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[Editorial] Elder Scrolls Online: Thoughts on the Collector's Edition Controversy

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Comments

  • deveilbladdeveilblad Member UncommonPosts: 193

    How are people even okay with this ? I just don't....what... ?

     

    This is like if Blizzard had released Mist of Pandaria, but the only way to play a Pandaren was to buy the Collector's Edition ? You'd have found that okay ? How are people okay with this ?

     

    Bill Murphy, just tell us you were paid by Zenimax to write this article lol... How can you defend a move like this ? You'd have written the exact same article if Blizzard had locked pandas behind collector's edition ? really ?

     

    (I took WoW because it's the most known MMO)

  • JJ82JJ82 Member UncommonPosts: 1,258
    Originally posted by Kuinn

    Name one themepark with big IP that has not twisted their own original lore to hell and back for gameplay and content purposes. Warcraft lore got butchered and even retconned by WoW, Warhammer lore got flushed down the toilet with WAR, TOR made up some silly gamey lore for gameplay purposes. It's just something that is going to happen with themeparks, no need to try and use it as a weapon against some particular game.

    1. WoW is an abomination. Congrats?

    2. Warhammer was also made by another DaoC designer who built War around DaoC style gameplay. Sound familiar at all?

    3. And I HATE YOU FOR DOING THIS, making it sound like I am defending SWTOR in any way, Making up lore where there is a gap, a little of it at that, is not CHANGING LORE. There was actually nothing in the timeframe of SWTOR lore wise and what they added did not conflict with lore after that timeframe.

    So, 1 point of yours is wrong, and the other two points prove that TESO doing it is a BAD IDEA since the are following in Warhammers footsteps in far too many ways, as well as the thing that caused MMOs to become stagnant, WoW. Thanks for the help in proving me right.

    "People who tell you you’re awesome are useless. No, dangerous.

    They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
    http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/

  • CazNeergCazNeerg Member Posts: 2,198
    Originally posted by inemosz

    You're absolutely fine with them contradicting their own statements?

    So, it's also fine if they were to contradict something else in the future?

    Honestly?  Any time I hear an employee say anything about a game, I take it with a bucket of salt and assume there is at least a fifty percent chance it is nothing but marketing nonsense.  I only judge a game by what is actually in the game, not by what people who work for the company say about it outside the game.

    Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
    Through passion, I gain strength.
    Through strength, I gain power.
    Through power, I gain victory.
    Through victory, my chains are broken.
    The Force shall free me.

  • JJ82JJ82 Member UncommonPosts: 1,258
    Originally posted by Kuinn
    Originally posted by someforumguy
    Originally posted by JJ82

    If anything they have provided a laurel leaf to the Elder Scrolls players that were upset about faction locks. Does this seem counter intuitive to the stance they took on faction locks originally? A little"

    No. What it did was prove that everything they said about why they used the base game design was a complete and total lie.

    Most TES fans that got upset about the game was WHY ISNT IT OPEN WORLD like TES games? We were told they HAD TO make it this way for realm pride and because MMOs require sacrifices.

    It was all BS, like most people said and they PROVED it. Its not a laurel, its a carrot on a stick to lead us away from the real issue, a poor game design that was just shown to be worthless made by people with no intention of making a TES game, just a DaoC remake.

     

    This. The free faction choice for a price makes their lore for this particilar game a joke. Just so they can sell a few extra pre orders?

    Not to mention that this is day 1 DLC for a SUBBASED game. That is one step beyond day 1 DLC for a boxpriced game.  

    You do realize that all sub games add extra races in expansion packs that cost money ON TOP OF the sub?

    So Expansions are now the same as pre-orders. As I have pointed out before, people will excuse anything no matter what with the craziest excuses imaginable.

     

    "People who tell you you’re awesome are useless. No, dangerous.

    They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
    http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/

  • ZandilZandil Member UncommonPosts: 252

    Don't like it don't play it, Simples 

     

    I tested it and i'll play it and i'll enjoy it, my choice, keyword here CHOICE.

    image
  • KuinnKuinn Member UncommonPosts: 2,072
    Originally posted by JJ82
    Originally posted by Kuinn

    Name one themepark with big IP that has not twisted their own original lore to hell and back for gameplay and content purposes. Warcraft lore got butchered and even retconned by WoW, Warhammer lore got flushed down the toilet with WAR, TOR made up some silly gamey lore for gameplay purposes. It's just something that is going to happen with themeparks, no need to try and use it as a weapon against some particular game.

    1. WoW is an abomination. Congrats?

    2. Warhammer was also made by another DaoC designer who built War around DaoC style gameplay. Sound familiar at all?

    3. And I HATE YOU FOR DOING THIS, making it sound like I am defending SWTOR in any way, Making up lore where there is a gap, a little of it at that, is not CHANGING LORE. There was actually nothing in the timeframe of SWTOR lore wise and what they added did not conflict with lore after that timeframe.

    So, 1 point of yours is wrong, and the other two points prove that TESO doing it is a BAD IDEA since the are following in Warhammers footsteps in far too many ways, as well as the thing that caused MMOs to become stagnant, WoW. Thanks for the help in proving me right.

     

    3. They pulled completely out of ass lore with Star Wars skin on it for gameplay purposes, but I guess it's that much different just so you can bash TESO.

     

    So, you have a mission, congrats?

  • red_cruiserred_cruiser Member UncommonPosts: 486

    A non-faction specific cosmetic human variety isn't content in a game that already has Bretons, Nords, and Redguards.

    Yes, if this was a Wild West game and they locked Native Americans or if this was a British Isles game and they locked Saxons; the argument that race = content would make sense.

    Context, people.  You want to call your character Tiberius so badly and wear cosmetically modified armor?  Spend the $20 for the extra perks.

  • KuinnKuinn Member UncommonPosts: 2,072
    Originally posted by JJ82
    Originally posted by Kuinn
    Originally posted by someforumguy
    Originally posted by JJ82

    If anything they have provided a laurel leaf to the Elder Scrolls players that were upset about faction locks. Does this seem counter intuitive to the stance they took on faction locks originally? A little"

    No. What it did was prove that everything they said about why they used the base game design was a complete and total lie.

    Most TES fans that got upset about the game was WHY ISNT IT OPEN WORLD like TES games? We were told they HAD TO make it this way for realm pride and because MMOs require sacrifices.

    It was all BS, like most people said and they PROVED it. Its not a laurel, its a carrot on a stick to lead us away from the real issue, a poor game design that was just shown to be worthless made by people with no intention of making a TES game, just a DaoC remake.

     

    This. The free faction choice for a price makes their lore for this particilar game a joke. Just so they can sell a few extra pre orders?

    Not to mention that this is day 1 DLC for a SUBBASED game. That is one step beyond day 1 DLC for a boxpriced game.  

    You do realize that all sub games add extra races in expansion packs that cost money ON TOP OF the sub?

    So Expansions are now the same as pre-orders. As I have pointed out before, people will excuse anything no matter what with the craziest excuses imaginable.

    Wut? I dont even know how you managed to mix pre-orders to expansions with what I said. Ease on the hate a bit so you dont see things that are not there pal.

  • RusqueRusque Member RarePosts: 2,785
    Originally posted by deveilblad

    How are people even okay with this ? I just don't....what... ?

     

    This is like if Blizzard had released Mist of Pandaria, but the only way to play a Pandaren was to buy the Collector's Edition ? You'd have found that okay ? How are people okay with this ?

     

    Bill Murphy, just tell us you were paid by Zenimax to write this article lol... How can you defend a move like this ? You'd have written the exact same article if Blizzard had locked pandas behind collector's edition ? really ?

     

    (I took WoW because it's the most known MMO)

    Yes, that would have been fine.

    Also, it's slightly different from an expansion which revolves around a specific race with that race being a primary feature of the expansion.

    It would have been more like Vanilla WoW launching with 8 races and then offering High Elves as a playable race for CE bonus. Cause that's why Zenimax did. 9 races to choose from. +1 for CE.

  • GhabboGhabbo Member UncommonPosts: 263
    And I remember when F2P was controversial, lol
  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 31,937
    Originally posted by someforumguy

    The obvious greedy part is the bit where they cash in on something that according to their own words and vision, breaks the lore for their own game. Free faction choice. And then put that behind a paid gate only to be purchased before any real review of the game has hit the media.

    The issue is not breaking the lore of their own game. This is the problem of some people because they want info and the game companies try to accommodate but they really need the ability to change as they see the need.

    They should have the right to change their game any way they want prior to release. Period. Well, they should have the right to change the game and be up front at the time they take money. They can't take money and "then" change because that becomes false advertising. Which they didn't do in this case.

    quite frankly I think game companies should just keep quiet until they have their game set in stone. less complaining and crying.

    The "issue" really is that they then allow certain perks dependent upon different pay schemes that seem to fly in the face of what a sub game is supposed to offer. That at least I can understand and understand why some players are pissed.

     

     

     

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  • TheCrow2kTheCrow2k Member Posts: 953
    Of course its greedy. An offering like a special more powerful is the sort of thing you find in the cash shops of 2bit pay to win F2P games. Worse still is that TESO requires box + sub & you still won't have access to everything unless you pay extra for the box, its pure greed.

    I bet the moment TESO converts to F2P (& it inevitably will) they will probably sell an imperial race unlock & a faction unlock from day one.
  • RusqueRusque Member RarePosts: 2,785
    Originally posted by TheCrow2k
    Of course its greedy. An offering like a special more powerful is the sort of thing you find in the cash shops of 2bit pay to win F2P games. Worse still is that TESO requires box + sub & you still won't have access to everything unless you pay extra for the box, its pure greed.

    I bet the moment TESO converts to F2P (& it inevitably will) they will probably sell an imperial race unlock & a faction unlock from day one.

    How is the Imperial Race more powerful?

    People have some weird misconceptions. It's just another humanoid race, it's not like Zenimax is giving them an iwin button.

  • EntinerintEntinerint Member UncommonPosts: 868
    Originally posted by Ghern
    Originally posted by Entinerint

    I pre-ordered the Imperial boxed edition.

    It is an AWESOME value actually, I had set aside $250 for the CE and I ended up with $150 left over, so that's pretty cool.

    ZOS have given the TES fans FIRST-PERSON COMBAT and REMOVED RACE LOCKS.

    They are finally doing it RIGHT, catering to the TES fan-base over all others.  Screw MMO nomads (2-3mil) and screw DAOC players (250k).  Their numbers don't even come close to TES fans (15mil+) and they wouldn't be loyal to a TES game anyway.  TES fanbase was the only hope this game ever had of having a large, stable community for more than a few months.

    GOOD JOB ZOS!

     

    You sound exactly like a lot of SWTOR fanboi's prior to that launch.

    I would temper that excitement a bit until we all actually see what that game is like. Many letdowns over the past several years.

    Oh, no, I'm fully aware this thing is going F2P after a year at the most, but as a massive self-admitted TES fanboi, it is gonna be HELLA fun in the mean time.

     

    Also...I've played 3 betas of ESO and am well aware of what I'm getting.

     
  • JJ82JJ82 Member UncommonPosts: 1,258
    Originally posted by Kuinn
    Originally posted by JJ82

    1. WoW is an abomination. Congrats?

    2. Warhammer was also made by another DaoC designer who built War around DaoC style gameplay. Sound familiar at all?

    3. And I HATE YOU FOR DOING THIS, making it sound like I am defending SWTOR in any way, Making up lore where there is a gap, a little of it at that, is not CHANGING LORE. There was actually nothing in the timeframe of SWTOR lore wise and what they added did not conflict with lore after that timeframe.

    So, 1 point of yours is wrong, and the other two points prove that TESO doing it is a BAD IDEA since the are following in Warhammers footsteps in far too many ways, as well as the thing that caused MMOs to become stagnant, WoW. Thanks for the help in proving me right. 

    3. They pulled completely out of ass lore with Star Wars skin on it for gameplay purposes, but I guess it's that much different just so you can bash TESO. 

    So, you have a mission, congrats?

    Look at my post history, I cant STAND SWTOR.

    Now tell me some of the things they changed with lore to make SWTOR.

    And yes, my mission is to point out the lies, flaws and all around crappiness of any game I see attempting to lie to hide it, by misleading players or abusing IPs. Hell I loved SWG but I can say a lot that was bad about it, the entire Jedi idea was a massive mistake just as an example because the game was during a time when there were only a few Jedi that escaped the slaughter and most of them gave up their Jedi ways.

    And as I pointed out, WoW was an abomination and War was made into the mess it was thanks to Former DaoC designers trying to recapture what they thought was glory, and now history is repeating itself with TESO.

    You just don't like the fact that not everyone kisses up to developers every idiotic idea.

    "People who tell you you’re awesome are useless. No, dangerous.

    They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
    http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/

  • JJ82JJ82 Member UncommonPosts: 1,258
    Originally posted by Kuinn
    Originally posted by JJ82
    Originally posted by Kuinn
    Originally posted by someforumguy

    This. The free faction choice for a price makes their lore for this particilar game a joke. Just so they can sell a few extra pre orders?

    Not to mention that this is day 1 DLC for a SUBBASED game. That is one step beyond day 1 DLC for a boxpriced game.  

    You do realize that all sub games add extra races in expansion packs that cost money ON TOP OF the sub?

    So Expansions are now the same as pre-orders. As I have pointed out before, people will excuse anything no matter what with the craziest excuses imaginable.

    Wut? I dont even know how you managed to mix pre-orders to expansions with what I said. Ease on the hate a bit so you dont see things that are not there pal.

    Right, you replied to someone pointing out that the CE is allowing faction choice as a pre-order with "sub games add extra races"  and after being pointed out that you are flat out wrong in your comparison you want to pretend you didn't do it. The quotes are right there^

    Extra races in expansions have nothing to do with an extra race in a pre-order. One is an exclusive, the other comes with every purchase because its what the game is based off of, the expansion race, area and quests. Not even apples to oranges, more like apples to pizza.

    "People who tell you you’re awesome are useless. No, dangerous.

    They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
    http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/

  • CazNeergCazNeerg Member Posts: 2,198
    Originally posted by Sovrath

    quite frankly I think game companies should just keep quiet until they have their game set in stone. less complaining and crying.

    Couldn't agree more.

    Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
    Through passion, I gain strength.
    Through strength, I gain power.
    Through power, I gain victory.
    Through victory, my chains are broken.
    The Force shall free me.

  • LunarpacLunarpac Member UncommonPosts: 57
    What's with the whole "WoW does it, so it's okay then"-attitude?
  • DAS1337DAS1337 Member UncommonPosts: 2,610

    I can only assume that with the massive amount of reply's that this article has received, you are getting a ton of hate.  You deserve it too.

     

    I should have stopped reading when you miss-used the word 'their'.  You shouldn't be a writer if you can't use there, they're and their correctly, hands down.  

     

    I did stop reading however, when you outright lied about the Imperial race being just a vanity race.  You are flat out wrong.  You are lying.  Why?  Because the race has a UNIQUE SKILL LINE attached to it.  Note the word, unique.  Note that the race in question is a STAPLE to all TES games and it is being used as 'PRE-LAUNCH DLC'.  This isn't a pet that doesn't attack.  It's not some experience gaining item.  It's not a horse with just a skin.  It's a race that has unique skills attached to it, and you are paying for it.

     

    I don't care if you like it or not.  But trying to pass yourself off as a writer by not knowing the English language and lying to everyone is nearly as unacceptable as the topic of your damn article.

     

    I can only assume that rest of the article would have infuriated me even more.  I'm glad I stopped reading, and I'm making a note to ignore any other article that you write.  For my own sanity at least.

  • Skeeter50Skeeter50 Member UncommonPosts: 147
    Originally posted by DAS1337

    I can only assume that with the massive amount of reply's that this article has received, you are getting a ton of hate.  You deserve it too.

     

    I should have stopped reading when you miss-used the word 'their'.  You shouldn't be a writer if you can't use there, they're and their correctly, hands down.  

     

    I did stop reading however, when you outright lied about the Imperial race being just a vanity race.  You are flat out wrong.  You are lying.  Why?  Because the race has a UNIQUE SKILL LINE attached to it.  Note the word, unique.  Note that the race in question is a STAPLE to all TES games and it is being used as 'PRE-LAUNCH DLC'.  This isn't a pet that doesn't attack.  It's not some experience gaining item.  It's not a horse with just a skin.  It's a race that has unique skills attached to it, and you are paying for it.

     

    I don't care if you like it or not.  But trying to pass yourself off as a writer by not knowing the English language and lying to everyone is nearly as unacceptable as the topic of your damn article.

     

    I can only assume that rest of the article would have infuriated me even more.  I'm glad I stopped reading, and I'm making a note to ignore any other article that you write.  For my own sanity at least.

    Races have a passive skill line and I hear may or may not have a ultimate.

    Are you mad cause the Imperial is OP?(I have yet to see the passives of the Imperial)

    Are you mad cause  you have a choice to make?

    Do you hate choice in character building?

    Are you banned from buying the CE?

     

  • StarIStarI Member UncommonPosts: 987

    I read a forum thread about it at first and got slightly mad too. Than I went over on their site and read the description and said "hey this is not that bad. I don't care that much about imperials, there's planty of other choices and a part of people will level quicker than me anyway, exp bonus or not." So I bought a standard edition as I wouldn't mind starting 5 days earlier. It's TES, good or bad, I like IP enaugh to give it a go and even if I get only a month of fun out of it so be it, I've spent more for less fun. Besides a couple of friends of mine gave me good vibes after playing beta.

     

    And I skipped BF4 and DayZ SA so I had some spare money anyway ...

  • jbombardjbombard Member UncommonPosts: 598
    Well the last thing I want to do is pay a subscription and then have to pay for microtransactions on top of it.  Especially for something as major as a race.  Bah bye ESO.  Just because WoW gets away with it doesn't mean anyone else can.  Look at SWTOR they thought they could sit on their asses taking their sweet time to get out new content(like WoW used to do) and that bit them in the ass so hard they had to turn F2P.   The rules aren't the same, WoW is an exception.  WoW could hit players in the head with a brick every time they log in and their fans would love it and call it the most innovative feature yet.  When you have a large base of addicts to buy your product you can get away with a lot more.
  • WolfsheadWolfshead Member UncommonPosts: 224
    Originally posted by Wicoa

    I don't have a problem with pets and mounts (cosmetic stuff) being sold in the shop. However a playable race thats only available to collectors editions just doesn't sit right with me. I was someone on the fence thinking about trying the game but Im going to pit the market against itself and see what Wildstar/SOE ALL PASS/WOD has to offer.

     

    I think ESO is outrageously overpriced but thats okay I dont have to buy it.  If in one or two years time it is pitched at a better price (considering the subscription) I might have a go.  Until then, plenty more fish in the sea.  I fell for it once with swtor, never again.

     

    IMHO they have priced themselves out of the market, there is no point in buying unless your a hardcore Scrolls fan.  NDA still in place and not many have seen the end game they have.

     

    Sorry what is that make game overprice honest????

     

    If i go to Elder scroll online homepage and order collector's edition is will cost me €75,30 and if buy on my country biggest game web sit it will cost me €139,51 and i wont get 5 early access & explorer's pack + monthly fee will cost me €11,74 in subscribe fee each month andl WoW cost me €12.99 in subscribe fee each month.

     

    So yeah you can play race thats only available to collectors editions is this the only reason then you serious need to get over yourself and when come Wildstar we dont even know release date on it yet and WoD well it wont come until end of this year as early but with blizzard a 3rd cash shop button and sell free lvl 90 char boost soon in cash shop i dont see why anyone in there right mind will 1st pay €12.99 in subscribe fee each month and then extra to get lvl 90 char boost but i guess if you like to Pay to Skip game content go a head to play WoW where you dont need work get epic blizzard gave away epic like candy so yeah if you only problem is prize on a collectors editions and you use special race for you pay extra money then you more problem then most people have.

     

    Beside no one is hold a gun to head and force you to pay €75,30 collectors editions you can always buy normal version of game too.

     

     
  • DihoruDihoru Member Posts: 2,731
    Gonna love the look on people's faces when, within a year, maybe a year and a half, they announce the game is going F2P or shutting down.

    image
  • Skeeter50Skeeter50 Member UncommonPosts: 147
    Originally posted by Dihoru
    Gonna love the look on people's faces when, within a year, maybe a year and a half, they announce the game is going F2P or shutting down.

    You love to see failing AAA games?

    You should be banned from the community for that statement. Go buy a console and play some shitty $60 solo game with 2 days of content.

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