That's a matter of personal preference isn't it? If you don't like add-ons, you won't use them. If you are an add-on programmer, you'll stick with the game because you see something in it that you like, but would like to diversify/improve/streamline. If you're an add-on user, it means you found an add-on that you like to keep you interested in playing the game. I don't see how this will allegedly "kill" a game.
That's a matter of personal preference isn't it? If you don't like add-ons, you won't use them. If you are an add-on programmer, you'll stick with the game because you see something in it that you like, but would like to diversify/improve/streamline. If you're an add-on user, it means you found an add-on that you like to keep you interested in playing the game. I don't see how this will allegedly "kill" a game.
At least for hardcore players like me we are forced to use add-ons to stay competitive with players and guilds that want to be the best. If you don't use them you are at a severe disadvantage. My experience with being a top world raider in WoW has caused me to hate add-ons in MMO's forevermore. Though I tolerated it for many years, If i had to make a top 5 list of reasons I quit WoW, the constant requirement of constantly updating and tweaking with addons to remain competitive would definitely be in there.
That's a matter of personal preference isn't it? If you don't like add-ons, you won't use them. If you are an add-on programmer, you'll stick with the game because you see something in it that you like, but would like to diversify/improve/streamline. If you're an add-on user, it means you found an add-on that you like to keep you interested in playing the game. I don't see how this will allegedly "kill" a game.
Kill the game is going too far. Change the game is more accurate.
Basically here's a quick explanation. If you know someone's stamina is low, you know you can attack them and have an advantage. Unlike other games that are all GCD plus ability CD focused, ESO is based off your resources. Namely magic and stamina. If you don't have enough magic, you can't do magic abilities. If you don't have stamina, you can't do stamina abilities. The mod freakout is that you can hang out not engaged in combat while other people are fighting and see whom has low stamina or magic. You know whom to strike because you can see who's vulnerable. The regular UI doesn't give such an option and therefore the mod gives a significant advantage when picking and choosing your opponents to engage. This means that those that want to be competitive in PVP will use the mod or something similar or accept the fact that they are going to be at a disadvantage. So it's not as cut and dry as a personal preference. If the information was only displaying your own character and no one else, then yeah it would be personal preference. This is about add-ons acquiring information on other players and using that information for a significant advantage. Information not available in the default UI that comes with the game.
Now, if you want an add-on to display how much gold you have without opening your inventory, I see that particular add-on is harmless. Unfortunately, just read these comments. These aren't people clammoring for information already available to be displayed in a more friendly fashion to their liking. No, these people want an Advantage, period. And for that reason, add-ons should not be allowed at all. One bad apple ruins the bunch, etc....
Me...I don't need an add-on to own. Alot of you do (lol snicker l2p)
To answer the OP: If Zenimax doesn't do something to seriously constrain the info gathered through the API, yes, the PVP-based endgame will die.
Before there were addons as such, you had some margin for error because you had to "figure it out"... situations were a bit more forgiving because the developers weren't challenged with having to create encounters where some mod is telling the player exactly what and how to do something. Encounters today feel like a country line dance where everyone moves in unison because they are told exactly how and where to move.
It is almost a guarantee that Wildstar will follow the above "must have this addon to play this game" format, I just hope ESO limits what is possible with addons so the game doesn't become just another twtich style combat dance dance revolution simulator.
Last night I dropped in on a WildStar steam where a person was using enough mods that the game was indistinguishable from WoW. (not intended as a knock on WS).
ESO already has scrolling combat text and modified health bars. I don't know about threat meters but if you can set up SCT you can probably make a DPS meter.
Well how about you dont use it than?
Is that hard?
I played WoW since Vanilla up to Cata, and have never used an Addon.
Before there were addons as such, you had some margin for error because you had to "figure it out"... situations were a bit more forgiving because the developers weren't challenged with having to create encounters where some mod is telling the player exactly what and how to do something. Encounters today feel like a country line dance where everyone moves in unison because they are told exactly how and where to move.
It is almost a guarantee that Wildstar will follow the above "must have this addon to play this game" format, I just hope ESO limits what is possible with addons so the game doesn't become just another twtich style combat dance dance revolution simulator.
Last night I dropped in on a WildStar steam where a person was using enough mods that the game was indistinguishable from WoW. (not intended as a knock on WS).
ESO already has scrolling combat text and modified health bars. I don't know about threat meters but if you can set up SCT you can probably make a DPS meter.
Well how about you dont use it than?
Is that hard?
I played WoW since Vanilla up to Cata, and have never used an Addon.
Of course I may be wrong but based on your statement it would be pretty safe to assume that you never strived to do any server or world firsts then because for actual competitive MMO players addons are a must. That's why I hate them. I used to be in a Server/ World First guild in WoW for years and man let me tell you....updating those addons all the time gets annoying.
I know there are a lot more than two factions in this argument... but two really stand out to me.
We have the group that basically wants all the same options that WOW and RIFT give them. It boils down to getting more information, that information being fast, easy to see and easy tp comprehend format. In some cases they want information that isn't provided at all by the stock UI. Scrolling combat text, buffs bars, debuff bars, being able to tell every ones resources down to the decimal.
Then you have another faction that may or may not be MMO fans, but they want the game to be more like what birthed it in the first place. That being the single player Elder Scrolls series. They want the UI out of the way, they want to interact and react to the action on the screen. Some of them desire it for immersion and some of them see it as a version of fair play.
Both groups feel entitled to some degree to get what they want and many people in each group don't give a damn what the other side thinks or suggests. They are literally trapped in their method of thinking. This is obvious to me because several times ideas have been suggested (which are good ideas) and both sides almost always glaze right over it and go back to fighting.
The pro-addon side will tell you that you don't need their mods and you can just use the stock UI.
The anti-addon side counters with that doesn't mean you won't have an advantage over me.
The pro-addon side attempts to soothe their fears and tell them that is not the case.
The anti-addon side refuses to buy into these ideas.
The pro-addon side exclaims that Zenimax had a hand in this so its fine.
The anti-addon side exclaims that Zenimax is not infallible and has changed several things because of our feedback.
Round and round and round we go for 100 page threads in some communities. All the while both sides pick only talking points that benefit them the most. All the while Zenimax remains tight lipped as ever and they are the ones to blame for the controversy in the first place.
At no point have they polled us on what we desire. At no point have stepped forward and said "Hey both of you have some really good ideas. Give us some time to think on them."
The compromises exist and if you missed them then you have not been paying attention. Which means you are one of the people with blinders on. I will not repeat them here, go back and read some of the threads and reddit posts again.
I still think there are ways for both sides to be happy.
Player 1 - I want a bunch of extra information! I want charts and graphs and scrolling text. I want my interface covered in numbers! I want to know immediately when to counter. I want to know my enemies exact health, stamina and magicka to the exact number. I want I want I want I want.
Player 2 - I just want to play with the stock UI. I want the game to be fair. I wish I could disable you being able to see all my vitals on you screen like a readout from Star Trek.
Player 1 - CHEATER
Except in the case of the privacy mod:
Player 1 is using existing, in game tools and content, devleoped and included by the devs in line with their stated design goalds in order enhance their gameplay experience and dislpay in game information that is viewable by design.
Player 2 is abusing the same systems to hide default game information that is viewable by design, in order to obtain an advantage not included in the games default mechanics.
Which sounds more like cheating to you?
Show me a themepark MMORPG that when I select a target doesn't show me their health bar.
Show me a themepark MMORPG that when I select a target doesn't show me their action bar.
Show me a themepark MMORPG that when I select a target doesn't show me their cast bar.
Show me a themepark MMORPG that when I select a target doesn't show me their active buffs / debuffs.
This is how MMORPGs work.
It actually is included in the game default mechanics. All of that information is TURNED OFF by default. You have to mod the game to TURN IT ON.
This sort of mod simply overrides that and puts it back to default.
"I also noticed a part of the UI that listed ADD ON's... I only hope this will not be the same nightmare, that it has created in other games..."
what? i dont get it?
ADD-ON's are freely used so if u dont want them dont use em? i dont get why u would be against this, no one is forcing u to use addon's.
Exactly...
It's just the same old entitled attitude of "I don't want to use this, but if I CHOOSE not to use it don't let anybody ELSE use it either..."
Personal freedom ends where it hits the freedom of others. So you shout "I WANT TO SEE YOUR INFO! YOU DON't HAVE NO CHOICE!" yourself. So you want to encage the freedom of others to chose if you are allowed to see their info and stats. You yourself say I want to, so everybody has to comply....
This is why Add-Ons like that are so argued... One party loses freedom of choice either way.
On the point of basic infos... Well: Buffs/debuffs... Intuition, feeling of time, remembrance to recast stuff.. So thinking!
On the point of target health: It hits/bites you: >=1, it drops dead >=0
It is THAT easy, everything else is not really relevant.
Nobody would discuss anything if it was about an add-on that only allows to modify your own UI and showing you your own stats...
Yes, in carebear PvE it is that easy....
But this is a multi faction, AVA centric, PvP focused MMORPG....ala DAOC.
Competetive PvPers will not put up with suh hit and miss feedback. They won't...it's as simple as that.
If the UI does not include these things they will demand mods that do, if the PvE carebears force the adoption of a privacy mod the PvP community will desert this game in droves as the stock functionality just does not function to a competetive standard in terms of combat feedback. It's that simple.
They can demand all they want. At the end of the day - the only people being snotty brats about this are you guys. "If I can't get my way, then I'll just leave."
Well... don't let the door hit you in the backside on the way out.
I DEMAND that you not be able to get this information about my character. And if you don't comply - I'll just use a mod that overrides your BS.
Or... we can all drop this nonsense, try to get along, and try to explain to the devs they need to be more hands on about this. Like I said from the very beginning: either put it in the game and make it official, or don't. Either way - leave it alone. Mods aren't going to bring about anything positive for the entire community. This discussion alone proves it.
At least for hardcore players like me we are forced to use add-ons to stay competitive with players and guilds that want to be the best. If you don't use them you are at a severe disadvantage. My experience with being a top world raider in WoW has caused me to hate add-ons in MMO's forevermore. Though I tolerated it for many years, If i had to make a top 5 list of reasons I quit WoW, the constant requirement of constantly updating and tweaking with addons to remain competitive would definitely be in there.
But isn't it kinda logically, that you have to tweak your gear and tools to belong to the best of the best? In my active time as a paintball player I had to work with my marker, too. I modified it, I tweaked it. Other sports or games develop better gloves, tweak their cars or have a personalized set of golf clubs.
That may be annoying for those who just want to play the game, but if you want to belong to the top then I think it's pretty normal that you're not just playing the game but also know the tools you're using.
I can't believe this debate is still going on given that the Devs have spoken:
"... Finding the right answers to these questions often means leaving the API very open during this beta phase. It helps us see where limits may or may not be and helps us determine what makes the best possible ESO experience for everyone."
"...as a game played with thousands of others, we also must be mindful of any mods that give clear mechanical advantages in competitive situations. Maintaining a level playing field will always be our first priority..."
"... We do not want those who aren’t interested in using an add-on to feel compelled to do so because they cannot remain competitive without them..."
"...As we continue beta testing, we’ll continue to evaluate add-ons and the implications they have on other players, but you can expect changes to the API before launch..."
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
the moral to this whole story is Zenimax been stated that" ELDER SCROLLS ONLINE is not a game for NUMBERS DPS METERS OR CRAZY UI". it is a modern online RPG not a card game. i can provide the link if anyone needs it. u mod your screen but leave my Intel out. simple
Im waiting to see what changes they do make. Pretty sure it wont be much. The game was made with Add-ons in mind. Theres a few good add-ons right now, plus several sites already set up to distribute these add=ons.
Like the posts above me, they have stated they will be changes. What those changes will be only they know.
Add-ons are fine, if you personally don't like it, you have a "choice" not to use them, and who ever likes them has the choice to use them. It's never a good idea to take away choice.
Originally posted by Pednick Add-ons are fine, if you personally don't like it, you have a "choice" not to use them, and who ever likes them has the choice to use them. It's never a good idea to take away choice.
You should really read what has been posted in a thread before posting.
Originally posted by Pednick Add-ons are fine, if you personally don't like it, you have a "choice" not to use them, and who ever likes them has the choice to use them. It's never a good idea to take away choice.
You should really read what has been posted in a thread before posting.
You should really learn what a shared view is, before posting.
Originally posted by LupusVai The irony is that all the people defending the PvP mod and saying that it doesn't give a bias and is perfectly fair will all also be running the privacy mod so that no one else can use the PvP mod on them. Ah the sweet smell of hypocrisy. ;-)
you're confused... i will happily be running a modified player / target frame UI mod, that shows me all said info, but i wont use the information blocker, as i dont care enough todo so... having the extra information, being able to track buffs and debuffs is a quality of life feature for me, one i prefer to play with. i dont care if other people can also see my information, i expect it in a MMO releasing in 2014.
the actual ironic part is that people are all like "i dont want to HAVE to use addons, but instead of using one that gives me the information, i'll use one that blocks the information". thats illogical no matter how you look at it.
Hiding stuff that is meant to be seen sounds more like a cheat then more visibily showing what is there anyways.
It's not meant to be seen. It can't be seen from the standard UI. Your entire premise is false. In fact those mods came out of a test of a game that is not released yet. How do you know they meant for the mods to be able to read other players info? The API process is still under NDA.
You know what information we do have is them talking about their UI and not watching other peoples' cast bar. They talk about you seeing animations and being able to recognize what the opponent is doing. You're reaching for the crutch without giving ESO game design a fair shot. The problem with all this is that it impacts other players gameplay because the information you are getting is stuff you wouldn't know otherwise without using a the mod in the OP or a similar mod. People will have to use it to stay as competitive as others whom will use the mod. Those that do not will be accepting that they are playing PVP at a disadvantage.
sorry but thats an irrelevant argument "it's not meant to be seen it cant be seen fro the standard UI" completely disagree, it is meant to be seen... in ZOS vision of how they want their UI to look, they wanted a minimalistic approach to a UI which for some players it's fine and they're happy with that, but they also understand that for some players this isnt acceptable so they designed an API and opened up add-ons to be develiped so the people who want more, can get it so everyone can "play how they want" which is a big design philosophy to them regardless of how you try to spin it
Hiding stuff that is meant to be seen sounds more like a cheat then more visibily showing what is there anyways.
It's not meant to be seen. It can't be seen from the standard UI. Your entire premise is false. In fact those mods came out of a test of a game that is not released yet. How do you know they meant for the mods to be able to read other players info? The API process is still under NDA.
You know what information we do have is them talking about their UI and not watching other peoples' cast bar. They talk about you seeing animations and being able to recognize what the opponent is doing. You're reaching for the crutch without giving ESO game design a fair shot. The problem with all this is that it impacts other players gameplay because the information you are getting is stuff you wouldn't know otherwise without using a the mod in the OP or a similar mod. People will have to use it to stay as competitive as others whom will use the mod. Those that do not will be accepting that they are playing PVP at a disadvantage.
sorry but thats an irrelevant argument "it's not meant to be seen it cant be seen fro the standard UI" completely disagree, it is meant to be seen... in ZOS vision of how they want their UI to look, they wanted a minimalistic approach to a UI which for some players it's fine and they're happy with that, but they also understand that for some players this isnt acceptable so they designed an API and opened up add-ons to be develiped so the people who want more, can get it so everyone can "play how they want" which is a big design philosophy to them regardless of how you try to spin it
"... Finding the right answers to these questions often means leaving the API very open during this beta phase. It helps us see where limits may or may not be and helps us determine what makes the best possible ESO experience for everyone."
"...As we continue beta testing, we’ll continue to evaluate add-ons and the implications they have on other players, but you can expect changes to the API before launch..."
I guarantee you - you're not going to get information about other players - period. And I guarantee you - you're not going to be able to auto-cast stuff.
Why? Because of what too many people have already said to you.
"... We do not want those who aren’t interested in using an add-on to feel compelled to do so because they cannot remain competitive without them..."
Also, their top priority is not mod support for the API:
"...as a game played with thousands of others, we also must be mindful of any mods that give clear mechanical advantages in competitive situations. Maintaining a level playing field will always be our first priority..."
Read into PR. Fluff all you like, I honestly don't care either way... Quality of life will be better if I have it, I won't cry if I don't... All the anti-add-on crowd however are going to be seriously butthurt when they realise Zos giving information any Aaa mmo offers thier players just in the form of add-ons like target information ships at launch and is still available... What then what will you do, not play, whine some more, make justifications why they left it in afterall? What's your course of action when target information ships at launch in the API?
I am however glad you now have a scapegoat for Pvp, no one can ever outplayed you because if someone kills you they clearly are using add-ons... Also ZOS. Top priority is shipping the game and making $$$ and there is just as many people who want more information then what's offered, so they'll do what files their pockets
Here is a direct quote from a programmer at a major ESO site discussing being able to access the api info referring to the "exact" pvp mod that has been mentioned here.
Out of respect I will not link this site or poster but it is not that hard to find.
" As a seasoned macro dev , I can tell you that if you give me info on a enemy player via api or even a graphic, I can hotspot that graphic and auto fire skills when needed. As it stands now I have totally owned because of this and sent videos to Z to help them see the need to tone back the enemy data that is exposed."
How do you feel about that pvp ui mod now?
Yup, the devs need to lock some of that down tight. Anytime PVP is involved, people are going to rewrite the book attempting to gain an edge.
I really hope they are going to prohibit the use of add-ons that offer combat information that is not available through the vanilla ui. Seeing an enemy player's health, mana, stamina and casting bar offers a clear advantage in pvp. Will I use these add-ons, if it's allowed? For sure. I am not gonna gimp myself to make a statement.
Right now the game is a breath of fresh air with its minimalistic ui. Please keep it that way.
Comments
That's a matter of personal preference isn't it? If you don't like add-ons, you won't use them. If you are an add-on programmer, you'll stick with the game because you see something in it that you like, but would like to diversify/improve/streamline. If you're an add-on user, it means you found an add-on that you like to keep you interested in playing the game. I don't see how this will allegedly "kill" a game.
At least for hardcore players like me we are forced to use add-ons to stay competitive with players and guilds that want to be the best. If you don't use them you are at a severe disadvantage. My experience with being a top world raider in WoW has caused me to hate add-ons in MMO's forevermore. Though I tolerated it for many years, If i had to make a top 5 list of reasons I quit WoW, the constant requirement of constantly updating and tweaking with addons to remain competitive would definitely be in there.
Kill the game is going too far. Change the game is more accurate.
Basically here's a quick explanation. If you know someone's stamina is low, you know you can attack them and have an advantage. Unlike other games that are all GCD plus ability CD focused, ESO is based off your resources. Namely magic and stamina. If you don't have enough magic, you can't do magic abilities. If you don't have stamina, you can't do stamina abilities. The mod freakout is that you can hang out not engaged in combat while other people are fighting and see whom has low stamina or magic. You know whom to strike because you can see who's vulnerable. The regular UI doesn't give such an option and therefore the mod gives a significant advantage when picking and choosing your opponents to engage. This means that those that want to be competitive in PVP will use the mod or something similar or accept the fact that they are going to be at a disadvantage. So it's not as cut and dry as a personal preference. If the information was only displaying your own character and no one else, then yeah it would be personal preference. This is about add-ons acquiring information on other players and using that information for a significant advantage. Information not available in the default UI that comes with the game.
My comment to the pro-add-on crowd:
L2P, losers....srsly
Now, if you want an add-on to display how much gold you have without opening your inventory, I see that particular add-on is harmless. Unfortunately, just read these comments. These aren't people clammoring for information already available to be displayed in a more friendly fashion to their liking. No, these people want an Advantage, period. And for that reason, add-ons should not be allowed at all. One bad apple ruins the bunch, etc....
Me...I don't need an add-on to own. Alot of you do (lol snicker l2p)
To answer the OP: If Zenimax doesn't do something to seriously constrain the info gathered through the API, yes, the PVP-based endgame will die.
That's just, like, my opinion, man.
Well how about you dont use it than?
Is that hard?
I played WoW since Vanilla up to Cata, and have never used an Addon.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
Of course I may be wrong but based on your statement it would be pretty safe to assume that you never strived to do any server or world firsts then because for actual competitive MMO players addons are a must. That's why I hate them. I used to be in a Server/ World First guild in WoW for years and man let me tell you....updating those addons all the time gets annoying.
I know there are a lot more than two factions in this argument... but two really stand out to me.
We have the group that basically wants all the same options that WOW and RIFT give them. It boils down to getting more information, that information being fast, easy to see and easy tp comprehend format. In some cases they want information that isn't provided at all by the stock UI. Scrolling combat text, buffs bars, debuff bars, being able to tell every ones resources down to the decimal.
Then you have another faction that may or may not be MMO fans, but they want the game to be more like what birthed it in the first place. That being the single player Elder Scrolls series. They want the UI out of the way, they want to interact and react to the action on the screen. Some of them desire it for immersion and some of them see it as a version of fair play.
Both groups feel entitled to some degree to get what they want and many people in each group don't give a damn what the other side thinks or suggests. They are literally trapped in their method of thinking. This is obvious to me because several times ideas have been suggested (which are good ideas) and both sides almost always glaze right over it and go back to fighting.
The pro-addon side will tell you that you don't need their mods and you can just use the stock UI.
The anti-addon side counters with that doesn't mean you won't have an advantage over me.
The pro-addon side attempts to soothe their fears and tell them that is not the case.
The anti-addon side refuses to buy into these ideas.
The pro-addon side exclaims that Zenimax had a hand in this so its fine.
The anti-addon side exclaims that Zenimax is not infallible and has changed several things because of our feedback.
Round and round and round we go for 100 page threads in some communities. All the while both sides pick only talking points that benefit them the most. All the while Zenimax remains tight lipped as ever and they are the ones to blame for the controversy in the first place.
At no point have they polled us on what we desire. At no point have stepped forward and said "Hey both of you have some really good ideas. Give us some time to think on them."
The compromises exist and if you missed them then you have not been paying attention. Which means you are one of the people with blinders on. I will not repeat them here, go back and read some of the threads and reddit posts again.
I still think there are ways for both sides to be happy.
It actually is included in the game default mechanics. All of that information is TURNED OFF by default. You have to mod the game to TURN IT ON.
This sort of mod simply overrides that and puts it back to default.
You guys will say anything to weasel your logic.
They can demand all they want. At the end of the day - the only people being snotty brats about this are you guys. "If I can't get my way, then I'll just leave."
Well... don't let the door hit you in the backside on the way out.
I DEMAND that you not be able to get this information about my character. And if you don't comply - I'll just use a mod that overrides your BS.
Or... we can all drop this nonsense, try to get along, and try to explain to the devs they need to be more hands on about this. Like I said from the very beginning: either put it in the game and make it official, or don't. Either way - leave it alone. Mods aren't going to bring about anything positive for the entire community. This discussion alone proves it.
But isn't it kinda logically, that you have to tweak your gear and tools to belong to the best of the best? In my active time as a paintball player I had to work with my marker, too. I modified it, I tweaked it. Other sports or games develop better gloves, tweak their cars or have a personalized set of golf clubs.
That may be annoying for those who just want to play the game, but if you want to belong to the top then I think it's pretty normal that you're not just playing the game but also know the tools you're using.
I can't believe this debate is still going on given that the Devs have spoken:
"... Finding the right answers to these questions often means leaving the API very open during this beta phase. It helps us see where limits may or may not be and helps us determine what makes the best possible ESO experience for everyone."
"...as a game played with thousands of others, we also must be mindful of any mods that give clear mechanical advantages in competitive situations. Maintaining a level playing field will always be our first priority..."
"... We do not want those who aren’t interested in using an add-on to feel compelled to do so because they cannot remain competitive without them..."
"...As we continue beta testing, we’ll continue to evaluate add-ons and the implications they have on other players, but you can expect changes to the API before launch..."
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Im waiting to see what changes they do make. Pretty sure it wont be much. The game was made with Add-ons in mind. Theres a few good add-ons right now, plus several sites already set up to distribute these add=ons.
Like the posts above me, they have stated they will be changes. What those changes will be only they know.
for you and 200 other people OP...
"An it harm none, do what thou wilt"
You should really read what has been posted in a thread before posting.
You should really learn what a shared view is, before posting.
"An it harm none, do what thou wilt"
you're confused... i will happily be running a modified player / target frame UI mod, that shows me all said info, but i wont use the information blocker, as i dont care enough todo so... having the extra information, being able to track buffs and debuffs is a quality of life feature for me, one i prefer to play with. i dont care if other people can also see my information, i expect it in a MMO releasing in 2014.
the actual ironic part is that people are all like "i dont want to HAVE to use addons, but instead of using one that gives me the information, i'll use one that blocks the information". thats illogical no matter how you look at it.
sorry but thats an irrelevant argument "it's not meant to be seen it cant be seen fro the standard UI" completely disagree, it is meant to be seen... in ZOS vision of how they want their UI to look, they wanted a minimalistic approach to a UI which for some players it's fine and they're happy with that, but they also understand that for some players this isnt acceptable so they designed an API and opened up add-ons to be develiped so the people who want more, can get it so everyone can "play how they want" which is a big design philosophy to them regardless of how you try to spin it
"... Finding the right answers to these questions often means leaving the API very open during this beta phase. It helps us see where limits may or may not be and helps us determine what makes the best possible ESO experience for everyone."
"...As we continue beta testing, we’ll continue to evaluate add-ons and the implications they have on other players, but you can expect changes to the API before launch..."
I guarantee you - you're not going to get information about other players - period. And I guarantee you - you're not going to be able to auto-cast stuff.
Why? Because of what too many people have already said to you.
"... We do not want those who aren’t interested in using an add-on to feel compelled to do so because they cannot remain competitive without them..."
Also, their top priority is not mod support for the API:
"...as a game played with thousands of others, we also must be mindful of any mods that give clear mechanical advantages in competitive situations. Maintaining a level playing field will always be our first priority..."
Yup, the devs need to lock some of that down tight. Anytime PVP is involved, people are going to rewrite the book attempting to gain an edge.
I really hope they are going to prohibit the use of add-ons that offer combat information that is not available through the vanilla ui. Seeing an enemy player's health, mana, stamina and casting bar offers a clear advantage in pvp. Will I use these add-ons, if it's allowed? For sure. I am not gonna gimp myself to make a statement.
Right now the game is a breath of fresh air with its minimalistic ui. Please keep it that way.