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Why This game will be as successful as SKYRIM and past ES games.

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  • immodiumimmodium Member RarePosts: 2,610
    Originally posted by spizz
    Originally posted by immodium
    Originally posted by PsychoPigeon
    Originally posted by immodium
    Originally posted by karmath

    Skyrim is a sandbox, albeit a lesser one compared to others in the ES series.

    ES:O Is a themepark clone with the ES IP.

    If you cannot grasp these two very simple facts you really should throw your PC out a window.

    Skyrim, heck all ES games are not sandbox games. They are non-linear themepark games. All the rides are there for me to ride, I can just ride them in any order I want to.

     

     

    Just stop, you have no clue what you're talking about

    People who think ES games are sandbox games have no clue what they are talking about.

    Which single player rpg games do you describe as a sandbox games ?

    To my knowledge none.

    Sandbox games are something along the lines of Simcity/Theme Park/Hospital/Roller Coaster Tycoon and the king right now, Minecraft to name a few.

     

    If the game does not allow me to terraform, build/destroy all element of the game world it is not a sandbox.

    If I could destroy/rebuild/re-design Riften in Skyrim, or even changehow the surrounding landscape looks it would then be a sandbox.

    If I could manipulate water flow to power a mill I constructed to grind wheat to make bread to sell it would be a sandbox.

     

    If ES is a sandbox then so is GTA, Farcry and any other open world game. Open World =/= Sandbox.

     

    When an RPG let's me create/destroy the game world then it's a sandbox. The only real sandbox element to Skyrim was the Hearthstone expansion that allowed me to build a house. Even then it was very restrictive with where you could actually build.

    image
  • JJ82JJ82 Member UncommonPosts: 1,258
    Originally posted by Adokas
    Originally posted by JJ82

     The fact that you are taking me saying "I wont pay $15 unless I get my $15 worth out of it" as "it isn't worth it for everyone" isn't even worthy of being called sad.

    I pretty much just say it as I see it in the way I want it to fit my opinion. These last few pages and your posts, seem to have been nothing but statements about what's valuable and how people are dummies for doing this and that. It's all fine that you think it's not valuable. Others might. No need to force it down others throats.

     Fixed, cause the irony is rich enough to fund a nation.

    "People who tell you you’re awesome are useless. No, dangerous.

    They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
    http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/

  • ViperDragonViperDragon Member UncommonPosts: 101
    Despite some of the negativity, I'm optimistic.  Anyone who can make Morrowind, Oblivion, and Skyrim are a safe bet.

    A great list of free games (mostly MMORPGs): http://www.mytop10games.com/

  • HatefullHatefull Member EpicPosts: 2,502


    Originally posted by -aLpHa-
    Originally posted by fistorm
    No I am dead serious, and I will stand by these words well after release, years into playing ESO when it comes out. I want you to read this post after release and then remember my name, I speculate on every game that comes out with high accuracy.  So in the future when you want to know solid speculations, just look for my name.   Many games I have posted on, and have all been right so far.  I trust myself pretty well.  I hope you can trust me too someday.  if you cant trust me, trust in this guy.... Matt Firor is a vetern of game design he's been around mmo desiging as long as I been playing,  I think he knows 100% what people want and has learned from failure when he first started, I think what he can do more then most game designers can do is make what people want, which is a SKYRIM ONLINE, which is the reason I think they picked him in the first place.   That's why I trust this game isn't some fluff or rip off and I believe it when the devs say this is SKYRIM ONLINE.  We look to the top of whos running things and this one has a long time old school designer who's A+ in my book.  Its like looking at a star quarterback really, and knowing whos going to win the game.If anyone can make a single player quality game ONLINE, it is this guy! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matt_Firor

    I already TRUST you explicitly, please show me the light MASTER! Please let me bath in your shadow so i can absorb all that EXPERIENCE and KNOWLEDGE and maybe some of that CLAIRVOYANCE will rub off on me!



    I..I have to agree with -aLpHa- here. You like the game, good for you. A lot won't, a lot will. However, Your narcissism does not make your opinions fact.

    If you want a new idea, go read an old book.

    In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.

  • JJ82JJ82 Member UncommonPosts: 1,258
    Originally posted by immodium

    To my knowledge none.

    Sandbox games are something along the lines of Simcity/Theme Park/Hospital/Roller Coaster Tycoon and the king right now, Minecraft to name a few.

     

    If the game does not allow me to terraform, build/destroy all element of the game world it is not a sandbox.

    If I could destroy/rebuild/re-design Riften in Skyrim, or even changehow the surrounding landscape looks it would then be a sandbox.

    If I could manipulate water flow to power a mill I constructed to grind wheat to make bread to sell it would be a sandbox.

     

    If ES is a sandbox then so is GTA, Farcry and any other open world game. Open World =/= Sandbox.

     

    When an RPG let's me create/destroy the game world then it's a sandbox. The only real sandbox element to Skyrim was the Hearthstone expansion that allowed me to build a house. Even then it was very restrictive with where you could actually build.

     Allow me to point you in the direction of either Nexus or Steams Workshop.

    Wow, cant believe someone actually posted that as if people don't know about TESs massive sized modding community, one so large that Bethesda worked with the community and steam while making Skyrim to make sure there was a shop setup and tools out in players hands before the game was even released.

    "People who tell you you’re awesome are useless. No, dangerous.

    They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
    http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/

  • HellidolHellidol Member UncommonPosts: 476
    Originally posted by -aLpHa-

    Skyrim and ESO are two completely different gametypes, i won't even dare compare them.

     

    have you played the beta? The games are comparable, ESO does a lot of things right while leveling, beyond that none of us know. 

    If they continue down this path I would foresee ESO doing very very well, good as skyrim not so much but time will tell if they have good end game beyond pvp.

     

    This will be my go to game for sure tho, right now I am playing SWTOR and that game is pretty much crap compared. 

    image
  • killion81killion81 Member UncommonPosts: 995
    It should be pretty interesting to see how it all pans out.  I won't be there for launch, but I think the odds are on the side of something similar to a train wreck.  You know you shouldn't care or look, but for some reason you have the urge to witness the mayhem.
  • immodiumimmodium Member RarePosts: 2,610
    Originally posted by JJ82
    Originally posted by immodium

    To my knowledge none.

    Sandbox games are something along the lines of Simcity/Theme Park/Hospital/Roller Coaster Tycoon and the king right now, Minecraft to name a few.

     

    If the game does not allow me to terraform, build/destroy all element of the game world it is not a sandbox.

    If I could destroy/rebuild/re-design Riften in Skyrim, or even changehow the surrounding landscape looks it would then be a sandbox.

    If I could manipulate water flow to power a mill I constructed to grind wheat to make bread to sell it would be a sandbox.

     

    If ES is a sandbox then so is GTA, Farcry and any other open world game. Open World =/= Sandbox.

     

    When an RPG let's me create/destroy the game world then it's a sandbox. The only real sandbox element to Skyrim was the Hearthstone expansion that allowed me to build a house. Even then it was very restrictive with where you could actually build.

     Allow me to point you in the direction of either Nexus or Steams Workshop.

    Wow, cant believe someone actually posted that as if people don't know about TESs massive sized modding community, one so large that Bethesda worked with the community and steam while making Skyrim to make sure there was a shop setup and tools out in players hands before the game was even released.

    I know about mods. I play a heavily modded version of Skyrim.

    I haven't played the game for months but if you could point me in the direction of a mod that turns Skyrim, a non-linear themepark game into a fully destructible world that also have the tools to rebuild structures.

    A mod that turns Skyrim into Minecraft I would most certainly check out.

    Hopefully that's what EQN is going for.

    image
  • fistormfistorm Member UncommonPosts: 868

    Dev video Minute 5:36  Proves that ESO WILL BE a SANDBOX, being able to do what you when you want and feel like it... isn't that the true definition of SANDBOX?

    http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/media/videos/411

  • NephaeriusNephaerius Member UncommonPosts: 1,671
    Originally posted by fistorm 

    "Anyone whos ever played SKYRIM,  will atleast BUY or TRY ESO. "

    Sorry but I stopped reading here because that's just a ludicrous claim.  For example I have every ES game released to date however I will not bother with ESO at all.

    Steam: Neph

  • NephaeriusNephaerius Member UncommonPosts: 1,671
    Originally posted by fistorm

    Dev video Minute 5:36  Proves that ESO WILL BE a SANDBOX, being able to do what you when you want and feel like it... isn't that the true definition of SANDBOX?

    http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/media/videos/411

     Really?  You're going to start claiming that ESO is a sandbox now?  It's a themepark through and through. 

    Steam: Neph

  • immodiumimmodium Member RarePosts: 2,610
    Originally posted by fistorm

    Dev video Minute 5:36  Proves that ESO WILL BE a SANDBOX, being able to do what you when you want and feel like it... isn't that the true definition of SANDBOX?

    http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/media/videos/411

    The thing is, no one on these forums can agree on what a sandbox is. I've had this debate a number of times. :)

    image
  • hammarushammarus Member UncommonPosts: 196

    Ok I will admit it.  I am one of those guys on steam with several THOUSAND hours of game time into Skyrim.  Should I get a job? Sure, but while I look I can have fun too. 

     

    Now, as to ESO being a success.  I'm not saying Im in beta or anything...  BUT ESO is NOT Skyrim!!! Not by a hair not by a mile. As the game stands now it is highly unlikely I will play it.  As its concentrating too much on pvp which is EXACTLY like Guild Wars pvp.  And not enough on the ES IP pve.  Which sadly includes exploration.  Not that there isn't some, its just incredibly limited and the pve plays like a generic mmo.

    Its not likely that the game will change between now and launch so. I doubt I will play it.

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 31,937
    Originally posted by fistorm

    Dev video Minute 5:36  Proves that ESO WILL BE a SANDBOX, being able to do what you when you want and feel like it... isn't that the true definition of SANDBOX?

    http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/media/videos/411

    It's definitely not a sandbox. Even the mmorpg.com staff who reported on the game, wrote about it on this site indicated that it's a themepark.

    I can't speak about beta but I can speak about my pax "hands on" and it was a theme park.

    Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb." 

    Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w


    Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547

    Try the "Special Edition." 'Cause it's "Special." https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/64878/?tab=description

    Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo 
  • hammarushammarus Member UncommonPosts: 196
    Originally posted by immodium
    Originally posted by fistorm

    Dev video Minute 5:36  Proves that ESO WILL BE a SANDBOX, being able to do what you when you want and feel like it... isn't that the true definition of SANDBOX?

    http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/media/videos/411

    The thing is, no one on these forums can agree on what a sandbox is. I've had this debate a number of times. :)

    ^ Exactly.  Though sandbox does imply certain things.   And that Dev. is skirting the truth by the mere fact no one can agree on what sandbox is, so it can be said its sandbox no matter what it really is.

  • collektcollekt Member UncommonPosts: 328
    Why do people keep hammering away with comments about ESO not being exactly like Skyrim and such? I just don't understand the logic. Just because it's an Elder Scrolls game doesn't mean it needs to be exactly like the other single player games. It means that it's set in the same universe, using the same lore, etc. It's like comparing Warcraft 3 to WoW. Are they both Warcraft games? Yes. Are they both very similar in terms of gameplay? No, and to expect that from games of different genres is downright retarded. RPG is not the same as MMORPG. Get over it.
  • fistormfistorm Member UncommonPosts: 868
    Originally posted by Sovrath
    Originally posted by fistorm

    Dev video Minute 5:36  Proves that ESO WILL BE a SANDBOX, being able to do what you when you want and feel like it... isn't that the true definition of SANDBOX?

    http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/media/videos/411

    It's definitely not a sandbox. Even the mmorpg.com staff who reported on the game, wrote about it on this site indicated that it's a themepark.

    I can't speak about beta but I can speak about my pax "hands on" and it was a theme park.

    The dev video shows that it will be EXACTLY like SKYRIM as far as SANDBOX terms go.   I don't see ES doing a game differently then what they tell the public,  expecially since they say it was a base concept at the very start of the game and had probably been put into the foundation of the game already.   I will agree with the game company as telling the TRUTH until they tell me something otherwise, and so far they have proven in the past they don't lie and have a record of being able to do this with a game.  So theres really no reason not to believe this is how they are making the game.

     

    Even further I just want to say that THIS FEATURE, is the main feature that made SKYRIM so great!  If you are going to have a SKYRIM ONLINE like the devs say, this has to be part of it, and would defeat the purpose of an online SKYRIM as they put it.  So Its hard for me to buy into anything anyone says that's contrary to this.   To much data is in favor of the Company, and so is the credibility with everything they showed us so far.

  • spizzspizz Member UncommonPosts: 1,971
    Originally posted by immodium
    Originally posted by spizz
    Originally posted by immodium
    Originally posted by PsychoPigeon
    Originally posted by immodium
    Originally posted by karmath

    Skyrim is a sandbox, albeit a lesser one compared to others in the ES series.

    ES:O Is a themepark clone with the ES IP.

    If you cannot grasp these two very simple facts you really should throw your PC out a window.

    Skyrim, heck all ES games are not sandbox games. They are non-linear themepark games. All the rides are there for me to ride, I can just ride them in any order I want to.

     

     

    Just stop, you have no clue what you're talking about

    People who think ES games are sandbox games have no clue what they are talking about.

    Which single player rpg games do you describe as a sandbox games ?

    To my knowledge none.

    Sandbox games are something along the lines of Simcity/Theme Park/Hospital/Roller Coaster Tycoon and the king right now, Minecraft to name a few.

     

    If the game does not allow me to terraform, build/destroy all element of the game world it is not a sandbox.

    If I could destroy/rebuild/re-design Riften in Skyrim, or even changehow the surrounding landscape looks it would then be a sandbox.

    If I could manipulate water flow to power a mill I constructed to grind wheat to make bread to sell it would be a sandbox.

     

    If ES is a sandbox then so is GTA, Farcry and any other open world game. Open World =/= Sandbox.

     

    When an RPG let's me create/destroy the game world then it's a sandbox. The only real sandbox element to Skyrim was the Hearthstone expansion that allowed me to build a house. Even then it was very restrictive with where you could actually build.

    This is for me not the definiton of an rpg sandbox game.

    Sandbox mmos are for me for example:

    * Eve Online; Vanguard; Ryzom; A Tale in the Desert

    * modable Arma i.e. DayZ and yes for me Skyrim is a sandbox aswell, a massive one.

     

    The term sandbox was used before even minecraft was released, a sandbox game is a free-roaming game with a none-linear gameplay.

    A sandbox game does not need to have the option to create or destroy the game world.

     

     

    The opposite of an rpg sandbox game would be for example:

    * Age Of Conan

    * SWTOR

     

     

    Mincraft is for me rather a freeform building game with sandbox possibilities.

     

  • fistormfistorm Member UncommonPosts: 868

    I think we can all agree we all have a different view of a sandbox, but this is really about how SKYRIM's style of sandbox is what people are going to love in ESO as a skyrim fan and I have no doubt it will be a key part of what will make ESO the next gen mmo that will set the benchmark.

     

    /waves hand to post below,  up here, up here. I am defending it!

  • JJ82JJ82 Member UncommonPosts: 1,258
    Originally posted by immodium
    Originally posted by JJ82

     Allow me to point you in the direction of either Nexus or Steams Workshop.

    Wow, cant believe someone actually posted that as if people don't know about TESs massive sized modding community, one so large that Bethesda worked with the community and steam while making Skyrim to make sure there was a shop setup and tools out in players hands before the game was even released.

    I know about mods. I play a heavily modded version of Skyrim.

    I haven't played the game for months but if you could point me in the direction of a mod that turns Skyrim, a non-linear themepark game into a fully destructible world that also have the tools to rebuild structures.

    A mod that turns Skyrim into Minecraft I would most certainly check out.

    Hopefully that's what EQN is going for.

     Holy hell....

    you can use the construction tool to move, remove, alter anything, build anything.

    Secondly. fully DESTRUCTABLE does not = sandbox.

    How much more are we going to change the meanings of the words sandbox and themepark to defend TESO? Cant anyone defend it for what it actually is?

    "People who tell you you’re awesome are useless. No, dangerous.

    They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
    http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/

  • AdokasAdokas Member CommonPosts: 217
    Originally posted by JJ82
    Originally posted by immodium
    Originally posted by JJ82

     Allow me to point you in the direction of either Nexus or Steams Workshop.

    Wow, cant believe someone actually posted that as if people don't know about TESs massive sized modding community, one so large that Bethesda worked with the community and steam while making Skyrim to make sure there was a shop setup and tools out in players hands before the game was even released.

    I know about mods. I play a heavily modded version of Skyrim.

    I haven't played the game for months but if you could point me in the direction of a mod that turns Skyrim, a non-linear themepark game into a fully destructible world that also have the tools to rebuild structures.

    A mod that turns Skyrim into Minecraft I would most certainly check out.

    Hopefully that's what EQN is going for.

     Holy hell....

    you can use the construction tool to move, remove, alter anything, build anything.

    Secondly. fully DESTRUCTABLE does not = sandbox.

    How much more are we going to change the meanings of the words sandbox and themepark to defend TESO? Cant anyone defend it for what it actually is?

    I'd love to be detailed about what I personally like. But, NDA. But uh, it's no sandbox. I agree on that.

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 31,937
    Originally posted by fistorm
    Originally posted by Sovrath
    Originally posted by fistorm

    Dev video Minute 5:36  Proves that ESO WILL BE a SANDBOX, being able to do what you when you want and feel like it... isn't that the true definition of SANDBOX?

    http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/media/videos/411

    It's definitely not a sandbox. Even the mmorpg.com staff who reported on the game, wrote about it on this site indicated that it's a themepark.

    I can't speak about beta but I can speak about my pax "hands on" and it was a theme park.

    The dev video shows that it will be EXACTLY like SKYRIM as far as SANDBOX terms go.   I don't see ES doing a game differently then what they tell the public, 

    oh dear ...

    With all due respect I think you need to play it before you staunchly defend whether it's a sandbox or themepark.

    as I said "I can't talk about beta but I can talk about my pax 'hands on' and it was a theme park"

    Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb." 

    Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w


    Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547

    Try the "Special Edition." 'Cause it's "Special." https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/64878/?tab=description

    Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo 
  • JJ82JJ82 Member UncommonPosts: 1,258
    Originally posted by fistorm

    Dev video Minute 5:36  Proves that ESO WILL BE a SANDBOX, being able to do what you when you want and feel like it... isn't that the true definition of SANDBOX?

    http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/media/videos/411

     This would be the same people that have stated its open world, when it clearly isn't (part of the world being open is not open world, the word world mean the ENTIRETY). Stated that you are free to create the character you like just like TES games, even though they are class locked and cant use every skill/spell in the game like you can in TES games, meaning you are not free at all, you are bound like in every other class based game with a skill tree that gives you options.

    They have twisted so many meanings to try to make it fit TES it just goes to show the thing cant stand on its own. Sure didn't see Bethesda trying to make Skyrim sound like Oblivion or Oblivion like Marrowind...........

    It will take years to get over the fact they stated they put in 1st person to satisfy those saying it wasn't TES enough. They have no respect for gamers intellect. Guess we all know who they are targeting for their audience.

    "People who tell you you’re awesome are useless. No, dangerous.

    They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
    http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/

  • spizzspizz Member UncommonPosts: 1,971

    "The dev video shows that it will be EXACTLY like SKYRIM as far as SANDBOX terms go"

     

    Most of the weekend tester probably cant tell you this since the time was too short to see everything, it was only a weekend and maybe with a lvl cap. They dont know high level areas or how questing looks like in these areas, how the adventuring is possible. And we all know that at the first lower levels the game world is often a bit more restricted like in many other games and that you will find of course some quests around the next corner.

    But there is one thing for sure, you cant make an mmo exactly like Skyrim.

    Skyrim with a co-op feature would do the trick and this would be actually amazing.

  • fistormfistorm Member UncommonPosts: 868

    http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/media/videos/411    Minute 6:40 of video explains end game 50+  ( they say three things, you can PVP, or Heroic Raids, or going into an AVENTURE ZONE, which is the 50+ sandbox areas)

    If you watch the dev video, and sometimes it takes a couple times to watch to understand what they are saying, but it tells you how it will be at 50+ and how it works at that lvl.  Even shows what appears to be a few group dungeons.

This discussion has been closed.