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Yes. Yes it is. Landmark especially. You build what you want (to a seemingly greater power than any other sandbox game), you explore where you want and as far as I understand it there aren't even quest or levels. That said I am under the impression Everquest Next will be more story focussed and will encourage players to pull together to do world events, quest and so on but it's still hard to deny that Everquest Next will be a sandbox based on what we've heard so far.
Originally posted by ozmono Yes. Yes it is. Landmark especially. You build what you want (to a seemingly greater power than any other sandbox game), you explore where you want and as far as I understand it there aren't even quest or levels. That said I am under the impression Everquest Next will be more story focussed and will encourage players to pull together to do world events, quest and so on but it's still hard to deny that Everquest Next will be a sandbox based on what we've heard so far.
In 2 years, when people have actually stepped foot in the game, we'll know more about how Dave and Smed's vision actually panned out. Until then, the public has only been presented with a sales pitch.
Wait and see. Don't hang off the hype and promises of a product that is woefully under-developed.
Originally posted by Telondariel Originally posted by ozmono Yes. Yes it is. Landmark especially. You build what you want (to a seemingly greater power than any other sandbox game), you explore where you want and as far as I understand it there aren't even quest or levels. That said I am under the impression Everquest Next will be more story focussed and will encourage players to pull together to do world events, quest and so on but it's still hard to deny that Everquest Next will be a sandbox based on what we've heard so far.
Well, put it this way, they've not only been promoting it as a sandbox game but they've run several demonstrations for the press. Numerous media have been shown it, played it and reported on it if you don't just believe SOE is serious about attempting what they've been promoting. It would be a colossal backflip and waste I might add if they suddenly scrapped what they've developed and shown to this date and made another themepark MMORPG. Now with that said, I did put some caution in my post, the text you coloured orange was the best example but I also said "seemingly greater power" and that was the only real thing which could be accused of buying into the hype.
Why are people getting so hung up on sandbox vs something else? EQN will be heavily story driven by the NPCs. That feature alone will make many argue that it can not be a sandbox. They may use instancing to tell part of that story. Again a hit against sandbox. There will be required serverwide events called Rally Calls that will permenantly change the game world. This point can be argued both ways. It is a mandatory scripted event so obviously not a sandbox. But on the other hand the game does permenately change so it obviously is a sandbox.
But all that aside. The game is going to be FTP. Download the game client, create a character, move beyond the starting area then make up you mind. If the game turns out to be fun and thoughtfull then does it really matter what label was assigned to it by lay people on the message boards? If not then uninstall the game and move on to the next greatest thing.
Originally posted by ozmono Originally posted by Telondariel Originally posted by ozmono Yes. Yes it is. Landmark especially. You build what you want (to a seemingly greater power than any other sandbox game), you explore where you want and as far as I understand it there aren't even quest or levels. That said I am under the impression Everquest Next will be more story focussed and will encourage players to pull together to do world events, quest and so on but it's still hard to deny that Everquest Next will be a sandbox based on what we've heard so far.
I dunno. If you are talking about the bits showing rudimentary combat, parcour movement, and small-scale world destructability, then none of those really give an idea of the larger picture of Dave and Smed's claims to it being "the world's largest sandbox". Which, in my above post, is what I said. We haven't been shown much, but there sure have been quite a few presentations with a lot of words thrown around.
Currently it's just discussion and fizzled hype. When they show actual gameplay (not a simple demo), when we've heard in-game reports from players and not from media with invested interests, then we'll see if the vision has come together and who it will ultimately appeal to.
My addendum here is that I want it to be an amazing game. I've been playing EQ and EQ2 for about 12 years now. I don't care if it's sandboxy or not; I just want a truly deep, immersive world that I could spend years (not weeks or months) playing. My concern is the simplification and monetization that EQ and EQ2 have undergone since Dave Georgeson came on board, and how "accessible" EQN will be at launch. Dave is a very good salesman and greases his audience with exactly what they want to hear, which makes me leery of the end product. I hope it works out, but I still have a queasy knot in my stomach to the potential reality.
Originally posted by Telondariel In 2 years, when people have actually stepped foot in the game, we'll know more about how Dave and Smed's vision actually panned out. Until then, the public has only been presented with a sales pitch. Wait and see. Don't hang off the hype and promises
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Originally posted by Gintoh I mean the EQN, not EQN:L. Iv'e looked on the web but I hear mixed reports, that there was a 100 m dollar budget version and a 20 mil version, is this going to be the sandbox version?
If you mean literally, a box with sand, then probably not. If you mean a game played on a box (PC/PS4) with sand in it (desert), probably. If you mean one of a million other things that people consider to be a sandbox, who knows.
Do you even know what a sandbox is, and if so, from what they have revealed, does it fall under those specific conditions?
Sometimes I'm scared for people (unless they are trolling, then I laugh). Is the sky blue? I don't know, look out a window...
I've been following EQN/LM for way too long, but really, it only takes a few minutes to pretty much learn everything there is to know and not have to ask. The more you know
sandbox is different than a beech or desert.
Any sandbox/sandpit i have let my children play in have had tools to play with. it has never been just a box with sand, thats boring.
Now if they create a gaming world where i can choose to go and quest or craft or even just explore, but whichever i choose i can progress somewhere in the game by doing what i choose... then i will accept it as a sandbox with tools in.
No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin
With what we know, some will say it is, some will say it is a hybrid. I would be in the hybrid crowd, but it is just easier to say and not argue with anyone. It probably will be as much a sandbox as anything else you will see in the future that has developer content and is a AAA mmo.
From the sounds of it the world will not be scaled to a players level. Instead it will be scaled to the strength of arms that the group can bring. Either by equiping better armor and weapons and/or bringing enough friends.
That being said means that quests will be distinct and de-centeralized. So if you decide to turn right while everyone else turns left, you will still find things to do.
That to me is the only true definition of sandbox. A big open world where you decide which way to turn.
Everything else is just frosting on the sandbox cake.
You will be able to permenately change the game by finding dungeons and tunnels. You will also be able to change the terrain. Some stuff will heal over time. Dungeons can be closed by cataclysmic events like an earthquake.
There will be crafting (how it will work is still anyones guess though)
There will be player built housing but it will not be easy to get a plot on which to build your house.
Mob and NPC interaction will all be "faction" based. And how you build or destroy that faction all depends on decisions that you make.
There will be a story. And the story will drive some sort of quest line. Major chapters of the story will be told using Rallying Calls. But you will be free to do what you want (although it looks like the Rallying Calls have a predefined outcome in the end). Help the enemy and you will slow down the progression of the Rally Call.
If you want to build faction with the town folk do things to help them. If you want to build faction with the Orcs attacking the town then attack the town people.
Yes it will be a sandbox style game. Here is my really simple definition. If you log into two different EQN servers and go to the same place you will most likely see different things. The AI of the game is supposed to allow for dynamic mob movement instead of static spawns so it reacts to what players are doing. Players are going to be able to build structures. There are story arcs that will allow for different results on different servers. There is procedurally generated content that is random so it won't be the same on every server etc.
If you log off in EQN and then go out of town for 2 weeks and come back and log in there is a good possibility the world around you will be different. That certainly isn't true in most MMORPG out there and it isn't supposed to be just scripted chains like GW2 has where there are only 3 states to an area and it rotates between them.
EQN will not be sandbox from what I have seen so far. They would need to bring something new to the table. My guess like lots of themepark MMOs, they will take some features from sandbox games we love and add them. Like player housing. Adding a few splashes of sandbox features make the game sandbox? Not IMO. Others would disagree.
Now if you play EQN:L and you port your creations to EQN, now playing 2 games makes EQN sandbox? Kinda. Myself I only have time for 1 game!
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Originally posted by anwar Please define "sandbox".
How dare you bring logic to the internet!
Originally posted by DamonVile It has sandbox features, but it isn't going to be what a purist would call a sandbox.
May i ask what a sandbox is for a purist. Because of the sound of it no sandbox MMO would fullfil that description.
Originally posted by Aelious The term used was "biggest sandbox style..." regarding EQN so not a pure sandbox but more of a sandpark. Landmark will be a pure sandbox though, the teleportation spires and handful of meeting place landmarks being the only developer placed entities to begin with. Going back to EQN it will be interesting to see how the overall game plays. The world is from a procedural seed so more land can be added easily and can be very large not to mention the layers deep that shifts over time. If they also have a way to generate basic animals/mobs in the gameworld you may be able to travel far into a direction and explore. There are no typical levels but gear "tiers" to achieve per class. Depending on how many classes one is willing to gain (they have to be found/earned) and play or enlarge the pool of abilities for your other classes one could be kept busy for a while. Fairly open ended from the sounds of it but not entirely skills based. A bit plus is not symbols above the head and a smart system for quests. There are demo videos of Storybricks that are promising regarding that but just the absence of symbols witll make the world seem more like a world and less like connect the dots. The one feature that isn't sandbox but brilliant imo is Rallying Calls. Month(s) long ongoing quest events with multiple ways to help out progressing the world story. Rather than having structures and storyline aspects strait patched in the players help move it along. Mostly on paper? Sure but I have no doubt they can pull it off. They wouldn't have scrapped the second iteration otherwise. How sandbox it may be will depend on personal definition IMO.
The one feature you call isn't sandbox may be more in the spirit of sandbox as many may think. It is a lot like old world gm events(UO), but a lot more automized, a lot more open ended, and a lot more world affecting.
Any event, any quest, where everyone is part of, and will inherently change, affect the world is a sandbox feature.. it is very similar with one time quests, affecting the world, which are also, at least in my mind, sandbox style quests.
Though, EQN will have most probably a lot more convential, not so much sandbox, quests, too. At least guess so.
But ultimately as someone else already said in this thread we really don't know enough to call that beast.. until now we have some basic ideas, some basic tools, and you can imagine almost everything from that on.. but what we finally get, what EQN finally will be have to be seen. So lets dring some tea and wait.
Basically EQ:N is supposed to be EQ:L with combat. EQ:L is supposed to determine the baseline for how the world will look in EQ:N.
So, based on that info, I would say that if you consider EQL a sandbox, then you should also consider EQN one too. That said, sandbox is such a loaded term on these forums (like themepark, or wow clone), that it's impossible to tell who thinks what exactly constitutes a sandbox. Everyone seems to have their own personal definition, which is superior to everyone elses, and anything that doesn't completely match their contrived definition is 100% not a 'true' sandbox, but rather some cheap imitator.
No-one agrees on what a sandbox really is so not really something we can answer. But, I don't see Sandboxes/Theme parks as an either/or thing though. I think it makes more sense to view it as a continuum. In that way, I would say EQL and Next would be closer to the sandbox side of things. Extreme sandbox there wouldn't be anything in game. We could all stare a blank screen lol.
Originally posted by aesperus Originally posted by Gintoh I mean the EQN, not EQN:L. Iv'e looked on the web but I hear mixed reports, that there was a 100 m dollar budget version and a 20 mil version, is this going to be the sandbox version?
Actually EQN:L is going to have combat also. EQN has the expanded classes, where you get your abilities from your class(es). EQN also will have developer made content/events. EQN:L you get your abilities from what I have seen from crafting gear/weapons. Players will be making content and not all of it will be fantasy based/restricted. Think it is on the main continent, but the other ones, anything goes.
I am more interested in EQN, as EQN:L I can see people putting time into it and actually maybe making it better than EQN for a lot of people, but that takes time and is down the road. EQN will have professional content out of the gate.
I am interested in EQN:L, but I gotta see how robust the pve content is and other parts, that I imagine will be procedurally generated probably on the main continent (maybe everywhere, not sure how they will do it, just that they have combat/monsters out of the gate, they have said).
I may not like EQN in the end, if it is so casual that you feel what you do doesn't matter much (if you understand what I am saying there).
People could actually in time make almost their own mmos in EQN:L if given enough tools, SoE can make profit off of the store of the creators world/mmo. Will they let people design mobs/classes and such, along with the content? Have to see how much they open it up in the end.
EQN:L is very much a sandbox, EQN is more hybrid in the classic sense of things, but in more modern terms it is probably as much sandbox as you are going to get in a mmo that have developer content and the features it lists.
The Overlord John Smedley said it (both) will be Sandboxes, but then again, John Smedley said it.
So you do the maths............