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Discrimination against hearing impaired in a new mmo?(ESO)

2

Comments

  • ArchlyteArchlyte Member RarePosts: 1,405

    All MMOs should henceforth be mandated to provide Chat Bubbles because of the Americans With Disabilities Act. Some lawyers might make some money pursuing this obvious discrimination from games like SWTOR, Planetside 2, etc.

    This would be a good lever to get chat bubbles into games again. File Suit!

    MMORPG players are often like Hobbits: They don't like Adventures
  • kakasakikakasaki Member UncommonPosts: 1,205
    Originally posted by Archlyte

    All MMOs should henceforth be mandated to provide Chat Bubbles because of the Americans With Disabilities Act. Some lawyers might make some money pursuing this obvious discrimination from games like SWTOR, Planetside 2, etc.

    This would be a good lever to get chat bubbles into games again. File Suit!

     

    Hope this is sarcasm or trolling cause if you are serious.... god help us all.

    A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...

  • ArchlyteArchlyte Member RarePosts: 1,405
    Originally posted by kakasaki
    Originally posted by Archlyte

    All MMOs should henceforth be mandated to provide Chat Bubbles because of the Americans With Disabilities Act. Some lawyers might make some money pursuing this obvious discrimination from games like SWTOR, Planetside 2, etc.

    This would be a good lever to get chat bubbles into games again. File Suit!

     

    Hope this is sarcasm or trolling cause if you are serious.... god help us all.

    Well they force other crap on us through Government and Litigation already. Might as well use it for something I like :)

    MMORPG players are often like Hobbits: They don't like Adventures
  • kakasakikakasaki Member UncommonPosts: 1,205
    Originally posted by Archlyte
    Originally posted by kakasaki
    Originally posted by Archlyte

    All MMOs should henceforth be mandated to provide Chat Bubbles because of the Americans With Disabilities Act. Some lawyers might make some money pursuing this obvious discrimination from games like SWTOR, Planetside 2, etc.

    This would be a good lever to get chat bubbles into games again. File Suit!

     

    Hope this is sarcasm or trolling cause if you are serious.... god help us all.

    Well they force other crap on us through Government and Litigation already. Might as well use it for something I like :)

    Short answer: No

     

    Longer answer: As other have stated on this thread, it is not discrimination. Second: I hate chat bubbles. Why force them on me? Lastly: Are we not sick in this country of frivolous, time/tax payer money wasting litigation that only makes the lawyers richer?

    A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...

  • onlinenow25onlinenow25 Member UncommonPosts: 305
    Originally posted by General-Zod
    Originally posted by Quirhid
    Certain services need to be made available to everyone (by law?). Games are not included in those services. This is not discrimination.

    This.

    At the end of the day this is just entertainment folks...

    The last job I worked at had 5 different restaurants sued by a single person because of a few minor over sights in wheel chair accessibility.  

     

    When I say minor, I mean there were 3 tables that where half an inch too "low" for standard wheel chair accessibility. 

     

    And the food at the restaurant I worked was for leisure and in no way required or needed to supply food for the area that it was in. 

     

    To knowingly not put in or account for people of disability is discrimination.  Sorry you can't make a white only shopping mall now can you?

  • CouganCougan Member UncommonPosts: 422
    Thought all the VA was in subtitles anyway.
  • onlinenow25onlinenow25 Member UncommonPosts: 305

    OP if you wanna make a lot of money, contact Zenimax let them know of your situation.

     

    If they do not provide a solution to your situation, and basically tell you tough shit, thats called Gross Negligence.

     

    I don't know if you could find a lawyer to take it up, but you might be able to.  It just depends on if they think its a real issue or not and could establish a presidence to require video games to be accessible to those that are hard of hearing.

  • ZebladeZeblade Member UncommonPosts: 931

    "discrimination" its not.

    Granted out of 300mil people there are around 4mill that have hearing problems. No those are not ALL deaf. That has hearing loss and the like.

    I mean there are tons of movies that have NO subs in them. So its not the lack of care or someone is trying or meaning to "discriminate" (some do) yet not here. They ESO cares about NO ONE. So welcome to the club.

    I heard there is this man that can take care of that. If one simply would ask and believe. Child like faith. They believe anything. Been there face to face seen it. So it does happen every day. Easier out side of USA. For most out there believe in voodoo and the like. So "magic" happens all the time. Here haha if they cant see or hear or taste it.. its not real.

  • Arche_AgeArche_Age Member Posts: 11

    Wow some of you guys are really fucking degrading.

     

    The way you treat someone with a disability really shocks me.

     

    OP, is having trouble with the game.

     

    Zenimax didn't provide his needs. 

     

    So therefore, he posted his issue.

     

    I think it should be standard practice to help those who have a disability.

     

    If this is how the ESO community acts towards the impaired.

     

    Well than have fun with your quest grinding no endgame PVE bug ridden gold spamming pos eso copy/paste dungeon skin game. 

  • dbgagerdbgager Member UncommonPosts: 175
    Online....lol..Where exactly does it say in there advertisements or info on the game. " Game is hearing impaired freindly". Gross Neglicence for what. It is not harming him in any way whatsoever that he cannot play the game. That is truly dumb..Do you even understand what gross negligence means.  Nobody has stated or promised this poster that these things would be provided in the game.
  • CandyCaneNJCandyCaneNJ Member UncommonPosts: 187
    Originally posted by evilized
    Apparently OP didn't get the response he wanted the last time he posted this same exact thread on the general forum and decided to try his luck here. Go pity-fish somewhere else. It was already explained that companies aren't required to have disability related support in their products, only in communication with customers. As I said in your other thread, stop trying to be a victim and take some personal responsibility. This sort of behavior is really pathetic.

    You are a complete rude jerk. It's sad that people talk to people online any way they want without any kind of compassion or thought. Disgusting example of a person with 0 manners 

  • IvidnaelaxIvidnaelax Member UncommonPosts: 67
    Like people said, "this is not the forum for you to call out Zenimax." You need to go to their personal forums and post your complaint there. I do understand your point of view, but how are they to know when you don't personally tell them. A company cannot work with someone if they don't know about it, but like other people have said, "They don't have to do anything of the sort either to make a specific accommodation that could be to burden some on them as a whole, but coming here to complain about it is serving you no good.
  • kakasakikakasaki Member UncommonPosts: 1,205
    Originally posted by Arche_Age

    Wow some of you guys are really fucking degrading.

     Apart from one or two posts, please point out what was degrading about what is being discussed?

    The way you treat someone with a disability really shocks me.

     Not really treating them any differently than the average posters treat each other around here... Not saying that is correct but he is not being treated differently than most posters here.

    OP, is having trouble with the game.

     Yeah, so our a lot of people.

    Zenimax didn't provide his needs. 

     Can't meet the needs for every possible customer...

    So therefore, he posted his issue.

     No one stopped him from doing so...

    I think it should be standard practice to help those who have a disability.

     True but this is not always feasibly possible...

    If this is how the ESO community acts towards the impaired.

     So from one or two posters on here you are passing judgement on an ENTIRE community?!?! Exaggerate much? 

    Well than have fun with your quest grinding no endgame PVE bug ridden gold spamming pos eso copy/paste dungeon skin game. 

    So your real issue is you don't like the game hence your over reaction? Gotcha!

     

     

    A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...

  • PurutzilPurutzil Member UncommonPosts: 3,048

    Honestly I don't think they are discriminating knowingly. People tend to forget about issues that others have. Its not as if they WANT to leave people out, it just doesn't come to mind. Commonly, this is reflected for those who are colorblind who often get shafted on games when they first come out.

     

    That said, I would emphasize the need for speech bubbles or other things. Its benefitial to everyone really, and it helps those who are hearing impaired have a chance to experience the game more fully.

  • onlinenow25onlinenow25 Member UncommonPosts: 305
    Originally posted by dbgager
    Online....lol..Where exactly does it say in there advertisements or info on the game. " Game is hearing impaired freindly". Gross Neglicence for what. It is not harming him in any way whatsoever that he cannot play the game. That is truly dumb..Do you even understand what gross negligence means.  Nobody has stated or promised this poster that these things would be provided in the game.

    If you read my post you would actually understand where the Gross Negligence comes from.

     

    It comes from the person in this case OP asking for a solution to his disability, and Zenimax not providing one if they do not provide one.

     

    While there may not be any laws to protect against this currently there will be, as with a whole bunch of new laws protecting both the consumer and business end of virtual property.

     

    No matter what product is being using, if it is unusable by a select portion of a group of people it is discrimination.  By definition what the OP is experience is discrimination.

     

    http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/discrimination

     

    Here look up the definition I provided a link.  Its discrimination no matter how you slice it.  But can be easily fixed and seen as a simple oversight as long as Zenimax provides a solution to the OP's problem.

  • onlinenow25onlinenow25 Member UncommonPosts: 305
    Originally posted by Purutzil

    Honestly I don't think they are discriminating knowingly. People tend to forget about issues that others have. Its not as if they WANT to leave people out, it just doesn't come to mind. Commonly, this is reflected for those who are colorblind who often get shafted on games when they first come out.

     

    That said, I would emphasize the need for speech bubbles or other things. Its benefitial to everyone really, and it helps those who are hearing impaired have a chance to experience the game more fully.

    Ownestly they probably arn't.  They just cut corners because they were strapped on time and didnt' think about those that are hard/can't hear.

     

    The big issue comes up when this information is given to them, that their product is discriminitory towards the hard of hearing and if Zenimax provides no solution and ignores it.

     

    Then it goes from Negligence, to Gross Negligence.

  • LordZeikLordZeik Member UncommonPosts: 276
    I've seen people overcome their disabilities all the time and make do. Heck there is this one brave soul who plays league of legends without the use of his hands.(and does a better job than some of the people I've teamed with) Next time OP you may want to do a little more research before going all PC on Zenimax.  The addon system for ESO makes up for a good amount of it's shortcomings.
  • KuinnKuinn Member UncommonPosts: 2,072
    Originally posted by Crownregent

    Hello.

    As a born deaf person of 35 years old, I have played my share of mmos through the years.

    Ultima Online was my first fully invested mmo and I was really thrilled that everything had to be written in order to be conveyed.

    Then SWG came along and the same thread of info conveying was followed.

    Wow started with missing speech bubbles here and there but they got fixed along the way.

    Then there is Elder Scrolls Online...

    Where to start? First Lydia and then the prophet... most people who is over the age of 20 cant properly hear what they say.

    Then lots of the story chains where you have to follow people and they chat away you don't understand or hear what they say due to either crappy voice actors, weird accents or other issues.

    Is any of this speech in writing? NO..... Not even in chat screen which would made it bearable.. but there has been times I have had to guess what the answer to questions were just because there wasn't any written proof to back up what I guessed.

    Try to play the game from beginning to scratch with NO sound whatsoever... and then you maybe get what im upset about.

    So in my honest opnion Eso is a discriminatory game against anyone who has a hearing impediment.

     

    So Zenimax... unless u fix this shit.. u can forget me as a subscriber and probably everyone else who like to know the story in whole.

    Crownregent

     

    I was really surprised there's no subtitles to toggle on for this game, it's one of the first things I always  toggle on in games. The dialog is written but often NPC's speak outside of dialog and it's not written anywhere. I havent tried the chatbox option "show npc talk in chat" or something like that, but I assume it works only for the dialog too.

  • onlinenow25onlinenow25 Member UncommonPosts: 305
    Originally posted by LordZeik
    I've seen people overcome their disabilities all the time and make do. Heck there is this one brave soul who plays league of legends without the use of his hands.(and does a better job than some of the people I've teamed with) Next time OP you may want to do a little more research before going all PC on Zenimax.  The addon system for ESO makes up for a good amount of it's shortcomings.

    Its one thing to not have arms and expect to play video games, its another thing COMPLETELY to be hearing impaired and have a game not have subtitles.

     

    One you physically do not have the capability to use a keyboard like someone else, and currently there is no technology we have to allow a person with two missing arms to have something function as well as our arms and hands do.

     

    Second the OP has a direct way of dealing with his handy cap, that is his ability of sight and read.  While one situation is completely fucked because of his bad luck of being born/getting his arms removed from an accident, the other has a very VERY simple solution to the problem.

     

    Its posts like these that... yea... really hope you don't reproduce and raise children with that mindset.

  • DamonVileDamonVile Member UncommonPosts: 4,818

    why should a disabled person have to over come it, when it's a feature many " normal" people want and use in a game.

    Turning off the sound and playing music instead is a pretty normal thing for gamers. It's very weird that they didn't think of this. I don't think this has to be a special feature put into the game so deaf people can play. Subtitles is something that should just be standard in any well designed game.

  • CandyCaneNJCandyCaneNJ Member UncommonPosts: 187
    Originally posted by DamonVile

    why should a disabled person have to over come it, when it's a feature many " normal" people want and use in a game.

    Turning off the sound and playing music instead is a pretty normal thing for gamers. It's very weird that they didn't think of this. I don't think this has to be a special feature put into the game so deaf people can play. Subtitles is something that should just be standard in any well designed game.

    Exactly. TV's in America have mandatory closed captioning for the hearing impaired since the late 80's-early 90's. Having subtitles in PC games is just common sense

  • Thomas2006Thomas2006 Member RarePosts: 1,152

    I have to wander if it was just a oversite on there part and less about discrimination. 99% of the quests are texted and voiced. They must have just not thought about the walking sequeces or the parts that are also not texted. Doesnt make alot of sense when like I said the biggest part of the game has text and voice both.

  • dbgagerdbgager Member UncommonPosts: 175
    Originally posted by onlinenow25
    Originally posted by dbgager
    Online....lol..Where exactly does it say in there advertisements or info on the game. " Game is hearing impaired freindly". Gross Neglicence for what. It is not harming him in any way whatsoever that he cannot play the game. That is truly dumb..Do you even understand what gross negligence means.  Nobody has stated or promised this poster that these things would be provided in the game.

    If you read my post you would actually understand where the Gross Negligence comes from.

     

    It comes from the person in this case OP asking for a solution to his disability, and Zenimax not providing one if they do not provide one.

     

    While there may not be any laws to protect against this currently there will be, as with a whole bunch of new laws protecting both the consumer and business end of virtual property.

     

    No matter what product is being using, if it is unusable by a select portion of a group of people it is discrimination.  By definition what the OP is experience is discrimination.

     

    http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/discrimination

     

    Here look up the definition I provided a link.  Its discrimination no matter how you slice it.  But can be easily fixed and seen as a simple oversight as long as Zenimax provides a solution to the OP's problem.

    There are no laws that provide for products to be used by all people..Besides the fact that it is impossible. Should all cars have controls in them for blind or paralyzed people. How about a  telephone ..I guess they are discriminating against deaf people to..or a smoke alarm...or countless other products. And those are actually products where yu can be harmed by not being able to hear. But they are not required to make them work for deaf people. This is a game and the fact that its only an entertainment product and he is being harmed in no way whatsoever...makes it even less likely that they would take you seriously.

    Gross Negligence. An indifference to, and a blatant violation of, a legal duty with respect to the rights of others. Gross negligence is a conscious and voluntary ...

     

    There is no legal duty whatsoever for companys to provide products for all people...The judge would laugh you out of the courtroom. 

  • kakasakikakasaki Member UncommonPosts: 1,205
    Originally posted by onlinenow25
    Originally posted by dbgager
    Online....lol..Where exactly does it say in there advertisements or info on the game. " Game is hearing impaired freindly". Gross Neglicence for what. It is not harming him in any way whatsoever that he cannot play the game. That is truly dumb..Do you even understand what gross negligence means.  Nobody has stated or promised this poster that these things would be provided in the game.

    If you read my post you would actually understand where the Gross Negligence comes from.

     

    It comes from the person in this case OP asking for a solution to his disability, and Zenimax not providing one if they do not provide one.

     

    While there may not be any laws to protect against this currently there will be, as with a whole bunch of new laws protecting both the consumer and business end of virtual property.

     

    No matter what product is being using, if it is unusable by a select portion of a group of people it is discrimination.  By definition what the OP is experience is discrimination.

     

    http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/discrimination

     

    Here look up the definition I provided a link.  Its discrimination no matter how you slice it.  But can be easily fixed and seen as a simple oversight as long as Zenimax provides a solution to the OP's problem.

    Did I miss the part where he contacted the company and they told him no?

    A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...

  • EhllfhireEhllfhire Member UncommonPosts: 633
    Originally posted by Crownregent

    Hello.

    As a born deaf person of 35 years old, I have played my share of mmos through the years.

    Ultima Online was my first fully invested mmo and I was really thrilled that everything had to be written in order to be conveyed.

    Then SWG came along and the same thread of info conveying was followed.

    Wow started with missing speech bubbles here and there but they got fixed along the way.

    Then there is Elder Scrolls Online...

    Where to start? First Lydia and then the prophet... most people who is over the age of 20 cant properly hear what they say.

    Then lots of the story chains where you have to follow people and they chat away you don't understand or hear what they say due to either crappy voice actors, weird accents or other issues.

    Is any of this speech in writing? NO..... Not even in chat screen which would made it bearable.. but there has been times I have had to guess what the answer to questions were just because there wasn't any written proof to back up what I guessed.

    Try to play the game from beginning to scratch with NO sound whatsoever... and then you maybe get what im upset about.

    So in my honest opnion Eso is a discriminatory game against anyone who has a hearing impediment.

     

    So Zenimax... unless u fix this shit.. u can forget me as a subscriber and probably everyone else who like to know the story in whole.

    Crownregent

    I doubt Zenimax cares for the .0000000000001% of their players who decide to try play a game despite being limited. They arent here to cater to you. And secondly Im 36 and can hear the convos just fine. And where do you draw the line? What if a deaf illiterate player plays? Is it still zenimax's fault? No, its natures, and nature is a cruel mistress. Be happy its the 21st century where they dont kill you at birth for being differant

    Any graphical, audio, or gameplay restrictions not seen in other mmos but found in FFXIV can be blamed on one thing.
    PS3

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