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What is SWToR Doing Right?

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  • muffins89muffins89 Yakima, WAPosts: 1,306Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by lizardbones
    Originally posted by Fermian

    - Group quests

    - Companions

    - Combat

    - chests

     

    Chests?

     

    just because you don't like the game.  doesn't mean other people don't.

    I think the prostitute mod corrupted your game files man. -elhefen

  • simsalabim77simsalabim77 Somewhere, CAPosts: 627Member Uncommon
    I play it because it's Star Wars, and the PVP is quite fun IMO. It's a fine themepark MMO. 
  • aRtFuLThinGaRtFuLThinG MelbournePosts: 1,134Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by CazNeerg
    Originally posted by stragen001
    Originally posted by orionblack
    Originally posted by jesteralways

    3 things make people come  and play the game : 

    1. the name Star Wars

    2. Star Wars

    3. star wars

    This ^...because if it was not a Star Wars game, it would have been shut down a long time ago.

    Yes, this

    If this logic was accurate, SWG would still be running.  BioWare is at least as important a part of the equation as Star Wars, if not more important.

    They WERE still running fine when they were shut down.

     

    They were shutdown because their SW license got revoked to make way for SWTOR.

     

    SWG STILL has fans making and running emulators and that population is NOT small (definitely more than the number of people that play Mortals Online or Darkfall or any smaller and crappier mmos), and you are talking about graphics from 10 years ago.

     

    That alone should be enough to prove the power of the Star Wars brand.

  • heider89heider89 bergenPosts: 142Member Uncommon

    1: operations/flashpoints love raiding inn swtor

    2: class story

    3: pvp/huttball

    4: classes and combat  healing with commando is some of the most fun i had inn any mmo

    5: starwars!

    6: GSF  i love space pvp its a fun mini game if you can call it that

  • TorvalTorval Oregon CountryPosts: 7,221Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by CazNeerg

    Originally posted by Torvaldr

    Like post 2 says, the class stories. They're fun. It's a primary reason why I'm playing and did buy the sub time. I'm playing through the Consular and Smuggler storylines. If I keep subscribed to the game after those, it's likely only because I want to experience some other class lines. I could easily see doing a Knight and a Trooper after this. I'm not so interested in the Imperial side.

    You're missing out.  Given that the flavor of the given class stories varies substantially depending on whether you lean toward light choices or dark choices, you can judge every story on both it's dark version and light version.  As far as Light Side stories go, the Sith Warrior gets arguably the most heroic and compelling one in the entire game.

    And speaking strictly in terms of writing quality and freshness in the context of a Star Wars game, the Imperial Agent provides the best base narrative of any class in the game.  Bounty Hunter is the weakest on the Imperial side, by a fair margin.  It's still better than the narrative in pretty much all other released MMOs, but I would argue not good enough to justify repeating the shared Imperial content a fourth time just to get to it, unless repetition just doesn't bother you.

    Yeah, I know, but it's just how I feel now. Who knows down the line. Maybe I'll delve into the Empire and see some stories there. For the moment I'm still enthralled with the Republic in a way I never could as a kid watching the Rebel Alliance fight the Empire. I'd like to think we can write a different future. :p

    Originally posted by Fermian

    Originally posted by lizardbones
    Originally posted by Fermian

    - Group quests

    - Companions

    - Combat

    - chests

    Chests?

    :) ye there are a lot of loot boxes. Some of them are defended by elite mobs and drop good loot. Not easy to solo but fun to try.

    Not only that, but mobs occasionally drop really good loot that you can either use on yourself or companions or sell.
  • ZandilZandil templestowePosts: 234Member Uncommon

    hutball

    HUTBALL

    HUTBALL

    Love the PvP in SWTOR, it's fun you can be a tank and have a purpose in PvP and people understand objectives need to be reached not just kill on site all the time. 

    Oh and you get to kick people in the nutsack ( this alone is worth $15 buck a month to me )

    Did i mention you get your own SPACESHIP 

     

    image
  • Jerek_Jerek_ tulsa, OKPosts: 409Member
    Originally posted by lizardbones

    Ok, there are lots of discussions on what SWToR does wrong.  There is even a column and associated forum thread revisiting SWToR's F2P options explaining in pretty good detail how it compared to other F2P implementations.  However, SWToR's Cartel shop, outside of their non-digital subscriptions has made $139M last year.  It's been a year or so since they went F2P and they seem to be going pretty strong.  There are unconfirmed reports from community managers and developers for EA that SWToR has a million players a month logging in to play the game and that 500k of those players are subscribers.

     

    So what gives?  What is SWToR doing right to attract all those people?  We know what they're doing wrong.  Good grief you can't throw a stone lately for hitting a SWToR thread talking about how horrible the game is.  But they must be doing something right.  A million people would not be playing a bad game.  So what is it?  What is pulling in all those people?

     

    They are doing something right for the bottom line, but that's not the same thing as right for players.  You say a million people would not be playing a bad game.. My first thought is, would a million people be playing swtor if it wasn't for the star wars IP?  I don't think it would be even close without the IP.  Also I still don't think of it as a "bad game".  Its a terrible MMORPG, but aspects of it can still be a lot of fun at least for a few months.  So in the end I'd say what Bioware is doing is successfully milking the story aspect of the game and the IP for everything they can get.  Its bad news for players that want to see better quality games and less abusive business practices from the industry.

  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member
    Originally posted by Jerek_
    Originally posted by lizardbones

    Ok, there are lots of discussions on what SWToR does wrong.  There is even a column and associated forum thread revisiting SWToR's F2P options explaining in pretty good detail how it compared to other F2P implementations.  However, SWToR's Cartel shop, outside of their non-digital subscriptions has made $139M last year.  It's been a year or so since they went F2P and they seem to be going pretty strong.  There are unconfirmed reports from community managers and developers for EA that SWToR has a million players a month logging in to play the game and that 500k of those players are subscribers.

     

    So what gives?  What is SWToR doing right to attract all those people?  We know what they're doing wrong.  Good grief you can't throw a stone lately for hitting a SWToR thread talking about how horrible the game is.  But they must be doing something right.  A million people would not be playing a bad game.  So what is it?  What is pulling in all those people?

     

    They are doing something right for the bottom line, but that's not the same thing as right for players.  You say a million people would not be playing a bad game.. My first thought is, would a million people be playing swtor if it wasn't for the star wars IP?  I don't think it would be even close without the IP.  Also I still don't think of it as a "bad game".  Its a terrible MMORPG, but aspects of it can still be a lot of fun at least for a few months.  So in the end I'd say what Bioware is doing is successfully milking the story aspect of the game and the IP for everything they can get.  Its bad news for players that want to see better quality games and less abusive business practices from the industry.

     

    Consumers will take a substandard product because they have to, but not because they want to.  Playing SWToR is a want, not a need.  SWToR has something that people want.  "Star Wars IP" by itself does not answer the question of why players have continued to play the game since 2011.  I agree that it is certainly something that will draw people in.  But it wouldn't keep them playing this long by itself.  It wouldn't have made the F2P transition as successful as it was by itself.

     

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • Jerek_Jerek_ tulsa, OKPosts: 409Member
    Originally posted by lizardbones

     

     

    Consumers will take a substandard product because they have to, but not because they want to.  Playing SWToR is a want, not a need.  SWToR has something that people want.  "Star Wars IP" by itself does not answer the question of why players have continued to play the game since 2011.  I agree that it is certainly something that will draw people in.  But it wouldn't keep them playing this long by itself.  It wouldn't have made the F2P transition as successful as it was by itself.

     

    I disagree.  The IP alone was enough to bring in many and keep them.  The only people I know still playing are examples.  They can complain for hours and when asked why they still play?  "because its star wars."

    I think the same effects at play with the F2P crowd to a lesser degree.  There are tons of f2p mmo's, but only 1 with the force.

  • PpiperPpiper Horsham, PAPosts: 648Member Uncommon
    I liked the Heroics.
  • aRtFuLThinGaRtFuLThinG MelbournePosts: 1,134Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by lizardbones

    Consumers will take a substandard product because they have to, but not because they want to.  Playing SWToR is a want, not a need.  SWToR has something that people want.  "Star Wars IP" by itself does not answer the question of why players have continued to play the game since 2011.  I agree that it is certainly something that will draw people in.  But it wouldn't keep them playing this long by itself.  It wouldn't have made the F2P transition as successful as it was by itself.

     

    It might be a "first world need" for those Star Wars fans but it is indeed a need for them.

     

    Emotional need is also a need for some - not just eating, sleeping a drinking.

     

    Star Wars experience for some Star Wars fans is very emotional.

  • cheyanecheyane Rome Posts: 3,002Member Uncommon

    I think the biggest mistake people make is they think everyone plays like them. That we all finish content quickly and move on and therefore there isn't a need to pay for beyond a month or so. Here is where the biggest illusion lies, see not everyone plays like that. I play in spurts where I can go up to level 26 or so then take a break but I remain subscribed and I also play slowly.


    The biggest draw in this game is the class stories they are well done and I feel really connected because my character has a voice and I enjoy listening to her speak. I have 9 characters who I play slowly and I am subbed and my highest is level 36. Chances are I am not the only person who plays like this. Just because I take a break it does not mean I stop subbing even when I am subbed to another game. I show support to games I like by continuing a subscription .


    Also the normal quests are voiced over and this is so fabulous because it makes me feel more connected to the world. Call me easy to please but Mass Effect blew me away I am very much a story person. I do not look too deeply or dissect the games I play and tear them down to find out what I dislike about them I just enjoy what I can. May be its my over half a century perspective that life has so few things to make one happy so where you can find some enjoyment do not spend too much time tearing it down or looking for faults.

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  • kabitoshinkabitoshin Posts: 758Member Uncommon
    It's probably safe to say that there terrible restrictions are making them alot of money, and cartel packs are just evil for people with addictive personalities.
  • MardukkMardukk Posts: 1,557Member Uncommon
    The class story that I experienced was very good, imp agent. But the thought of going through the linear quest hub again was a complete turnoff. I have no idea what people do with this game after one linear run through on each side.

    Maybe all that money is just that many unique users doing the two month linear run through.
  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member
    Originally posted by Jerek_
    Originally posted by lizardbones

     

     

    Consumers will take a substandard product because they have to, but not because they want to.  Playing SWToR is a want, not a need.  SWToR has something that people want.  "Star Wars IP" by itself does not answer the question of why players have continued to play the game since 2011.  I agree that it is certainly something that will draw people in.  But it wouldn't keep them playing this long by itself.  It wouldn't have made the F2P transition as successful as it was by itself.

     

    I disagree.  The IP alone was enough to bring in many and keep them.  The only people I know still playing are examples.  They can complain for hours and when asked why they still play?  "because its star wars."

    I think the same effects at play with the F2P crowd to a lesser degree.  There are tons of f2p mmo's, but only 1 with the force.

     

    There are many Star Wars IP games.  Half of them are duds.  They don't even have enough sales register as having sold a single copy on VGChartz.  If the Star Wars IP by itself was the only necessary selling point, then every Star Wars game would do well.  This is not the case.  SWToR must have something in addition to being a Star Wars game to be in the top ten best selling Star Wars themed games in addition to making the money it is making.

     

    If anyone is curious about what the best selling Star Wars games are, it's the Lego ones.

     

    **

     

    The idea that it's the Star Wars IP that is doing the work makes sense, but only if SWToR is an especially good Star Wars themed game.

     

    **

     

    So I ask the question of any current players, in your opinion does SWToR provide an exceptionally good "Star Wars" experience?

     

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • DamonVileDamonVile Vancouver, BCPosts: 4,818Member

    The community I'm part of has guilds in many mmos. The swtor chapter has well over 200 people in it. They don't sit around complaining about the game wishing it was better....in fact I don't really remember the last time I saw a complaint post in that chapters forums.

    They raid, they have a bunch of static groups that all level together. What they did right was the same thing all those "wow clone " ( not a negative ) mmos did right. They offer people who like progression based game play a fun place to do it in as part of the star wars universe.

  • CazNeergCazNeerg Puyallup, WAPosts: 2,198Member

    Originally posted by aRtFuLThinG

    They WERE still running fine when they were shut down.

    They were shutdown because their SW license got revoked to make way for SWTOR.

    SWG STILL has fans making and running emulators and that population is NOT small (definitely more than the number of people that play Mortals Online or Darkfall or any smaller and crappier mmos), and you are talking about graphics from 10 years ago.

    That alone should be enough to prove the power of the Star Wars brand.

    SWG was gone for years before TOR came out.  You are referring to NGE.  And neither SWG or NGE ever had anywhere close to the number of players TOR had at it's lowest point.

    Originally posted by Jerek_ 

    I disagree.  The IP alone was enough to bring in many and keep them.  The only people I know still playing are examples.  They can complain for hours and when asked why they still play?  "because its star wars."

    I think the same effects at play with the F2P crowd to a lesser degree.  There are tons of f2p mmo's, but only 1 with the force.

    If the IP alone were enough, SWG would have had a million players.

    Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
    Through passion, I gain strength.
    Through strength, I gain power.
    Through power, I gain victory.
    Through victory, my chains are broken.
    The Force shall free me.

  • rodingorodingo Posts: 2,346Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by DamonVile

    They raid, they have a bunch of static groups that all level together. What they did right was the same thing all those "wow clone " ( not a negative ) mmos did right. They offer people who like progression based game play a fun place to do it in as part of the star wars universe.

    Though I think there their particular F2P model is something they did wrong as I discuss how I feel here, I agree with what you say on what they did right.

    "If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor

  • robthemaniacrobthemaniac Atlanta, GAPosts: 57Member

    Its KOTOR3(Knights of the Old Republic), simple as that.

    In the previous games you did not get to choose how many action bars you had on the screen. You didn't have an option to pay $15 a month and get increased XP or other goodies, you got what the game gave you. 

    SWTOR essentially a 200 hour main story line, and seven 200 hour story line xpacs, for free. 

    Go play it like a bad ass single player game set in a popular IP, where you can co-op with anyone you want whenever you want, and hopefully you'll walk away with a better view of the game. Isn't that what people have called this game all along, f2p or not?

     So what I didn't get sprint until level one and had to wait until level 10?  In single player games you don't get to chose when you get what bonuses if you got any.

    You wanted to know why a million people are playing this? Because it's close enough to KOTOR3 to count as KOTOR3, and there are well over a million people willing to settle with SWTOR as KOTOR3.

  • robthemaniacrobthemaniac Atlanta, GAPosts: 57Member
    Originally posted by lizardbones
     

     

    So I ask the question of any current players, in your opinion does SWToR provide an exceptionally good "Star Wars" experience?

     

    It does indeed. That's what this company does is make immersive RPGS. Mass Effect, Dragon Age, KotoR. That's why they have the playerbase they do. People want a Star Wars RPG, the MMO part doesn't even matter that much, one million people want to feel like Luke, Han, Boba etc.

  • MamasGunMamasGun SomewhereIn, FLPosts: 152Member

    Good day.

    I'd like to preface this whole thing by saying- I am aware of the Star Wars franchise, but I have not seen them.  It's not my usual cup of tea.  I have played (and enjoyed) many a SW game, Knights of the Old Republic being one of them. 

    I appreciate this game for these reasons:

    1- Character Creation.  Not the best out of any MMO, but enough variety to see a multitude of different people/species.  It's a nice treat, really.  I really care about my character.

    2- Class Story.  Though I may not follow the SW, I appreciate what's going on here.  I'm a Smuggler, and I love how my chick can be as tough-as-nails as Han Solo. 

    3- The Dialogue.  I literally laugh at some of the responses my chick comes up with.  This has never happened in an MMO before.  Being able to choose how you respond to people is just... it's a very nice pace from other MMO's (like Secret World, where your character is just there and doesn't have a single opinion as to the craziness that's going on around them).

    4- The Scenery.  Some areas are just SO pretty, and some of the creature designs are spot on.  Definitely not something you can see somewhere else.

    5-  Everyone gets their own Spaceship.  That's pretty cool.  Furthermore, I like how the appearance changes based on Class.  It doesn't feel like, "Everyone gets the same thing to save development time/money".

    6- Legacy system.  I'm not really one to have multiple "toons" in MMO's, so having one Legacy account-wide doesn't bother me.  Actually, I really enjoy it!  It only furthers the notion of your character belonging to the Universe, not just grinding in it.

    7-  Lore is already established.  Again, I'm not a SW fan.  But I love that the galaxy is already established, so there is a fine level of polish in both the setting and the story.

    And, last one: 8- Dirty Kick:  Easily the best move in any game.

    The one thing I find laughable about all of it is not the F2P system.  It's the Jedi's.  I've seen many a person ask simple questions in the chat, and I see Jedi's answering with THE RUDEST answers.  Everyone wants to be a Jedi, but nobody wants to act like it.  ;)  Also, I play on the RP server- and I don't see too much RP going on.  Which, I figured, this being a SW game, there would be a lot of people RP'ing.  Not so- at least, I haven't witnessed it.

    Thanks for making this post.  I have seen a lot of slack for SWToR, and I was a little weary to try it (based on the things I've seen and not being a SW fan myself).  But, honestly, this game is one of the best MMO experiences you can get, in terms of gameplay, character development and story.

    I'd like to end this with a quote from the above: "the MMO part doesn't even matter that much".  Exactly.  This is a prime MMO that, if you didn't look at the chat box, wouldn't even be able to tell is an MMO because it is crafted so well.

    Loves: SMITE, WildStar, Project Zomboid, PSO2, DCUO,

    Worst Online Communities: WoW/WoD(the OG MMO Trolls), DayZ/WarZ, SMITE/LoL/DOTA, EVE Online, APB
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    All the comparisons
    I think it’s dumb and it’s embarrassing
    I’m switching off
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  • ktanner3ktanner3 lakeland, FLPosts: 4,074Member Common
    For me the IP was only enough to get me in the door. When the NGE hit I bolted SWG and never looked back as did MANY other players. Clearly the Star Wars brand wasn't enough to save that game. I'm actually a bigger fan of Star Trek yet I didn't last more than two months in that game. IP alone doesn't keep me playing.

    What keeps me playing is the unique way that Bioware has merged interactive story content with the questing. I also love the companion system,the combat, the flashpoints, the legacy system as well as the events that keep popping out.No other MMO has given me this much entertainment for this long. I give it breaks every now and then,but I have no interest in any other MMO so I eventually come back.








    Currently Playing: Star Wars The Old Republic

  • CazNeergCazNeerg Puyallup, WAPosts: 2,198Member
    [mod edit]

    Pfffft...  The writing and art design are both appropriate to their respective factions.  Look at Star Wars generally, not just this game.  All the characters who look cool? Imperial and/or Sith.  All the characters who are actually interesting?  Either Imperial, Sith, or criminals.  In Star Wars, "Good" = lame and boring, and Republic = Born Losers.  They got that exactly right.  If the Republic had been cooler or it's characters had possessed better fashion sense, it wouldn't have been Star Wars.

    Though they did give the Republic player characters the option of being cool and interesting, if you make enough dark side choices in their class stories.  The only class stories where you can go full light without it being nauseating though are the Imp ones.

    Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
    Through passion, I gain strength.
    Through strength, I gain power.
    Through power, I gain victory.
    Through victory, my chains are broken.
    The Force shall free me.

  • cheyanecheyane Rome Posts: 3,002Member Uncommon

    My husband was watching a Star Wars rerun on all 6 episodes on TV and he is not a huge Star Wars fan and cannot even remember watching them when they came out and in all probability did not. I oth am a huge fan and he has played SWTOR. He was going 'my god this looks so much like the game'. It's funny how people see things differently and he went back to playing the game again after a hiatus of a few months. I bet there are lots of people just like him who are not really Star Wars fans but have heard of it and have a vague recollection of it and relate to the game.


    Oh and he plays a Sith Sorcerer.

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  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member
    Originally posted by rodingo
    Originally posted by DamonVile

    They raid, they have a bunch of static groups that all level together. What they did right was the same thing all those "wow clone " ( not a negative ) mmos did right. They offer people who like progression based game play a fun place to do it in as part of the star wars universe.

    Though I think there their particular F2P model is something they did wrong as I discuss how I feel here, I agree with what you say on what they did right.

     

    The discussion isn't limited to the F2P experience.  SWToR has players who play for free, who have at some point spent money on the game and people who are currently subscribers to the game.  All of these players are playing the game for some perceived benefit.

     

    Going to start editing the OP soon to add some of these reasons in.  Some of them seem like good reasons to play the game.

     

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

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