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Why I left EVE -- and why you shouldn't bother with this game.

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Comments

  • WickershamWickersham Mississauga, ONPosts: 2,379Member
    A few months isn't enough time to become accustomed to how eve is different than your typical MMORPG; so, instead of picking the game apart on this forum due to something you don't fully understand why don't you just ask the vets here for advice or help?

    "The liberties and resulting economic prosperity that YOU take for granted were granted by those "dead guys"

  • Beatnik59Beatnik59 Chicago, ILPosts: 2,238Member Uncommon

    I played EVE for a few years, mainly around the FSCN/BOB wars and the Good/BOB wars.  I can't lie.  I dug on it.  I ran a corp (a roleplay corp), joined corps and ran my own private mining corp with my alt.  Never got suicide ganked in highsec (I left around the time it was becoming popular), I did my share of 0.0 fighting/ratting and low-sec fighting/ratting.

    I didn't leave because of the grief.  Grief is actually really easy to avoid if you just do some basic things, like run a tackler/escort alt orbiting your covetor, or not going in on Teamspeak/Vent, or not registering for player forums.  I have to laugh when these EVE heavyweights b!tch about "vent hacks" and website hacks in a game that actually promotes metagaming as a way to win.  I say what goes around, comes around, and I bet you'll see a whole lot more hacks and malware attacks as this game progresses into its next decade (if it even lasts that long).

    But you see, that's the real problem with EVE.  As it's a game that is centered around professionalized clan versus clan organizations, the very entry requirements to the "game in chief" exposes you to the dirty tricks.  You want to join an alliance corp?  That's cool...but expect to be required to register to forums, log on to Teamspeak, killboards, yadda yadda, and then some time down the line get hacked by an alliance who takes you down.  But that's just window dressing.

    Strangely enough, when I went out cruising for a fight in lo-sec with my puny Punisher frigate, nearly all the would-be pirates and gankers I targeted warped out real quick.  Pussies, really.  Why?  Real simple.  They know that I'm flying something that I don't give a sh!t about, so they don't give a sh!t about it.  What they want is the Caldari Navy battleship you earned, or the covetor, or something they know you like...even something cheap and worthless to them is better if they know it's important to you.

    When I played, piracy was seen as a profession; a way to earn ISK.  These days, it seems piracy is just a way to earn lulz and forum fame.  Cheap gimmicks, really.  That's all EVE seems to be about now.

    Part of it may be that the EVE faithful already have achieved their goals, and have new goals...perhaps even perverse goals...which don't include much game-related satisfaction anymore.  They don't need ISK.  They don't need security.  They don't even need to train new skills so much.  What they need is to get a rise out of another human being, or to feel that all the EVE success makes them special, or powerful, or whatnot.

    Part of it may also be that CCP just isn't interested in giving you much of a game to play if you aren't going to "fit in" to the way the alliances have set things up on Tranquility (namely, mandatory voice use, IP tracking, professionalized guild membership, etc.).  Most of the players who aren't in that 10% of alliance players are still playing no better than Castor, as far as their gameplay.

    To the guy who got canned and said, "I felt that," congratulations.  You have now just become initiated into the death-spiral of hardcore addictiveness, where your emotional health is now tied into a system that makes money--hand over fist--off of your emotional crisis.  The fact that you "got revenge" is, in the long run, probably the worst thing that could happen to you, since it'll only feed you deeper into the obsession.

    But I do have to agree with the folks here, the EVE faithful, who say that CCP isn't going to change, and that grief is just part of the EVE experience.  Grief is, quite frankly, the only thing that is keeping the accounts subbed. to this thing  Grief has always been the flipside of powergaming; I don't think you can separate the two, psychologically.  Grief gives you an incentive to become a powergamer, it gives you drive to maintain your power, and it is also your reward (to grief others at will) for powergaming well.  EVE wouldn't survive without it, since without grief, hardcore EVE players would no longer have any hopes or fears.  CCP, I think, knows this, which is why they are going to double-down and triple down on it whenever it is convenient.  Tales of grief get the PLEX bought, the PLEX used and the accounts resubbed for those who are on the fence.

    __________________________
    "Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
    --Arcken

    "...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
    --Hellmar, CEO of CCP.

    "It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
    --Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE

  • kinartkinart KalavrytaPosts: 120Member Common
    I haven't played EvE and now considering trying it. I don't understand though OP, if you really feel about this cause, why don't you make a guild with other people and hunt down the grievers? Like Space Police or something.
  • QuesaQuesa Sacramento, CAPosts: 1,246Member
    Originally posted by kinart
    I haven't played EvE and now considering trying it. I don't understand though OP, if you really feel about this cause, why don't you make a guild with other people and hunt down the grievers? Like Space Police or something.

    Because that would take effort...

  • IkedaIkeda Largo, FLPosts: 2,204Member Uncommon

    Hahah El Oh El.

    So it's pretty public.  I've been back in Eve, what, like 1-2 weeks now.  I lost my first ship lastnight.  I (being dumb) warped into a combat hub with my light explorer frigate.  Except, it wasn't just any combat hub but one of the Sansha's hardest hitting combat hubs.  

    A person, with a warrant, came in, helped clear the area (took them 1.5 hrs), and then helped me get my stuff back.  They even handed me all the salvage. (~63million)

    Now...

    How many gankers have I seen in 2 weeks?  0.  

    I did have one arsehat scan my Badger II as I was leaving Penirgman with a cargo full of Exploration items (5 Herons, with full gear, including rigs probes drones).  But, I expect that when I'm flying ye ol barge of goodies.

    So I think people just wanna get their panties twisted about the game.  Today, they overhauled Industry and I've heard both positives and negatives.  If I were a long time player it might make me more skittish, but since I'm not I like the changes.

    SWTOR: F2P or Premium? Want Galactic Strongholds early? http://www.swtor.com/r/LbMdN7 Use the referral for 7 days of subscriber access. Unlock your GS today!

  • RylahRylah Tribal VillagePosts: 193Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Ikeda

    Hahah El Oh El.

    So it's pretty public.  I've been back in Eve, what, like 1-2 weeks now.  I lost my first ship lastnight.  I (being dumb) warped into a combat hub with my light explorer frigate.  Except, it wasn't just any combat hub but one of the Sansha's hardest hitting combat hubs.  

    A person, with a warrant, came in, helped clear the area (took them 1.5 hrs), and then helped me get my stuff back.  They even handed me all the salvage. (~63million)

    Now...

    How many gankers have I seen in 2 weeks?  0.  

    I did have one arsehat scan my Badger II as I was leaving Penirgman with a cargo full of Exploration items (5 Herons, with full gear, including rigs probes drones).  But, I expect that when I'm flying ye ol barge of goodies.

    So I think people just wanna get their panties twisted about the game.  Today, they overhauled Industry and I've heard both positives and negatives.  If I were a long time player it might make me more skittish, but since I'm not I like the changes.

    That's the spirit!

    About the industry changes: For long time near monopolists the changes are of course a bit harsh, but the overall goal of EvE, to move power from the game to players, was reached perfectly. Production is now both more risky and potentially more rewarding than before as it should be. Sucks that I get a bit less out of salvage but I pay this price happily when looking at how this will shake some markets and player behaviour up.

    To the guy above who was lecturing about hacking... If you join a corp of this kind because you think it will actually improve your gaming experience you deserve every little bit they have coming at you. It's really not hard to sort the better apples from the rotten ones.

    Now let's hope that the changes to 0.0 CCP Seagull hinted at for the following patches have an equally dramatic effect. I want all the powerblocks crumble and fall! Mwaahaaaa. Ok, I'm ok, all fine again, no need to call the medic...

  • Agent_JosephAgent_Joseph SarajevoPosts: 1,070Member Uncommon

    what now ? , should that player (Chribba) start crying like baby start looking for mum and leave game ;

    http://evenews24.com/2014/07/28/chribba-loses-tengu-to-pandemic-legion/

    only EVE is real MMO...but I am impressive with TSW

  • HarikenHariken Brighton, MAPosts: 985Member Uncommon
    Whenever someone ask me about Eve online i direct them to minebumping.com and they can't believe this goes on in a game where your asked to pay monthly for. Its like being forced to play your game the way some sick people with no life want . No one with common sense would put up with this crap. Every mmo player i know hate this game now. It was bad back when i played it but now its just filled with sick people. And the people that defend it might even be part of that sick group of players coming here and saying its not that bad. I hope they keep losing players. The people that play that game are not good. No matter what gets posted here.
  • fearufearu Your mom's pantiesPosts: 142Member Uncommon

    Tears have been harvested.

     

     

  • Agent_JosephAgent_Joseph SarajevoPosts: 1,070Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Hariken
    Whenever someone ask me about Eve online i direct them to minebumping.com and they can't believe this goes on in a game where your asked to pay monthly for. Its like being forced to play your game the way some sick people with no life want . No one with common sense would put up with this crap. Every mmo player i know hate this game now. It was bad back when i played it but now its just filled with sick people. And the people that defend it might even be part of that sick group of players coming here and saying its not that bad. I hope they keep losing players. The people that play that game are not good. No matter what gets posted here.

    what ?  you wish more psycho/sick peoples in your games !?

    only EVE is real MMO...but I am impressive with TSW

  • cupofcoffeecupofcoffee StuttgartPosts: 13Member
    Originally posted by Hariken
    Whenever someone ask me about Eve online i direct them to minebumping.com and they can't believe this goes on in a game where your asked to pay monthly for. Its like being forced to play your game the way some sick people with no life want . No one with common sense would put up with this crap. Every mmo player i know hate this game now. It was bad back when i played it but now its just filled with sick people. And the people that defend it might even be part of that sick group of players coming here and saying its not that bad. I hope they keep losing players. The people that play that game are not good. No matter what gets posted here.

    i agree 100%!

    Those Code guys are scary close to fascism and despotism (look the definitions up and compare to the stuff they write on their homepage). I am ok with sandbox and open world but there should be some lines you should not be allowed to cross, if there is nobody to counter them.

    I mean, we all have morals and other rules that guide us without explicit laws - those should apply everywhere. Even in gaming.

     

  • cupofcoffeecupofcoffee StuttgartPosts: 13Member

    there are morals that are not based on religions or other convictions - we all know that it is wrong to blackmail and threaten and so on. i think we can all agree on that.

    piracy is part of EVE - i am fine with that (as are many others). but we have a new level of organized extortion and cult-like behaviour that is just wrong.

    i am accepting, ofc, other opinions on this...

  • RenoakuRenoaku Posts: 1,005Member Uncommon

    CCP won't get involved just because someone is blowing up your ship in High Sec for any reason.

    However should enough people complain in like exact words about this site, and involved parties

    http://www.minerbumping.com/p/the-code.html 

    About ship bumping to prevent a player from warping off and such then it can be considered harassment and a GM can take care of the issue likely.

    Also if enough complain about this specific group of players trying to set rules that are not actually in the game up and doing harassment then it might be able to be dealt with my staff or should be dealt with.

    To be straight blowing up a ship is not harassment, bumping, Making Demands, Making players have to respond to chat for any reason is harassment and should be dealt with if they want to fire on another ship for any reason they do have that right because concord will deal with them.

    Also the way to deal with Gankers is run a "Skiff" full tank build, have an ORCA, and 5+ accounts with shield boosters on them as well in high sec as well as not be in a corporation then no one can gank you.

  • DihoruDihoru ConstantaPosts: 2,731Member
    Originally posted by cupofcoffee

    there are morals that are not based on religions or other convictions - we all know that it is wrong to blackmail and threaten and so on. i think we can all agree on that.

    piracy is part of EVE - i am fine with that (as are many others). but we have a new level of organized extortion and cult-like behaviour that is just wrong.

    i am accepting, ofc, other opinions on this...

    Good deeds can end up with evil ends and vice versa. You need to revise some of your cognitive pathways because while indeed certain things in EVE are unquestionably ethically negative these are rare and more often than not galvanize the community to better itself. Looking from the outside the negative outliers do stand out more, from within you realize the vast, vast, majority of people are alright or even really nice (in WoW for example you can get shunned by an entire server because of one thing you did in-game or out of it, in EVE we accept bad apples as well as good ones because it is all subjective in the end).

    image
  • MMORPGtesterMMORPGtester Home, PAPosts: 76Member

    Beta tested this game, ran around with Pan back in the dev days. But had other things to test, So I moved on.
    Came back to give it a try recently "few months ago", got blown up by players multiple times in newbie area. left the game I won't be back or sub till they fix the playing issue, in it's current state IMO this game is unplayable for new players.

    And yes I still have my beta account.

  • PhryPhry HampshirePosts: 6,296Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by MMORPGtester

    Beta tested this game, ran around with Pan back in the dev days. But had other things to test, So I moved on.
    Came back to give it a try recently "few months ago", got blown up by players multiple times in newbie area. left the game I won't be back or sub till they fix the playing issue, in it's current state IMO this game is unplayable for new players.

    And yes I still have my beta account.

    its surprising just how unsafe 1.0 space can be..

     

    perhaps if you actually tried playing the game you might be a bit more convincing image

  • AreWeLiveAreWeLive Brockville, ONPosts: 115Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Dihoru
    Originally posted by cupofcoffee

    there are morals that are not based on religions or other convictions - we all know that it is wrong to blackmail and threaten and so on. i think we can all agree on that.

    piracy is part of EVE - i am fine with that (as are many others). but we have a new level of organized extortion and cult-like behaviour that is just wrong.

    i am accepting, ofc, other opinions on this...

    Good deeds can end up with evil ends and vice versa. You need to revise some of your cognitive pathways because while indeed certain things in EVE are unquestionably ethically negative these are rare and more often than not galvanize the community to better itself. Looking from the outside the negative outliers do stand out more, from within you realize the vast, vast, majority of people are alright or even really nice (in WoW for example you can get shunned by an entire server because of one thing you did in-game or out of it, in EVE we accept bad apples as well as good ones because it is all subjective in the end).

     

     You have to be talking about WoW 8 or 9 years ago when your rep mattered. Since they merged battlegroups and brought in all their looking for group things, this has not been true. 

     Running something today and having someone ninja an item is totally normal and seems as the accepted, the day's a server would actually police itself are long gone and so are the morals. (generally speaking)

     

     As for eve, it is not as bad as people make it out to be, really it is the closest thing to real life there is in a virtual world. There is always a chance you will get robbed or scammed if you let your guard down or walk down a dark ally at night.  Sucks when it happens but it can happen.

     

     

  • cupofcoffeecupofcoffee StuttgartPosts: 13Member
    Originally posted by Dihoru You need to revise some of your cognitive pathways ...

    Thank you for that!

    We just seem to have different opinions on this matter. I have been playing EVE for a long time, so i know about the community there, there are ofc many decent and nice players. But there is a also a developement in the recent year/months which i judge to be worrisome.

    Again: This is my opinion and therefore my subjective way of viewing things (since, ofc, i dont have empirical data or anything).

  • kairel182kairel182 SMD, RIPosts: 241Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by AreWeLive
    Originally posted by Dihoru
    Originally posted by cupofcoffee

    there are morals that are not based on religions or other convictions - we all know that it is wrong to blackmail and threaten and so on. i think we can all agree on that.

    piracy is part of EVE - i am fine with that (as are many others). but we have a new level of organized extortion and cult-like behaviour that is just wrong.

    i am accepting, ofc, other opinions on this...

    Good deeds can end up with evil ends and vice versa. You need to revise some of your cognitive pathways because while indeed certain things in EVE are unquestionably ethically negative these are rare and more often than not galvanize the community to better itself. Looking from the outside the negative outliers do stand out more, from within you realize the vast, vast, majority of people are alright or even really nice (in WoW for example you can get shunned by an entire server because of one thing you did in-game or out of it, in EVE we accept bad apples as well as good ones because it is all subjective in the end).

     

     You have to be talking about WoW 8 or 9 years ago when your rep mattered. Since they merged battlegroups and brought in all their looking for group things, this has not been true. 

     Running something today and having someone ninja an item is totally normal and seems as the accepted, the day's a server would actually police itself are long gone and so are the morals. (generally speaking)

     

     As for eve, it is not as bad as people make it out to be, really it is the closest thing to real life there is in a virtual world. There is always a chance you will get robbed or scammed if you let your guard down or walk down a dark ally at night.  Sucks when it happens but it can happen.

     

     

    This in spades.  Implementations of idiotic grouping and "Looking For Dungeon/Raid" have completely ruined the sense of community and reputation.  It further increased the anonymity that the internet creates, not only allowing these people to be jerks but actually encourages them because there's virtually no penalty for doing so.

     

    Back in the late 90's to early 2k, player reputation was everything.  You were known server wide for good deeds, or infamous for being a gigantic 'asshat' as previously stated.  Even in game that didn't allow huge freedoms such as EVE, you still had a reputation.  It's just the sense that PvP brings out the most competitive nature in people, allowing some to take it too far, especially given the hidden nature of the internet.

     

    A game such as EVE does allow these types of players to grief much more significantly than the restrictive themepark games that we're so fond (not) of seeing churned out.  But a game such as EVE gives the players the ability to not only grief such as this, but allows players to enforce their own sense of policing and sense of order.  The major issue is what was mentioned previously; the general attitude of the internet has spiraled out of control into the gutter in the last 10 years.  With the influx of so many players into MMO's, it's only natural to see a larger percentage of jerks, but this is almost unnatural.  The anonymity of the internet encourages these people to act completely different than they would to someone's face.  There just aren't enough "white knights" to police the growing number of asshats to the communities.

     

    And let's get one thing straight; no matter if you're a fan of the game or not, WoW has one of the WORST player bases in the entire MMO history.  Statistically speaking this has to be true given the number of players, but in general the type of player that game attracts are the same types like the CoD crowd that trash talk everyone on XBOX.  These players are just degenerate scumbags and I've had better experiences is League of Legends than I have in WoW in the past 8 years.  And that's saying something coming from a game that has more asshats than all of these games combined.

     

    You have to ask yourself one thing; would you rather be told what to play and how to play it in these themepark games and continue to be a sheep thinking you have a sense of freedom.  Or would you give up some of that safety in the pursuit of those said freedoms that allow the players to think for themselves and given more than just a carrot on a stick that the developer tells them to run for?  I would take a game like EVE and many more to come than another one of these brain dead, idiotic games that requires less thought than drooling on my keyboard.

  • HazelleHazelle Brampton, ONPosts: 760Member
    Originally posted by MMORPGtester

    Beta tested this game, ran around with Pan back in the dev days. But had other things to test, So I moved on.
    Came back to give it a try recently "few months ago", got blown up by players multiple times in newbie area. left the game I won't be back or sub till they fix the playing issue, in it's current state IMO this game is unplayable for new players.

    And yes I still have my beta account.

    Post your character's name so that we can verify your story otherwise nobody can believe your fantastic tale about being killed in the newbie area.

  • BladestromBladestrom edinburghPosts: 4,946Member Uncommon
    Not saying story is true (seems very unlucky), but I certainly would not be posting a characters name In a website for this game as that would leave him open to abuse/bullying.

    rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar

    Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D

  • DemrocksDemrocks wonderlandPosts: 124Member


    Originally posted by Phry
    Originally posted by MMORPGtester Beta tested this game, ran around with Pan back in the dev days. But had other things to test, So I moved on. Came back to give it a try recently "few months ago", got blown up by players multiple times in newbie area. left the game I won't be back or sub till they fix the playing issue, in it's current state IMO this game is unplayable for new players. And yes I still have my beta account.
    its surprising just how unsafe 1.0 space can be..

     

    perhaps if you actually tried playing the game you might be a bit more convincing


    6 years of Eve and got killed 3 times total in Hisec 2 times i opened fire on the guy stealing my cans.

    Best mmo sandbox ever made period.
    From pvp to the meta game from the market players and Fleet Commanders to the scammers and the grunts and meatshields this game has everything....

    But ! recent years brought me not the stuff i realy wanted and i lost abit of love for Eve Online.
    As a nullsec player and a wormhole dweller i was hoping for expansions that expanded the game much further then where its at now.

    But hey its only just beginning its second decade ! so there is still hope :)
    With a new man in charge and CCP Seagul and her vieuw maybe....just maybe stuff gets better.

    And we need more lore......about the Sleepers / Jove
    Its still such a mystery with them that i realy cannot wait to find more ingame stuff that tells me more parts of what happened.

    Eve Online is the most unique mmo ever made an even tough it has its flaws and cant get dull at times it always pulls you back for some reason.

  • RylahRylah Tribal VillagePosts: 193Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by cupofcoffee

    there are morals that are not based on religions or other convictions - we all know that it is wrong to blackmail and threaten and so on. i think we can all agree on that.

    piracy is part of EVE - i am fine with that (as are many others). but we have a new level of organized extortion and cult-like behaviour that is just wrong.

    i am accepting, ofc, other opinions on this...

    CODE. provides a lot of laughter. Just look at their killboards when they need like 3-4 tries to finally gank an afk Mackinaw. Usually they kill mostly bots operated by stupid players (minimum skill retrievers for example) which is actually a good thing. I have yet to see a player who actually pays them for a "permit". It is only 10 mio. for a year but I would rather selfdestruct before paying that as many others.

    What they achieved is mostly that people fly in properly tanked procurers or skiffs now -  at least in the systems where they come regularly and they caused the founding of the anti ganking movement which has its own intel channels and quite some people actively hunting gankers. So fun is to be had.

    Their roleplaying on the other hand is a mixed pot. The dedication and always talking in character and role are awesome. But the context really sucks. The backstory their never ever undocking leader made up is really bad. Consistent in its twisted logic but bad from a literature point of view.

    Originally posted by Agent_Joseph

    what now ? , should that player (Chribba) start crying like baby start looking for mum and leave game ;

    http://evenews24.com/2014/07/28/chribba-loses-tengu-to-pandemic-legion/

    Nah, stop it. When people read the story and especially how Chribba reacted their whole fabrics of doom and decay will fall apart.
  • StarIStarI Mount EverestPosts: 926Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Bladestrom
    Not saying story is true (seems very unlucky), but I certainly would not be posting a characters name In a website for this game as that would leave him open to abuse/bullying.

     

    There is no excuse for not at least adding a link to killmail to such a story.

    If you're worried and not man enaugh to deal with consequences, thinking before posting may work wonders.

    Since all he has proven atm is being a butt-hurt lying gamer.

    Besides he did say he left game and not planning to  come back.

  • cesmode8cesmode8 Posts: 318Member Uncommon

    Eve is a shining example of a game that stands the test of time.  Although I do not play it and probably never will, Im glad it has existed and Im glad it has stayed true to itself, to an extent.

    I played about 5 years ago for a month or two.  Steep learning curve, so much to learn.  More so than any game, and thats completely fine.  My problem was that eventually people like me bled off, and there wasnt anyone around to socialize with or play with.  Everyone that CAN help you is YEARS(literally...years) ahead of you.  Theres no catching up, no hope for new players to one day partake in some of these deep space adventures and battles and economy wars that I love reading about.  There is such a barrier to entry that I cannot ever overcome.  

    The game is most of what I have always wanted in a space sandbox game.  I wish the battles were a bit more engaging, they look...pretty boring.  Epic in scale, cool visually, but pretty un-engaging.  But overall, CCP has done well by letting human nature dictate the pulse of Eve, whether for bad or worse.  Even if someone trolls you, thats part of it.

     

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