Originally posted by OldMMOGamer The game world is huge, In fact tell me what game is bigger. BTW, loads of people in game and theres a que for PVP on Wabbajack. So all the doom gloomers need to find another game to unload on. JS
There are plenty of game worlds that are larger. LOTRO, for example, is at least dozens of times larger. But of course quantity >/ quality. No point having an insanely huge game world if the content is lacking and/or there are not enough people to occupy it. And speaking of sandbox games, it kind of worries me that many of the current game designers are trying to outdo each other with regards to game world size. It's getting a bit over the top.
It wont change like that. I think best bet would have any future zones in eso to also be pvp zones as well, say Falkreach hold in skyrim for a new veteran zone, have pvp content in as well, vice versa for the other alliances.
How exactly do you open up the whole map level 1 in an MMO with players of different levels?
I made it to VR4, wasn't hating on the VR all that much actually, just quit because if they can't be assed to put their European server center in Europe to support their game then why the hell should I support them with a sub?
Scale stats up/down as needed. Make levels completely irrelevant. Easy to do, bit harder to tune, but not really a brainer.
Unless we have a FFXIV-ARR style revamp of the game, this will never happen. It's too substantial a change...
Hell, as it is they can't even fix their major bugs... and are completely unwilling to acknowledge the major design flaws in the game, because they'd have to fix those, too.
Just hold out hope that they someday get their heads out of their collective rectal orifice. That's a necessary first step towards useful change in the game.
Well, there is some hope. Here is a ZoS post from June 17:
Thank you all for sharing your thoughts with us. Some updates will have a large amount of new content or systems, others will focus more on fixes and improvements. Update 1.2 is the latter; it focuses more on fixes and improvements than new content, especially compared to the Craglorn update. That will not always be the case.
We will have at least one more set of patch notes to add to 1.2 before it goes live next week. We are also working on a status update on other game content and systems (such as our plans for stamina/weapon ability builds, Templars, and Heavy and Medium armor) that we hope to share with you this week.
They have posted elsewhere in the forums that they are "looking at" veteran ranks, or something to that effect..
Only this will take a lot of patience. Who knows how long it will take to get to these things? Months, probably. I'm thinking they know they need to fix these issues before they try to launch on console. They want the box sales from that and I'm pretty sure console players won't put up with the stuff PC players have gone through.
Couldn't disagree with your closing comment at all.
And what the dev comment really says is:
I know we said we would be releasing new content every 4-6 weeks but actually that isn't going to be the case any more.
Yes management could employ a bigger team but all areas of staffing are being looked at
Yes I know this means you won't be getting what we suggested you would get as subscribers pre-launch
but we didn't really promise
and when we can string you along with a tale about bug fixes but not every patch ... and you don't complain
well can you blame management
Deja vu. The forums should be in uproar.
And a key reason, imo, why subscription games no longer get subscribers. People don't expect anything; don't believe devs grandiose tales. So they don't sub so the company doesn't get any money. So the money isn't there it can't afford to develop new content. A self-fulfilling cycle.
Originally posted by Ehllfhire Itll never happen. There isnt a sandbox mmo that didnt completely fail
Except EVE, UO, and holy crap the first mmo ever still requires a sub and is running, meridian 59.
Itll never happen because the guys in charge of the game have no creativity or ability to step out of their box and make something they've never made before. They did the only thing that have the ability to do, which is why the only good thing people ever say about the game is that leveling 1-50 was fun.
I'm starting to see what's going on here. A lot of people on this site speak from a pve only viewpoint. Look at eso like this, making a sandbox would be impossible.
When looking at it from a players perspective who spends all their time in Cryodill, it's not much of a reach at all. Cyrodiil has the foundation in place.
Originally posted by bcbully I'm starting to see what's going on here. A lot of people on this site speak from a pve only viewpoint. Look at eso like this, making a sandbox would be impossible.
When looking at it from a players perspective who spends all their time in Cryodill, it's not much of a reach at all. Cyrodiil has the foundation in place.
There is nothing sandbox about cyrodil, are you high?
Any graphical, audio, or gameplay restrictions not seen in other mmos but found in FFXIV can be blamed on one thing. PS3
Originally posted by Ehllfhire Itll never happen. There isnt a sandbox mmo that didnt completely fail
Except EVE, UO, and holy crap the first mmo ever still requires a sub and is running, meridian 59.
Itll never happen because the guys in charge of the game have no creativity or ability to step out of their box and make something they've never made before. They did the only thing that have the ability to do, which is why the only good thing people ever say about the game is that leveling 1-50 was fun.
Not sure about UO and Meridian, but while EVE is a great success for CCP--a relatively small company that self-publishes so they get to call the shots, EVE is not a "breakout success". They have (or had at last report) about 500K subscribers, and given that the structure of the game is a bit anti-alt, has more multiboxing than I've ever seen elsewhere--it't the norm more than the exception. So, it's possible that they have more like 250K actual players. And they spent their first year at about 20-30K--I know, I was there. They acknowledge publicly that they have only about a 10% retention rate.
It's hard to say whether this is primarily because of their sandbox-only play (and pretty limited sandbox too--the universe is big, but there's not much fun to do other than PvP, so you have to be in to that). Even SWG, another touted sandbox, had trouble getting over 350K subs, and was down in the 200s roughly when they started the experimentation that drove players away.
Big companies, and AAA games nowadays, are not going to gamble $100mil or more on numbers like that.
I'll add that in my opinion, if players want more innovated play, they are going to have to look at indies, and ones where the budget is maybe only $10 mil or so--and looks it. The more money invested in a game, the less risk they tend to be able to take--and innovation is VERY risky. Innovation fails as much as it succeeds.
How exactly do you open up the whole map level 1 in an MMO with players of different levels?
I made it to VR4, wasn't hating on the VR all that much actually, just quit because if they can't be assed to put their European server center in Europe to support their game then why the hell should I support them with a sub?
They are putting it in Europe? Didn't they have a post showing the server setup?
Sometime in summer...regarding the EU server move. Though they also said shortly after launch before,
They did a post about the move going well and posted a picture (the picture being from February iirc).
Comments
There are plenty of game worlds that are larger. LOTRO, for example, is at least dozens of times larger. But of course quantity >/ quality. No point having an insanely huge game world if the content is lacking and/or there are not enough people to occupy it. And speaking of sandbox games, it kind of worries me that many of the current game designers are trying to outdo each other with regards to game world size. It's getting a bit over the top.
http://www.giantbomb.com/profile/aperturesilence/blog/a-relative-size-comparison-of-game-world-maps-fasc/49712/
Scale stats up/down as needed. Make levels completely irrelevant. Easy to do, bit harder to tune, but not really a brainer.
Couldn't disagree with your closing comment at all.
And what the dev comment really says is:
Deja vu. The forums should be in uproar.
And a key reason, imo, why subscription games no longer get subscribers. People don't expect anything; don't believe devs grandiose tales. So they don't sub so the company doesn't get any money. So the money isn't there it can't afford to develop new content. A self-fulfilling cycle.
Except EVE, UO, and holy crap the first mmo ever still requires a sub and is running, meridian 59.
Itll never happen because the guys in charge of the game have no creativity or ability to step out of their box and make something they've never made before. They did the only thing that have the ability to do, which is why the only good thing people ever say about the game is that leveling 1-50 was fun.
When looking at it from a players perspective who spends all their time in Cryodill, it's not much of a reach at all. Cyrodiil has the foundation in place.
There is nothing sandbox about cyrodil, are you high?
Any graphical, audio, or gameplay restrictions not seen in other mmos but found in FFXIV can be blamed on one thing.
PS3
Not sure about UO and Meridian, but while EVE is a great success for CCP--a relatively small company that self-publishes so they get to call the shots, EVE is not a "breakout success". They have (or had at last report) about 500K subscribers, and given that the structure of the game is a bit anti-alt, has more multiboxing than I've ever seen elsewhere--it't the norm more than the exception. So, it's possible that they have more like 250K actual players. And they spent their first year at about 20-30K--I know, I was there. They acknowledge publicly that they have only about a 10% retention rate.
It's hard to say whether this is primarily because of their sandbox-only play (and pretty limited sandbox too--the universe is big, but there's not much fun to do other than PvP, so you have to be in to that). Even SWG, another touted sandbox, had trouble getting over 350K subs, and was down in the 200s roughly when they started the experimentation that drove players away.
Big companies, and AAA games nowadays, are not going to gamble $100mil or more on numbers like that.
I'll add that in my opinion, if players want more innovated play, they are going to have to look at indies, and ones where the budget is maybe only $10 mil or so--and looks it. The more money invested in a game, the less risk they tend to be able to take--and innovation is VERY risky. Innovation fails as much as it succeeds.
Sometime in summer...regarding the EU server move. Though they also said shortly after launch before,
They did a post about the move going well and posted a picture (the picture being from February iirc).