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Why are we so accepting of bugged/broken/incomplete MMO releases?

uggeh12uggeh12 Valencia, CAPosts: 44Member

With the release of ESO imminent and with early access already going on I've noticed the same kind of posts I see after any major release; "games broken", "I can't play"," too many bugs", etc.  Of course I see the now predictable responses of; "game plays perfectly for me", "it's launch what do you expect" and, "maybe you should play single players games if you dont like (insert problem here)".

So my question is why are MMO players, and gamers in general, so accepting of an incomplete product? I doubt most of us would be as accepting if we bought a brand new car in the same relative condition most MMOs release at. This isn't an attack against ESO or any other MMO, I'm merely curious why we as gamers put up with this and in some cases actually defend the developer for giving us a incomplete product.

Would love to hear your thoughts.

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Comments

  • dinamsdinams Muriae, VAPosts: 1,362Member
    Originally posted by uggeh12

    With the release of ESO imminent and with early access already going on I've noticed the same kind of posts I see after any major release; "games broken", "I can't play"," too many bugs", etc.  Of course I see the now predictable responses of; "game plays perfectly for me", "it's launch what do you expect" and, "maybe you should play single players games if you dont like (insert problem here)".

    So my question is why are MMO players, and gamers in general, so accepting of an incomplete product? I doubt most of us would be as accepting if we bought a brand new car in the same relative condition most MMOs release at. This isn't an attack against ESO or any other MMO, I'm merely curious why we as gamers put up with this and in some cases actually defend the developer for giving us a incomplete product.

    Would love to hear your thoughts.

    Game plays perfectly for me, its launch what do you expect? 

    Maybe you should play single players games if you dont like downtimes

     

     

    "It has potential"
    -Second most used phrase on existence
    "It sucks"
    -Most used phrase on existence

  • asmkm22asmkm22 Anchorage, AKPosts: 1,788Member
    Originally posted by uggeh12

    With the release of ESO imminent and with early access already going on I've noticed the same kind of posts I see after any major release; "games broken", "I can't play"," too many bugs", etc.  Of course I see the now predictable responses of; "game plays perfectly for me", "it's launch what do you expect" and, "maybe you should play single players games if you dont like (insert problem here)".

    So my question is why are MMO players, and gamers in general, so accepting of an incomplete product? I doubt most of us would be as accepting if we bought a brand new car in the same relative condition most MMOs release at. This isn't an attack against ESO or any other MMO, I'm merely curious why we as gamers put up with this and in some cases actually defend the developer for giving us a incomplete product.

    Would love to hear your thoughts.

    Because MMO's are a lot more complicated to make and run.

    You make me like charity

  • MadatanMadatan PitePosts: 167Member Uncommon
    Because people don't seem to realize that almost ALL new products, whether it's a physical item or a software rarely comes out perfect from the start.
  • LostarLostar Johnstown, PAPosts: 901Member

    Because I don't have the time or manpower to make an MMO and playing an MMO that might have some kinks here and there doesn't have the potential to kill me...

     

    First world problems.

  • fivorothfivoroth LondonPosts: 3,661Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Madatan
    Because people don't seem to realize that almost ALL new products, whether it's a physical item or a software rarely comes out perfect from the start.

    My Iphone 5s came out fine at launch.

    Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.

  • PoachinatorPoachinator Mystic, CTPosts: 80Member
    Originally posted by uggeh12

    With the release of ESO imminent and with early access already going on I've noticed the same kind of posts I see after any major release; "games broken", "I can't play"," too many bugs", etc.  Of course I see the now predictable responses of; "game plays perfectly for me", "it's launch what do you expect" and, "maybe you should play single players games if you dont like (insert problem here)".

    So my question is why are MMO players, and gamers in general, so accepting of an incomplete product? I doubt most of us would be as accepting if we bought a brand new car in the same relative condition most MMOs release at. This isn't an attack against ESO or any other MMO, I'm merely curious why we as gamers put up with this and in some cases actually defend the developer for giving us a incomplete product.

    Would love to hear your thoughts.

    Because they will fix it and everyone around here has been waiting for the next big thing since Vanilla WoW.

  • MadatanMadatan PitePosts: 167Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by fivoroth
    Originally posted by Madatan
    Because people don't seem to realize that almost ALL new products, whether it's a physical item or a software rarely comes out perfect from the start.

    My Iphone 5s came out fine at launch.

    And yet there are iPhones that breaks, that catches fire, that experience bugs etc etc.

    Your empiric study of one item is no point at all.

  • Four0SixFour0Six Missoula, MTPosts: 1,181Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by uggeh12

    With the release of ESO imminent and with early access already going on I've noticed the same kind of posts I see after any major release; "games broken", "I can't play"," too many bugs", etc.  Of course I see the now predictable responses of; "game plays perfectly for me", "it's launch what do you expect" and, "maybe you should play single players games if you dont like (insert problem here)".

    So my question is why are MMO players, and gamers in general, so accepting of an incomplete product? I doubt most of us would be as accepting if we bought a brand new car in the same relative condition most MMOs release at. This isn't an attack against ESO or any other MMO, I'm merely curious why we as gamers put up with this and in some cases actually defend the developer for giving us a incomplete product.

    Would love to hear your thoughts.

     

    Why does Justin Bieber sell millions of albums?

     

    I believe that the answer to this question will also answer yours.

  • BeansnBreadBeansnBread PshPosts: 5,498Member Uncommon
    I think it has a lot to do with sunk costs fallacy. In this case, the sunk costs aren't just money, but also time spent defending, propping up or otherwise supporting a game (any game). Once you actually put your money on the line, it just strengthens the bond between consumer and product to the point where almost everything becomes forgivable.
  • SovrathSovrath Boston Area, MAPosts: 18,453Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by uggeh12

    With the release of ESO imminent and with early access already going on I've noticed the same kind of posts I see after any major release; "games broken", "I can't play"," too many bugs", etc.  Of course I see the now predictable responses of; "game plays perfectly for me", "it's launch what do you expect" and, "maybe you should play single players games if you dont like (insert problem here)".

    So my question is why are MMO players, and gamers in general, so accepting of an incomplete product? I doubt most of us would be as accepting if we bought a brand new car in the same relative condition most MMOs release at. This isn't an attack against ESO or any other MMO, I'm merely curious why we as gamers put up with this and in some cases actually defend the developer for giving us a incomplete product.

    Would love to hear your thoughts.

    Probably because it doesn't bother them.

    Some players blow a gasket and some players just don't care. It's a non-issue.

    It's like going to a carnival haunted house and either getting mad because it wasn't scary at all and you can see the wire and the head of one of the monsters came off or getting into the spirit of the thing and not letting the papier-mache skeletons with the missing arm bother you.

    It's essentially about acknowledging issues and making a decision to either "not play" because the issues are too much to handle or to say "yeah their are issues but they won't affect my mood and I'll just roll with the punches.

    Where it starts getting tense is where there are a group of players who are afronted by the idea that not every one is incensed as they are.

    this is not to say people should just "take it". But it does mean that people who aren't interested in a flawed experience should remove themselves from teh equation but realize that decision is their right and also what they "should" do.

    They should then "let go" of the fact that not everyone is as bothered as they and that must be "ok".

    Otherwise, in the end, one is just going to become a bitter individual.

  • WereLlamaWereLlama Lubbock, TXPosts: 243Member

    Game development is trending towards players being part of the development process.

    Players are paying, in some cases, more to be part of the early development.

     

  • kanechartkanechart Barrie, ONPosts: 630Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by uggeh12

    With the release of ESO imminent and with early access already going on I've noticed the same kind of posts I see after any major release; "games broken", "I can't play"," too many bugs", etc.  Of course I see the now predictable responses of; "game plays perfectly for me", "it's launch what do you expect" and, "maybe you should play single players games if you dont like (insert problem here)".

    So my question is why are MMO players, and gamers in general, so accepting of an incomplete product? I doubt most of us would be as accepting if we bought a brand new car in the same relative condition most MMOs release at. This isn't an attack against ESO or any other MMO, I'm merely curious why we as gamers put up with this and in some cases actually defend the developer for giving us a incomplete product.

    Would love to hear your thoughts.

    Overall it's pretty good for me.. Though I know some the complex issues has causes some the more complex quests to break. They were working but they ended up breaking the longer the server was up. Clearly something their going to fix as time goes on.

    Using ESO as an example as a broken or unfinished MMORPG is pretty much saying you think AoC was the best MMORPG in the world with your lies. Please don't be so insulting to this community.

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  • VelocinoxVelocinox Old Folks Home, CAPosts: 810Member Uncommon

    The ESO release is going... relatively well for me, so no complaints. But, I do agree that we are far too complacent on MMO releases. At worst we complain on a forum or send a nasty email to CS. Which are both ineffectual and childish, but we need to do something more. Unfortunately it involves not playing that next new game, and far too many MMO fans are willing to do that. We buy it, get bored and move on.

     

    If they threw open the doors at release one day and all that were waiting to get in were the crickets and a few family members trying to help out their sons and daughters, they might eventually realize we're not happy, and not just the victims of low attention spans. Until then, we keep buying even though it's not well made.

     

    (flame preemption: I'm not necessarily talking about ESO, here. So don't feel the need to jump to the defense of that new game smell that you'll be bashing in a few months anyway.)

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  • DamonVileDamonVile Vancouver, BCPosts: 4,818Member
    Over the last 15 years a lot of mmos have launched. All of them have had issues at launch....some obviously worse than others. Is it more rational to be raging because this one had issues or understanding because complex systems always have both deadlines for launch and issues that only come up once you put millions of people into the server.
  • ZebladeZeblade Colorado Springs, COPosts: 926Member

    You know OP I ask this all the time. If its beta people will defend "its beta!" Come launch its "what do you expect all mmos are like this at launch".

    Most people are just sheep. So most expect a unfinished product I will to they say. Yet we buy software all the time and will NOT take, handle any bugs. You can get games of steam that are still in beta still alpha and told will have bugs and problems.

    Yet go read what they say about your $60 MMO you just paid for. Read all the stuff they EXPECT and you will do since you paid them $60. We hand over the money with no say so at all. We take what ever they give. We expect nothing for that $60. Yes nothing you already said will have bugs, crashes, lots of down time, end game may not even be in yet and thats fine.

    You see the start of something that you don't have to finished it, all you have to do is promise some stuff up front and HAHA they the people (sheep) will STILL PAY!

    You defend something you have no access to. You didnt speak to them about any of this yet here you are and all you have as proof is your $60 you freely blindly handed over and the past "all mmos are like this". Yeah were the smart ones huh :(

  • uggeh12uggeh12 Valencia, CAPosts: 44Member
    Originally posted by kanechart
     

    Overall it's pretty good for me.. Though I know some the complex issues has causes some the more complex quests to break. They were working but they ended up breaking the longer the server was up. Clearly something their going to fix as time goes on.

    Using ESO as an example as a broken or unfinished MMORPG is pretty much saying you think AoC was the best MMORPG in the world with your lies. Please don't be so insulting to this community.

    Not sure what you're on about in the second part. I'm not attacking ESO, I mentioned it because it officially releases tomorrow and there are a lot of posts on this site about it. Had I wrote this post 2 months from now I would probably reference Wildstar's release, its just the hot topic at the moment. I tried ESO and didn't like it but I have no ill will towards it, the opposite in fact I hope ESO does well because Goddess knows the MMO market needs something to pull it out of the slump it's in. No need to get defensive.

  • lugallugal Escondido, CAPosts: 636Member Uncommon
    As long as fools preorder games, buy into beta/alpha, you will continue to see releases like we have seen for the last 15 years.

    Roses are red
    Violets are blue
    The reviewer has a mishapen head
    Which means his opinion is skewed
    ...Aldous.MF'n.Huxley

  • dinamsdinams Muriae, VAPosts: 1,362Member
    Originally posted by Zeblade

    You know OP I ask this all the time. If its beta people will defend "its beta!" Come launch its "what do you expect all mmos are like this at launch".

    Most people are just sheep. So most expect a unfinished product I will to they say. Yet we buy software all the time and will NOT take, handle any bugs. You can get games of steam that are still in beta still alpha and told will have bugs and problems.

    Yet go read what they say about your $60 MMO you just paid for. Read all the stuff they EXPECT and you will do since you paid them $60. We hand over the money with no say so at all. We take what ever they give. We expect nothing for that $60. Yes nothing you already said will have bugs, crashes, lots of down time, end game may not even be in yet and thats fine.

    You see the start of something that you don't have to finished it, all you have to do is promise some stuff up front and HAHA they the people (sheep) will STILL PAY!

    You defend something you have no access to. You didnt speak to them about any of this yet here you are and all you have as proof is your $60 you freely blindly handed over and the past "all mmos are like this". Yeah were the smart ones huh :(

    ok

    "It has potential"
    -Second most used phrase on existence
    "It sucks"
    -Most used phrase on existence

  • SovrathSovrath Boston Area, MAPosts: 18,453Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Zeblade

     

    Most people are just sheep.

    I be a little careful about calling people "sheep".

    Problem with that statement is that you are assuming you aren't a sheep. It's been my experience that looking into the lives of others usually reveals a lot of things where one could come back and say "wait a minute, you like, follow, believe, buy, listen to, watch x?" Aren't you a sheep for doing that?

    I find it much better to understand their motivations which, though different than mine, might just reveal a different set of priorities that aren't concerened with things that you might be concerned with.

    And while I"m at it, same with people mentioning "well justin beiber sells ...".

    Things is, those people are going to say that mr. beiber's music just doesn't have the depth, the musical intricacy blah blah blah as the music that "they" listen to.

    Yet, knowing full well what the most complex music out their is/sounds like I would better dollars to donuts that those people who bash on beiber's music probably don't listen to stuff that is much better.

    The real issue there is that different music (or different "anything") speaks to different things, things that people require at the time. Sometimes it's just fun, sometimes, it's about raw energy, sometimes it's about sublime beauty, and sometimes it's just about being a "kid" who wants to be a screaming fan girl/fan boy and go nuts over Frankie and Annette.

     

     

  • psiicpsiic Tampa, FLPosts: 943Member Uncommon

    I have never been accepting of it. 

    However every time I have ever complained about any game I get flamed to death by the fanbois and viral marketers, and usually end up with a temp ban from the forum moderators.

    Does not matter that I am being honest and accurate, they say I am inciting by posting a negative comment.

     

    Sadly gamers have gone from being the most intelligent people in the room, to being the most ignorant.

     

    If gamers could ever organize,  the power we could have over this industry would be incredible.

     

    Organized boycotts would put all the power in the hands of the customer where it should be.

     

     

  • orionblackorionblack Wichita Falls, TXPosts: 474Member Uncommon

    For the same reasons people keep making useless topics that don't help at all. 

    It's going to take a complete collapse to work this problem out.

  • kabitoshinkabitoshin Posts: 758Member Uncommon
    Because they eventually get fixed, I remember WoW was a buggy mess for it's first couple years.
  • SomeOldBlokeSomeOldBloke Lancaster, UKPosts: 2,141Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Madatan
    Because people don't seem to realize that almost ALL new products, whether it's a physical item or a software rarely comes out perfect from the start.

    and yet you think that this is acceptable.

  • DEAD.lineDEAD.line LisbonPosts: 424Member

    Step 1- Don't buy games at launch

    Step 2- Wait to see what people say about said game. Wait abit more if it's an mmorpg, since it's bigger.

    Step 3- Buy/Don't buy the game

    Step 4- Win

    Also, fanboys. They'll defend the company's every last move, only on rare occasion actually speaking their minds and being against something they do. This goes for ESO and literally, any game.

    I read Metal Gear Solid 5 had less than 4 hours of gameplay. Many called it out, but many also defended it, with one that actually said, and i'm not joking "I know it's a rip-off, but i love MGS, so i bought it anyway". So yeah, fanboys.

  • SomeOldBlokeSomeOldBloke Lancaster, UKPosts: 2,141Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by kabitoshin
    Because they eventually get fixed, I remember WoW was a buggy mess for it's first couple years.

    and you think this is acceptable also, this is the reason why companies get away with it. If we either didn't buy there products or demanded a refund every time they did it we would start to get what we should be getting in the first place.

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