Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Fuzzy Avatars Solved! Please re-upload your avatar if it was fuzzy!

[General Article] Elder Scrolls Online: An Alternate Opinion

124678

Comments

  • shalissarshalissar Pohjois-PohjanmaaPosts: 298Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Iselin

    I agree with some of what you said and disagree with other things but can't go into detail yet.

     

    But I will say this: it's a game with a split personality: I mean PVE and PVP with respect to the social aspect - The PVE open world leans heavily toward solo content but this type of PVP leans heavily the other way to a far greater extent than most other MMOs.

     

    The emphasis of this game when it was first announced was clearly the Cyrodiil PVP... it's worth remembering that. Too bad you have to wait till level 10 to get started on that part - especially if group activities are what you're looking for.

     

    The difference between the two is so stark that you might as well think of this as two games: the alliance war game where grouping, strategy and tactics are king and the Elder Scrolls PVE game where lore and story content rule the day.

     

    Some will like one...some will like the other... and if you're lucky, you'll like both. I'm happy to be in this 3rd category.

    Same here. Without going into specifics, this is definitely the title for me.

  • TelondarielTelondariel Ottawa, ONPosts: 1,001Member
    Originally posted by MikeB
    Originally posted by Telondariel
    Originally posted by MikeB

    Want to zero in on the starter island stuff since I see it come up a lot:

    I really think the reason we can't square the starter island experience is because we (MMO vets) aren't actually the target audience for it. That's why you're seeing all these weird reactions this weekend. People who don't like the game at first and then warm up to it once they get off the island.

    If not us, then who? Well, ZOS is trying to get non-MMO playing ES fans, and more importantly, console players, into the fold. The starter island is more than likely designed with them in mind, which is why it's a much shallower experience than the rest of the game. Imagine being a console only player who has never played an MMO and being dropped into the post starter island zones immediately? Would probably be pretty overwhelming, no?

    Does that mean it has the potential to just turn some MMO vets off immediately? I'm sure. But it looks like a lot of people gave it another whack and humped through it into the real game.

    That's my take, anyways.

    I think that's a valid point.  An introduction isn't a bad thing, and if you see it as such and just work through it, there is an entire world of game out there shortly after you start.  Basing opinions on the intro and extending that to the entire game is disingenuous at best.  Unfortunately there are reviews out there doing just that and hordes of their supplicants are drinking it up.

    I was a lot more worried about this on Friday. I even wrote a blog about it. But I've been going through a lot of the feedback here and on other sites and there is a very clear trend of opinion shift for a lot of people who made it through the starter area and saw the rest of the game over the weekend. That's not to say everyone will be this way, ESO isn't for everyone, but thankfully it looks like a ton of people gave the game a real chance.

     

    The in-game chat I read over the weekend was very positive.  I think those that actually took advantage of the Beta weekend finally had a chance to see for themselves if they'd like it or not.  Having a free trail before launch certainly gave me a lot more information to go on.  Nothing beats tromping around and going for a test-drive.

    image
  • TelondarielTelondariel Ottawa, ONPosts: 1,001Member
    Originally posted by shalissar
    Originally posted by Iselin

    I agree with some of what you said and disagree with other things but can't go into detail yet.

     

    But I will say this: it's a game with a split personality: I mean PVE and PVP with respect to the social aspect - The PVE open world leans heavily toward solo content but this type of PVP leans heavily the other way to a far greater extent than most other MMOs.

     

    The emphasis of this game when it was first announced was clearly the Cyrodiil PVP... it's worth remembering that. Too bad you have to wait till level 10 to get started on that part - especially if group activities are what you're looking for.

     

    The difference between the two is so stark that you might as well think of this as two games: the alliance war game where grouping, strategy and tactics are king and the Elder Scrolls PVE game where lore and story content rule the day.

     

    Some will like one...some will like the other... and if you're lucky, you'll like both. I'm happy to be in this 3rd category.

    Same here. Without going into specifics, this is definitely the title for me.

    Ditto.  I've been playing EQ2 forever and have finally found a game that could cut that umbilical cord.

    image
  • ninjagrannyninjagranny PortsmouthPosts: 25Member
    One poster above did mention something important  in that the weapons armour and clothing were relatively "realistic" - there are no garish clothing or wow sized weapons or flouro Armours .. yet . With any MMO pounds count and eventually  they will bow to the kiddies and allow stupid clothing weapons and armour ( they even have in IP restricted games like LOTRO) but currently  noone looks stupid , which is great.
  • keithiankeithian Los Angeles, CAPosts: 3,042Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by erikkennedy

    Either you didn't really play this game, or its already changed significantly since you have. Almost everything you said about the starter zone is incorrect, and I just finished it myself yesterday. I didn't feel like I was running erands, I felt like I had to find and help all of the villagers before the Covenant attacked and killed everyone. There were lots of other real people running around, and I even got friend requests. I was able to immediately start crafting. The chat box was so busy I had to work hard to ignore it.

    There are still some bugs. I'm sure some of the things you were looking for will be implemented. It just seems like in an effort for you guys to find a differing opinion, what you did instead was something ignorant.

    Same experience as this guy. I guess when you are playing an MMO with a few journalists you don't see a lot in the chat box because I did (quite a lot) including friend requests which caught me off guard for a starter area and people all the time asking questions and giving advice...so not sure if you were playing beta or in a controlled environment with a several people.

    There are two things I agree with this article:

    1) The animations of some of the characters needs improvement. They aren't horrible but they could be improved.

    2) The monthly price is steep for many and I continue to recommend that they make it the same price as a Netflix subscription as that is a mental barrier for many.

    None of this will deter me from playing. For how long? Probably until Occulus Rift takes me away when that gets released late in 2014 :-) lol. 

    Though a multiplayer would have been nice with Skyrim, the modding community tried that and it failed miserably. I actually wanted an MMO knowing some of the sacrifices and those don't bother me all that much. I just wish (and still hope for) a little more dynamic PVE world.

    Whoops thought of a 3rd point: If you read what Iselin posted above, I agree with it. It does feel like two totally different games, the PVP and PVE and the PVE at least through level 10-12ish feels very solo slanted. I'm looking forward to release when I can get into the more social aspects like the dungeons, adventure zones, anchors, etc.
     

    There Is Always Hope!

  • WereLlamaWereLlama Lubbock, TXPosts: 243Member

    Well.. the second zone I observed being played seemed just as locked in and linear as the first. 

    I do hope they  change it to enable players to travel anywhere right after the first short gloom intro, even if it leads to getting 'two dimensional'-itus by a giant.

     

  • GorweGorwe Ald'RuhnPosts: 2,476Member Uncommon

    This is my only thought about TES franchise:

    "Some things are meant to stay private/played singleplayer"

    Idk what is the idea behind ESO(actually I do-it's the Third coming of DAoC)...

     
  • davvindavvin Tucson, AZPosts: 155Member

    For me, there isn't anything meaningful that sets it apart from other MMO's, so why pay, AND with there being a ton of other people running around it doesn't really feel like Elder Scrolls, so why pay?

    If it was F2P I would play it from time to time, since it's not going to be I won't. I don't have to play every game so I don't care if it's F2P or not, they haven't given me any good reasons to need to get the game in the first place. If the game was truly amazing, fun and I just had to play it I would pay for it, but that's not what I've found, so I just don't care.

  • DakirnDakirn Kansas City, MOPosts: 374Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by MikeB

    Want to zero in on the starter island stuff since I see it come up a lot:

    I really think the reason we can't square the starter island experience is because we (MMO vets) aren't actually the target audience for it. That's why you're seeing all these weird reactions this weekend. People who don't like the game at first and then warm up to it once they get off the island.

    If not us, then who? Well, ZOS is trying to get non-MMO playing ES fans, and more importantly, console players, into the fold. The starter island is more than likely designed with them in mind, which is why it's a much shallower experience than the rest of the game. Imagine being a console only player who has never played an MMO and being dropped into the post starter island zones immediately? Would probably be pretty overwhelming, no?

    Does that mean it has the potential to just turn some MMO vets off immediately? I'm sure. But it looks like a lot of people gave it another whack and humped through it into the real game.

    That's my take, anyways.

    Do you guys tend to group at all during MMO reviews? Did you try doing quests with other people who were (or weren't) on the same step?

    This game is solo centered and it absolutely ruined the beta for me and my friends, yet I see very few reviewers talk about questing with other people (something a LOT of people tend to do in MMOs).

    I think that grouping and questing needs to really be talked about, but most reviewers are playing the game solo (and MAYBE group for a specific group instance) and are missing a large part of the game for many people.  The result is a lot of people are going to be seriously pissed when they play at release.

  • azzamasinazzamasin Butler, OHPosts: 3,058Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by erikkennedy

    Either you didn't really play this game, or its already changed significantly since you have. Almost everything you said about the starter zone is incorrect, and I just finished it myself yesterday. I didn't feel like I was running erands, I felt like I had to find and help all of the villagers before the Covenant attacked and killed everyone. There were lots of other real people running around, and I even got friend requests. I was able to immediately start crafting. The chat box was so busy I had to work hard to ignore it.

    There are still some bugs. I'm sure some of the things you were looking for will be implemented. It just seems like in an effort for you guys to find a differing opinion, what you did instead was something ignorant.

    Well his opinion and your opinion are both right.  Which is what Opinions are supposed to be like.  The issue is there are far greater murmurs of agreement with Gareth's opinion then yours and therein lies the problem.

    Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!

    Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!

    Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!

    image

  • azzamasinazzamasin Butler, OHPosts: 3,058Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by MikeB
    Originally posted by Telondariel
    Originally posted by MikeB

    Want to zero in on the starter island stuff since I see it come up a lot:

    I really think the reason we can't square the starter island experience is because we (MMO vets) aren't actually the target audience for it. That's why you're seeing all these weird reactions this weekend. People who don't like the game at first and then warm up to it once they get off the island.

    If not us, then who? Well, ZOS is trying to get non-MMO playing ES fans, and more importantly, console players, into the fold. The starter island is more than likely designed with them in mind, which is why it's a much shallower experience than the rest of the game. Imagine being a console only player who has never played an MMO and being dropped into the post starter island zones immediately? Would probably be pretty overwhelming, no?

    Does that mean it has the potential to just turn some MMO vets off immediately? I'm sure. But it looks like a lot of people gave it another whack and humped through it into the real game.

    That's my take, anyways.

    I think that's a valid point.  An introduction isn't a bad thing, and if you see it as such and just work through it, there is an entire world of game out there shortly after you start.  Basing opinions on the intro and extending that to the entire game is disingenuous at best.  Unfortunately there are reviews out there doing just that and hordes of their supplicants are drinking it up.

    I was a lot more worried about this on Friday. I even wrote a blog about it. But I've been going through a lot of the feedback here and on other sites and there is a very clear trend of opinion shift for a lot of people who made it through the starter area and saw the rest of the game over the weekend. That's not to say everyone will be this way, ESO isn't for everyone, but thankfully it looks like a ton of people gave the game a real chance.

     

     

    Well I don't know exactly what you mean by starter area?  But I did manage to make it to level 8 and I think it was the 3rd zone (not counting cold harbor) and the game opened up a lot and actually became quite fun.  I think ZOS needs to spend the next 2 months Revamping Cold Harbor and the first 2 zones.

    Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!

    Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!

    Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!

    image

  • khelluskhellus tulsa, OKPosts: 25Member

    Most likely the journalists played on a different server(different build) than the rest of the beta testers.I know I wouldn't want someone to write a preview of my game from an experience they got while I was stress testing server stability.I would want them to have the most stable bug free build I had available and I would have a support staff on hand solely for them.

     

  • BlackWatchBlackWatch OKC, OKPosts: 983Member

    I'm all for game reviews and advanced feedback... but what about the NDA?

    I'm not saying I disagree with the OP, but I'm curious about how much of what has been said here should actually be said here?  

    image

  • NotimeforbsNotimeforbs Memphis, TNPosts: 346Member Common
    Originally posted by Gotterdammer
    Originally posted by erikkennedy

    Either you didn't really play this game, or its already changed significantly since you have. Almost everything you said about the starter zone is incorrect, and I just finished it myself yesterday. I didn't feel like I was running erands, I felt like I had to find and help all of the villagers before the Covenant attacked and killed everyone. There were lots of other real people running around, and I even got friend requests. I was able to immediately start crafting. The chat box was so busy I had to work hard to ignore it.

    There are still some bugs. I'm sure some of the things you were looking for will be implemented. It just seems like in an effort for you guys to find a differing opinion, what you did instead was something ignorant.

    I'm going to agree with this. This article just seems to reach for things to be negative about just for the sake of being negative. While I don't think TESO will hold my interest for long due to the other two heavy hitters releasing this year, I have definitely pre-ordered and I have no doubt that the time I do spend with it will be enjoyable.

    I can't help but wonder the same thing about a lot of reviews just like this one.  I just finished up my Beta experience and all I can say is these reviewers (and I've read a lot of them) just seem to be saying negative things about the most trivial matters.  My experience was nothing but constant good things, even for an outdated Beta build.  It's almost like they want it to fail.  And they all, evey, single, one of them make a statement about it should be F2P.  I'm not a huge conspiracy theorist, but it's almost like someone is paying them to promote a business model that has been proven time and time again to be a scam.  And the ONLY reason it is a successful business model is because the game that use them are absolute garbage from the repeat factory, and there simply are no other options.

    TESO plays differently than any MMO I've played in the last 10 years.  It's pushing me out of my comfort zones in ways that I like.  I went into it not interested in even the slightest sense.  I came out of it with 2 pre-orderd copies of the Collector's Edition.  I cannot believe the things these reviewers are saying - they're just so... trivial and retarded.

    I think the big deal is once people get their hands on an actual good game, and realize it will survive on a Sub Model - all these other companies who preach doom and gloom about the "failed subscription model" as justification for promoting a money scam operation will look pretty stupid.  But even then... these reviewers have power.  People will hate this game just because it is popular to hate it.

    Makes me so sick.

     
  • VolgoreVolgore Posts: 2,210Member Uncommon

    I agree to the article in both the positive and negative points.

    It restored some faith into this site which gets often critisized for it's blatant biase. After the user's many complains about mmorpg.com always giving out free hype for every other game (to be) released and protecting flawed products in favor for their friends in the industry, it's good to see that now and then someone isn't shy to tell things how they are.

    Keep them coming!

    image
  • IkifalesIkifales tucson, AZPosts: 269Member Uncommon
    Hmmm...somewhat inaccurate on the social aspect. It is very much traditional MMO in that regard. The chat window was ridiculously busy in the starter zone and everywhere else too when I played in the last several beta tests. Not sure how you had that experience... unless you played beta way before that.
  • nerovipus32nerovipus32 dublinPosts: 2,735Member
    Originally posted by Volgore

    I agree to the article in both the positive and negative points.

    It restored some faith into this site which gets often critisized for it's blatant biase. After the user's many complains about mmorpg.com always giving out free hype for every other game (to be) released and protecting flawed products in favor for their friends in the industry, it's good to see that now and then someone isn't shy to tell things how they are.

    Keep them coming!

    I've yet to see an accurate review on this site. Just look at some of the scores they have given on here.

  • MikeBMikeB MMORPG.com Community Manager Queens, NYPosts: 5,724Administrator Uncommon
    Originally posted by Dakirn
    Originally posted by MikeB

    Want to zero in on the starter island stuff since I see it come up a lot:

    I really think the reason we can't square the starter island experience is because we (MMO vets) aren't actually the target audience for it. That's why you're seeing all these weird reactions this weekend. People who don't like the game at first and then warm up to it once they get off the island.

    If not us, then who? Well, ZOS is trying to get non-MMO playing ES fans, and more importantly, console players, into the fold. The starter island is more than likely designed with them in mind, which is why it's a much shallower experience than the rest of the game. Imagine being a console only player who has never played an MMO and being dropped into the post starter island zones immediately? Would probably be pretty overwhelming, no?

    Does that mean it has the potential to just turn some MMO vets off immediately? I'm sure. But it looks like a lot of people gave it another whack and humped through it into the real game.

    That's my take, anyways.

    Do you guys tend to group at all during MMO reviews? Did you try doing quests with other people who were (or weren't) on the same step?

    This game is solo centered and it absolutely ruined the beta for me and my friends, yet I see very few reviewers talk about questing with other people (something a LOT of people tend to do in MMOs).

    I think that grouping and questing needs to really be talked about, but most reviewers are playing the game solo (and MAYBE group for a specific group instance) and are missing a large part of the game for many people.  The result is a lot of people are going to be seriously pissed when they play at release.

    I've played the game with friends for my entire experience, actually. Anywhere from 2-4 people at any given time. The only time it wasn't friendly for group questing was when doing 'main story' quests, which are an extremely tiny portion of the content. I read something like 5-6 hours total if done back-to-back according to Paul Sage in a recent AMA.

    Michael "MikeB" Bitton
    Community Manager
    Twitter: @eMikeB

  • nerovipus32nerovipus32 dublinPosts: 2,735Member
    Originally posted by MikeB
    Originally posted by Dakirn
    Originally posted by MikeB

    Want to zero in on the starter island stuff since I see it come up a lot:

    I really think the reason we can't square the starter island experience is because we (MMO vets) aren't actually the target audience for it. That's why you're seeing all these weird reactions this weekend. People who don't like the game at first and then warm up to it once they get off the island.

    If not us, then who? Well, ZOS is trying to get non-MMO playing ES fans, and more importantly, console players, into the fold. The starter island is more than likely designed with them in mind, which is why it's a much shallower experience than the rest of the game. Imagine being a console only player who has never played an MMO and being dropped into the post starter island zones immediately? Would probably be pretty overwhelming, no?

    Does that mean it has the potential to just turn some MMO vets off immediately? I'm sure. But it looks like a lot of people gave it another whack and humped through it into the real game.

    That's my take, anyways.

    Do you guys tend to group at all during MMO reviews? Did you try doing quests with other people who were (or weren't) on the same step?

    This game is solo centered and it absolutely ruined the beta for me and my friends, yet I see very few reviewers talk about questing with other people (something a LOT of people tend to do in MMOs).

    I think that grouping and questing needs to really be talked about, but most reviewers are playing the game solo (and MAYBE group for a specific group instance) and are missing a large part of the game for many people.  The result is a lot of people are going to be seriously pissed when they play at release.

    I've played the game with friends for my entire experience, actually. Anywhere from 2-4 people at any given time. The only time it wasn't friendly for group questing was when doing 'main story' quests, which are an extremely tiny portion of the content. I read something like 5-6 hours total if done back-to-back according to Paul Sage in a recent AMA.

    I think your reviewing of this game has been appalling, considering some of the other mmo's that are no better got glowing reviews.

  • osc8rosc8r SydPosts: 687Member
    Originally posted by JJ82
    Originally posted by Cures80

    all this blabla while everyone (who wants to ) knows that its about the pvp! like someone said in the other thread: did you also review DAOC leaving out the RvR? This is an RvR game goddammit ^^ and its a great one.

    Would this be the RvR that's going to be based on piss poor animations, horrible combat and no collision detection?!?

    Oh yeah.

    And no. According to anyone that replies to someone stating the base game design is based on PvP, we are told it isn't, its all about the PvE.

    Exactly. You can already tell by the clunky combat that PVP just isn't going to work.

    Running errands? That's pretty much what ESO is.

  • SlaymoreSlaymore OsloPosts: 21Member Uncommon
    I didnt try pvp yet, but I love the combat. I tried alot of classes, and its got very nice feel to it. When you stab someone you feel you do it. Its not fluffy flashes like cartoonbattles.......
  • MikeBMikeB MMORPG.com Community Manager Queens, NYPosts: 5,724Administrator Uncommon
    Originally posted by nerovipus32
    Originally posted by MikeB
    Originally posted by Dakirn
    Originally posted by MikeB

    Want to zero in on the starter island stuff since I see it come up a lot:

    I really think the reason we can't square the starter island experience is because we (MMO vets) aren't actually the target audience for it. That's why you're seeing all these weird reactions this weekend. People who don't like the game at first and then warm up to it once they get off the island.

    If not us, then who? Well, ZOS is trying to get non-MMO playing ES fans, and more importantly, console players, into the fold. The starter island is more than likely designed with them in mind, which is why it's a much shallower experience than the rest of the game. Imagine being a console only player who has never played an MMO and being dropped into the post starter island zones immediately? Would probably be pretty overwhelming, no?

    Does that mean it has the potential to just turn some MMO vets off immediately? I'm sure. But it looks like a lot of people gave it another whack and humped through it into the real game.

    That's my take, anyways.

    Do you guys tend to group at all during MMO reviews? Did you try doing quests with other people who were (or weren't) on the same step?

    This game is solo centered and it absolutely ruined the beta for me and my friends, yet I see very few reviewers talk about questing with other people (something a LOT of people tend to do in MMOs).

    I think that grouping and questing needs to really be talked about, but most reviewers are playing the game solo (and MAYBE group for a specific group instance) and are missing a large part of the game for many people.  The result is a lot of people are going to be seriously pissed when they play at release.

    I've played the game with friends for my entire experience, actually. Anywhere from 2-4 people at any given time. The only time it wasn't friendly for group questing was when doing 'main story' quests, which are an extremely tiny portion of the content. I read something like 5-6 hours total if done back-to-back according to Paul Sage in a recent AMA.

    I think your reviewing of this game has been appalling, considering some of the other mmo's that are no better got glowing reviews.

    I'm not sure what you're referring to. I didn't write this article. Just participating in the conversation! :)

    Michael "MikeB" Bitton
    Community Manager
    Twitter: @eMikeB

  • TdogSkalTdogSkal Livonia, MIPosts: 1,244Member
    Originally posted by orbitxo

    well written.

     

    -you explained the starter zone perfectly!

    -Free 2 play sayers need to calm down - it would not work for this game.

    - the game feels alot like 'elder scrolls' on the solo instances. but a bit odd seein  tons of players gathered around one quest giver.

    - we will see where this goes...

    This game will be Free 2 play within 6 months of Release.  That is all but written in stone.

    The game will not last as a p2p, it does not have enough features that keep p2p.

     

    Sooner or Later

  • DarkeonDarkeon BucurestiPosts: 47Member

    The game is quite good ... I was a bit surprised, in a good way.

    As for some people saying it is to expensive ... well, in these days you buy a single player game for 60$ and you play 10 - 20 hours, then maybe you play it again if you are a big fan and that's it.

    Paying for an MMO that gives you hundreds of hours of gameplay and paying a subscription to benefit from quality, regular updates and addons, etc is worth it imo. 

    As for the article, can't say I liked it much because I really liked the mechanics of the game, sure there's a lot of room for improvements but doesn't an mmo improve over time ? Everything will be ok with this mmo imo, even after a while it becomes buy to play or free to play. Is's already good !

     

  • alterfenixalterfenix Bielsko-BialaPosts: 343Member Uncommon
    Well the only thing that I can for real complain about is that there is just not enough quests to do - for that reason it feels just like fun on rails. If that changed then it would be a totally different story though as the rest seems to be ok. Not saying that it is my best MMORPG first impressions ever but it's definitely far from the worst.
Sign In or Register to comment.