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Dev's disrespecting PC gamer's

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  • monochrome19monochrome19 Chicago, ILPosts: 453Member Uncommon
    Just because a game was made on pc doesnt mean it has to be played there. You PC gamers/OP are too entitled and you have no reason to be. You all would do the world a great service if you fell off a cliff.
  • goldtoofgoldtoof leedsPosts: 337Member
    Catlana

    That's how console games are, boom or bust, they are either massive hits like gta or cod or they flop. Quoting individual games sales means nothing. Pc gamers play more of a variety of games, case in point cod ghosts is not the current best seller on pc.

    The pc does account for roughly half of all games sales. It used to be a third about 5 years back, but the pc market has grown of late due to the rise in indie gaming, cheaper pc parts, people realising the games are cheaper on pc and the growth of kickstarter.
  • ImsneakyImsneaky Jacksonville, FLPosts: 138Member
    I'm not sure PC gaming could ever catch up to the numbers of console gamers, mostly because many kids have consoles but no PC worth gaming on.  While consoles are expensive, a good gaming PC is much more expensive.  Now add in the fact that most laptops, even many pricey versions, simply won't run many games, and often, if they will run a game, the settings can't be maxed out.  A truly good gaming laptop like an ALienware is very expensive.

    Personally, I think PC makers are dropping the ball here.  They need somebody with vision to take the helm.  Somebody that realizes that they need to totally rethink how they make Laptops.  They need to:
    1. Keep cost of the PC low.  Not cheaper than other PC's, just not astronomical as is the case with the Alienware.
    2. Create a laptop that can be easily upgraded in not only RAM, but also processor.  In short, the processor must not be integrated with the MoBo.
    3. Have expansion slots in the PC that are there for a graphics card and a sound card.  I don't think you need more than that, but maybe a third would work.  Design this in such a manner that the cards can be fairly small, and have a retaining system that holds them in their slots.
    4. FANS FANS FANS!  A gamer is not actually looking for the sleekest, tiniest, cutest laptop...they want power, and power must come with advanced cooling.  Alienware does this.  It is a good bit thicker than most laptops, but that is more than OK.  The point here is that you may need a laptop for school/work, and don't have a budget for two PC's, so most people don't have two.  By making a laptop targeted at gamers, and their needs, a PC maker can increase sales, and everyone knows that sales is the first line on a business' income statement.
    Heck, if they really wanted to go all out, they could create the laptop with standard fan, but integrate a detachable water cooling system.  This system would hook to the laptop with two couplings, and it would have two hoses, that went to a combination tank and radiator with fans.  Preferable to too big.  If created properly, you would only need to connect this cooling device when you were going to power-game.  Just typing in word, emailing, and cruising the net should not require the device to be connected.

    If there were more gamers on laptops, then there might be more emphasis on catering to them.

    However, all is not lost.  Consoles will likely never get to play this:  Star Citizen

    https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/12762-Star-Citizen-Enlist-Your-Friends

    image

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  • MattatronMattatron Dunlap, ILPosts: 226Member
    Originally posted by Kazuhiro
     And the good news is, they will actually be getting easier to use since consoles are now becomming basically dumbed down pcs, making emulation even easier.

    Wait.. what did you think a console was before?

    A console is just a little, limited-function, gaming computer with licensed material.

  • LaterisLateris Phoenix, AZPosts: 1,748Member Uncommon
    Some are rather condescending but also prefer the console, while some are more aware of the freedom for development on a PC as opposed to the console.  Which is rather hypocritical since all console games are developed on a PC.  If I had to do a console it would be Sony over Microsoft any day. But yes I agree that the PC market is getting ignored and blown off. Which is why SC is funded by fans! 
  • Solar_ProphetSolar_Prophet Columbus, OHPosts: 876Member Uncommon

    I don't blame them for snubbing PC gamers in general. They're by far the most fickle and bi-polar type of gamers out there, and tend to throw the internet equivalent of huge screaming, crying, raging fits over relatively insignificant issues.

    Hell, just look at the ridiculous overreactions to not only Diablo 3's state at release, but toward all the 'fixes' Blizzard is now implementing. They're screaming and crying like children over BoA, complaining that Diablo is a 'trading game' (ignoring the fact that only legendaries & smart drops are BoA), complaining about Paragon 2.0, complaining that the auction house is being shut down (that one REALLY boggles my mind), complaining that drops are too good now (seriously... what...the...FUCK), and basically throwing childish fits over just about everything.

    I can't speak for anyone else, but if I were a developer the increased difficulty of creating software which will function on hundreds, if not thousands, of hardware + software configurations, when combined with the extremely immature, pessimistic, entitled attitude displayed by the vocal PC gamers, would have caused me to tell that community to go fuck itself a long time ago.

    If PC gamers want to be taken seriously, then they need to stop indulging in the exact same behavior that they, in their sheer arrogance, ascribe as being typical & exclusive to console gamers.

    AN' DERE AIN'T NO SUCH FING AS ENUFF DAKKA, YA GROT! Enuff'z more than ya got an' less than too much an' there ain't no such fing as too much dakka. Say dere is, and me Squiggoff'z eatin' tonight!

  • BigdavoBigdavo BrisbanePosts: 2,065Member
    I don't understand why anyone would want to subject themselves to playing a port. I don't think I've ever played a decent one yet.

    O_o o_O

  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member


    Originally posted by Bigdavo
    I don't understand why anyone would want to subject themselves to playing a port. I don't think I've ever played a decent one yet.

    I've played several. Just use a game controller.

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • DrakynnDrakynn The Pas, MBPosts: 2,030Member

    While PC Piracy has traditionally been the scapegoat of delayed releases o games not coming to PC,it's significance has been greatly exaggerated.It's effect is substantial but not the sole or biggest reason for the above,It's just overblown in some people's minds and the mind of CLiffyB who lost touch with reality over a decade ago when the sweet MS money started rolling in.

    Piracy is a problem on the PC but it's a static one now...Console Piracy is growing every year as it doing so becomes less convoluted because simple kits for doing so has become a lucrative black market.Hell on portable platforms piracy is probably worse than on PC already.So the PC  Piracy excuse is wearing thin.

    No the most common reason for PC delays is simply that software legacy support and differing hardware configurations makes PC development a much longer process as opposed to consoles where you have set hardware specs and one OS per platform  to support.

    The second most common reason is simply that the PC version is started later because the primary focus will always be the larger combined market of consoles.It's not disrespect.

    The only thing the OP is partly correct about is console exclusives which occur because the dev's are owned by the console company or the console company is paying the developer to make it exclusive.Neither is actual disrespect just good business sense.

    PC gamers have been hearing that the consoles are the future and PC gaming is dead coz PIRACY!!!! for two decades now,I don't think it's any more true today than it was back then.

  • JemcrystalJemcrystal Champaign, ILPosts: 1,552Member Uncommon

    I have yet to meet one PC pirate.  Where are they hiding?   This is about profit.  The bottom line.  The waiting game.  The money game.  If there is a pirate out there somewhere she/he's not much of a threat to PC profits.  I'll believe in ghosts first.  At least they've been sighted now and again.


  • OziiusOziius Baltimore, MDPosts: 1,388Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by asmkm22 The console market is much larger than the PC market.  Look at just the xbox live service, which hit something like 46 million users earlier this year.  That's easily 3 or 4 times the potential audience of PC gamers just with one console.  If you look at PC-exclusive games that have sold really well, most top out at around 10-12 million.  The Sims 2 hit 20 million or so, and it was pretty much aimed at the fairly huge casual-female market that later transitioned over to Farmville and other Facebook games.  The closest example of a non-casual PC game would be Diablo 3, which sold 12 million. Compare those numbers to, say GTA V, which has sold around 30 million in less than a month, or any of the various Wii exclusives which usually sold 20-30 million -- on one platform -- and it's not difficult to see why publishers are more interested in consoles.  They're cheaper to develop for and have a larger audience that includes teens just getting into games (more young teens can afford a console than a gaming computer). The problem for PC gamers is that the control and UI setup has to be completely reworked in most cases, which means most PC games end up with fairly crappy UI's or stripped down gameplay because they were designed for consoles first.  For that to change, there needs to be a larger potential audience for PC games, and that will never happen unless hardware and software prices really drop below the $500 range for a high-end gaming machine.  

    Agreed. In addition, although folks around here don't want to see or admit to the fact that the PC in general is dying. Look at the sales... Record lows across the board. I prefer PC gaming myself, but I don't deny the truth. We're a dying breed.

  • Stuka1000Stuka1000 Posts: 868Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by asmkm22

    The console market is much larger than the PC market.  Look at just the xbox live service, which hit something like 46 million users earlier this year.  That's easily 3 or 4 times the potential audience of PC gamers just with one console.  If you look at PC-exclusive games that have sold really well, most top out at around 10-12 million.  The Sims 2 hit 20 million or so, and it was pretty much aimed at the fairly huge casual-female market that later transitioned over to Farmville and other Facebook games.  The closest example of a non-casual PC game would be Diablo 3, which sold 12 million.

    Compare those numbers to, say GTA V, which has sold around 30 million in less than a month, or any of the various Wii exclusives which usually sold 20-30 million -- on one platform -- and it's not difficult to see why publishers are more interested in consoles.  They're cheaper to develop for and have a larger audience that includes teens just getting into games (more young teens can afford a console than a gaming computer).

    The problem for PC gamers is that the control and UI setup has to be completely reworked in most cases, which means most PC games end up with fairly crappy UI's or stripped down gameplay because they were designed for consoles first.  For that to change, there needs to be a larger potential audience for PC games, and that will never happen unless hardware and software prices really drop below the $500 range for a high-end gaming machine.

    You are missing a single point that to be honest most people miss, which is the premium price of console games over the same title on the PC.  If you consider that the life of a console is about 5 years and that a console game on average costs £10 more than on the PC then over that 5 years of game purchases you have spent enough to have bought a decent gaming PC in the first place.  A platform that already outstrips the new consoles in power and that you can upgrade as you see fit.  Unlike the console that will have the same, stale technology 5 years down the line with the same level of games.

  • LerxstLerxst Phx, AZPosts: 550Member
    Originally posted by eric1000
    Originally posted by asmkm22

    The console market is much larger than the PC market.  Look at just the xbox live service, which hit something like 46 million users earlier this year.  That's easily 3 or 4 times the potential audience of PC gamers just with one console.  If you look at PC-exclusive games that have sold really well, most top out at around 10-12 million.  The Sims 2 hit 20 million or so, and it was pretty much aimed at the fairly huge casual-female market that later transitioned over to Farmville and other Facebook games.  The closest example of a non-casual PC game would be Diablo 3, which sold 12 million.

    Compare those numbers to, say GTA V, which has sold around 30 million in less than a month, or any of the various Wii exclusives which usually sold 20-30 million -- on one platform -- and it's not difficult to see why publishers are more interested in consoles.  They're cheaper to develop for and have a larger audience that includes teens just getting into games (more young teens can afford a console than a gaming computer).

    The problem for PC gamers is that the control and UI setup has to be completely reworked in most cases, which means most PC games end up with fairly crappy UI's or stripped down gameplay because they were designed for consoles first.  For that to change, there needs to be a larger potential audience for PC games, and that will never happen unless hardware and software prices really drop below the $500 range for a high-end gaming machine.

    You are missing a single point that to be honest most people miss, which is the premium price of console games over the same title on the PC.  If you consider that the life of a console is about 5 years and that a console game on average costs £10 more than on the PC then over that 5 years of game purchases you have spent enough to have bought a decent gaming PC in the first place.  A platform that already outstrips the new consoles in power and that you can upgrade as you see fit.  Unlike the console that will have the same, stale technology 5 years down the line with the same level of games.

     

    You also can't overlook the fact that had GTAV been released on a PC as well, those numbers could have been 30 million too.  Console games have the luxury of being released first, then ported to the PC.  Just like any form of entertianment - TV show, movie, etc. the initial release is the largest sales point.  

     

    Going but just sales figures creates a self-perpetuating cycle - consoles games sell more because the consoles sell more because the games sell more.  The same with the UI as well.  This doesn't explain the initial cause of the reaction though - what really made consoles become the "favored" option for gamers.

     

     Personally, I can trace this back to the 80's when the market really started to come out.  PC's were considered a "business" machine that families bought primarily for business.; games were secondary.  That's the mentality the adults my age were brought up in; we owned the NES and Genesis for our games, the PC was for class work and business use.

     

    In that same market, the main video games had always been action based ones as well, even dating back to Donkey Kong and Pac Man.  Consoles had it made releasing those types of games,  The RPG's and Adventure games found a better home on the PC, but they were far from the mainstream type of game - you didn't go to the arcade to play Kings Quest!

     

    The people who took an interest in computers as a career or hobby found their true potential for gaming, but most of us people, my age, in my high school class, etc. were more focused on the casual/sports/action games the consoles offered and chose other career paths as adults.  These are the adults and parents who now feel "uncomfortable" around computers or don't see the full potential, or see the reason for spending money and time upgrading computers - they buy a name brand, stick with it for a few years, then buy a new one.

     

    This generation also looks at technology as being outdated and overpriced.  We've seen tech come and go for decades.  VCR players that once cost over $200 that people throw in the trash nowadays.  DVD's have been replaced by Blue Rays.  5.25" disks changed to 3.5", to CD-ROMS, to DVDs, and so on.  Unless you took an interest in this and understood the technology changes, it just looks like things come and go all the time so the "why bother?" mindset starts to set in.  "Computers get outdated so quickly, are overpriced and not worth the investment" because the generation of casual console gamers never took the time to understand why and how the technology changed.  They know their consoles.  They know how the consoles work.  They are familiar and comfortable with that knowledge.  PCs, on the other hand, are a strange place that have changed so many times, they can't keep up!

  • Dreamo84Dreamo84 Niagara Falls, NYPosts: 3,437Member Uncommon

    You know why? It's because people like my brother just said "I won't buy a console because the games are $60! I have never paid $60 for a PC game" and he's right! Everyone buys it on Steam sale lol.

    But seriously, PC might be the largest platform. But I can say with 100% certainty that most of those are not gaming PCs. I'm sorry, the average person doesn't even know what a gaming PC is let alone want to buy one. Almost everyone I know has one of the gaming consoles though.

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  • ProkaryotikProkaryotik Edmonton, ABPosts: 38Member

    2 reasons:

    1) Console companies ie: Sony and Microsoft pay game studios extra piles of cash to have exclusive rights to a game title either for a period of time or forever. Since PC has no all-encompassing company like that we rarely see PC exclusive games anymore.

    2) The specs for consoles are constant while PCs are ever changing. When you're designing a game and working within the constraints of the system its easier to know your boundaries on a console than it is on a PC. Thus PC games must go through rigorous testing and whatnot in order to optimize it on multiple platforms. There are just so many variables in PC gaming hardware and software that can cause problems and inevitably ends up costing companies money spending time and effort debugging all those combinations.

  • aRtFuLThinGaRtFuLThinG MelbournePosts: 1,134Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by catlana
    Originally posted by goldtoof
    No its not

    Pc is the largest selling platform.

    All consoles combined outsell pc, but no individual console does.

    Quoting figures for individual games means nothing. The pc market, and pc gamers is more varied in its taste. Consoles tend to be boom or bust with their games, they're either massive hits like gta, cod and gow or they do nothing.

    GTA V has out sold every other video game this year. GTA V may eventually be ported to PC. However, Rockstar did not port Red Dead to pc. Rockstar has obviously concluded that releasing on PC costs them money.

    You may be right on total sales but for an individual game basis consoles have much higher numbers.

    That speaks more for the strength of GTA series, NOT the strength of console. GTA could've released V on iphone/android and it would have been sold in vast numbers just the same. There is virtually no way to tank it unless they did something really stupid.

     

    However, if devs try releasing indie or smaller/unheard of games on console, I don't even think the dev will even make 10k in sales. On steam on PC on the other hand, people gobble it up like no tomorrow as long as they sell it cheap.

     

    And corrrection on the all consoles combined outsell pc part, they don't and it is not even close. Just goggle some stats you will find it.

  • rojoArcueidrojoArcueid hell, NJPosts: 6,778Member Uncommon
    i'll pass AC:IV on PC. I'll sacrifice the superior graphics and get it on PS4 (when i get one) because Assassins Creed multiplayer always suck on PC. Either nobody plays or their netcode is garbage because it never finds people on PC. I never had that problem on consoles with any AC online.

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  • iamrtaiamrta centreville, VAPosts: 164Member Common
    It is ironic considering all of the "live" gameplay they ever show at E3 are done on PC's hiding behind little cardboard displays. 
  • DrakynnDrakynn The Pas, MBPosts: 2,030Member
    Originally posted by Havekk

     


    Originally posted by asmkm22 The console market is much larger than the PC market.  Look at just the xbox live service, which hit something like 46 million users earlier this year.  That's easily 3 or 4 times the potential audience of PC gamers just with one console.  If you look at PC-exclusive games that have sold really well, most top out at around 10-12 million.  The Sims 2 hit 20 million or so, and it was pretty much aimed at the fairly huge casual-female market that later transitioned over to Farmville and other Facebook games.  The closest example of a non-casual PC game would be Diablo 3, which sold 12 million. Compare those numbers to, say GTA V, which has sold around 30 million in less than a month, or any of the various Wii exclusives which usually sold 20-30 million -- on one platform -- and it's not difficult to see why publishers are more interested in consoles.  They're cheaper to develop for and have a larger audience that includes teens just getting into games (more young teens can afford a console than a gaming computer). The problem for PC gamers is that the control and UI setup has to be completely reworked in most cases, which means most PC games end up with fairly crappy UI's or stripped down gameplay because they were designed for consoles first.  For that to change, there needs to be a larger potential audience for PC games, and that will never happen unless hardware and software prices really drop below the $500 range for a high-end gaming machine.  

     

    Agreed. In addition, although folks around here don't want to see or admit to the fact that the PC in general is dying. Look at the sales... Record lows across the board. I prefer PC gaming myself, but I don't deny the truth. We're a dying breed.

     

    While you are right about the record lows in the last year it's yet to be seen whether that is a temporary thing due to the mass adoption of mobile platforms like smart phones and tablets or a permanent trend.I have a tablet but also plan on having a good PC because I like both platforms for different purposes and games.Your cries of doom are as of yet unproven and unsubstantiated.

  • Thomas2006Thomas2006 Millersburg, INPosts: 805Member Uncommon

    The reason is simple. Why would anyone buy a subpar console copy of a game when they can almost always get a better expierence and graphics on the pc copy.

    Really would you rather play GTA V on the PC or a console? Would you rather play AC4 on the PC with semi better graphics or on a console with less graphic quality?

    Want to know why we didnt get Dust 514 for the PC. Because Sony dumpped a massive bucket of money to make it a PS exclusive. Not to mention compared to other shooter games on the market it is very VERY subpar.

  • heirloomheirloom Los Angeles, CAPosts: 5Member

    They're almost turning console into PC. That way they're monopolized or something...hmm...that sounds familiar...oh never mind that.

    But yeah, it's sad that there are console exclusives but the least I could do is not support it by not buying le console just for that exclusive. I try to satisfy myself just watching a full playthrough of it. It may not be enough but at least I didn't spend much, since I'm mostly after the story of the game anyway. But if it's a different type of game...well...that really sucks.

  • FoomerangFoomerang Portland, ORPosts: 5,565Member Uncommon

    Everyone who buys a gaming console has the full intention to look for, buy, and play games on it. Not everyone who own a PC is using it as a gaming machine.

    So from a developer's perspective, which demographic would you make your games for? The one where you know that 100% of the people who own that platform are looking to buy games on a regular basis, or the platform where you really don't know how many people are even looking for your game on their platform let alone have a powerful enough rig to run it.

    Consoles are easier to make games for than a pc because you are only dealing with a single hardware configuration. A console sits in the living room attached to the tv by default (those of you who have pc's hooked up to your living room tv for entertainment are in the extreme minority right now).

    Easy to develop for, easy access for users, a reliable demographic with a high attach rate. PC gaming is an expensive hobby if you truly want to have the best graphics year in and year out.

    You can play hypotheticals all day long. Spouting off, "well if this game came out on pc it would have far superior graphics and the mod community would be outstanding." But the reality is that console exclusive aint going anywhere and if you want to hold out for a pc port, go for it but thats not really gaming imho.

    If you are really into gaming, then the platform does not matter. Any gamer worth their weight in hot pockets will go where the games they want are available. IF thats pc, then there it is. IF its a console exclusive and they deem it a must have title, then you pony up the cash and get your game on.

    I play games on my pc and it is easier to count how many consoles and handhelds i have not owned, than it is try try and calculate all of the gaming devices I have attained in my 35+ years of gaming. And I dont regret any of it. I would have missed out on some of the best gaming experiences ever had I taken the stance of pc superiority > all.

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