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ESO needs to explain stuff better ingame!

ElikalElikal ValhallaPosts: 8,063Member

I found over the 3 beta weekends I participated both myself and a lot of my fellow players remained at odds over a whole lot of things. Many of my frustrations over ESO just came from not knowing how stuff functions or misunderstanding it.

The entire crafting was a mess to me. I never found it you need 10 pieces of any material to forge them into mats without asking in chat. Or another example: would it be so difficult to have a tool typ on runes and glyphs how they work? Like the fact you have to right click a piece of gear to insert a glyph! Sometimes it didn’t even work, and I never understood if it was a bug, or if I did something wrong. Or whether or not you can remove glyphs and if yes how. Or that people can currently NOT go into the same story instance. People like me literally spent HOURS trying to get fellow players into the same story instance, for 2 days I simply thought I was too dumb, until by random chance of a conversation I found it, it was not intended at all. Or how armor works. Like, at all! In other MMos or RPGs – or even Skyrim – I am used to a very different mechanic. Here, after 3 weekends I still barely understand how armor works and most of it I still dont get.

 

I could make a really LONG list about such issues, but especially since ESO makes a LOT of things so very different, I find the ingame explanations about virtually everything in ESO poor and horrible. Things need a LOT more tooltips. You can tell how big of an issue this is, because you ALWAYS see the same questions over and over.

Why can I not trade? (Because you need to ungroup!)

How can I leave Cyrodiil?

How do I use a repair kit?

Do I get gear decay from PVP death?

How do Synergies work? (Most people I met didn’t even KNOW they exist!)

 

 

The list could be prolongued endless. So if anyone here has some contact to ZOS, PLEASE let them know ESO seriously needs WAAAAY better ingame infos! Otherwise a lot of people will ragequit, simply because they don’t understand the game, and that would be really a pity.

 

People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert

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Comments

  • TelondarielTelondariel Ottawa, ONPosts: 1,001Member

    I play a 10 year old game, EQ2, and people still ask in-game about how to do things.  Why do people ask questions?  Because, generally, they are new to the game and there is a learning curve.

     

    ESO is the same.  It's new for everyone and there are systems and mechanics to learn.  Blaming the game and the developers because you as a new player haven't learned how to navigate yet is disingenuous. 

    image
  • DrDwarfDrDwarf TeesidePosts: 475Member
    Originally posted by Telondariel

    I play a 10 year old game, EQ2, and people still ask in-game about how to do things.  Why do people ask questions?  Because, generally, they are new to the game and there is a learning curve.

     

    ESO is the same.  It's new for everyone and there are systems and mechanics to learn.  Blaming the game and the developers because you as a new player haven't learned how to navigate yet is disingenuous. 

    No No No.

    I think there is a big difference between people who are simply too damn lazy and selfish to go and do some basic research to answer a question and the game having appropriate tutorials and tool tips in game.

    There is a whole culture thats appeared in MMOS where lazy people are serviced by sycophants who reward that laziness.

    When you change the mechanics within a genre you also need to work a bit harder to ensure players understand where those changes are.

    I do appreciate a lot is learnt from trying to do in game and asking can be very efficient but why we should have a whole list of how to videos on the publishers website come launch instead of them relying on fans to produce them.

  • whisperwyndwhisperwynd montreal, QCPosts: 1,479Member

     Considering all the negative input you post about ESO, I'm surprised you even care what Zenimax does or doesn't do for launch...

    I think those questions are asked players that hate to read because this past weekend was my first and I had little trouble understanding the gameplay. 

  • alterfenixalterfenix Bielsko-BialaPosts: 343Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Elikal

    I found over the 3 beta weekends I participated both myself and a lot of my fellow players remained at odds over a whole lot of things. Many of my frustrations over ESO just came from not knowing how stuff functions or misunderstanding it.

    The entire crafting was a mess to me. I never found it you need 10 pieces of any material to forge them into mats without asking in chat. Or another example: would it be so difficult to have a tool typ on runes and glyphs how they work? Like the fact you have to right click a piece of gear to insert a glyph! Sometimes it didn’t even work, and I never understood if it was a bug, or if I did something wrong. Or whether or not you can remove glyphs and if yes how. Or that people can currently NOT go into the same story instance. People like me literally spent HOURS trying to get fellow players into the same story instance, for 2 days I simply thought I was too dumb, until by random chance of a conversation I found it, it was not intended at all. Or how armor works. Like, at all! In other MMos or RPGs – or even Skyrim – I am used to a very different mechanic. Here, after 3 weekends I still barely understand how armor works and most of it I still dont get.

    With this I have to agree. I have already said that atleast a few times on TESO forums myself. This is in fact my biggest complain about tutorial zones - not enough stuff explaining game mechanics.

     

    I could make a really LONG list about such issues, but especially since ESO makes a LOT of things so very different, I find the ingame explanations about virtually everything in ESO poor and horrible. Things need a LOT more tooltips. You can tell how big of an issue this is, because you ALWAYS see the same questions over and over.

    Why can I not trade? (Because you need to ungroup!)

    Sounds like a bug rather. Possibly it should be reported.

    How can I leave Cyrodiil?

    Well wayshrines... Although they could add there some quest to visit it or atleast mark it on the map straight away.

    How do I use a repair kit?

    Put it in quickslot (ingame help explaining how to use those should be extended btw). Then approach gate / wall, target it and use repair item in your quickslot. The exact procedure does not really require explanation however quickslots are a different story.

    Do I get gear decay from PVP death?

    Whenever you get message on the screen that durability of your items is reduced. It does not happen in PvP. If it does then it is a bug and needs to be reported.

    How do Synergies work? (Most people I met didn’t even KNOW they exist!)

    Well, again see what I told about tutorial zones and tutorials in general. 

     

    The list could be prolongued endless. So if anyone here has some contact to ZOS, PLEASE let them know ESO seriously needs WAAAAY better ingame infos! Otherwise a lot of people will ragequit, simply because they don’t understand the game, and that would be really a pity.

    Well have to agree with that. Just take a look ad such crafting. Really fun stuff going on there but then who really cares if its not described at all. Then there comes at launch this new guy that did not play in beta or did it very briefly. He starts doing stuff in game and obviously follows path provided by developers. He learns that crafting exists (press K and see the list) but then since other occupy nodes as well + grabbing random stuff in other TES games often has it's punishment he has a trouble of finding out how it exactly works. Funny thing is that such Skyrim did have quite nice and detailed tutorial i.e. for blacksmithing. Why TESO does not?

     

  • Lord.BachusLord.Bachus Den HelderPosts: 9,064Member Uncommon

    Its oldfashioned MMO, try and figure out for yourself..

     

    next month we will see an explosion of youtube guides... So why spending money on ingame tutorials

    Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)

  • ElikalElikal ValhallaPosts: 8,063Member
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

    Its oldfashioned MMO, try and figure out for yourself..

     

    next month we will see an explosion of youtube guides... So why spending money on ingame tutorials

    You seriously think that is good advise for a 200-300 million dollar expensive Triple A MMO? To "let people figure out"?

    People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert

  • SpottyGekkoSpottyGekko RotterdamPosts: 3,845Member Uncommon

    I've had great fun figuring out how things work in ESO so far... image

     

    But I'm patient and not in any kind of rush. And most importantly, I enjoy being in the game world. So I experiment, read all the tooltips and menu options and even make notes !

     

    For instance, I quickly learned that I needed 10 raw items before I could refine anything, because the game told me so in the refining window.

  • CazNeergCazNeerg Puyallup, WAPosts: 2,198Member
    Where are these people having so much trouble coming from?  I can't think of anything that was hard to figure out.

    Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
    Through passion, I gain strength.
    Through strength, I gain power.
    Through power, I gain victory.
    Through victory, my chains are broken.
    The Force shall free me.

  • JudgeUKJudgeUK Posts: 846Member Uncommon

    OP - have a look at this:

    http://www.tesguide.com/

    It's one of the guide sites out there, not the only one by any means. There's still some sections that need filling out, but should be of some help. It's been updated pretty well and probably worth coming back to now and again.

    Edit: - also keep an eye on these how to guides here:

    http://www.theelderscrollsonlinepowerguide.com/guides.aspx

  • hg2012hg2012 CardiffPosts: 69Member

    I don't feel there needs to be a million more pop ups on screen telling you how to do stuff because there are already too many, however I feel there needs some crafting quests to introduce you to crafting early. Something similar to when you talk to a blacksmith for the first time in Skyrim and they get you to make stuff for them.

    I honesty feel this is a big thing those starter islands are missing as they should introduce you to crafting the moment you leave the prison.

  • ElikalElikal ValhallaPosts: 8,063Member
    Originally posted by Reham34
    Originally posted by Elikal
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

    Its oldfashioned MMO, try and figure out for yourself..

     

    next month we will see an explosion of youtube guides... So why spending money on ingame tutorials

    You seriously think that is good advise for a 200-300 million dollar expensive Triple A MMO? To "let people figure out"?

    Well it doesn't matter because if the game held your hand like you want it to others would cry it's too hand holding.  

    Where did you get the $200-300 million number ?

    i think it is a good thing for company because instead of holding your hand you will need to TAKE TIME and learn it.  

    Two words:

    Groundhog Day.

    People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert

  • ReklawReklaw Am.Posts: 6,474Member Uncommon

    Funny thing I actually play games to find these things out by playing.

    It´s like people are afraid to click on things or find things out themself or actually look at what´s on-screen.

     

  • DilweedDilweed EindhovenPosts: 222Member

    It's because people only know wow.

    Everything that is different from wow, they don't understand, think it is bugged/broken or it is a fail.

    People didn't understand wow at first either but they learned.

    If only people accepted, that they have to learn when something is new, things would be a lot simpler.

  • SomeOldBlokeSomeOldBloke Lancaster, UKPosts: 2,141Member Uncommon
    The only problem I had was figuring out how to make my iron ore into ingots and after 10mins of screwing around I googled it. It may have told me how to do it in the popups but I must have missed it. The rest of the stuff was fairly easy to deduce.
  • SiugSiug TallinnPosts: 1,236Member Uncommon
    I don't like hand holding anymore because that's why MMOs have become more and more boring for me over the years. But as OP is clearly on yet another crusade I'll just block him for good to read no more. Enough is enough.
  • nerovipus32nerovipus32 dublinPosts: 2,735Member
    The OP originally gave out about the tutorial starter zones and now he is giving out about things not being explained enough. The OP is just one of a few posters on mmorpg.com that make controversial posts just for the sake of it. He finds something to moan about every week. OP why do you even play mmo's they obviously make you miserable?
  • someforumguysomeforumguy HomePosts: 3,538Member Uncommon

    I don't understand why the OP is being attacked about this. His topic has nothing to do with a MMO holding your hand. He doesn't want the game to be dumbed down. He just wants to see some kind of ingame reference he can check.

    I think it is funny that some people here think that not having a userguide is what makes a game more complex. MMO's are just generally very bad with this. There are a few though that have an excellent ingame reference.

  • kage71kage71 Los Angeles, CAPosts: 72Member
    Originally posted by Elikal
    Originally posted by Reham34
    Originally posted by Elikal
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

    Its oldfashioned MMO, try and figure out for yourself..

     

    next month we will see an explosion of youtube guides... So why spending money on ingame tutorials

    You seriously think that is good advise for a 200-300 million dollar expensive Triple A MMO? To "let people figure out"?

    Well it doesn't matter because if the game held your hand like you want it to others would cry it's too hand holding.  

    Where did you get the $200-300 million number ?

    i think it is a good thing for company because instead of holding your hand you will need to TAKE TIME and learn it.  

    Two words:

    Groundhog Day.

    I must agree too many games have held people hands only to find out they were doing way too much it is about time and refreshing that a game has came out without all that. Lets take the time to learn the game on our own or better yet just don't play it because all in all it will be just too overwhelming for your taste.

  • DrDwarfDrDwarf TeesidePosts: 475Member
    Originally posted by Reklaw

    Funny thing I actually play games to find these things out by playing.

    It´s like people are afraid to click on things or find things out themself or actually look at what´s on-screen.

     

    No I think we are discussing different things.

    Why not have us all guess what the key bindings are and have us have to remap them so we can actually play the game because for a twist, the games company designed the controls so they only suit a particular kind of deformed human body ?   You'd enjoy finding that out too I guess ?

    How about you need to do a 6 month detailed Internet search and employ at least 14 specialist private detectives to actually find out how to download the game in the first place ?    You'd enjoy finding that out too I guess ?

     

     

  • someforumguysomeforumguy HomePosts: 3,538Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Wiha
    I don't like hand holding anymore because that's why MMOs have become more and more boring for me over the years. But as OP is clearly on yet another crusade I'll just block him for good to read no more. Enough is enough.

    Offering an explanation about game mechanics has nothing to do with handholding. Please learn the difference.

    An example of handholding in an MMO is a quest that tells you to search for the hidden cave, while meanwhile showing you a glowing trail leading towards it. That is handholding. And this is not what the OP is talking about.

    Offering a tutorial or guide that explains how to craft or use/customize the map or whatever, is not handholding, it is called documentation.

  • nerovipus32nerovipus32 dublinPosts: 2,735Member
    Originally posted by someforumguy
    Originally posted by Wiha
    I don't like hand holding anymore because that's why MMOs have become more and more boring for me over the years. But as OP is clearly on yet another crusade I'll just block him for good to read no more. Enough is enough.

    Offering an explanation about game mechanics has nothing to do with handholding. Please learn the difference.

    An example of handholding in an MMO is a quest that tells you to search for the hidden cave, while meanwhile showing you a glowing trail leading towards it. That is handholding. And this is not what the OP is talking about.

    Offering a tutorial or guide that explains how to craft or the map or whatever, is not handholding, it is called documentation.

    and you're saying they should have this in beta? You do know the game has not released yet right?

  • DrDwarfDrDwarf TeesidePosts: 475Member

    ^^^

    He is not saying that at all.

  • MikeBMikeB MMORPG.com Community Manager Queens, NYPosts: 5,715Administrator Uncommon
    Originally posted by Elikal

    Why can I not trade? (Because you need to ungroup!)

    How can I leave Cyrodiil?

    How do I use a repair kit?

    Do I get gear decay from PVP death?

    How do Synergies work? (Most people I met didn’t even KNOW they exist!)

     

     

    Most of this is, in fact, explained in game. :)

    I don't think the trading was working properly this weekend, so I'm fairly sure you don't need to ungroup to trade.

    Cyrodiil's tutorial explains the wayshrine to exit, use of repair kits (even has you actually USE a repair kit on a siege weapon), and a bunch more. I don't recall on gear decay, but it may have been explained. If not, it would be pretty easy to figure out through play.

    If you press F1 in game there is a whole section full of tutorials and information on most aspects of the game.

    Michael "MikeB" Bitton
    Community Manager
    Twitter: @eMikeB

  • nerovipus32nerovipus32 dublinPosts: 2,735Member
    When you go to craft everything is explained in a tool tip, i guess the OP just skipped through it.
  • someforumguysomeforumguy HomePosts: 3,538Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by nerovipus32
    Originally posted by someforumguy
    Originally posted by Wiha
    I don't like hand holding anymore because that's why MMOs have become more and more boring for me over the years. But as OP is clearly on yet another crusade I'll just block him for good to read no more. Enough is enough.

    Offering an explanation about game mechanics has nothing to do with handholding. Please learn the difference.

    An example of handholding in an MMO is a quest that tells you to search for the hidden cave, while meanwhile showing you a glowing trail leading towards it. That is handholding. And this is not what the OP is talking about.

    Offering a tutorial or guide that explains how to craft or the map or whatever, is not handholding, it is called documentation.

    and you're saying they should have this in beta? You do know the game has not released yet right?

    No I don't say that anywhere. I also quoted someone who didn't address that point either. I quoted someone who doesn't seem to understand the difference between handholding and a userguide.

    So randomly assuming that I am against whatever in the beta is kind of pointless, not?

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