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Black Desert Ranger PvP imbalance - 4 rangers defeat a 65 guild siege

2

Comments

  • cooleechang1cooleechang1 Fresno, CAPosts: 20Member
    I guess no one knows that BDO have a stats reduction for PVP.  If you are up against zergs, stats are balance out for you to have a chance.
  • WoeToTheVanquishedWoeToTheVanquished USA #1, ILPosts: 23Member

    none of you have ever experienced real pvp? real open world combat with little to no safe areas? where when someone attacks you, you can either fight back or plead to them to "please stop" and they'll just kill you anyway. it's basically like being violated over a video game. let's also factor in the loss of detrimental amounts of experience upon death, or even dropping valuable items from your inventory upon death. where death actually matters in a game. not as hardcore as DEATH = DELETION, but still exponentially more than frustrating. where you should always be paranoid of another player, and know damn well that you can only rely upon yourself. 

     

    I want games to come back to those roots.

  • DullahanDullahan Posts: 2,053Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by DMKano

    Spam one attack and win - woohoo!

    Epic.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRaHFDQPAYE

    Source:

    http://2p.com/6313367_1/Black-Desert-PvP-Imbalance-5-Rangers-Defeat-the-Whole-Guild-in-Fortress-Siege-by-Nichole.htm

     

    Pretty funny to see one attack spammed over and over and over again - even the guys recording are cracking up on how broken it is.

    The people they were attacking were obviously unprepared and horrible.  They had every opportunity to kill the rangers but didn't because they were so afk and disorganized.


  • DullahanDullahan Posts: 2,053Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Sevala

    Having never played the game, I'm not commenting about the mechanics, or damage of the class vs other classes, only the video itself:

     

    Meh...after watching this video it sounds more like "Oh noes...the zergball failed..."

    Those 60 players looks kinda sad, and looked like the 5 man team was much more organized/better players. The 5 man team is using voice, using terrain, dodging attacks, nailed the weak links first, etc. (like when he is hiding in a bush and quite a few run past him.)

    Personally, I'd give that a "win" in a game. Kinda sick of zerg balls and numbers being the only thing that matter in any PVP. More power to them.

     

    Again, though, I do not know about the mechanics involved, however, I am always a fan of skill being more of a factor than numbers, so I like the part of that I see in the video.

    Exactly.  These players were just much better and more more prepared.  They were good at aiming and their opposition looked completely confused.  If they flanked out and charged the rangers they'd of been dead in 5 seconds, but instead they huddled up like idiots and stayed at range where they obviously were at a disadvantage.  Also to note, the game currently only has 4 classes, so a lot of those other players they were fighting were rangers as well, and had access to the same "OP ability" that the rangers were using.


  • RecoreRecore Posts: 5,090Member Uncommon

    Playing Lineage 2 I have seen first hand many times how 1 group can hit a siege field and run through 100 players. It all depends on levels, gear and team skills. Not saying this was legit but its possible.

    With that being said I cant wait for this game. :-)

    Raptr Gamercard
  • ikcinikcin AmberPosts: 620Member Common
    Originally posted by DMKano

    More harsh punishing world?

    You do realize that BD will have PvE servers..... how harsh is that?

    AA has no PvE servers - its  PvP game at heart, all servers are the same ruleset.

    Black Desert Russia is announced to have F2P PvE and PvP servers and P2P PvE and PvP servers.

    4 different server types.

    No, they did not promise 4 different server types. You are lost in translation. They said it is possible to make PvP and less PvP servers without PK, but they are not sure. There will not be PvE servers, because this is open world game. The game will be F2P in Russia, but marketing model in every country is a choice of the publisher. Russian publisher promised the game will not be P2W.

    image

  • DullahanDullahan Posts: 2,053Member Uncommon

    To me, nothing could be better news than to hear they feel BD is enjoyable enough to exist solely as a PVE game.  The biggest drawback of pvp sandbox games in the past (see Darkfall for a perfect example) is that without pvp, they are nothing.  That means the game doesn't truly support a variety of gameplay and progression options.  I personally wouldn't want to play a game without pvp, but its always good to hear that they are trying to appeal to more than just the hardcore pvpers.

    Originally posted by ikcin
    No, they did not promise 4 different server types. You are lost in translation. They said it is possible to make PvP and less PvP servers without PK, but they are not sure. There will not be PvE servers, because this is open world game. The game will be F2P in Russia, but marketing model in every country is a choice of the publisher. Russian publisher promised the game will not be P2W.

    Side note, open world has no relation to pvp.  Open world just means the world is open and not instanced...


  • moosecatlolmoosecatlol Boring, TXPosts: 1,171Member Uncommon

    520 potions. . . jesus!

     

    Also yes, there are class imbalances in beta. WAPOW imagine that! It's as if this site exists to garner a community of people who have never played an MMO before.

    Every MMO that has ever existed has been extremely exploitable in it's early levels of development.

     

     

    Anyways, Kano, thanks for this, highly amusing. Also that sneaking at the beginning of the video seems to have made me so excited, that I'm now lightheaded.

  • FdzzaiglFdzzaigl Somewhere in nowherePosts: 2,309Member Uncommon

    Lol wow.

    Then again, I remember how we defeated an entire siege of the central castle in WvWvW in Guild Wars 2 once with a couple of elementalists sporting full berserker gear and a mesmer doing the speed thingy + meteor rain.

    But the single attack spam stuff in the later parts of the video definitely show that there is a problem.

    Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!

  • DullahanDullahan Posts: 2,053Member Uncommon
    Have to say I'm more disappointed to hear about the lack of healer classes than I am to hear players can kill you spamming aimed abilities.  At least theres some skill involved in those abilities.  If there was a few healers classes however, ganking this many people would become next to impossible.


  • moosecatlolmoosecatlol Boring, TXPosts: 1,171Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Fdzzaigl

    Lol wow.

    Then again, I remember how we defeated an entire siege of the central castle in WvWvW in Guild Wars 2 once with a couple of elementalists sporting full berserker gear and a mesmer doing the speed thingy + meteor rain.

    But the single attack spam stuff in the later parts of the video definitely show that there is a problem.

    The player seems to have built around a high stun, high damage, low efficiency skill. Added on top of that his shots will bounce up to a certain number of times within a certain distance. It will be nerfed. However how is no one pointing out how he juked an entire guild of 65 players by hiding in some bushes. That by far and wide the highlight of that video.

  • SamuraiXIVSamuraiXIV Philadelphia, PAPosts: 354Member

    He was critin every shot which means he is way higher level then the ones he is killing. 

    edit: That's why I don't PvP in mmorpg it based on level and gear versus skill in first person shooters where I actually see me get better the more I play.

    "mmorpg.com forum admins are all TROLLS and losers in real life"
    My opinion

  • FdzzaiglFdzzaigl Somewhere in nowherePosts: 2,309Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by moosecatlol
     

    The player seems to have built around a high stun, high damage, low efficiency skill. Added on top of that his shots will bounce up to a certain number of times within a certain distance. It will be nerfed. However how is no one pointing out how he juked an entire guild of 65 players by hiding in some bushes. That by far and wide the highlight of that video.

    Definitely the coolest part of the video, but probably not the most problematic one. The TTK was too low, but taking a group of clustered people by surprise with massive aoe is something I've done in many games. Always epic moments.

    It can usually be avoided by the targets if they take their precautions.

    The fact that one spam attack is so powerful on a single target basis as well was a more important indicator that it was OP as hell imo.

    Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!

  • kitaradkitarad RomePosts: 1,739Member Uncommon

    I am one of those idiots who tend to stand about with their mouth open when I get attacked. This is why PvP escapes me especially strategy and stuff. In the BGs in WoW I could defend a flag or something or keep a flag carrier alive but planning and attacking would have been beyond me. Good thing I was not born a Spartan  or I might have threatened their legend.

     

    There are people who excel at this stuff and they are for whom these games are orgasmic I feel. People like me go where they are told to and stand about  acting as cannon fodder. I think I am the perfect foot soldier . I tried playing company of heroes but once the game got tougher I was completely useless but I still love watching these games. I enjoyed Starcraft II immensely may be because it was not so difficult and the strategy not so complicated. Also I can set it to easy when stumped image

     

    These types of games where your opponent is clever and will flank and use tactics is fun when the people are matched with equal cunning. I avoid them not because I do not enjoy them but I acknowledge my meager planning and strategic skills. I prefer bashing poor defenseless cows and boars to oblivion since they will not be pouring over a map in the near future. Well unless of course something out of the Atrocity Archives decides to descend upon us. Then bovine intelligence might be a real threat.

    image

  • hikaru77hikaru77 buenos airesPosts: 1,035Member Uncommon

    Two words: Korean MMO.  

     

     

  • ikcinikcin AmberPosts: 620Member Common
    Originally posted by Dullahan

    Side note, open world has no relation to pvp.  Open world just means the world is open and not instanced...

    No, open world means you cannot cut or replace parts of the game when you want. PvP is guild wars, sieges, tournaments, cargo loot and etc, and ofc 1vs1 fights too. The PvP in open world game is one with PvE. You don't go in some special area to fight with the other players. You fight with mobs, then with players, or with mobs and players in the same time. So to remove PvP is like cutting of PvE :) In fact most of the russian players are PvPers, so I doubt there will be servers without PK in Russia, no matter what publisher says.

    And about the class balance, it was not a point of tests in CBT2, so, yes there is no class balance... in fact half of the classes are not implemented yet :)

     

    image

  • DullahanDullahan Posts: 2,053Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by ikcin
    Originally posted by Dullahan

    Side note, open world has no relation to pvp.  Open world just means the world is open and not instanced...

    No, open world means you cannot cut or replace parts of the game when you want. PvP is guild wars, sieges, tournaments, cargo loot and etc, and ofc 1vs1 fights too. The PvP in open world game is one with PvE. You don't go in some special area to fight with the other players. You fight with mobs, then with players, or with mobs and players in the same time. So to remove PvP is like cutting of PvE :) In fact most of the russian players are PvPers, so I doubt there will be servers without PK in Russia, no matter what publisher says.

    And about the class balance, it was not a point of tests in CBT2, so, yes there is no class balance... in fact half of the classes are not implemented yet :)

     

    Actually no, it doesn't mean any of those things.  Open world, not to be confused with a seamless world, is the opposite of an instanced world.  Everquest for example,  primarily a pve game (95% of servers), was open world in that every zone was connected to 1 game world and was completely without instances.  Every player in a city or dungeon could see every other player in the game on that server in that city or dungeon.

    Just to clarify, there are some differences of opinion on what makes a game open world.  Some say it means completely seamless (which I disagree with).  Some say it has to have multiple forms of progression to be open world, but thats basically the definition of sandbox, not open world.  Others argue it has to have no artificial barriers or invisible walls, but as it applies to mmorpgs, most agree that its simply means the world is connected, players can roam anywhere without restriction (but not without risk), and there is no instancing that would, in essence, disconnect players from other players or the game world proper.

    What open world isn't dependent on however, is player vs player combat.  Not in mmorpgs, or any other genre of games.


  • OriousOrious O''Fallon, ILPosts: 548Member
    It's hard to tell because most of the time no one was fighting back or knew the enemy was near enough to attack.

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  • goboygogoboygo Posts: 784Member Uncommon

    This game needs more camera shake...... there is actually a moment during combat when the guys camera wasn't spastically shaking all over the place..    What is this supposed to simulate?   My bow makes the ENTIRE world shake.  The game is so much more EXCITING when I cant focus on anything.

     

    Dumb ass over used game effect.  I definitely want my camera spazzing out for 4 hours straight when I'm sieging.

    "Fighting Internet stupidity one post at at time"
  • ChrisboxChrisbox Monroe, NJPosts: 1,707Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Copperfield

     

    yes its possible in archeage..

     

    There are small groups running around with 4 one shot builds and aeo and 2 healers who complete destroy groups of more then 30 people..

     

    Asians dont know the word ttk

    Won't be possible post nerf lol

    Played-Everything
    Playing-FFXIV:ARR

  • UtinniUtinni Richmond, VAPosts: 380Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by DMKano
    Originally posted by Copperfield

    this is some retarded crap..

     

    The asian developers dont know nothing about TTK in games..

     

    The same crap is possible in archeage

    100% wrong - 4 rangers vs a guild of 65 = dead 4 rangers.

     

    Although this is correct, you will most certainly see 65 v 4 fights in Archeage. 

  • ikcinikcin AmberPosts: 620Member Common
    Originally posted by Dullahan

    Actually no, it doesn't mean any of those things.  Open world, not to be confused with a seamless world, is the opposite of an instanced world.  Everquest for example,  primarily a pve game (95% of servers), was open world in that every zone was connected to 1 game world and was completely without instances.  Every player in a city or dungeon could see every other player in the game on that server in that city or dungeon.

    Just to clarify, there are some differences of opinion on what makes a game open world.  Some say it means completely seamless (which I disagree with).  Some say it has to have multiple forms of progression to be open world, but thats basically the definition of sandbox, not open world.  Others argue it has to have no artificial barriers or invisible walls, but as it applies to mmorpgs, most agree that its simply means the world is connected, players can roam anywhere without restriction (but not without risk), and there is no instancing that would, in essence, disconnect players from other players or the game world proper.

    What open world isn't dependent on however, is player vs player combat.  Not in mmorpgs, or any other genre of games.

    Ok, let say in this particular case open world is seamless, so you cannot remove the PvP because it is a part of the PvE and vice versa, like for example was in Lineage 2.

     

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  • vvhitevvizardvvhitevvizard MoscowPosts: 12Member

    Guys, lets just chill! I played CBT2 myself, it was a crazy bug that got fixed in a few days. there were lots of unplanned things popping up here and there, and the majority of them got addressed on the fly.

     

    check this video, lv 52 ranger normal gameplay:

  • vvhitevvizardvvhitevvizard MoscowPosts: 12Member
    In fact most of the russian players are PvPers, so I doubt there will be servers without PK in Russia, no matter what publisher says.

    very true. We might make daum.net pvp regulators become more hardcore for gamenet.ru (equipped items drop from players with negative karma, inventory items drop when a player dies from mobs, pvp/pk from lv 1, etc): all the polls show the majority of players do see the game as a true Lineage 2 successor.

  • vvhitevvizardvvhitevvizard MoscowPosts: 12Member
    Originally posted by goboygo

    This game needs more camera shake.....

    Camera shake/motion blur may be reduced down to zero/disabled respectively.

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