It's important to remember Trion didn't develop the game, they only licensed it, so they don't actually have to return that investement. They do need to return what they spend to port o the west and translate it, but that may not have cost that much.
Honestly, between Founders packs and abit from the cash shop, that shouldn't be too hard, i imagine. Then it's a question to required costs to keep it running. I'd say one should look at EnMass's financials to see if TERA paid off well for them to get an idea. Obviously, they're not the same type of game, but it's a similar picture.
Originally posted by dais I guess you would have to define "smashing success". What it sounds like is the people playing it are already really enjoying it, so that's a win. If you are talking about number of players actively playing the game as sucess then it's going to have to appeal to a much larger playerbase. It would have to make big changes to PvP because honestly the biggest playerbase are PvE players (despite the very vocal PvP minority). Open world non consensual PvP sucks if you just want to level or farm or grind crafting etc etc. To be honest I haven't played the game so I am speaking from ignorance, I am only going off of what I have heard so if that's inaccurate please let me know.
I think many people underastimate the desire to PvP.
In short, just look at all the millions that enjoy playing PvP games like FPS games (CoD, BF,...) and MOBAs (LoL, Dota,...)
If you think any competent MMORPG developer wants to throw a blind eye on that mass of potential customers, than think again. In fact we've seen a lot of attempts already but most of them fall short because MMORPG works differently than, for example, some moba game.
If currently PvE players prevail in MMORPGs that is with a reason. And the main reason being that MMORPGs have failed at creating a proper and working PvP environment (beyond battlegrounds and arenas). Which is not surprising because a massive online rpg is an enormously harder project with a number of extra obstacles compared to much simpler multiplayer games.
Personaly I enjoy having both PvE and PvP nicely tied inside my MMORPG. I'm just waiting for someone to develop something close to EvE inside a 3d fantasy world.
So far AA is probably the closest.
I totally agree with you, however I think you may have misunderstood what I was saying. I think a game needs to have both PvE content and PvP content to be a huge success, however games that force you to PvP when you want to only PvE will end up failing, or in MMO terms of failing (which means a small community playing it). I included the non-consensual PvP statement because games that are total FFA unrestricted PvP will just bring griefers/trolls/gankers and drive out the PvE crowd which is a large percentage of the playerbase. MOBAs are obviously a huge success as are many FPS games and those are almost exclusively PvP, but they are done very well as they are balanced and fair. RPG PvP almost always boils down to whoever is better geared or higher level, and the bad players just gank lower level players to stroke their egos. Right now AA looks like it's going to have unrestricted (or restricted with mild punishments) PvP. Somehow every sandbox thinks that it absolutely has to have full PvP to be a real game which is a shame. There are much better ways to introduce competition in a game against other players without it degrading into camping lowbies to stop them from questing.
IMHO there is a fundamental disconnect with open PvP in a "persistent world" MMO--that being that competition is almost always not on a level playing field. Just about every MMO has either or both of a level and gear progression, as well as perhaps a social progression (i.e. power guilds, etc.). It all depends on the kind of competition you like. IRL, most sports are set up to be as level as possible (though professional sports teams salaries are an issue between big and small markets). But I suppose that can be used as a point of comparison--do you come from a "small market" where your favorite team hardly ever seems to be able to compete? Do you resent the deep pockets of a New York, Boston, LA, etc? This to me is a pale imitation of the disparity that exists in most MMOs.
I admit, I am a PvE only player--and to demonstrate just how much, I played Eve for 3-4 years at launch and I can't ever recall firing at another player... However, what it is that I'm looking for (and my tastes are changing, I think), is some game to some day create a real "virtual world" sandbox, meaning that players are somehow bound to play in a way that matches the fiction in the world. Now, I'm not saying everyone has to RP in-character. But what I am saying is that the world has a dynamic, on-going fiction that while you might decide to not play in (e.g., a war between two countries), the effect of that war is inescapable--for example, its effect on the economy.
Also, the problem in today's MMOs with "ganking" and "griefing" is that these games rarely impose a "social order" or response that acts as a deterrence. So likewise, with my virtual world concept, play which is at odds with the social norms of the society of an area must also come with negative consequences. However, IRL, imprisonment or death is a real deterrent, but I'm not so sure what you can do in a game. I see that AA has a justice system, but I really don't know enough about it to know how effective (or how fair) it will be.
So, the tl;dr version of the above: I wouldn't mind PvP in an open world, sandbox MMO, if it actually fit into a real virtual world setting.
One of the most important factors will be in removing as much of the "typical Asian grind" flavor from AA as possible, for the simply fact that NA players do not tend to like those games.
One simple one that springs to mind is the BS with limited labor points.
Western players, or many at least, do not like to have their gameplay artificially gated by such an obvious mechanic to go spend money in the cash shop. Especially if they are paying a VIP "sub". "Even tho you are paying to play the game, you can only do so much of this....". Lot of people hate that.
Things of that nature.
Otherwise, this game will simply go the way of Age of Wushu, a few players in the West, but nothing significant. That game could not escape being an "Asian grindier", although being one of the best of its kind yet seen.
One of the most important factors will be in removing as much of the "typical Asian grind" flavor from AA as possible, for the simply fact that NA players do not tend to like those games.
One simple one that springs to mind is the BS with limited labor points.
Western players, or many at least, do not like to have their gameplay artificially gated by such an obvious mechanic to go spend money in the cash shop. Especially if they are paying a VIP "sub". "Even tho you are paying to play the game, you can only do so much of this....". Lot of people hate that.
Things of that nature.
Otherwise, this game will simply go the way of Age of Wushu, a few players in the West, but nothing significant. That game could not escape being an "Asian grindier", although being one of the best of its kind yet seen.
I expect the same from AA.
I think that the main problem are people that hate for the sake of hating. I'm not talking about you; but there are many people who are either misinformed or purposely misinforming people.
There Is Only One Thing ArcheAge Is Lacking , Something Only A Handful Of Games Are Doing Yet, Its Cheap Fast And Ez, And Every Game That Has Implicated It , The Players Just Love It.
Give it to a publisher that is not obsessed with gambling lockboxes, does not constantly turn their philosophies upside down and runs down everything they touch.
With Trion at helm ArcheAge will never be a smashing success and you know it.
Give it to a publisher that is not obsessed with gambling lockboxes, does not constantly turn their philosophies upside down and runs down everything they touch.
With Trion at helm ArcheAge will never be a smashing success and you know it.
Trion...the company that made Rift which tries to incorporate the best features.....hell, all features that every other mmo has. You can't trust them. They only care about their precious Rift.
Deepdown we all know that their master plan is to incorporate all the popular features from ArcheAge into Rift. The next Rift expansion will be a themepark owpvp continent. This is why they are charging $150 to alpha test a game that was already developed, tested, and released. They need that money for Rift and once Rift is the ultimate western themepark AND sandbox they will kick AA to the curb.
It will be just a niche game in the U.S. Not enough pve content will turn most people off. Its to late to change what the game is. It won't do well here as it is no matter what pvper's say.. Its already been proven with other better games that games like this are not ever popular.
I believe the following changes would make ArcheAge a smashing success for the North American region:
1. Remove Hackshield from the game launch process
2. Remove character collision
3. Add macros
4. Add addons
5. Add a /follow command (Yes there is a follow keybind but this would make it much better)
6. Add an /assist command
lol!
Sarcasm here is strong.
+1
Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.
Originally posted by stayBlind No PvP or combat. I want to be a farmer. Also, I think it would be really cool if we could build fighter jets or space ship type vehicles.
You can be a farmer already and no one is forcing you to PvP.
You know what he means.
He just wants to farm and trade and not to get ganked while doing it.
There are so many other games with no pvp, consensual pvp, and other iterations.
A game comes along that is a little different, and players want to change it. Don't you players have enough games to play?
As to " He just wants to farm and trade and not to get ganked while doing it." , I suggest Farmville.
Originally posted by stayBlind No PvP or combat. I want to be a farmer. Also, I think it would be really cool if we could build fighter jets or space ship type vehicles.
You can be a farmer already and no one is forcing you to PvP.
You know what he means.
He just wants to farm and trade and not to get ganked while doing it.
There are so many other games with no pvp, consensual pvp, and other iterations.
A game comes along that is a little different, and players want to change it. Don't you players have enough games to play?
As to " He just wants to farm and trade and not to get ganked while doing it." , I suggest Farmville.
Its impossible to make changes to ArcheAge to make it a smash in NA. For one, its korean and there isnt much that can be done about that. Its also a PvP game and to change that would be to make a completely different game.
Maybe if they made some of the game elements deeper (item making process and class system are uninspired) more PvErs and crafters would tolerate the PvP aspects, but its just simply not strong enough in those areas to capture people long term.
I don't see how allowing players to "Freely" change skills would mess up PVP, In Guild wars 2, I can freely change my skills outside of PVP in town and then go into PVP with different skills later on it doesn't interrupt PVP at all, doesn't give me any unfair advantage others don't have.
Same thing with Dark Fall, I can change my class any time I want in a town I have to spend 60 seconds casting without getting attacked so it can't be done during PVP, I can change my skills any time I want doesn't give me any unfair advantage, I don't understand why "ArcheAge" didn't adopt such a system.
I love PVP in games, but to have these limits, let alone now that I just found out you have 5000 Labor points and once used you can't craft or harvest anymore and only gain 5 points every 5 real life minutes it turns me away from the game even more.
I don't think the game will be strong enough to keep players there I mean look at "Rift" I don't even put much money into Rift at all $20 maybe that is about all in over a year , and Defiance lost a lot of players because of some of the changes it was pretty much dead which is why they are making changes to the new season trying to bring the game back to life for season 2
You do understand MMO's cost money right??? If you spent 20 bucks all year, then they made nothing off of you, if everyone did this, the game would be off line, the freeloaders need to understand this company's need to make money, they can't add everything in a game at first either until they see if they get it back, the issue today more than ever, with F2P there are to many free loaders.
I play ESO because there is a sub, I love because you don't like a game that it fails, that means you don't like it, there are plenty who do like it, but saying a game fails because you dislike is a silly statement, saying I dislike it is fine, but using a word fail, makes me laugh, heck I would love for you to say my games fail and I make millions, sure please do.
In my opinion all they need to do is replace the Korean cut scenes with English versions and launch. This is the first game I have been this pleased with since LoTRO's beta.
Edit - Wreckboy I had an issue with hacksheild a day or so ago and their tech rep told me to try deleting the asc folder
Comments
It's important to remember Trion didn't develop the game, they only licensed it, so they don't actually have to return that investement. They do need to return what they spend to port o the west and translate it, but that may not have cost that much.
Honestly, between Founders packs and abit from the cash shop, that shouldn't be too hard, i imagine. Then it's a question to required costs to keep it running. I'd say one should look at EnMass's financials to see if TERA paid off well for them to get an idea. Obviously, they're not the same type of game, but it's a similar picture.
I totally agree with you, however I think you may have misunderstood what I was saying. I think a game needs to have both PvE content and PvP content to be a huge success, however games that force you to PvP when you want to only PvE will end up failing, or in MMO terms of failing (which means a small community playing it). I included the non-consensual PvP statement because games that are total FFA unrestricted PvP will just bring griefers/trolls/gankers and drive out the PvE crowd which is a large percentage of the playerbase. MOBAs are obviously a huge success as are many FPS games and those are almost exclusively PvP, but they are done very well as they are balanced and fair. RPG PvP almost always boils down to whoever is better geared or higher level, and the bad players just gank lower level players to stroke their egos. Right now AA looks like it's going to have unrestricted (or restricted with mild punishments) PvP. Somehow every sandbox thinks that it absolutely has to have full PvP to be a real game which is a shame. There are much better ways to introduce competition in a game against other players without it degrading into camping lowbies to stop them from questing.
IMHO there is a fundamental disconnect with open PvP in a "persistent world" MMO--that being that competition is almost always not on a level playing field. Just about every MMO has either or both of a level and gear progression, as well as perhaps a social progression (i.e. power guilds, etc.). It all depends on the kind of competition you like. IRL, most sports are set up to be as level as possible (though professional sports teams salaries are an issue between big and small markets). But I suppose that can be used as a point of comparison--do you come from a "small market" where your favorite team hardly ever seems to be able to compete? Do you resent the deep pockets of a New York, Boston, LA, etc? This to me is a pale imitation of the disparity that exists in most MMOs.
I admit, I am a PvE only player--and to demonstrate just how much, I played Eve for 3-4 years at launch and I can't ever recall firing at another player... However, what it is that I'm looking for (and my tastes are changing, I think), is some game to some day create a real "virtual world" sandbox, meaning that players are somehow bound to play in a way that matches the fiction in the world. Now, I'm not saying everyone has to RP in-character. But what I am saying is that the world has a dynamic, on-going fiction that while you might decide to not play in (e.g., a war between two countries), the effect of that war is inescapable--for example, its effect on the economy.
Also, the problem in today's MMOs with "ganking" and "griefing" is that these games rarely impose a "social order" or response that acts as a deterrence. So likewise, with my virtual world concept, play which is at odds with the social norms of the society of an area must also come with negative consequences. However, IRL, imprisonment or death is a real deterrent, but I'm not so sure what you can do in a game. I see that AA has a justice system, but I really don't know enough about it to know how effective (or how fair) it will be.
So, the tl;dr version of the above: I wouldn't mind PvP in an open world, sandbox MMO, if it actually fit into a real virtual world setting.
One of the most important factors will be in removing as much of the "typical Asian grind" flavor from AA as possible, for the simply fact that NA players do not tend to like those games.
One simple one that springs to mind is the BS with limited labor points.
Western players, or many at least, do not like to have their gameplay artificially gated by such an obvious mechanic to go spend money in the cash shop. Especially if they are paying a VIP "sub". "Even tho you are paying to play the game, you can only do so much of this....". Lot of people hate that.
Things of that nature.
Otherwise, this game will simply go the way of Age of Wushu, a few players in the West, but nothing significant. That game could not escape being an "Asian grindier", although being one of the best of its kind yet seen.
I expect the same from AA.
I think that the main problem are people that hate for the sake of hating. I'm not talking about you; but there are many people who are either misinformed or purposely misinforming people.
Google was invented; let's make use of it.
There Is Only One Thing ArcheAge Is Lacking , Something Only A Handful Of Games Are Doing Yet, Its Cheap Fast And Ez, And Every Game That Has Implicated It , The Players Just Love It.
Dedicated In Game Party Voice Chat .
Give it to a publisher that is not obsessed with gambling lockboxes, does not constantly turn their philosophies upside down and runs down everything they touch.
With Trion at helm ArcheAge will never be a smashing success and you know it.
Trion...the company that made Rift which tries to incorporate the best features.....hell, all features that every other mmo has. You can't trust them. They only care about their precious Rift.
Deepdown we all know that their master plan is to incorporate all the popular features from ArcheAge into Rift. The next Rift expansion will be a themepark owpvp continent. This is why they are charging $150 to alpha test a game that was already developed, tested, and released. They need that money for Rift and once Rift is the ultimate western themepark AND sandbox they will kick AA to the curb.
Nothing?
I believe the following changes would make ArcheAge a smashing success for the North American region:
1. Remove Hackshield from the game launch process
2. Remove character collision
3. Add macros
4. Add addons
5. Add a /follow command (Yes there is a follow keybind but this would make it much better)
6. Add an /assist command
I loved that in Neocron. Another great old game.
lol!
Sarcasm here is strong.
+1
Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.
There are so many other games with no pvp, consensual pvp, and other iterations.
A game comes along that is a little different, and players want to change it. Don't you players have enough games to play?
As to " He just wants to farm and trade and not to get ganked while doing it." , I suggest Farmville.
He should enjoy that.
http://www.entropiapartners.com/?r=22415
Don't think it it will make AA smashing success ,
but this game seriously need item destroy (decay) upon dead (PVP, PVE) and better craft system , the RNG craft is no good.
I hope they will bring the item decay (destroy) system to test at beta before release the game.
The old item decay wasn't good , more like sacrifice another item to raise your item's durability.
Better if ArcheAge use EVE item decay , you know ... get kill and your gears goon.
Thought some players will think it too hardcore .
This game also need better gold sink.
Also i like to see the PK players drop items they carry in they bags when they die ,
PK sound like they are all hardcore player and don't mind about the risk of get they item drop when die.
At less ArcheAge need 2 more beta test other stuff before release state .
But at the rate of hype , i think this game will in release state soon ,
Of course , with no changes ,
It will be at level of Age of Wulin , but smashing success is just a dream.
Nothing will make MMO's anything more than what they are because the new player base will throw a tantrum and ask for a refund.
Even though they played the game every day for months.
My suggestion would be to look up sarcasm.
imo? things that cannot be implemented
open skill system
horizontal progression system
more dynamic actiony combat
more interesting quests and npc's
more westernized and realistic art style...
...so waiting for black desert then...
You do understand MMO's cost money right??? If you spent 20 bucks all year, then they made nothing off of you, if everyone did this, the game would be off line, the freeloaders need to understand this company's need to make money, they can't add everything in a game at first either until they see if they get it back, the issue today more than ever, with F2P there are to many free loaders.
I play ESO because there is a sub, I love because you don't like a game that it fails, that means you don't like it, there are plenty who do like it, but saying a game fails because you dislike is a silly statement, saying I dislike it is fine, but using a word fail, makes me laugh, heck I would love for you to say my games fail and I make millions, sure please do.
Error: No Keyboard Detected!
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Help support an artist and gamer who has lost his tools to create and play: http://www.gofundme.com/u63nzcgk
In my opinion all they need to do is replace the Korean cut scenes with English versions and launch. This is the first game I have been this pleased with since LoTRO's beta.
Edit - Wreckboy I had an issue with hacksheild a day or so ago and their tech rep told me to try deleting the asc folder
"C:Program Files (x86)GlyphGamesArcheAgeAlphain32hshieldasc"
worked for me.
I miss DAoC