 5.00.-, there is absolutely no justification to address the issues of trolls.

    Your solution is not too drastic. It is probably the only solution to maintain a healthy forum community for a free-2-play title without having high expenses on Community Management. People simply tend to have better manners when they have a "face".

     

     

  • jesteralwaysjesteralways ChittagongPosts: 1,007Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by rodingo
    Originally posted by jesteralways
    Originally posted by rodingo
    Originally posted by fivoroth
    Typical "freeloader" comments. These people have jobs and are so busy and can't afford 9 bucks a month. Really? That's like 1-2 pints of beer!

    Exactly.  Maybe they feel the beer is the worth price but not the game.  I can think of quite a few games that I would rather spend the money on piss beer than waste it on a sub.  It's all about perceived value and right now even Keystone is more worthy of my money than any sub based MMO. 

    Then don't play these games, It is as simple as that. you wanna play their game, you want to enjoy the game to your heart's content but as soon as a topic of payment(for something that is valid and reasonable, not trying to grab cash for something like quick bar) comes you tell them to fuck off, you go to their forums and use slur, you come to a mmo site and antagonize the game and publisher. that is a mental problem

    LOL.  Easy there killer. 

    I was talking of perceived value and I think you mistook me for someone that wants to,..hmm lets see:

    1) Wants to play a f2p game until my heart is content?  Not even remotely sure where you got that from.  Thinking a game is not worth a sub is not the same as wanting to play a f2p game.

    2) Telling people to "fuck off".  No, I didn't do that either.

    3) I go to game's forums and use slurs.  No, though I think you fit that bill.

    4) I go to an MMO site and antagonize a game and it's publisher?  Seriously?

    Funny you mention mental problem....

    That "you" is directed to all the players who are bashing AA because it is a subscription based game. this "you" is directed to all players who fits the criteria i mentioned in my post. it is not solely directed to you. I should have elaborated it in my post. But again, don't play the subscription based games or if an f2p game comes with "optional" subscription. you should spend your money on beer and don't even come here to explain why beer is more worthy of your $$ which is over and done in about 2 min while a game that entertains for years is not worthy of mere 15$ a month.

    i want an open world, no phasing, no instancing.i want meaningful owpvp.i want player driven economy.i want meaningful crafting.i want awesome exploration, a sense of thrill.i want ow housing with a meaningful effect on my entire gameplay experience, not just some instanced crap.i want all of these free of cost, i don't wanna pay you a cent, game devs can eat grass and continue developing game for me.
    Seems like that is the current consensus of western mmo players.

  • SpottyGekkoSpottyGekko RotterdamPosts: 3,845Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by evilized
    Originally posted by Mtibbs1989
    Originally posted by evilized
    Free to play crowd, is it any wonder?

    More like the current cesspool of people brooding hate in the gaming community today. This attitude exists regardless of payment model.

     

    This too. You will see a larger segment of complainers in a free environment though.

    The general chat during the Closed Beta events had more "bro's" than I've ever seen outside of an online shooter...

     

    I suspect that AA will suffer from an initial overload of "F2P peeveepee'ers", but hopefully things will settle down some after their attention spans have been exceeded. Shouldn't take more than a month at most... image

     

    Getting through that first few weeks will be an exercise in patience and endurance though.

  • phumbabaphumbaba kuopioPosts: 138Member
    Originally posted by grimal

    I wasn't aware that SWTOR did not allow posts for nonsubscribers;  I look at their forums from time to time but never post there (I will check though now since I have stopped my sub).

    Two questions:

    1) If F2P MMO  ==  trashy forums....what is the answer?  I haven't looked recently but is this common amongst any other F2P mmos (EQ1, Marvel, APB)?  If so, what do they do?  Limit the forum to sub or an elevated status level?

    2) If F2P != trashy forums....why on this one?  Is it really because people are that upset?  Or is it due to a certain crowd being drawn to this title??  If so, what do they do?  If they start a massive wave of post deletions, I'm sure the crowd will flock to other sites complaining of it.  Or do they wipe at launch and limit thereafter?

     

    Please do not turn this into a free to play vs sub flame war. 

    No, F2p does not always == trashy forums. I would argue the reasons for the situation in AA are quite clear. The game is advertised as sandbox with f2p no tricks, no traps and it's beta. Problems are plenty in contrast to expectations and hype surrounding the game. Frustration, immaturity and total freedom to express your opinion without consequence. Not a good recipe to foster a good community. Completely foreseeable in case of AA.

  • AmbrosiaAmorAmbrosiaAmor Miami, FLPosts: 915Member
    Originally posted by Remains

    There's topics other than F2P that are being discussed loudly. Like this for instance:

    http://forums.archeagegame.com/showthread.php?30017-Cash-Shop-Is-Going-To-Ruin-The-Game-At-This-Rate

     

    55 pages and still going. Almost 1200 folks are not happy with the way the cash shop is being handled versus 200 that are O.K. with it. How will XL Games and TRION handle this?

    image

  • An4thorAn4thor RomaPosts: 524Member
    Originally posted by AmbrosiaAmor
    Originally posted by Remains

    There's topics other than F2P that are being discussed loudly. Like this for instance:

    http://forums.archeagegame.com/showthread.php?30017-Cash-Shop-Is-Going-To-Ruin-The-Game-At-This-Rate

     

    55 pages and still going. Almost 1200 folks are not happy with the way the cash shop is being handled versus 200 that are O.K. with it. How will XL Games and TRION handle this?

    If they are smart they will make changes.

  • kitaradkitarad RomePosts: 1,742Member Uncommon
    Why maintain a forum for f2p they are not paying so boot them and make sure only subbers can post on the forums or keep it to the founders for now. Why waste time and money policing forums full of freeloaders.

    image

  • SpottyGekkoSpottyGekko RotterdamPosts: 3,845Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by AmbrosiaAmor
    Originally posted by Remains

    There's topics other than F2P that are being discussed loudly. Like this for instance:

    http://forums.archeagegame.com/showthread.php?30017-Cash-Shop-Is-Going-To-Ruin-The-Game-At-This-Rate

     

    55 pages and still going. Almost 1200 folks are not happy with the way the cash shop is being handled versus 200 that are O.K. with it. How will XL Games and TRION handle this?

    At best, Trion will pass-on the player sentiment to XLGames, who will in all likelihood largely disregard it.

     

    I imagine XLGames are already working on their next MMO for the Korean market. If AA "fails" in NA/EU, I seriously doubt whether XLGames will devote significant resources to developing a "western" version of AA. If they had felt that strongly about it, it would already be done. They'll most likely just move the game away from Trion to a less "picky" publisher and/or shut it down in the west if it becomes really unprofitable.

  • AmjocoAmjoco Layton, UTPosts: 4,777Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by kitarad
    Why maintain a forum for f2p they are not paying so boot them and make sure only subbers can post on the forums or keep it to the founders for now. Why waste time and money policing forums full of freeloaders.

    I'm not real familiar with this games f2p format, but don't they make money from it? 

    Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.

  • KyleranKyleran Tampa, FLPosts: 19,980Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by AmbrosiaAmor
    Originally posted by Remains

    There's topics other than F2P that are being discussed loudly. Like this for instance:

    http://forums.archeagegame.com/showthread.php?30017-Cash-Shop-Is-Going-To-Ruin-The-Game-At-This-Rate

     

    55 pages and still going. Almost 1200 folks are not happy with the way the cash shop is being handled versus 200 that are O.K. with it. How will XL Games and TRION handle this?


    So much QQ about relatively nothing:  This is what they are upset about:

    - Sand glasses are what restore your boat when its broken (these will sell for extremely high prices early on and proceed to lose value over time).
    - Eco fuel is what used to be called "meteors", but basically provides ~5m speed boost to your boat, which is very useful on the ocean.
    - Regrade scrolls basically make it so that you have a very high chance of making your gear better (For high level weapons the difference between green and mythic tier of the same item is almost x2)

    They want people to fight in this game, and ocean based combat is a main way to PVP. People won't be as willing to do it if reparing boats is too expensive, so I've no objections to this addition.

    Of course, if you are trying to evade the enemy, Eco fuel is very important too, watched my guildmates out run many enemies on a recent trade pack run, until they came across another ship that had it as well.  Again, not a game breaker and good for the combat portion of the game.

    Regrade scrolls do suck, I don't like chance based item improvement items in any game, cash shop or otherwise.

    For the most part, these changes will prevent alchemists or other crafters from making a fortune selling them in the early game, fine with me, I'm not really crafter, and could care less what crafters want in terms of dominating the economy. 

    Someone called crafting the "metagame" of ArcheAge, if so, they need to stamp that out as quickly as possible. Territory control via PVP should be the metagame, and I think 2 of 3 changes above actually support this. Crafting should be designed to support the PVP metagame, not the other way around.

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.
    "I don't have one life, I have many lives" - Grunty
    Still currently "subscribed" to EVE, and only EVE!!!
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  • doodphacedoodphace Vancouver, BCPosts: 1,815Member
    Originally posted by rodingo
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by rodingo
    Originally posted by fivoroth
    Typical "freeloader" comments. These people have jobs and are so busy and can't afford 9 bucks a month. Really? That's like 1-2 pints of beer!

    Exactly.  Maybe they feel the beer is the worth price but not the game.  I can think of quite a few games that I would rather spend the money on piss beer than waste it on a sub.  It's all about perceived value and right now even Keystone is more worthy of my money than any sub based MMO. 

    So the game is worthy of your time, but not your money?

    Got it.

    No. You don't "got it".  It's not worthy of my time either.  No where did I say it was.

    The discussion was talking about paying subscription fees. If the game is not worth your time or money, what would said game being "F2P" solve? ...or did you just want to complain.

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