Let's say it in this way: where there is smoke, there is usually a fire. If you watch and read the many previews, I'd say the majority of them is as critical as AngryJoe, and usually all on the same issues.
Sure, it could all be a big conspiracy of ALL the media guys to bring your most beloved MMO down. But then, how likely is that really?
That same "issue" being: "This isn't Skyrim Online! I wants Skyrim Online!"
No I think folks just really want a good mmo and the issue is this may not be one
Unfortunately, I don't think many people on this board will ever be satisfied. And if some are satisfied, there's these groups around, who will do everything they can to let everyone know how dumb the other group is for liking it, and the other way around. So we'll just constantly dance around like that. xD It seems like it, at least.
Let's say it in this way: where there is smoke, there is usually a fire. If you watch and read the many previews, I'd say the majority of them is as critical as AngryJoe, and usually all on the same issues.
Sure, it could all be a big conspiracy of ALL the media guys to bring your most beloved MMO down. But then, how likely is that really?
That same "issue" being: "This isn't Skyrim Online! I wants Skyrim Online!"
No I think folks just really want a good mmo and the issue is this may not be one
Have we finally reached consensus at mmorpg.com on what makes a "good" MMO? I must have missed that if we did.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Originally posted by Asariasha Stop watching. Play games on your own. Give the game a chance to suck you in. And make you very own sum up.
What a load of crap. Are you a shill for Zenimax? Blindly spend $100+ dollars "just to see?" YOU are the reason all this crap keeps getting made. Everybody buys and buys "just to see" that in the end, it's a crap game. Same old, same old.
I guess you have been asleep for a week and didn't hear about the 500,000 Curse free beta keys? Last I heard they still had some.Play on your own IS the only sensible thing to do... it can be done for free this weekend. If 4 days playing isn't enough to let you make up your own mind, then you have no "own mind" to make up.
Yea... I've NEVER played an MMO in my life. I have NO CLUE what I enjoy and what I don't. I best go grab one of those beta keys and "try it out for myself", because what I have read and heard indicates this is the game for me.
By the way, I have already been in the beta and asked Zenimax to delete my account. I HAVE tried it. My gameplay experience reinforced what I have read and seen.
By all means, buy it. Or try it for free. Maybe it will be everything that you ever dreamed of. Don't waste your breath on trying to make me a convert.
Now, if Zenimax actually makes an Elder Scrolls MMO with attributes, skills that ANYONE (no class locked ones) can get, all 10 races at the get go (not behind paywalls), and dropped forced faction PvP with locked faction zones right off the bat, I'll take another looksee. I don't see that happening, do you?
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse. - FARGIN_WAR
Originally posted by Asariasha Stop watching. Play games on your own. Give the game a chance to suck you in. And make you very own sum up.
What a load of crap. Are you a shill for Zenimax? Blindly spend $100+ dollars "just to see?" YOU are the reason all this crap keeps getting made. Everybody buys and buys "just to see" that in the end, it's a crap game. Same old, same old.
I guess you have been asleep for a week and didn't hear about the 500,000 Curse free beta keys? Last I heard they still had some.
Play on your own IS the only sensible thing to do... it can be done for free this weekend. If 4 days playing isn't enough to let you make up your own mind, then you have no "own mind" to make up.
Yea... I've NEVER played an MMO in my life. I have NO CLUE what I enjoy and what I don't. I best go grab one of those beta keys and "try it out for myself", because what I have read and heard indicates this is the game for me.
By the way, I have already been in the beta and asked Zenimax to delete my account. I HAVE tried it. My gameplay experience reinforced what I have read and seen.
By all means, buy it. Or try it for free. Maybe it will be everything that you ever dreamed of. Don't waste your breath on trying to make me a convert.
Now, if Zenimax actually makes an Elder Scrolls MMO with attributes, skills that ANYONE (no class locked ones) can get, all 10 races at the get go (not behind paywalls), and dropped forced faction PvP with locked faction zones right off the bat, I'll take another looksee. I don't see that happening, do you?
You misunderstand my intentions: I have absolutely zero desire to convert anyone, least of all you. I have RL friends that don't like it and some who do.
I only responded to you because you were jumping down someone's throat because the "Zenimax Shill" as you put it, had the temerity to suggest people should check it out for themselves and make up their own mind.
For all I know you wear socks with sandals and that works for you... vive le difference!
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Originally posted by Aldous.Huxley Review of lvls 1-9...
Although some points are valid, any mmo reviewed thru the tutorial portion of the game are not comprehensive enough to sway my opinion. Especially when I know what comes later, beyond those opening lvls.
If I am not grabbed right off the bat, starting with character creation, I will not log in again. Maybe you'll play through MANY hours of "un-fun" play to "get to the good part", but not me.
And that would qualify you to critique character creation and nothing else
You're so cute
I did NOT say "ending with character creation", but rather "STARTING with character creation." Bit of a difference, wouldn't you say?
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse. - FARGIN_WAR
Unfortunately, I don't think many people on this board will ever be satisfied. And if some are satisfied, there's these groups around, who will do everything they can to let everyone know how dumb the other group is for liking it, and the other way around. So we'll just constantly dance around like that. xD It seems like it, at least.
True - but the devs are not helping by keeping the NDA in place.
WoW had an "appalling" launch resulting. The justified righteous ire of 20 servers worth of upset people. Blizzard (basically) said sorry server meltdown, new servers incoming. And because hundreds of thousands had participated in an open beta and knew that there was a game there the flames were drowned.
As it stands TESO has no defence against the likes of AJ's "non-positive" review.
True - but the devs are not helping by keeping the NDA in place.
I agree.
there are criticisms and some things I find greatly disappointing but there are a lot of good things as well and no way to have a real discussion other than saying "grab a key and try it yourself".
But I think some of this is just that some players want x, y and z and they are not willing or not interested in letting that go and just enjoying themselves.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
I agree with most of what he had to say. Specifically involving the Imperial race, lack of side quests early in the game, and no collision detection. To follow up on collision detection, PvP that involves keep sieges needs to have this. Holding doorways and broken down walls by stacking your tanks in a line is a huge advantage on the defender. As of now, without collision, either side can stack AOE characters on each other to clear in an unrealistic way. Or, just run right through your defenses.
My experience wasn't boring though. Everyone has a different opinion I guess.
The problem I have with reviews even from credible sources, is that many are based on the type of game and gameplay that the reviewer *enjoys*. That's subjective.
As such, unless I like the same things that the reviewer likes, the review is pretty much useless as a tool to determine if I will like the game.
Originally posted by RealmLordsKen The problem I have with reviews even from credible sources, is that many are based on the type of game and gameplay that the reviewer *enjoys*. That's subjective.
As such, unless I like the same things that the reviewer likes, the review is pretty much useless as a tool to determine if I will like the game.
Wise words... just one tiny example for me: collision detection... I could give less of shit about that.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Originally posted by RealmLordsKen The problem I have with reviews even from credible sources, is that many are based on the type of game and gameplay that the reviewer *enjoys*. That's subjective.
As such, unless I like the same things that the reviewer likes, the review is pretty much useless as a tool to determine if I will like the game.
+1
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Yeah AngryJoe doesn't strike me as a TES lore buff nor an avid ingame reader of all the books. It is almost like a "dude bro" thoughts of the game to level 9.
Originally posted by RealmLordsKen The problem I have with reviews even from credible sources, is that many are based on the type of game and gameplay that the reviewer *enjoys*. That's subjective.
As such, unless I like the same things that the reviewer likes, the review is pretty much useless as a tool to determine if I will like the game.
I disagree. Reviews are not useless - even if you don't like the same things as the reviewer - as long as they are clear.
Some examples. Collision detection; AJ prefers it, no big deal for e.g. Iselin. You can decide. Doesn't invalidate the review.
Another obvious one: art style. There is video footage and you can decide whether you like it or not.
Mob combat is another. AJ feels a lot of it is pretty bland - you can see multiple kills and decide for yourself.
There are things AJ feels go against ES lore - again you can decide. (And it won't be a few rogue defectors who opt for a certain race - in time there will be lots). You can decide however what it means to you.
And so on.
And if you watch / listen to enough reviews you can create an impression.
Now there are people saying the reviews don't go into x, y and z, the reviews are to limited, shallow etc. but those I have seen are because Zenimax have limited what can be said. So there usefulness at this moment in time is limited - but they are not useless.
Even if you don't agree with him on the subject it is going to give you a pretty good general view about what more casual type mmo players are going to thing. Its not difficult to track a record of what reviewers have done and see how much there viewpoints line up with yours. Oh and collision detection is a pretty useful thing for pvp game play.
Originally posted by funyahns Even if you don't agree with him on the subject it is going to give you a pretty good general view about what more casual type mmo players are going to thing. Its not difficult to track a record of what reviewers have done and see how much there viewpoints line up with yours. Oh and collision detection is a pretty useful thing for pvp game play.
Unless it gets exploited to create traffic jams where 3 tanks with out of sight healer support spamming AOE heals can hold back 300... sorry, been there...done that....did NOT get the T-shirt.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Apparently, Massively labeled ESO as "absolutely nothing special". I really didn't expect that the press are so determined to bash the game this hard. I thought that it'll be the otherwise.
Well hopefully there is something special in the Cyro PvP. From the reviews I've seen, it looks like the PvE is just another themepark with no attempt at a virtual world with consequences or even risk vs reward.
I do like the gfx and the mouse look combat control...if they could have just dropped some of the themepark linear quest crap.
Am I the only person left that reviews my own games by buying them and playing them? Are there really that many sheep on the edge of their seat waiting to be told to buy something because a reviewer said it was good or to stay away because a reviewer said it was bad? I genuinely feel sorry for people with the mentality that they need to constantly be told what to like and not like.
Originally posted by funyahns Even if you don't agree with him on the subject it is going to give you a pretty good general view about what more casual type mmo players are going to thing. Its not difficult to track a record of what reviewers have done and see how much there viewpoints line up with yours. Oh and collision detection is a pretty useful thing for pvp game play.
Unless it gets exploited to create traffic jams where 3 tanks with out of sight healer support spamming AOE heals can hold back 300... sorry, been there...done that....did NOT get the T-shirt.
From a game designer point of view, this example isn't an exploit, nor is it a bad 'design'.
This is just one of the three 'mitigation / damage / healing' numbers needing adjustment.
For the record, I like AJ's direct no-BS style and calling it like it is.
For the disaster that was the TW:Rome2, AJ's review was the only one that was actually reflective of the quality.
Gdemami - Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
Am I the only person left that reviews my own games by buying them and playing them? Are there really that many sheep on the edge of their seat waiting to be told to buy something because a reviewer said it was good or to stay away because a reviewer said it was bad? I genuinely feel sorry for people with the mentality that they need to constantly be told what to like and not like.
So do tell how do you make a decision on which games to buy? Do you watch the CGI trailer? Do you go to the website of the game and read what the market people have written? Do you just blindly buy a game you think looks good? Choosing to buy because a reviewer tell you to is dumb. I don't think anyone in here has said that. Using it as a tool to try and guess about what a game is going to be like is where its most useful.
Originally posted by funyahns Even if you don't agree with him on the subject it is going to give you a pretty good general view about what more casual type mmo players are going to thing. Its not difficult to track a record of what reviewers have done and see how much there viewpoints line up with yours. Oh and collision detection is a pretty useful thing for pvp game play.
Unless it gets exploited to create traffic jams where 3 tanks with out of sight healer support spamming AOE heals can hold back 300... sorry, been there...done that....did NOT get the T-shirt.
That is not a collision detection problem though. That is a designing issues. Oh and where did you see 3 tanks hold back 300 people in a battle? A lot of MMO's have gone without them so I am curious
Originally posted by funyahns Even if you don't agree with him on the subject it is going to give you a pretty good general view about what more casual type mmo players are going to thing. Its not difficult to track a record of what reviewers have done and see how much there viewpoints line up with yours. Oh and collision detection is a pretty useful thing for pvp game play.
Unless it gets exploited to create traffic jams where 3 tanks with out of sight healer support spamming AOE heals can hold back 300... sorry, been there...done that....did NOT get the T-shirt.
That is not a collision detection problem though. That is a designing issues. Oh and where did you see 3 tanks hold back 300 people in a battle? A lot of MMO's have gone without them so I am curious
Lol i love this guys reviews. I have agreed with most of them too. The best line of the review is that the game is a cheap knockoff of Tes games. Had my laughing so hard. Might as well go play Skyrim until it goess f2p. I just picked up Eldercsrolls Anthology. So i now own all the Tes games and it will keep me busy until this goes f2p.
Comments
Unfortunately, I don't think many people on this board will ever be satisfied. And if some are satisfied, there's these groups around, who will do everything they can to let everyone know how dumb the other group is for liking it, and the other way around. So we'll just constantly dance around like that. xD It seems like it, at least.
Have we finally reached consensus at mmorpg.com on what makes a "good" MMO? I must have missed that if we did.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
By the way, I have already been in the beta and asked Zenimax to delete my account. I HAVE tried it. My gameplay experience reinforced what I have read and seen.
By all means, buy it. Or try it for free. Maybe it will be everything that you ever dreamed of. Don't waste your breath on trying to make me a convert.
Now, if Zenimax actually makes an Elder Scrolls MMO with attributes, skills that ANYONE (no class locked ones) can get, all 10 races at the get go (not behind paywalls), and dropped forced faction PvP with locked faction zones right off the bat, I'll take another looksee. I don't see that happening, do you?
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.- FARGIN_WAR
You misunderstand my intentions: I have absolutely zero desire to convert anyone, least of all you. I have RL friends that don't like it and some who do.
I only responded to you because you were jumping down someone's throat because the "Zenimax Shill" as you put it, had the temerity to suggest people should check it out for themselves and make up their own mind.
For all I know you wear socks with sandals and that works for you... vive le difference!
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
I did NOT say "ending with character creation", but rather "STARTING with character creation." Bit of a difference, wouldn't you say?
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.- FARGIN_WAR
True - but the devs are not helping by keeping the NDA in place.
WoW had an "appalling" launch resulting. The justified righteous ire of 20 servers worth of upset people. Blizzard (basically) said sorry server meltdown, new servers incoming. And because hundreds of thousands had participated in an open beta and knew that there was a game there the flames were drowned.
As it stands TESO has no defence against the likes of AJ's "non-positive" review.
I agree.
there are criticisms and some things I find greatly disappointing but there are a lot of good things as well and no way to have a real discussion other than saying "grab a key and try it yourself".
But I think some of this is just that some players want x, y and z and they are not willing or not interested in letting that go and just enjoying themselves.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
I agree with most of what he had to say. Specifically involving the Imperial race, lack of side quests early in the game, and no collision detection. To follow up on collision detection, PvP that involves keep sieges needs to have this. Holding doorways and broken down walls by stacking your tanks in a line is a huge advantage on the defender. As of now, without collision, either side can stack AOE characters on each other to clear in an unrealistic way. Or, just run right through your defenses.
My experience wasn't boring though. Everyone has a different opinion I guess.
220,000+ views and climbing in 19 hours.
Whether you agree with him or not there's a lot of interest in what he has to say.
Gdemami -
Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
As such, unless I like the same things that the reviewer likes, the review is pretty much useless as a tool to determine if I will like the game.
Wise words... just one tiny example for me: collision detection... I could give less of shit about that.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
+1
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Good for him. I disagree.
I'm not an IT Specialist, Game Developer, or Clairvoyant in real life, but like others on here, I play one on the internet.
I disagree. Reviews are not useless - even if you don't like the same things as the reviewer - as long as they are clear.
Some examples. Collision detection; AJ prefers it, no big deal for e.g. Iselin. You can decide. Doesn't invalidate the review.
Another obvious one: art style. There is video footage and you can decide whether you like it or not.
Mob combat is another. AJ feels a lot of it is pretty bland - you can see multiple kills and decide for yourself.
There are things AJ feels go against ES lore - again you can decide. (And it won't be a few rogue defectors who opt for a certain race - in time there will be lots). You can decide however what it means to you.
And so on.
And if you watch / listen to enough reviews you can create an impression.
Now there are people saying the reviews don't go into x, y and z, the reviews are to limited, shallow etc. but those I have seen are because Zenimax have limited what can be said. So there usefulness at this moment in time is limited - but they are not useless.
Unless it gets exploited to create traffic jams where 3 tanks with out of sight healer support spamming AOE heals can hold back 300... sorry, been there...done that....did NOT get the T-shirt.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Well hopefully there is something special in the Cyro PvP. From the reviews I've seen, it looks like the PvE is just another themepark with no attempt at a virtual world with consequences or even risk vs reward.
I do like the gfx and the mouse look combat control...if they could have just dropped some of the themepark linear quest crap.
Am I the only person left that reviews my own games by buying them and playing them? Are there really that many sheep on the edge of their seat waiting to be told to buy something because a reviewer said it was good or to stay away because a reviewer said it was bad? I genuinely feel sorry for people with the mentality that they need to constantly be told what to like and not like.
From a game designer point of view, this example isn't an exploit, nor is it a bad 'design'.
This is just one of the three 'mitigation / damage / healing' numbers needing adjustment.
For the record, I like AJ's direct no-BS style and calling it like it is.
For the disaster that was the TW:Rome2, AJ's review was the only one that was actually reflective of the quality.
Gdemami -
Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
So do tell how do you make a decision on which games to buy? Do you watch the CGI trailer? Do you go to the website of the game and read what the market people have written? Do you just blindly buy a game you think looks good? Choosing to buy because a reviewer tell you to is dumb. I don't think anyone in here has said that. Using it as a tool to try and guess about what a game is going to be like is where its most useful.
That is not a collision detection problem though. That is a designing issues. Oh and where did you see 3 tanks hold back 300 people in a battle? A lot of MMO's have gone without them so I am curious
I want to know what that game is too.
Lol i love this guys reviews. I have agreed with most of them too. The best line of the review is that the game is a cheap knockoff of Tes games. Had my laughing so hard. Might as well go play Skyrim until it goess f2p. I just picked up Eldercsrolls Anthology. So i now own all the Tes games and it will keep me busy until this goes f2p.