I'm struggling to see how people did not see this type of announcement coming.....
It is clearly an acid test exercise......
Gate a core race behind an additional CE purchase in order to both maximise launch revenue and also assess community reaction.
This is basically just the first layer of framework before the game goes F2P with full on cash shop six months after launch.
Zeni are just dipping their toe in the water here in order to see what sorts of content they can get away with charging for when the game does move to a full F2P model shortly after release....
Welcome to the new world.....
Driz
I completely agree with this. It s truly a test, and a money grab.
It's simply outrageous that a company some $200m in the hole with investors to fund creation of a product, want to do something so dastardly as grab money when selling the product!
throwing money at a project != good product that is worth paying for
if you buy everything just because it had a big production-price-tag on it you need to review yourself as a consumer. I mean common guys we need to educate our children someday about the value and worth of money.
Future generations will be impacted if stuff like this is accepted.
You really just compared a life value lesson with buying a CE edition of a game, which if you bought on greenmangaming for 20% is $4.00 above retail asking price for the game? Are you serious? If you buy the physical edition for $20 more than digital you get an art book and a statue, which to some are worth $20.00.
Buying an MMO at release is one thing many like to do. Most other games, imagine this one, MMO gamers wait until they are on sale. I buy nearly every other game at 50-75% when they are on sale on steam.
Maybe people should worry about their own finances and educating their own children. I read about people complaining about gamestop selling used games for $5.00 less than new games cost, yet offer them only 40% of what its worth. Its called lazy people, they don't have to do anything other than walk into the store and sell it back. Toss it on Ebay and make double that roughly (-15% of final value for eBay/paypal fees).
there is a lot more that just the CE, pre-orders and such that is turning me off from the game. Quite a bit. the lack of information, poor beta participation, the quality of the play just within the streams. Gotta be honest, this may be the first game in a decade i didn't pre-order or buy outright.
The quality of play i did get to see from people streaming was.......less than encouragable and Other than the lore, i'm not seeing much unique here.
I think I may practice the art of "Saving My Moneh!" or maybe just get wildstar instead.
So if they waited 2 months and offered this for the same price difference as an expansion would it make a difference? Don't mmos frequently add new races and such as expansions?
Yes. You buy the expansion and pay the monthly fee and you are fine to go.
Yet i find it strange that only those who buy the "collector edition" of that expansion will be able to play that race.
It doesn't feel right when im paying a monthly sub to have Zenimax come to me and say
Zenimax "Hey look! we have a new race to for you to play! just pay us 20$!"
OMG! That guy has the same car as me, but he paid extra for the luxury edition. I paid less for the base model. I can't believe they gave him power windows, power locks, a moonroof, and a satellite radio. People should boycott the car companies, for giving extras to people that are willing to pay for them. If they don't give the luxury features to everyone, the base model customers will be in an uproar!!!! This is outrageous, I should be entitled to everything he is even though I paid less.
OMG! That guy has the same car as me, but he paid extra for the luxury edition. I paid less for the base model. I can't believe they gave him power windows, power locks, a moonroof, and a satellite radio. People should boycott the car companies, for giving extras to people that are willing to pay for them. If they don't give the luxury features to everyone, the base model customers will be in an uproar!!!! This is outrageous, I should be entitled to everything he is even though I paid less.
free to play and buy to play mentality. No a subscription based one. You want a better car analogy.
You have twins, you tell each you love them equally. But on their 18th birthday one gets an economy edition and the other gets a fully loaded addition. The one who got the standard edition ask why if you love us the same. The parents say well they were the one who came out first.
OMG! That guy has the same car as me, but he paid extra for the luxury edition. I paid less for the base model. I can't believe they gave him power windows, power locks, a moonroof, and a satellite radio. People should boycott the car companies, for giving extras to people that are willing to pay for them. If they don't give the luxury features to everyone, the base model customers will be in an uproar!!!! This is outrageous, I should be entitled to everything he is even though I paid less.
How about this comparison. The base model of the car comes missing a window on the passenger door. To have all the windows you need get the luxury edition. It's fair right? Because it's not like you absolutely have to have a window on every door. But of course no one would ever buy a new car missing a window because it's a feature we expect. Imperial race its not an "extra". Basically what they did was flip a switch so that the imperial race will be grayed out for everyone except those that bought the Imperial edition. I'm sure they did this because of pressure from higher up. I can't imagine the people actually developing the game wanting to do something like this.
Well, I won't be getting it because of letting any race play any faction. One of the things that made DAoC great in the old days was the realm pride. People would do crazy things and pull lots of hours in order to defend their keeps in the frontiers from the enemy realms. The feelings were so powerful and it made us play better together, our realms had such strong solidarity, even if forum drama was massive between realms. It was one of the best experiences I ever had in any MMORPG. Things like language barrier, alienness that makes your enemies more threatening because they are different from you, different skills, classes, etc all have a deep psychological impact.
It disappeared when Mythic began to let people cross realm on the same server. It was one of the worst things Mythic did outside of the ToA expansion.
I have not had such intense feelings in an MMORPG since DAoC and I long for them in an RvR game. The closest I got was in WAR, but it really needed three factions.
Well, I won't be getting it because of letting any race play any faction. One of the things that made DAoC great in the old days was the realm pride. People would do crazy things and pull lots of hours in order to defend their keeps in the frontiers from the enemy realms. The feelings were so powerful and it made us play better together, our realms had such strong solidarity, even if forum drama was massive between realms. It was one of the best experiences I ever had in any MMORPG. Things like language barrier, alienness that makes your enemies more threatening because they are different from you, different skills, classes, etc all have a deep psychological impact.
It disappeared when Mythic began to let people cross realm on the same server. It was one of the worst things Mythic did outside of the ToA expansion.
I have not had such intense feelings in an MMORPG since DAoC and I long for them in an RvR game. The closest I got was in WAR, but it really needed three factions.
Shame that Zenimax are dropping the ball.
Realm pride can't be imitated anymore because people will simply quit if their realm is losing and reroll.
I bet 90% of the people moaning about the imperial race lock were never even going to place that race anyway, just up in arms cause they looking for something to hate on.
The Unlocking of the races is the biggest problem, would be good if it was always locked to the people that bought the Explorers version whatever it is, but we all know later on down the track they going to open it up for everyone in the cash shop, just like the imperial race.
I will buy & play regardless, but if pvp/cyrodil is just a massive battleground with 20 instances of the same thing, then it wont be for long.
OMG! That guy has the same car as me, but he paid extra for the luxury edition. I paid less for the base model. I can't believe they gave him power windows, power locks, a moonroof, and a satellite radio. People should boycott the car companies, for giving extras to people that are willing to pay for them. If they don't give the luxury features to everyone, the base model customers will be in an uproar!!!! This is outrageous, I should be entitled to everything he is even though I paid less.
More like OMG! that guy got the same car as me but he paid extra so he got 4 wheels while i only have 3. And the car manufactor promised me that we only had to pay a base sum to get all the important parts!
You know... Zenimax kinda wants us to believe this is a p2p game and not a f2p game.
Had it been a f2p your example would be correct. Sorry
OMG! That guy has the same car as me, but he paid extra for the luxury edition. I paid less for the base model. I can't believe they gave him power windows, power locks, a moonroof, and a satellite radio. People should boycott the car companies, for giving extras to people that are willing to pay for them. If they don't give the luxury features to everyone, the base model customers will be in an uproar!!!! This is outrageous, I should be entitled to everything he is even though I paid less.
More like OMG! that guy got the same car as me but he paid extra so he got 4 wheels while i only have 3. And the car manufactor promised me that we only had to pay a base sum to get all the important parts!
You know... Zenimax kinda wants us to believe this is a p2p game and not a f2p game.
Had it been a f2p your example would be correct. Sorry
Your example is so spot on...I mean a missing race is so spot on the same as a vehicle with 3 wheels instead of 4 that can not drive now thus being unusable. Wow.....those are so the same.
I think the only way any of this would make sense to me is if they
- Made the CE $100 more (so we dont get anything like 40% buying it)
- THE CE gets to go any alliance with any race as a defector and is made distinct from the rest of his race (unique colour or clothing/mark he has to wear)
- Imperial Race is available to all
This whole thing stinks of FTP in as little time as it takes for them to decide the subs model isnt working.
Well, I won't be getting it because of letting any race play any faction. One of the things that made DAoC great in the old days was the realm pride. People would do crazy things and pull lots of hours in order to defend their keeps in the frontiers from the enemy realms. The feelings were so powerful and it made us play better together, our realms had such strong solidarity, even if forum drama was massive between realms. It was one of the best experiences I ever had in any MMORPG. Things like language barrier, alienness that makes your enemies more threatening because they are different from you, different skills, classes, etc all have a deep psychological impact.
It disappeared when Mythic began to let people cross realm on the same server. It was one of the worst things Mythic did outside of the ToA expansion.
I have not had such intense feelings in an MMORPG since DAoC and I long for them in an RvR game. The closest I got was in WAR, but it really needed three factions.
Shame that Zenimax are dropping the ball.
DAoC was a new IP wasn't it? You didn't have players with a decade-long history of playing specific races in the same world that were being forced into a faction because the developer decided arbitrarily that your race belonged in that faction. How do you expect someone to have pride in a faction when they're forced into it because they always play Bosmers rather than because they decided they wanted to be in that faction?
Originally posted by merv808OMG! That guy has the same car as me, but he paid extra for the luxury edition. I paid less for the base model. I can't believe they gave him power windows, power locks, a moonroof, and a satellite radio. People should boycott the car companies, for giving extras to people that are willing to pay for them. If they don't give the luxury features to everyone, the base model customers will be in an uproar!!!! This is outrageous, I should be entitled to everything he is even though I paid less.
More like OMG! that guy got the same car as me but he paid extra so he got 4 wheels while i only have 3. And the car manufactor promised me that we only had to pay a base sum to get all the important parts!
You know... Zenimax kinda wants us to believe this is a p2p game and not a f2p game.
Had it been a f2p your example would be correct. Sorry
so you can't play ESO without the imperial skin? because you damn sure can't drive a car with only 3 wheels.
Originally posted by Nzscorpion80 I bet 90% of the people moaning about the imperial race lock were never even going to place that race anyway, just up in arms cause they looking for something to hate on.
there is no doubt about that. they seem to be mainly pissed because they don't get everything in the standard edition that people get in the imperial edition when they pay more money.
dare i say they are a bunch of communists? lol (i am joking)
Originally posted by merv808OMG! That guy has the same car as me, but he paid extra for the luxury edition. I paid less for the base model. I can't believe they gave him power windows, power locks, a moonroof, and a satellite radio. People should boycott the car companies, for giving extras to people that are willing to pay for them. If they don't give the luxury features to everyone, the base model customers will be in an uproar!!!! This is outrageous, I should be entitled to everything he is even though I paid less.
More like OMG! that guy got the same car as me but he paid extra so he got 4 wheels while i only have 3. And the car manufactor promised me that we only had to pay a base sum to get all the important parts!
You know... Zenimax kinda wants us to believe this is a p2p game and not a f2p game.
Had it been a f2p your example would be correct. Sorry
so you can't play ESO without the imperial skin? because you damn sure can't drive a car with only 3 wheels.
OMG! That guy has the same car as me, but he paid extra for the luxury edition. I paid less for the base model. I can't believe they gave him power windows, power locks, a moonroof, and a satellite radio. People should boycott the car companies, for giving extras to people that are willing to pay for them. If they don't give the luxury features to everyone, the base model customers will be in an uproar!!!! This is outrageous, I should be entitled to everything he is even though I paid less.
free to play and buy to play mentality. No a subscription based one. You want a better car analogy.
You have twins, you tell each you love them equally. But on their 18th birthday one gets an economy edition and the other gets a fully loaded addition. The one who got the standard edition ask why if you love us the same. The parents say well they were the one who came out first.
end of lesson.
That's a terrible analogy and it doesn't fit the discussion at all. The developers are giving MORE to the people that are willing to pay MORE for it. Plain and simple. What if the kid that got the fully loaded edition contributed $2000 dollars of their own money, while the other kid refused to? That's what we are talking about here.
OMG! That guy has the same car as me, but he paid extra for the luxury edition. I paid less for the base model. I can't believe they gave him power windows, power locks, a moonroof, and a satellite radio. People should boycott the car companies, for giving extras to people that are willing to pay for them. If they don't give the luxury features to everyone, the base model customers will be in an uproar!!!! This is outrageous, I should be entitled to everything he is even though I paid less.
How about this comparison. The base model of the car comes missing a window on the passenger door. To have all the windows you need get the luxury edition. It's fair right? Because it's not like you absolutely have to have a window on every door. But of course no one would ever buy a new car missing a window because it's a feature we expect. Imperial race its not an "extra". Basically what they did was flip a switch so that the imperial race will be grayed out for everyone except those that bought the Imperial edition. I'm sure they did this because of pressure from higher up. I can't imagine the people actually developing the game wanting to do something like this.
How is the imperial race not an "extra"? There are plenty of other races to choose from, none being more important than the other. Besides that, the imperial race wasn't even in the game before this. Its not an overpowered race, its just a skin of a human, with a few different abilities. How again, is that not an "extra"
Wipe the tears from your eyes, then look at the situation again, you may be able to actually see whats happening.
I don't see anything wrong with offering more to people who are willing to pay more. It's a collectors edition, that is why people buy the collectors edition. Besides what difference does an extra race mean. I bought the collectors edition but still plan on playing a specific race and class. You people have way too much time on your hands to bitch about things.
You can upgrade your standard pre-order to Imperial edition after launch. I would not be surprised at all to see the Imperial race unlock in the cash shop down the road. Pure Zenimax cash grab.
Comments
You really just compared a life value lesson with buying a CE edition of a game, which if you bought on greenmangaming for 20% is $4.00 above retail asking price for the game? Are you serious? If you buy the physical edition for $20 more than digital you get an art book and a statue, which to some are worth $20.00.
Buying an MMO at release is one thing many like to do. Most other games, imagine this one, MMO gamers wait until they are on sale. I buy nearly every other game at 50-75% when they are on sale on steam.
Maybe people should worry about their own finances and educating their own children. I read about people complaining about gamestop selling used games for $5.00 less than new games cost, yet offer them only 40% of what its worth. Its called lazy people, they don't have to do anything other than walk into the store and sell it back. Toss it on Ebay and make double that roughly (-15% of final value for eBay/paypal fees).
there is a lot more that just the CE, pre-orders and such that is turning me off from the game. Quite a bit. the lack of information, poor beta participation, the quality of the play just within the streams. Gotta be honest, this may be the first game in a decade i didn't pre-order or buy outright.
The quality of play i did get to see from people streaming was.......less than encouragable and Other than the lore, i'm not seeing much unique here.
I think I may practice the art of "Saving My Moneh!" or maybe just get wildstar instead.
Yes. You buy the expansion and pay the monthly fee and you are fine to go.
Yet i find it strange that only those who buy the "collector edition" of that expansion will be able to play that race.
It doesn't feel right when im paying a monthly sub to have Zenimax come to me and say
Zenimax "Hey look! we have a new race to for you to play! just pay us 20$!"
I could live with it in a f2p game. Totally fine.
But not in a subscription game
OMG! That guy has the same car as me, but he paid extra for the luxury edition. I paid less for the base model. I can't believe they gave him power windows, power locks, a moonroof, and a satellite radio. People should boycott the car companies, for giving extras to people that are willing to pay for them. If they don't give the luxury features to everyone, the base model customers will be in an uproar!!!! This is outrageous, I should be entitled to everything he is even though I paid less.
free to play and buy to play mentality. No a subscription based one. You want a better car analogy.
You have twins, you tell each you love them equally. But on their 18th birthday one gets an economy edition and the other gets a fully loaded addition. The one who got the standard edition ask why if you love us the same. The parents say well they were the one who came out first.
end of lesson.
How about this comparison. The base model of the car comes missing a window on the passenger door. To have all the windows you need get the luxury edition. It's fair right? Because it's not like you absolutely have to have a window on every door. But of course no one would ever buy a new car missing a window because it's a feature we expect. Imperial race its not an "extra". Basically what they did was flip a switch so that the imperial race will be grayed out for everyone except those that bought the Imperial edition. I'm sure they did this because of pressure from higher up. I can't imagine the people actually developing the game wanting to do something like this.
I pre-ordered Southpark: Stick of Truth instead of this game.
It can wait.
ASUS G74sx
i7 quad core
16gb ddr3 ram
3gb ram Nvidia 560M
240GB SSD & 750GB
Well, I won't be getting it because of letting any race play any faction. One of the things that made DAoC great in the old days was the realm pride. People would do crazy things and pull lots of hours in order to defend their keeps in the frontiers from the enemy realms. The feelings were so powerful and it made us play better together, our realms had such strong solidarity, even if forum drama was massive between realms. It was one of the best experiences I ever had in any MMORPG. Things like language barrier, alienness that makes your enemies more threatening because they are different from you, different skills, classes, etc all have a deep psychological impact.
It disappeared when Mythic began to let people cross realm on the same server. It was one of the worst things Mythic did outside of the ToA expansion.
I have not had such intense feelings in an MMORPG since DAoC and I long for them in an RvR game. The closest I got was in WAR, but it really needed three factions.
Shame that Zenimax are dropping the ball.
Playing MUDs and MMOs since 1994.
Realm pride can't be imitated anymore because people will simply quit if their realm is losing and reroll.
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
I bet 90% of the people moaning about the imperial race lock were never even going to place that race anyway, just up in arms cause they looking for something to hate on.
The Unlocking of the races is the biggest problem, would be good if it was always locked to the people that bought the Explorers version whatever it is, but we all know later on down the track they going to open it up for everyone in the cash shop, just like the imperial race.
I will buy & play regardless, but if pvp/cyrodil is just a massive battleground with 20 instances of the same thing, then it wont be for long.
More like OMG! that guy got the same car as me but he paid extra so he got 4 wheels while i only have 3. And the car manufactor promised me that we only had to pay a base sum to get all the important parts!
You know... Zenimax kinda wants us to believe this is a p2p game and not a f2p game.
Had it been a f2p your example would be correct. Sorry
Your example is so spot on...I mean a missing race is so spot on the same as a vehicle with 3 wheels instead of 4 that can not drive now thus being unusable. Wow.....those are so the same.
I think the only way any of this would make sense to me is if they
- Made the CE $100 more (so we dont get anything like 40% buying it)
- THE CE gets to go any alliance with any race as a defector and is made distinct from the rest of his race (unique colour or clothing/mark he has to wear)
- Imperial Race is available to all
This whole thing stinks of FTP in as little time as it takes for them to decide the subs model isnt working.
DAoC was a new IP wasn't it? You didn't have players with a decade-long history of playing specific races in the same world that were being forced into a faction because the developer decided arbitrarily that your race belonged in that faction. How do you expect someone to have pride in a faction when they're forced into it because they always play Bosmers rather than because they decided they wanted to be in that faction?
The ball never fit this game to begin with.
so you can't play ESO without the imperial skin? because you damn sure can't drive a car with only 3 wheels.
[mod edit]
there is no doubt about that. they seem to be mainly pissed because they don't get everything in the standard edition that people get in the imperial edition when they pay more money.
dare i say they are a bunch of communists? lol (i am joking)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQh56geU0X8 it is you that fails
.
That's a terrible analogy and it doesn't fit the discussion at all. The developers are giving MORE to the people that are willing to pay MORE for it. Plain and simple. What if the kid that got the fully loaded edition contributed $2000 dollars of their own money, while the other kid refused to? That's what we are talking about here.
How is the imperial race not an "extra"? There are plenty of other races to choose from, none being more important than the other. Besides that, the imperial race wasn't even in the game before this. Its not an overpowered race, its just a skin of a human, with a few different abilities. How again, is that not an "extra"
Wipe the tears from your eyes, then look at the situation again, you may be able to actually see whats happening.