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Turning ESO into a Sandbox

JDis25JDis25 Posts: 715Member Uncommon

Creating a new Server with a new ruleset could push ESO from 0 to Hero.

 

First off, let me say. 1-50 was the best leveling experience I have had, ever. The ES lore was abundant, the World is detailed for an MMO, not so much for an ES game but that is to be expected.

There are books, letters, diaries, lorebooks, quest dialog and interesting characters. The story was personally more interesting than Skyrim's/Oblivion/Morrowind's main storyline. Molag Bal sewing unrest in Cyrodil while Meridia plots to help humanity defeat Molag Bal is a pretty solid Storyline. I loved the zones, they are a bit too cluttered for my tastes, but I think they work with some imagination on my part. There was always something to do.

ESO's main faults are Cyrodil PvP and lack of purpose, no gear, no xp, it's basically just for fun or I guess you get something after 90 days, not sure, didn't stay that long. Another fault is Vet content, which if they started a new server, they could completely remove. I hate it, with a vengeance. It is Zenimax trying to keep subscriptions and trying to be inconspicuous about it.

 

Remove the main storyline, Open up the entire map at level 1 (maybe disable fast travel for more immersion). Crafting/Gathering rewards XP, Grinding rewards XP, PvP rewards XP, Open World PvP including faction missions & Dark Brotherhood quests and player assassinations in some manner. Include Theives Guild!! Steal from other players. Create a Justice System. Create open world housing/farming

Make Level 50 the MAX, but make mentoring, or voluntary level reduction a possibility to assist with playing or helping friends/guildies and being rewarded for it.

 

This would be a stretch but I think this would make ESO so much better, almost what it should have been. It would take time, but would it be impossible? Surely the hard work is already there (the world, the enemies, the classes, the combat system, the ai). Creating structured content that is repetitive and will be eventually chewed up by players, will result in people leaving. Give them a playground to make their own adventures, and you will better retain your population.

 

 

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Comments

  • chondro69chondro69 everett, WAPosts: 53Member

    I concur. I hit V1 and  the game just came to a complete stop for me as far as fun factor goes. I did manage to force myself to V3 and didn't have an ounce of fun the whole time so why go on. Well i'm not, im gona put the game on hold for now and see what changes Zenimax makes over the next several months to decide if I will continue. huge disappointment.

    And im sorry Zenimax guild tabards and dye are cool and all but (should have already been in the game at launch) but that's not going to change what is broken about the game.

    The ball is in Zenimaxs court!

  • seraphynxseraphynx Newport News, VAPosts: 147Member
    it's never going to happen trust me.. game is what it is.. i think they made some good choices and lot of bad ones but they aren't going to completely re-do the game or anything close to what you are suggesting
  • EhllfhireEhllfhire Sacramento, CAPosts: 597Member
    Itll never happen. There isnt a sandbox mmo that didnt completely fail

    Any graphical, audio, or gameplay restrictions not seen in other mmos but found in FFXIV can be blamed on one thing.
    PS3

  • DamonVileDamonVile Vancouver, BCPosts: 4,818Member
    I'm sure future expansions could be more sandbox like but they'll never go back to old content and change it.
  • seraphynxseraphynx Newport News, VAPosts: 147Member
    Originally posted by DamonVile
    I'm sure future expansions could be more sandbox like but they'll never go back to old content and change it.

    they "could" but highly doubt they will MOST MMOs have a core design and hardly deviate very far from that.. what they end up doing is adding onto their core design and adding a lot more of the same that is already in the game ie more dungeons and such but hardly ever change that much from their original design.

  • Yoda_CloneYoda_Clone Harker Heights, TXPosts: 219Member

    Unless we have a FFXIV-ARR style revamp of the game, this will never happen.  It's too substantial a change...

    Hell, as it is they can't even fix their major bugs... and are completely unwilling to acknowledge the major design flaws in the game, because they'd have to fix those, too.

    Just hold out hope that they someday get their heads out of their collective rectal orifice.  That's a necessary first step towards useful change in the game.

  • jojommojojommo Canton, OHPosts: 3Member
    Cyrodiil is a PvP sandbox. They can add more and more there.
  • d_20d_20 AmsterdamPosts: 762Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Yoda_Clone

    Unless we have a FFXIV-ARR style revamp of the game, this will never happen.  It's too substantial a change...

    Hell, as it is they can't even fix their major bugs... and are completely unwilling to acknowledge the major design flaws in the game, because they'd have to fix those, too.

    Just hold out hope that they someday get their heads out of their collective rectal orifice.  That's a necessary first step towards useful change in the game.

    Well, there is some hope. Here is a ZoS post from June 17:

     

    Thank you all for sharing your thoughts with us. Some updates will have a large amount of new content or systems, others will focus more on fixes and improvements. Update 1.2 is the latter; it focuses more on fixes and improvements than new content, especially compared to the Craglorn update. That will not always be the case.

    We will have at least one more set of patch notes to add to 1.2 before it goes live next week. We are also working on a status update on other game content and systems (such as our plans for stamina/weapon ability builds, Templars, and Heavy and Medium armor) that we hope to share with you this week.

     

    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/comment/1002759#Comment_1002759

     

    They have posted elsewhere in the forums that they are "looking at" veteran ranks, or something to that effect..

     

    Only this will take a lot of patience. Who knows how long it will take to get to these things? Months, probably. I'm thinking they know they need to fix these issues before they try to launch on console. They want the box sales from that and I'm pretty sure console players won't put up with the stuff PC players have gone through.

     

    image
  • seraphynxseraphynx Newport News, VAPosts: 147Member
    Originally posted by jojommo
    Cyrodiil is a PvP sandbox. They can add more and more there.

    i'm hopeful for Cyrodiil but it's by no means a sandbox.. the layout is completely pre-determined the home castle are also completely pre-determined this alone pretty much takes out the main thing that could make it a sandbox imho.. you can't build forts or any real structures, you can't construct anything but seige gear and fix already pre-placed castles.. Cyrodiil could be pretty great but hardly a sandbox

  • OldMMOGamerOldMMOGamer Evans, COPosts: 100Member
    The game world is huge, In fact tell me what game is bigger. BTW, loads of people in game and theres a que for PVP on Wabbajack. So all the doom gloomers need to find another game to unload on.  JS
  • udonudon Durham, NCPosts: 1,767Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by jojommo
    Cyrodiil is a PvP sandbox. They can add more and more there.

    This,  The first time I ran around Cyrodill as a guest on a campaign that our side was dominating my thoughts keep coming back to "this is how the whole game should have been".  You can nit pick over if Cyrodill is or is not a sandbox because you can't build in it but the truth is it's much more of a open world zone than the rest of the game and as a result it has much more of a Skyrim feel to it.

    The base is there they just need to build on it.

  • seraphynxseraphynx Newport News, VAPosts: 147Member
    Originally posted by OldMMOGamer
    The game world is huge, In fact tell me what game is bigger. BTW, loads of people in game and theres a que for PVP on Wabbajack. So all the doom gloomers need to find another game to unload on.  JS

    not sure what that has to do with the topic on hand... size has nothing to do with the type of game it is or how the zones are played through

  • JDis25JDis25 Posts: 715Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by seraphynx
    Originally posted by DamonVile
    I'm sure future expansions could be more sandbox like but they'll never go back to old content and change it.

    they "could" but highly doubt they will MOST MMOs have a core design and hardly deviate very far from that.. what they end up doing is adding onto their core design and adding a lot more of the same that is already in the game ie more dungeons and such but hardly ever change that much from their original design.

    I hear ya, all I see with this game is potential, it's a shame the developers are convinced that grinding quests and not being rewarded for doing anything a second time, and basically not being able to play with friends at all was a better option. Why use up $250 million to put out a game, that is nonstop solo questing? I can't wrap my head around it. And an MMO of all things...

     

    Why did they deviate so much from core ES concepts. I could gain XP crafting in Skyrim, so why was that removed for ESO? boggles the mind....

     

    And the argument, "we wanted all characters to be able to explore the whole world" is bs, because I am not exploring the whole world, only seperate higher level instances of the zones... I can't even interact with people playing other factions, at all!

  • seraphynxseraphynx Newport News, VAPosts: 147Member
    Originally posted by JDis25
    Originally posted by seraphynx
    Originally posted by DamonVile
    I'm sure future expansions could be more sandbox like but they'll never go back to old content and change it.

    they "could" but highly doubt they will MOST MMOs have a core design and hardly deviate very far from that.. what they end up doing is adding onto their core design and adding a lot more of the same that is already in the game ie more dungeons and such but hardly ever change that much from their original design.

    I hear ya, all I see with this game is potential, it's a shame the developers are convinced that grinding quests and not being rewarded for doing anything a second time, and basically not being able to play with friends at all was a better option. Why use up $250 million to put out a game, that is nonstop solo questing? I can't wrap my head around it. And an MMO of all things...

     

    Why did they deviate so much from core ES concepts. I could gain XP crafting in Skyrim, so why was that removed for ESO? boggles the mind....

    my guess same reason SWTOR went the route they did.. investors see solo oriented themepark = money

  • RamanadjinnRamanadjinn Huntsville, ALPosts: 1,365Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by JDis25

    Creating a new Server with a new ruleset could push ESO from 0 to Hero.

     

     

    Remove the main storyline, Open up the entire map at level 1 (maybe disable fast travel for more immersion). Crafting/Gathering rewards XP, Grinding rewards XP, PvP rewards XP, Open World PvP including faction missions & Dark Brotherhood quests and player assassinations in some manner. Include Theives Guild!! Steal from other players. Create a Justice System. Create open world housing/farming

     

     

     

    I get that you like TES lore.  I think most of us do.

    But as others have said the game just isn't what you're looking for and it isn't what a lot of us wanted.  (i'm not knocking it, none of these games please everyone).

    It sounds like you should try some of the other games coming up soon that do have these sorts of things that you're after.

    Archeage has almost all of this stuff you're asking for and is going into beta this month.  Black Desert looks amazing but is further off for release by at least a year i'd say.  Also check out Gloria Victis and Life is Feudal.

    Then theres EVE Online, the king of the sandbox genre and like WOW is to the themeparks, EVE is the one to beat for sandboxes.

    Mortal Online is fun and unique but buggy and hosted on a dude's phone (hyperbole).

    Darkfall is worth a look. Ultima Online is still kicking if you don't mind a 90s game.

    None of them have TES lore obviously, but I promise you even if you want to wait on something not out yet like Black Desert or Archeage it will be a shorter wait than waiting for Zenimax to put out the sort of game you're after.

     

  • Octagon7711Octagon7711 Chicago, ILPosts: 1,517Member Uncommon

    I'm thinking the people who call the shots are only exposed to the game through monthly or weekly meetings.  I'm thinking the upper management know only what they get from the optimistic reports of team leaders who don't want to bring no bad news.  

    It's the only way I can see bugs not being a top priority and having more man power put into fixing them.  They are probably being reported as minor bugs which are being worked on.

    I loved leveling 1 to 50 in spite of the problems I encountered.  VR was not the game I wanted to play.  Even 1-50 wash't the same after the nerfs.

    "Change is the only constant."

  • koboldfodderkoboldfodder Danbury, DEPosts: 390Member Uncommon
    EQ, EQ2, and LOTRO all have a bigger world.
  • JDis25JDis25 Posts: 715Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Ramanadjinn
    Originally posted by JDis25

    Creating a new Server with a new ruleset could push ESO from 0 to Hero.

     

     

    Remove the main storyline, Open up the entire map at level 1 (maybe disable fast travel for more immersion). Crafting/Gathering rewards XP, Grinding rewards XP, PvP rewards XP, Open World PvP including faction missions & Dark Brotherhood quests and player assassinations in some manner. Include Theives Guild!! Steal from other players. Create a Justice System. Create open world housing/farming

     

     

     

    I get that you like TES lore.  I think most of us do.

    But as others have said the game just isn't what you're looking for and it isn't what a lot of us wanted.  (i'm not knocking it, none of these games please everyone).

    It sounds like you should try some of the other games coming up soon that do have these sorts of things that you're after.

    Archeage has almost all of this stuff you're asking for and is going into beta this month.  Black Desert looks amazing but is further off for release by at least a year i'd say.  Also check out Gloria Victis and Life is Feudal.

    Then theres EVE Online, the king of the sandbox genre and like WOW is to the themeparks, EVE is the one to beat for sandboxes.

    Mortal Online is fun and unique but buggy and hosted on a dude's phone (hyperbole).

    Darkfall is worth a look. Ultima Online is still kicking if you don't mind a 90s game.

    None of them have TES lore obviously, but I promise you even if you want to wait on something not out yet like Black Desert or Archeage it will be a shorter wait than waiting for Zenimax to put out the sort of game you're after.

     

    Oh I know, I am being optimistic, money talks so we will see what happens when subs start dropping. I realize it is basically just an ideal, one that will probably not come true.

     

    Black Desert has been on my radar for awhile. Archeage more recently. I am planning on checking AA, but I want to wait for release myself.  I may briefly play beta.

  • SoandsosoSoandsoso Richmond Hill, ONPosts: 533Member
    Originally posted by koboldfodder
    EQ, EQ2, and LOTRO all have a bigger world.

    How long have those games been around and added to the base game that launched......exactly.

  • RamanadjinnRamanadjinn Huntsville, ALPosts: 1,365Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by JDis25
     

    Oh I know, I am being optimistic, money talks so we will see what happens when subs start dropping. I realize it is basically just an ideal, one that will probably not come true.

     

    Black Desert has been on my radar for awhile. Archeage more recently. I am planning on checking AA, but I want to wait for release myself.  I may briefly play beta.

     

    I agree with you that money talks.  That is what its all about!

    I think they probably had a plan for each post launch scenario.  Its a big project and they'd be smart to plan for success and failure.

    They could do as you suggest and give the game a sort of "SOE NGE" treatment where they revamp everything.  Final Fantasy went that way.

    But so far their attitudes, reactions, and choices seem to have gone down the more traditional paths, and I would wager if they see a huge dropoff in sales the only retooling they'll be doing is in the form of a cash shop and free to play launch like so many others.  I would wager they already have a plan on how to implement a free to play model for their game with the tools already in place.   Which is not to say they will, but I will argue they are ready for it for sure!

    I'm not doom and gloom.  I'll never say "ESO is 3 months from free to play."  But I would argue with anyone that ESO is ready to go free to play whenever and if ever Zenimax decides the sales have hit rock bottom and subs aren't up to par.

  • CrusadesCrusades Columbus, OHPosts: 480Member
    Remove everything but cryodil - let bethesda come in and make a gigantic single player world for us to explore basically Skyrim, we gear up in that world and go to war in cryodil. End of discussion - ESO best single player rpg and best 3 faction pvp all wrapped in one game.
  • JDis25JDis25 Posts: 715Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Crusades
    Remove everything but cryodil - let bethesda come in and make a gigantic single player world for us to explore basically Skyrim, we gear up in that world and go to war in cryodil. End of discussion - ESO best single player rpg and best 3 faction pvp all wrapped in one game.

    Pretty cool idea, guarantee Bethesda will not touch this game though. 

     

    I like the Idea of an immersive single player experience taking place in each Faction's zones. Then just having Cyrodil be PvP and the multiplayer aspect of the game, if they marketed it that way it would have been so much better. I can't even enjoy Cyrodil PvP because I can't reach Vet 12.... So i at a disadvantage because all the time I have spent PvEing is not nearly enough... (vet 3)

  • OriousOrious O''Fallon, ILPosts: 548Member

    You get gear all the time in PvP....

    And you can purchase purples with alliance points... 

    I've pretty much spent most of my time in PvP since level 15 or so. Now Vet 1. You don't need to be V12 to have fun... You DO need to be V12 to jump in the middle of the fray like a BOSS and kill people.

    Once the 1-49 pvp zone comes out things will be pretty good. Most zones pretty much act like Vet only anyway.

    image

  • sketocafesketocafe StoupaPosts: 802Member Uncommon

    How exactly do you open up the whole map level 1 in an MMO with players of different levels?

    I made it to VR4, wasn't hating on the VR all that much actually, just quit because if they can't be assed to put their European server center in Europe to support their game then why the hell should I support them with a sub?

  • OriousOrious O''Fallon, ILPosts: 548Member
    Originally posted by sketocafe

    How exactly do you open up the whole map level 1 in an MMO with players of different levels?

    I made it to VR4, wasn't hating on the VR all that much actually, just quit because if they can't be assed to put their European server center in Europe to support their game then why the hell should I support them with a sub?

    They are putting it in Europe? Didn't they have a post showing the server setup?

    image

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