I am not a fan of the art direction of EQ NEXT but I am very excited about the sand box element coming recently in some games like ARMA modes, DAYZ SA, Dark Desert, EQ landmark etc..
I think Sand box will be the real trend of next gen online gaming.
Originally posted by Vivasvan Smed lets make this simple. People want EQ1 again. They want content and adventure and raids but they don't want it easy for a 5yr old.
World of Warcraft is popular due to content. It's only becoming unpopular because they made the game so easy people left.
The EQ1 formula and wow formula is what people want.
11 million people is what you would love to have.
People loved eq1 and wow because it had adventure and content that was challenging.
As soon as wow made it simple they lost 5 million players.
Do what you will.
Disagree there is a lot of people burnt out on the EQ/WoW themepark and are looking for something that is not WoW again. SOE is going to try the Sandbox route because what is old is new again.
Pantheon Online is the game you want to help get kick started but the interest for that kind of game is not as great as you think it is.
With the immaturiy of mmorpg players these days, I doubt something like EQN is going to actually work. Especally if it allows free open pvp, too many fat kids in their mom's basement who are cowards and run from a fight vs anyone who can actually fight back.
Being a pessimist is a win-win pattern of thinking. If you're a pessimist (I'll admit that I am!) you're either:
A. Proven right (if something bad happens)
or
B. Pleasantly surprised (if something good happens)
One might not agree on all with Smedley, but he is bringing up some valid points, discussable or not.
He's explanation is why I think TESO will fair well for a while, but then suffer the same problem as most modern MMOs. A shame.
Its more the fact they make the new content far to easy. at first it should be brutally hard so only the elite can do it, then steadly lower the diffculty so the casual scrubs can do it.
Being a pessimist is a win-win pattern of thinking. If you're a pessimist (I'll admit that I am!) you're either:
A. Proven right (if something bad happens)
or
B. Pleasantly surprised (if something good happens)
Originally posted by Siveria With the immaturiy of mmorpg players these days, I doubt something like EQN is going to actually work. Especally if it allows free open pvp, too many fat kids in their mom's basement who are cowards and run from a fight vs anyone who can actually fight back.
Your posts are coming off as immature, something to think about before calling other players immature. Force pvp is something they are not doing, it will be either a flagging system like SWG or separate servers.
Originally posted by Vivasvan I'm not a pvp fan at all
But the type of FFA open world pvp that might interest me is if every pvp action has a consequence in pve. That will be the best.
Example .. Your adventuring away in an area looking for a place to settle for the evening... You open a old inn door and see that the only bed available is taken. (The player in the bed is offline)
So you have two options for the night.. You can kill him and take the bed , rest for the night and your hp, exp, will all get a bonus.
BUT doing the above has a bad faction/reputation effect on you. If you encounter anyone from His race or class you will be marked and always attacked. Or at least branded an enemy if that household , race, etc.
Also how is it fair on the person that rested for the night in the first place as he logs in to find he has been murderd and has taken a negative hit to hp/exp? Well maybe that person should have find a more secure place to sleep for the night or barred the door or locked it.
This type of pvp in a seamless huge world would be perfect. All actions having consequence
Who the hell wants arena style quick pvp ganking? Oh only those that offer games on a F2p basis and want to limit dev time on true pvp that means something
Pvp in mmorpg is not needed unless it is like the above. If you want gank style pvp go play another game and stop trying to change the true mmorpg dungeons n dragons genre
That's is what EVE online is every action pve and pvp has a effect and it changes the game world, players are the content and its the interaction that makes EVE always different and changing.
Smedley wants to bring that into EQ Next where players themselves effect the change in the game but they are also adding in storybricks AI npcs, questing and other dev made events on top of top of that.
I don't think anyone would disagree with giving players tools and allowing a world to change or grow,but we are talking about SOE.The WAY they do things is every bit about monetary value and NOT about the game.
They changed direction because they saw the popularity of Voxels and i am sure got a really good deal on a license.Smedley gets NO credit for Voxel popularity,he was actually slow moving on it.He saw that they could probably resell the voxels license and mask it as a SOE game.They knew it wouldn't work in a real MMORPG so they decided to split it up and utilize the popular Everquest title.
Hmmm... There is no "voxels license", though. Voxels is a technology that's been around for years. It's always been an ideal way to create 3D worlds... It just hasn't been practical in the past because technology just wasn't there yet to really push it and do it justice.
For example, the game Outcast came out in 1999, and was based on Voxel tech.
There are newer game engines out there that have utilized it as well. The Crytek engine utilizes voxel technology to enable tunnels and overhangs to be created out of heightmap terrain (heightmaps don't inherently allow such things). There's an indie game engine called the C4 engine from Terathon whose entire terrain system is based on Voxel tech.
There's the Euclideon guys who've been working on their own voxel-based engine for a few years now at least...
StarForge is based on voxel technology as well.
And so forth.
Point is, SOE didn't get any license for Voxels. They just decided to adapt the technology (which is the use of volumentric "3D" pixels) for their own engine/game.
So, did they decide to hop on a bandwagon and join in on the fad? Yep, absolutely. That's what SOE's good at. Recognizing trends and then looking for ways to cash in on them.
In this case, though, they're not just playing "me-too". They're actually changing their whole approach to how a MMO can be designed. To me, honestly, the voxel tech is secondary. The real show of EQ:N is the sandbox approach they're taking, and the potential it has - if they pull it off well.
Personally, I trust very little of what Smedley says because he's gone back on his words so often in the past. It rings as little more than PR from a guy who "knows the language".
I don't think anyone would disagree with giving players tools and allowing a world to change or grow,but we are talking about SOE.The WAY they do things is every bit about monetary value and NOT about the game.
They changed direction because they saw the popularity of Voxels and i am sure got a really good deal on a license.Smedley gets NO credit for Voxel popularity,he was actually slow moving on it.He saw that they could probably resell the voxels license and mask it as a SOE game.They knew it wouldn't work in a real MMORPG so they decided to split it up and utilize the popular Everquest title.
Look no further than Smedley trying to spin some new game as the savior to SWG,he is all about BS marketing and not quality game design.He also changed direction because he saw the popularity of kick starters,so again an easy cash grab less cash input from SOE.
Game design has always been about investing in a game than trying to sell it,this was a massively cheaper endeavor and best of all SOE did not have to make Voxels nor did they even have to invest time making assets for a world.SUPER easy for them to auto generate a world add Voxels and sell it.
I have not researched the Voxels license but i bet it is really low,this Landmark with all the crowd funding is probably already in the green and they don't need much of a team, to work on it either so very little overhead.These are the true reasons Smedley changed direction.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
I like what hes saying and look forward to seeing it in action. Still, i cant help laughing at some of it. Political system where you were elected by the players sounds familar. So does alternative playstyles like maybe an image designer or dancer perhaps. Open world with mystery and sandbox elements too, seems like i played a triple A level western mmo that had this stuff. Maybe that games biggest flaw was being a decade ahead of its time.
Playing: CS:S, Waiting to try out TOR. Played: Sword of the New World, Infantryzone, Ragnarok Online,RF Online, Fury, Tabula Rasa, Star Wars Galaxies, Cosmic Rift....
I don't believe I've ever played what some on this site would call a sandbox mmorpg. I've played MMO"s from vanilla wow and many others that came after. But, like many have mentioned on here, some have been on par with wow, and many others have been lesser in overall value in my opinion. Regardless, I would say that most MMO's since wow have been extremely similar to wow which I thought was the answer. I enjoyed playing wow, and for the longest time I went searching for a game like wow but better. There isn't one in my opinion even though I don't like the way wow went with WoTLK and that's when I stopped playing. I just want a game to immerse me, and give me the feeling I had when I first stepped into Azeroth.
I thought Guild Wars 2 was that next step, that game that would have me lost in a world I could love, but it fell short. Not for lack of creativity, or any game system being inferior to others. Guild Wars 2 is truly a good game, but sadly, it is just more of the same, or too close to what wow is in my opinion. I have read thread after thread about how most of the mmo's we have come to know and play after wow just don't have enough in them to sustain our attention. They don't have enough content to compete with the players who rush through the content after a launch. I've never personally rushed thru content but I won't look down upon someone for doing what they ultimately want to do in a game they paid for, as long as it isn't griefing someone else. I do feel players leave mmo's quickly, even good ones, because their isn't enough to do, or the world isn't grand enough.
Now I heard about EQN:L and EQN and I was intrigued. I feel they are doing things right with Landmark and Next. They are going to allow the players to create some content, as of now, the architecture. I think this is a great start because it will take some of that strain off of the devs. I feel devs become extremely stressed with trying to please people about game mechanics, bugs, balance issues, and then they also need to be creating more "real estate" for the players to play on and experience new areas or storyline. Now that will be one thing almost off of their plate. They will give specifications for what they want to be made and then pick from player creations. At least I feel devs can focus on game mechanics, balance, boss encounters, loot, armor design or whatever you think of, just a little bit more because we help take something off of their plate. Some may see this as lazy development, and maybe you are right, I honestly don't know. I just feel if we can create the world with tools that are given to us, then the devs can focus their energy towards creating the longevity that we all want. I just feel we are all on this website because we love massive multiplayer online role playing games. Maybe we can have another great one with EQN.
Sorry if I offended anyone, or if I said anything that was misinformation, I too am human and make mistakes, cheers all.
Agreed. For all the hate SOE got. I think Smed learned the lesson.
And honestly, looking back to SWG debacle. Are we forgetting the SWG was only made because of SOE ? No other company even came close to something like that
Very true, however you have to temper this with the fact that SWG was broken for most of it's existence and SOE's solution was probably the single worst decision in online gaming history.
SWG was a decent game, as a crafting and social sandbox it was great, but it was buggy and some classes were unbalanced and others plain broken. Simply put the implementation was half-assed and SOE have a reputation for not going all-in when it comes to MMO's.
Remember Planetside? Great fun game, rarely ever patched, buggy as hell, easy to hack and destroyed by another SoE decision. PS2 is the same fish with different scales.
Love the sentiment Smedley outlines, but the execution needs to be equal to the promise. So far, so good with EQN:L apart from the pay-to-play alpha but SoE do have a history of screwing it up.
Expresso gave me a Hearthstone beta key.....I'm so happy
While I will always have concerns about a MMO built on a F2P budget, he has some good points.
"The real issue is a simple one – our ability to consume that content as players has gotten to the point that most content is done by the players nearly immediately after it’s released. It’s also laid out for all to see on any number of websites that contain complete spoilers up to and including the loot drop percentages.“
Comments
I am not a fan of the art direction of EQ NEXT but I am very excited about the sand box element coming recently in some games like ARMA modes, DAYZ SA, Dark Desert, EQ landmark etc..
I think Sand box will be the real trend of next gen online gaming.
Disagree there is a lot of people burnt out on the EQ/WoW themepark and are looking for something that is not WoW again. SOE is going to try the Sandbox route because what is old is new again.
Pantheon Online is the game you want to help get kick started but the interest for that kind of game is not as great as you think it is.
One might not agree on all with Smedley, but he is bringing up some valid points, discussable or not.
He's explanation is why I think TESO will fair well for a while, but then suffer the same problem as most modern MMOs. A shame.
--------------------------------------------
Youtube newb:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC96N3cxBuqKTPV2BQNlzGUw
Being a pessimist is a win-win pattern of thinking. If you're a pessimist (I'll admit that I am!) you're either:
A. Proven right (if something bad happens)
or
B. Pleasantly surprised (if something good happens)
Either way, you can't lose! Try it out sometime!
Its more the fact they make the new content far to easy. at first it should be brutally hard so only the elite can do it, then steadly lower the diffculty so the casual scrubs can do it.
Being a pessimist is a win-win pattern of thinking. If you're a pessimist (I'll admit that I am!) you're either:
A. Proven right (if something bad happens)
or
B. Pleasantly surprised (if something good happens)
Either way, you can't lose! Try it out sometime!
Your posts are coming off as immature, something to think about before calling other players immature. Force pvp is something they are not doing, it will be either a flagging system like SWG or separate servers.
That's is what EVE online is every action pve and pvp has a effect and it changes the game world, players are the content and its the interaction that makes EVE always different and changing.
Smedley wants to bring that into EQ Next where players themselves effect the change in the game but they are also adding in storybricks AI npcs, questing and other dev made events on top of top of that.
Enough of this sandbox nonsense. Everquest Next Is NOT a sandbox at all. It has fixed classes which you never ever find in a sandbox game.
So this marketing hype uses the term sandbox and you fall for it? Come on you know better than that.
Hmmm... There is no "voxels license", though. Voxels is a technology that's been around for years. It's always been an ideal way to create 3D worlds... It just hasn't been practical in the past because technology just wasn't there yet to really push it and do it justice.
For example, the game Outcast came out in 1999, and was based on Voxel tech.
There are newer game engines out there that have utilized it as well. The Crytek engine utilizes voxel technology to enable tunnels and overhangs to be created out of heightmap terrain (heightmaps don't inherently allow such things). There's an indie game engine called the C4 engine from Terathon whose entire terrain system is based on Voxel tech.
There's the Euclideon guys who've been working on their own voxel-based engine for a few years now at least...
StarForge is based on voxel technology as well.
And so forth.
Point is, SOE didn't get any license for Voxels. They just decided to adapt the technology (which is the use of volumentric "3D" pixels) for their own engine/game.
So, did they decide to hop on a bandwagon and join in on the fad? Yep, absolutely. That's what SOE's good at. Recognizing trends and then looking for ways to cash in on them.
In this case, though, they're not just playing "me-too". They're actually changing their whole approach to how a MMO can be designed. To me, honestly, the voxel tech is secondary. The real show of EQ:N is the sandbox approach they're taking, and the potential it has - if they pull it off well.
Personally, I trust very little of what Smedley says because he's gone back on his words so often in the past. It rings as little more than PR from a guy who "knows the language".
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
So long as they don't WoW/easy mode levels and content..
If EQ Next is a GW2 "Max level in a couple weeks, now do our other stuff until you get sick of it!" type of thing it's going to be a big downer...
Pretty sure the said it won't even have levels so you're good there
.
Playing:
CS:S, Waiting to try out TOR.
Played: Sword of the New World, Infantryzone, Ragnarok Online,RF Online, Fury, Tabula Rasa, Star Wars Galaxies, Cosmic Rift....
I agree , let us build the big forges, and kingdoms and houses, and castles.
Let us build bridges to get to new land, let us find ways to open up the world.
Let us discover new technologies and power.. don't have it all pre built by a team of devs.
Just give us the tools to do it.
BOYCOTTING EA / ORIGIN going forward.
Yeah, I about fell out of my chair
This is how I see it...
I don't believe I've ever played what some on this site would call a sandbox mmorpg. I've played MMO"s from vanilla wow and many others that came after. But, like many have mentioned on here, some have been on par with wow, and many others have been lesser in overall value in my opinion. Regardless, I would say that most MMO's since wow have been extremely similar to wow which I thought was the answer. I enjoyed playing wow, and for the longest time I went searching for a game like wow but better. There isn't one in my opinion even though I don't like the way wow went with WoTLK and that's when I stopped playing. I just want a game to immerse me, and give me the feeling I had when I first stepped into Azeroth.
I thought Guild Wars 2 was that next step, that game that would have me lost in a world I could love, but it fell short. Not for lack of creativity, or any game system being inferior to others. Guild Wars 2 is truly a good game, but sadly, it is just more of the same, or too close to what wow is in my opinion. I have read thread after thread about how most of the mmo's we have come to know and play after wow just don't have enough in them to sustain our attention. They don't have enough content to compete with the players who rush through the content after a launch. I've never personally rushed thru content but I won't look down upon someone for doing what they ultimately want to do in a game they paid for, as long as it isn't griefing someone else. I do feel players leave mmo's quickly, even good ones, because their isn't enough to do, or the world isn't grand enough.
Now I heard about EQN:L and EQN and I was intrigued. I feel they are doing things right with Landmark and Next. They are going to allow the players to create some content, as of now, the architecture. I think this is a great start because it will take some of that strain off of the devs. I feel devs become extremely stressed with trying to please people about game mechanics, bugs, balance issues, and then they also need to be creating more "real estate" for the players to play on and experience new areas or storyline. Now that will be one thing almost off of their plate. They will give specifications for what they want to be made and then pick from player creations. At least I feel devs can focus on game mechanics, balance, boss encounters, loot, armor design or whatever you think of, just a little bit more because we help take something off of their plate. Some may see this as lazy development, and maybe you are right, I honestly don't know. I just feel if we can create the world with tools that are given to us, then the devs can focus their energy towards creating the longevity that we all want. I just feel we are all on this website because we love massive multiplayer online role playing games. Maybe we can have another great one with EQN.
Sorry if I offended anyone, or if I said anything that was misinformation, I too am human and make mistakes, cheers all.
Very true, however you have to temper this with the fact that SWG was broken for most of it's existence and SOE's solution was probably the single worst decision in online gaming history.
SWG was a decent game, as a crafting and social sandbox it was great, but it was buggy and some classes were unbalanced and others plain broken. Simply put the implementation was half-assed and SOE have a reputation for not going all-in when it comes to MMO's.
Remember Planetside? Great fun game, rarely ever patched, buggy as hell, easy to hack and destroyed by another SoE decision. PS2 is the same fish with different scales.
Love the sentiment Smedley outlines, but the execution needs to be equal to the promise. So far, so good with EQN:L apart from the pay-to-play alpha but SoE do have a history of screwing it up.
Expresso gave me a Hearthstone beta key.....I'm so happy
Guess i need add the word "FARM" to Voxels for the smart ass who asked me if i know what a voxel is.
SOe is licensing the Voxels Farm engine for their game for the smart ass.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
While I will always have concerns about a MMO built on a F2P budget, he has some good points.
"The real issue is a simple one – our ability to consume that content as players has gotten to the point that most content is done by the players nearly immediately after it’s released. It’s also laid out for all to see on any number of websites that contain complete spoilers up to and including the loot drop percentages.“