Originally posted by rochrist I actually think an awful lot of people would be pretty ecstatic with a modern DAoC remake. Just sayin
250,000 people. Tops. Not enough to sustain a AAA MMO of this size. I should be one of them, but I'm not. Couldn't care less about Camelot Unchained, (which is exactly that). That kind of gameplay was fun a decade ago when it was new but now it is YAAAAAAAAWN. I need something deeper, richer and more innovative. Whether ESO will provide that, we shall see.
I'm sorry, I'm not even usually the type of person to make comments like this, but this article comes off as a desperate attempt to make as many excuses as possible to justify the need to pay for a feature that will not be available if you do not pay for it before preorders are no longer an option.
If it was just a little feature it wouldn't matter, but in a universe like the Elder Scrolls, giving the feature for "characters to join any alliance, no matter which race you choose" as a preorder bonus is a complete and utter cash grab, and is totally unfair to those people who don't have the money to pay for the preorder right now but plan on buying and subscribing to the game down the road.
I really don't see how you can argue that that is an okay bonus to add to preorder. It just isn't.
I agree with you.
It's disingenuous on the part of Zenimax because it nullifies what they said before about faction locks being necessary.
And I do have the money to buy the pre-order if I want to. I just don't like it and this really has impacted how I feel about this game.
This seems to me that they are not confident about their subscription plan working and that they are indeed going for the box sales and whatever extra they can get at the beginning through pre-order "offers" like the one in question here. This paid for pass on faction locking is just the sort of thing that would be likely to appear in a cash shop down the road if they go f2p.
This pre-order deal is disingenuous and therefore shows a lack of integrity with regard to the original rationale for why this game is going to be sub-based.
It makes me believe that if Zenimax announced tomorrow that they are removing all PvP from the game and are replacing Daedra with Rainbow ponies you guys would do everything in your power to make it sound like it makes sense and is perfect for TES lore, and a TES MMO.
Wouldn't be as bad, since when did a PvE game become PvP, again?
And point is proven 10 fold.
Not only are you attempting to say that this game is not built around PvP but you also ignored the Daedra to ponies point in order to try to make it sound good.
It seems to me you are running out of real and made up points to rage about. I have noticed you in a number of threads. You are really hopping to bury this game. Well, somebody has to be a mortician.
And the point is proven again. Cant make it look good, so attack the person instead.
You see, this is why I do not pay much attention to your numerous posts. You make statements, which are partially bogus and partially wrong. You make up things and make it look like it is a well known fact. You use "And the point is proven again" without actually proving any point. I do understand, you like to make it look good no matter what. Nothing wrong with that. You are also entitled to your opinion and means to popularize it.
And you are mistaken, I did not attack you (not yet). It was only innocent statement of what I have noticed, and innocent comment.
It is an AWESOME value actually, I had set aside $250 for the CE and I ended up with $150 left over, so that's pretty cool.
ZOS have given the TES fans FIRST-PERSON COMBAT and REMOVED RACE LOCKS.
They are finally doing it RIGHT, catering to the TES fan-base over all others. Screw MMO nomads (2-3mil) and screw DAOC players (250k). Their numbers don't even come close to TES fans (15mil+) and they wouldn't be loyal to a TES game anyway. TES fanbase was the only hope this game ever had of having a large, stable community for more than a few months.
It is an AWESOME value actually, I had set aside $250 for the CE and I ended up with $150 left over, so that's pretty cool.
ZOS have given the TES fans FIRST-PERSON COMBAT and REMOVED RACE LOCKS.
They are finally doing it RIGHT, catering to the TES fan-base over all others. Screw MMO nomads (2-3mil) and screw DAOC players (250k). Their numbers don't even come close to TES fans (15mil+) and they wouldn't be loyal to a TES game anyway. TES fanbase was the only hope this game ever had of having a large, stable community for more than a few months.
Could buy access to both EQ:N Landmark alpha and Rust with the same amount of money.. They set the price so high, that its either commit or avoid. No trying, no middle ground. A commited community could actully be a big possitive though. The tourists are a big problem to most modern mmos.
EDIT: And as for my two cents to the "locked-faction".. Shame on them. Asking as much as they do for this game, they should show more respect.
Could buy access to both EQ:N Landmark alpha and Rust with the same amount of money.. They set the price so high, that its either commit or avoid. No trying, no middle ground. A commited community could actully be a big possitive though. The tourists are a big problem to most modern mmos.
EDIT: And as for my two cents to the "locked-faction".. Shame on them. Asking as much as they do for this game, they should show more respect.
I would guess that a large chunk of the MMORPG crowd is going to give this one a pass and most of the Elder Scrolls crowd is going to grow tired of a sub when they realize the replayability is weak and you can't mod the game. They will probably ditch the sub and go hardcore cash shop by the time they release for consoles.
It is an AWESOME value actually, I had set aside $250 for the CE and I ended up with $150 left over, so that's pretty cool.
ZOS have given the TES fans FIRST-PERSON COMBAT and REMOVED RACE LOCKS.
They are finally doing it RIGHT, catering to the TES fan-base over all others. Screw MMO nomads (2-3mil) and screw DAOC players (250k). Their numbers don't even come close to TES fans (15mil+) and they wouldn't be loyal to a TES game anyway. TES fanbase was the only hope this game ever had of having a large, stable community for more than a few months.
GOOD JOB ZOS!
You sound exactly like a lot of SWTOR fanboi's prior to that launch.
I would temper that excitement a bit until we all actually see what that game is like. Many letdowns over the past several years.
" If anything they have provided a laurel leaf to the Elder Scrolls players that were upset about faction locks. Does this seem counter intuitive to the stance they took on faction locks originally? A little"
No. What it did was prove that everything they said about why they used the base game design was a complete and total lie.
Most TES fans that got upset about the game was WHY ISNT IT OPEN WORLD like TES games? We were told they HAD TO make it this way for realm pride and because MMOs require sacrifices.
It was all BS, like most people said and they PROVED it. Its not a laurel, its a carrot on a stick to lead us away from the real issue, a poor game design that was just shown to be worthless made by people with no intention of making a TES game, just a DaoC remake.
Or, maybe, they just realized that them HAVING TO lock the races was actually idiotic and they decided last minute they'd rather ESO be an Elder Scrolls MMO and not DAOC 2 TES edition? They didn't lie, they changed their stance after huge amounts of people complained. They did it with first-person combat, too. It's like their MO, these days. if enough people cry out "THIS SUCKS CUZ ITS NOT LIKE ELDER SCROLLS" they will do something about it. Likely not the thing you expect, but SOMETHING.
hahahaha.......
So why wasn't it removed from the entire game? If they have the ability to unlock it for a pre-order it can as easily be done for the entire game.
Its just in hopes to sucker a few more into buying, not realizing they may have pushed as many, if not more diehard DaoC players away in the process. When you lie and deceive as much as they have while trying to be TES for TES fans and DaoC for DaoC fans they cant help but get caught in a web.
Firor was in over his head from the start, the biggest IP given over to someone with no experience creating a massive MMO on his own, and he hasn't even learned any new tricks after all this time.
"People who tell you youre awesome are useless. No, dangerous.
They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/
" If anything they have provided a laurel leaf to the Elder Scrolls players that were upset about faction locks. Does this seem counter intuitive to the stance they took on faction locks originally? A little"
No. What it did was prove that everything they said about why they used the base game design was a complete and total lie.
Most TES fans that got upset about the game was WHY ISNT IT OPEN WORLD like TES games? We were told they HAD TO make it this way for realm pride and because MMOs require sacrifices.
It was all BS, like most people said and they PROVED it. Its not a laurel, its a carrot on a stick to lead us away from the real issue, a poor game design that was just shown to be worthless made by people with no intention of making a TES game, just a DaoC remake.
This. The free faction choice for a price makes their lore for this particilar game a joke. Just so they can sell a few extra pre orders?
Not to mention that this is day 1 DLC for a SUBBASED game. That is one step beyond day 1 DLC for a boxpriced game.
In terms of value 20$ for a race isn't a huge deal.....
The issue is the precedent it sets. By buying TESO your saying that it's OK to add premium content to a sub based game.....On launch day of all ludicrous things.
Vanity items are one thing. I STILL think it's garbage, but that battle has already been lost. But seriously AN ENTIRE RACE!. With passives and an ultimate that you can BUY and can not and will never be able to earn in game.
Where does the line get drawn?
In 5 years will we be looking at.....
Preorders can access every skill tree regardless of race or class?
Preorders get a 10% faster mount.
A Special quest arc and zone for CE buyers?
This isn't about TESO. It's about the MMO industry and acceptable behavior.
And buy Buying TESO your not only telling Zenimax that it's OK. your telling every company who will ever make an MMO that it's OK.
We as consumers have to put our foot down at some point. Or we will be DLCed and premium unlocked to death.
TOR had VIP area at the space station bar for CE buyers, that was really cool and I'd like to see more stuff like that, an actual VIP area instead of just a place where you can redeem your CE stuff. I dont want to see a full adventure zone or quests (big ones) tied to CE's though, it just feels like way too much dev time spent in fracturing the playerbase.
Maybe if there were less races to begin with I would see this imperial business as a bad thing, but there's 9 races already and the imperial is not officially part of any of the alliances so I dont see it as a huge deal tbh. It's a showoff race that does not belong into the alliances to begin with, feels more like a last minute decision to include the imperials as playable race at all and someone had the idea of making it a CE bonus.
It is very interesting to see this controversy develop here on mmorpg.com. I am unsure if this is becoming (or ever will become) a widespread pr nightmare; however, i believe there are some key points to be discussed here.
1) Imperials were originally thought to be kept out of the game because they did not fit into the 3 Faction model this game is designed around. Becoming available seemingly out of nowhere is a bit of a shocker and of course they are behind an additional payment. I wonder how long this race was in development, and if their implementation was simply an attempt to extract cash from players/fans wanting to play such a race or did their creation stem from the developers' own desires?
2) While the Imperial Race has received the most discussion, I do not believe it to be the most significant point. I am surprised more people are not centering their focus around being able to play any race on any faction. It is amusing to see a single pre-order bonus blatantly undermine a game's design so easily. One cannot deny that ESO was designed, at its core, with the 3 Locked Faction philosophy in mind, and as such many of the systems built in the game revolved around this concept. Such a pre-order bonus ruins the weight of that design and renders the purpose of many features in the game pointless.
3) With the pre-order bonus of being able to play any race on any faction in mind, one must ponder what was the purpose of designing the game with faction limitations in mind? Why design ESO in the way that they have if they were willing to implement such a bonus? For me, this is a red flag as it shows the developers either have little control over their product so any design in this game could be undermined if additional monies is involved, or that they have little faith in their original vision for the game.
I will enjoy reading the conversation this pre-order controversy stirs up. From my perspective, the pre-order bonus of being able to play any face on any faction is a dangerous way to undermine your core design philosophies for a few more funds.
+1
I'm fine with the imperial issue, it's not that important
The any race any faction move is the one that really turned me down
MMORPG.com staff is becoming a little too apologetic for my taste with reasoning like this :
All kidding aside, a lot of players are upset that pre-ordering the game allows you to play as any race on any faction. This is a buyer beware society and players should be allowed to make discretionary purchases wisely. I get that. ZeniMax also has the right to run their business how they see fit. They have a break even number that they need to achieve and they are trying to increase day one sales to get to that objective. I don’t find this greedy.
No one disputes that gaming companies, which are commercial companies ofc, try to make as much profit. Or that this is particular greedy. They create a new product to their best of abilities and try to sell it as much as possible. This is normal.
The obvious greedy part is the bit where they cash in on something that according to their own words and vision, breaks the lore for their own game. Free faction choice. And then put that behind a paid gate only to be purchased before any real review of the game has hit the media.
It can't be more obvious then this. It is obviously done like this to push more preorders over the counter. It is smart, because they know that most players will be faction locked so they can still say that the lore works.
Anyway, you guys (MMORPG.com staff) have grown soft. Nowadays you seem to only dare to critisize easy targets. Like your readers (with 'jokes') and games that put too many uncovered skin in a game from a company that no one cares about in the US.
This. The free faction choice for a price makes their lore for this particilar game a joke.
If you honestly think that, you haven't paid much attention to Elder Scrolls lore.
Peace is a lie, there is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken. The Force shall free me.
This. The free faction choice for a price makes their lore for this particilar game a joke.
If you honestly think that, you haven't paid much attention to Elder Scrolls lore.
Would this be the same lore that states that there were no emperors after the fall of the second empire until Septim took over? Or the same lore that states the empires lands were only attacked directly once and it was stopped at Marrowind?
Doh!
"People who tell you youre awesome are useless. No, dangerous.
They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/
" If anything they have provided a laurel leaf to the Elder Scrolls players that were upset about faction locks. Does this seem counter intuitive to the stance they took on faction locks originally? A little"
No. What it did was prove that everything they said about why they used the base game design was a complete and total lie.
Most TES fans that got upset about the game was WHY ISNT IT OPEN WORLD like TES games? We were told they HAD TO make it this way for realm pride and because MMOs require sacrifices.
It was all BS, like most people said and they PROVED it. Its not a laurel, its a carrot on a stick to lead us away from the real issue, a poor game design that was just shown to be worthless made by people with no intention of making a TES game, just a DaoC remake.
This. The free faction choice for a price makes their lore for this particilar game a joke. Just so they can sell a few extra pre orders?
Not to mention that this is day 1 DLC for a SUBBASED game. That is one step beyond day 1 DLC for a boxpriced game.
You do realize that all sub games add extra races in expansion packs that cost money ON TOP OF the sub? So having this imperial race as a CE bonus really does not feel like such a big deal at all, 1 race besides the rest of the 9, one race that does not even belong in any of the alliances and all this "day one DLC" bullshit does not prevent ANY content from ANY player besides the skin they choose to wear.
The more I think about it the more whiny bitches these "day one DLC" beggars feel like. Dont have extra 20? Choose a different skin or go play F2P games.
This. The free faction choice for a price makes their lore for this particilar game a joke.
If you honestly think that, you haven't paid much attention to Elder Scrolls lore.
Thats why i wrote 'for this particular game' . You know where they divided all races into 3 factions. I never said that this was a good idea. Just that Zenimax is contradicting themselves (with as reason more $$).
MMORPG.com staff is becoming a little too apologetic for my taste with reasoning like this :
All kidding aside, a lot of players are upset that pre-ordering the game allows you to play as any race on any faction. This is a buyer beware society and players should be allowed to make discretionary purchases wisely. I get that. ZeniMax also has the right to run their business how they see fit. They have a break even number that they need to achieve and they are trying to increase day one sales to get to that objective. I don’t find this greedy.
No one disputes that gaming companies, which are commercial companies ofc, try to make as much profit. Or that this is particular greedy. They create a new product to their best of abilities and try to sell it as much as possible. This is normal.
The obvious greedy part is the bit where they cash in on something that according to their own words and vision, breaks the lore for their own game. Free faction choice. And then put that behind a paid gate only to be purchased before any real review of the game has hit the media.
It can't be more obvious then this. It is obviously done like this to push more preorders over the counter. It is smart, because they know that most players will be faction locked so they can still say that the lore works.
Anyway, you guys (MMORPG.com staff) have grown soft. Nowadays you seem to only dare to critisize easy targets. Like your readers (with 'jokes') and games that put too many uncovered skin in a game from a company that no one cares about in the US.
I agree. There is a difference between journalism and veiled advertisement. However, it's pretty difficult to find real journalism anywhere in modern times, so maybe I'm asking too much.
" If anything they have provided a laurel leaf to the Elder Scrolls players that were upset about faction locks. Does this seem counter intuitive to the stance they took on faction locks originally? A little"
No. What it did was prove that everything they said about why they used the base game design was a complete and total lie.
Most TES fans that got upset about the game was WHY ISNT IT OPEN WORLD like TES games? We were told they HAD TO make it this way for realm pride and because MMOs require sacrifices.
It was all BS, like most people said and they PROVED it. Its not a laurel, its a carrot on a stick to lead us away from the real issue, a poor game design that was just shown to be worthless made by people with no intention of making a TES game, just a DaoC remake.
This. The free faction choice for a price makes their lore for this particilar game a joke. Just so they can sell a few extra pre orders?
Not to mention that this is day 1 DLC for a SUBBASED game. That is one step beyond day 1 DLC for a boxpriced game.
You do realize that all sub games add extra races in expansion packs that cost money ON TOP OF the sub? So having this imperial race as a CE bonus really does not feel like such a big deal at all, 1 race besides the rest of the 9, one race that does not even belong in any of the alliances and all this "day one DLC" bullshit does not prevent ANY content from ANY player besides the skin they choose to wear.
The more I think about it the more whiny bitches these "day one DLC" beggars feel like. Dont have extra 20? Choose a different skin or go play F2P games.
Are you sure you quoted the right person. Because in there I didnt mention the imperial race, just the free faction choice (for whatever race you pick).
And be careful with namecalling. I don't report easily, but I have my limits.
This. The free faction choice for a price makes their lore for this particilar game a joke.
If you honestly think that, you haven't paid much attention to Elder Scrolls lore.
Would this be the same lore that states that there were no emperors after the fall of the second empire until Septim took over? Or the same lore that states the empires lands were only attacked directly once and it was stopped at Marrowind?
Doh!
Please. There are no real Emperors in ESO. There is just the ability for whoever is the bloodiest killer in the currently ascendant faction to call himself Emperor until somebody else takes more scalps. It's just tin-pot wannabe dictators with delusions of grandeur.
Originally posted by someforumguy
Originally posted by CazNeerg
Originally posted by someforumguy
This. The free faction choice for a price makes their lore for this particilar game a joke.
If you honestly think that, you haven't paid much attention to Elder Scrolls lore.
Thats why i wrote 'for this particular game' . You know where they divided all races into 3 factions. I never said that this was a good idea. Just that Zenimax is contradicting themselves (with as reason more $$).
They may be contradicting their prior marketing statements, but that isn't the same thing as contradicting lore.
Peace is a lie, there is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken. The Force shall free me.
This. The free faction choice for a price makes their lore for this particilar game a joke.
If you honestly think that, you haven't paid much attention to Elder Scrolls lore.
Would this be the same lore that states that there were no emperors after the fall of the second empire until Septim took over? Or the same lore that states the empires lands were only attacked directly once and it was stopped at Marrowind?
Doh!
Name one themepark with big IP that has not twisted their own original lore to hell and back for gameplay and content purposes. Warcraft lore got butchered and even retconned by WoW, Warhammer lore got flushed down the toilet with WAR, TOR made up some silly gamey lore for gameplay purposes. It's just something that is going to happen with themeparks, no need to try and use it as a weapon against some particular game.
I have no issue with what ZeniMax sells or offers, they are well with in there right to change their policy and/or payment model at any time. However I believe that this pre-order goes against the spirit of there initial statement of why they decided to use a P2P model. There is NO controversy, but an acknowledgement that MMO players are willing to pay for content (cosmetic or otherwise) that they enjoy. This is a hobby not an expression of plutocracy. It is your right as a consumer to either buy or not buy the game and vote so to speak with your wallet.
This. The free faction choice for a price makes their lore for this particilar game a joke.
If you honestly think that, you haven't paid much attention to Elder Scrolls lore.
Thats why i wrote 'for this particular game' . You know where they divided all races into 3 factions. I never said that this was a good idea. Just that Zenimax is contradicting themselves (with as reason more $$).
They may be contradicting their prior marketing statements, but that isn't the same thing as contradicting lore.
You're absolutely fine with them contradicting their own statements?
So, it's also fine if they were to contradict something else in the future?
" If anything they have provided a laurel leaf to the Elder Scrolls players that were upset about faction locks. Does this seem counter intuitive to the stance they took on faction locks originally? A little"
No. What it did was prove that everything they said about why they used the base game design was a complete and total lie.
Most TES fans that got upset about the game was WHY ISNT IT OPEN WORLD like TES games? We were told they HAD TO make it this way for realm pride and because MMOs require sacrifices.
It was all BS, like most people said and they PROVED it. Its not a laurel, its a carrot on a stick to lead us away from the real issue, a poor game design that was just shown to be worthless made by people with no intention of making a TES game, just a DaoC remake.
This. The free faction choice for a price makes their lore for this particilar game a joke. Just so they can sell a few extra pre orders?
Not to mention that this is day 1 DLC for a SUBBASED game. That is one step beyond day 1 DLC for a boxpriced game.
You do realize that all sub games add extra races in expansion packs that cost money ON TOP OF the sub? So having this imperial race as a CE bonus really does not feel like such a big deal at all, 1 race besides the rest of the 9, one race that does not even belong in any of the alliances and all this "day one DLC" bullshit does not prevent ANY content from ANY player besides the skin they choose to wear.
The more I think about it the more whiny bitches these "day one DLC" beggars feel like. Dont have extra 20? Choose a different skin or go play F2P games.
Are you sure you quoted the right person. Because in there I didnt mention the imperial race, just the free faction choice (for whatever race you pick).
And be careful with namecalling. I don't report easily, but I have my limits.
The free faction choise cannot be a DLC since it does not cost anything, just preorder the game, cancel if you dont feel like playing after the NDA gets lifted.
If I get tempbanned because I speak what I think and how I feel about this, then I welcome the ban with open arms. I have limits too, and I've just about had it with the loud whining and raging over issues that barely can even be argued to exist.
Day one DLC my ass. Free pre-order feature, and CE skin.
Comments
250,000 people. Tops. Not enough to sustain a AAA MMO of this size. I should be one of them, but I'm not. Couldn't care less about Camelot Unchained, (which is exactly that). That kind of gameplay was fun a decade ago when it was new but now it is YAAAAAAAAWN. I need something deeper, richer and more innovative. Whether ESO will provide that, we shall see.
I agree with you.
It's disingenuous on the part of Zenimax because it nullifies what they said before about faction locks being necessary.
And I do have the money to buy the pre-order if I want to. I just don't like it and this really has impacted how I feel about this game.
This seems to me that they are not confident about their subscription plan working and that they are indeed going for the box sales and whatever extra they can get at the beginning through pre-order "offers" like the one in question here. This paid for pass on faction locking is just the sort of thing that would be likely to appear in a cash shop down the road if they go f2p.
This pre-order deal is disingenuous and therefore shows a lack of integrity with regard to the original rationale for why this game is going to be sub-based.
You see, this is why I do not pay much attention to your numerous posts. You make statements, which are partially bogus and partially wrong. You make up things and make it look like it is a well known fact. You use "And the point is proven again" without actually proving any point. I do understand, you like to make it look good no matter what. Nothing wrong with that. You are also entitled to your opinion and means to popularize it.
And you are mistaken, I did not attack you (not yet). It was only innocent statement of what I have noticed, and innocent comment.
I pre-ordered the Imperial boxed edition.
It is an AWESOME value actually, I had set aside $250 for the CE and I ended up with $150 left over, so that's pretty cool.
ZOS have given the TES fans FIRST-PERSON COMBAT and REMOVED RACE LOCKS.
They are finally doing it RIGHT, catering to the TES fan-base over all others. Screw MMO nomads (2-3mil) and screw DAOC players (250k). Their numbers don't even come close to TES fans (15mil+) and they wouldn't be loyal to a TES game anyway. TES fanbase was the only hope this game ever had of having a large, stable community for more than a few months.
GOOD JOB ZOS!
I am completely with you on this.
Could buy access to both EQ:N Landmark alpha and Rust with the same amount of money.. They set the price so high, that its either commit or avoid. No trying, no middle ground. A commited community could actully be a big possitive though. The tourists are a big problem to most modern mmos.
I would guess that a large chunk of the MMORPG crowd is going to give this one a pass and most of the Elder Scrolls crowd is going to grow tired of a sub when they realize the replayability is weak and you can't mod the game. They will probably ditch the sub and go hardcore cash shop by the time they release for consoles.
You sound exactly like a lot of SWTOR fanboi's prior to that launch.
I would temper that excitement a bit until we all actually see what that game is like. Many letdowns over the past several years.
hahahaha.......
So why wasn't it removed from the entire game? If they have the ability to unlock it for a pre-order it can as easily be done for the entire game.
Its just in hopes to sucker a few more into buying, not realizing they may have pushed as many, if not more diehard DaoC players away in the process. When you lie and deceive as much as they have while trying to be TES for TES fans and DaoC for DaoC fans they cant help but get caught in a web.
Firor was in over his head from the start, the biggest IP given over to someone with no experience creating a massive MMO on his own, and he hasn't even learned any new tricks after all this time.
"People who tell you youre awesome are useless. No, dangerous.
They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/
This. The free faction choice for a price makes their lore for this particilar game a joke. Just so they can sell a few extra pre orders?
Not to mention that this is day 1 DLC for a SUBBASED game. That is one step beyond day 1 DLC for a boxpriced game.
TOR had VIP area at the space station bar for CE buyers, that was really cool and I'd like to see more stuff like that, an actual VIP area instead of just a place where you can redeem your CE stuff. I dont want to see a full adventure zone or quests (big ones) tied to CE's though, it just feels like way too much dev time spent in fracturing the playerbase.
Maybe if there were less races to begin with I would see this imperial business as a bad thing, but there's 9 races already and the imperial is not officially part of any of the alliances so I dont see it as a huge deal tbh. It's a showoff race that does not belong into the alliances to begin with, feels more like a last minute decision to include the imperials as playable race at all and someone had the idea of making it a CE bonus.
+1
I'm fine with the imperial issue, it's not that important
The any race any faction move is the one that really turned me down
MMORPG.com staff is becoming a little too apologetic for my taste with reasoning like this :
All kidding aside, a lot of players are upset that pre-ordering the game allows you to play as any race on any faction. This is a buyer beware society and players should be allowed to make discretionary purchases wisely. I get that. ZeniMax also has the right to run their business how they see fit. They have a break even number that they need to achieve and they are trying to increase day one sales to get to that objective. I don’t find this greedy.
No one disputes that gaming companies, which are commercial companies ofc, try to make as much profit. Or that this is particular greedy. They create a new product to their best of abilities and try to sell it as much as possible. This is normal.
The obvious greedy part is the bit where they cash in on something that according to their own words and vision, breaks the lore for their own game. Free faction choice. And then put that behind a paid gate only to be purchased before any real review of the game has hit the media.
It can't be more obvious then this. It is obviously done like this to push more preorders over the counter. It is smart, because they know that most players will be faction locked so they can still say that the lore works.
Anyway, you guys (MMORPG.com staff) have grown soft. Nowadays you seem to only dare to critisize easy targets. Like your readers (with 'jokes') and games that put too many uncovered skin in a game from a company that no one cares about in the US.
If you honestly think that, you haven't paid much attention to Elder Scrolls lore.
Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The Force shall free me.
Would this be the same lore that states that there were no emperors after the fall of the second empire until Septim took over? Or the same lore that states the empires lands were only attacked directly once and it was stopped at Marrowind?
Doh!
"People who tell you youre awesome are useless. No, dangerous.
They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/
You do realize that all sub games add extra races in expansion packs that cost money ON TOP OF the sub? So having this imperial race as a CE bonus really does not feel like such a big deal at all, 1 race besides the rest of the 9, one race that does not even belong in any of the alliances and all this "day one DLC" bullshit does not prevent ANY content from ANY player besides the skin they choose to wear.
The more I think about it the more whiny bitches these "day one DLC" beggars feel like. Dont have extra 20? Choose a different skin or go play F2P games.
Thats why i wrote 'for this particular game' . You know where they divided all races into 3 factions. I never said that this was a good idea. Just that Zenimax is contradicting themselves (with as reason more $$).
I agree. There is a difference between journalism and veiled advertisement. However, it's pretty difficult to find real journalism anywhere in modern times, so maybe I'm asking too much.
Are you sure you quoted the right person. Because in there I didnt mention the imperial race, just the free faction choice (for whatever race you pick).
And be careful with namecalling. I don't report easily, but I have my limits.
Please. There are no real Emperors in ESO. There is just the ability for whoever is the bloodiest killer in the currently ascendant faction to call himself Emperor until somebody else takes more scalps. It's just tin-pot wannabe dictators with delusions of grandeur.
They may be contradicting their prior marketing statements, but that isn't the same thing as contradicting lore.
Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The Force shall free me.
Name one themepark with big IP that has not twisted their own original lore to hell and back for gameplay and content purposes. Warcraft lore got butchered and even retconned by WoW, Warhammer lore got flushed down the toilet with WAR, TOR made up some silly gamey lore for gameplay purposes. It's just something that is going to happen with themeparks, no need to try and use it as a weapon against some particular game.
I have no issue with what ZeniMax sells or offers, they are well with in there right to change their policy and/or payment model at any time. However I believe that this pre-order goes against the spirit of there initial statement of why they decided to use a P2P model. There is NO controversy, but an acknowledgement that MMO players are willing to pay for content (cosmetic or otherwise) that they enjoy. This is a hobby not an expression of plutocracy. It is your right as a consumer to either buy or not buy the game and vote so to speak with your wallet.
Besides it is only a game, life does go on.
Cheers
Rev.
You're absolutely fine with them contradicting their own statements?
So, it's also fine if they were to contradict something else in the future?
The free faction choise cannot be a DLC since it does not cost anything, just preorder the game, cancel if you dont feel like playing after the NDA gets lifted.
If I get tempbanned because I speak what I think and how I feel about this, then I welcome the ban with open arms. I have limits too, and I've just about had it with the loud whining and raging over issues that barely can even be argued to exist.
Day one DLC my ass. Free pre-order feature, and CE skin.