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SOE will sell your Landmark creations and keep 60% of sales.

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Comments

  • IcewhiteIcewhite Elmhurst, ILPosts: 6,403Member
    Originally posted by dandurin

    The correct value is simply the sweetspot that maximizes SOE's profit.  That is what modders "deserve", and it is determined by the marketplace, not by whether SOE is "greedy" or "moral" or "fair" or any other judgemental term or whether you think they do "0% of the work".   There's nothing to be outraged about.   SOE will either raise or lower the number based on data, not morality.

    And Rebel Leaders will attempt to drum up some righteous indignant outrage, and the witch hunt will (or not) happen.

    But we get an "OMG Evils of EvilCorp" thread on this site roughly six times a day. Probably not a very good spot to whip up a mob.

    Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  • mmoguy43mmoguy43 , CAPosts: 2,439Member Uncommon
    I think SOE is too bold to try something like this that could make players really rich and SOE get only 60%. As long as the player creation market isn't too bloated with junk or is terrible to navigate, for players that love to constantly create stuff this is going to be quite lucrative for them.
  • TissmogiTissmogi Portland, OHPosts: 177Member
    Originally posted by dandurin 

    You keep using words like "fair" and "deserve" and "compare", and what you "think" modders "should" get.  And you underline and capitalize and punctuate as if you were outraged and offended by the 40% number.

    Your observation is correct in so far as i already said many times incl. my OP that i think 40% is too little. I think a 60/40 would be nicer for the modders. Now you can argue against that if you want and i welcome you to do so.

    Just pointing out what i said however does not seem to server any purpose.

    I think that's displaying a fundamental misunderstanding of economics.  Thankfully, one beauty of markets is they only react to the opinions of those participating in the transactions.

    Not going to argue economics on a simple topic like this. I will just say that i will participate in that market by probably not buying overpriced Assets if SOE puts a 60% premium on them.

    We shall see how much they really cost, at this point it is all speculation and we heard from posters that actually add to the discussion as opposed to you that there might be a different revenue model behind this.

    The correct value is simply the sweetspot that maximizes SOE's profit.  That is what modders "deserve", and it is determined by the marketplace, not by whether SOE is "greedy" or "moral" or "fair" or any other judgemental term or whether you think they do "0% of the work".   There's nothing to be outraged about.   SOE will either raise or lower the number based on data, not morality.

    I agree, nothing to be outraged about. In the end i will maybe buy some of those assets or not. Never said SOE is greedy or brought moral into it. It's what it is.

    So what was your point making this post? 

     

  • AeliousAelious Portland, ORPosts: 2,854Member Uncommon
    An SoE employee makes the newest cool looking sword for the marketplace. I wonder if they see 40% of the sales from that item?

    Personally, if I can find a way to make money while doing something I would have anyways, using tools that aren't mine... Nope, no problem at all and 40% sounds great.
  • FlyByKnightFlyByKnight Algo Star SystemPosts: 651Member Uncommon

    "Hi, I have a player base of a millions. If you make some good optional content for it, I'll give you a 40% revenue share of the profits"  -Sony Online Entertainment

     

    "That's not fair, I should get 100% because I'm too dense to realize the part about the million+ player base and me not owning any copyrights of the title. What a scam" -MMORPG Genius

  • FlyByKnightFlyByKnight Algo Star SystemPosts: 651Member Uncommon
    P.S. Creators get to suggest prices for their work in some games. OMG. How unfair.
  • TissmogiTissmogi Portland, OHPosts: 177Member
    Originally posted by agnostic4eve

    Name a game that let's you create items for use in a game....

    I'm waiting....

      Team Fortress 2, Dota 2 to name just two on top of my head.

    Now name one that let's you make money off of your creations....

    Still waiting....

    Team fortress creators usually get 100k or more for community items amongst other perks like a unique one time item that usually sells to collectors for a few thousand.

    Now name an indie program that let's you make a share of the profits over 15%...

    That's what this is, an Indie program. They give you the platform to make a profit, it's very simple. I see this as Sony's acceptance of Indie designers. Not only have they opened the doors for Indie Game designers, and Author's, they are also opening the door for indie Graphic Designers. What better way of finding diamonds in the rough than giving them a platform to perform on.

    Indie is the future baby, get used to it.

    What this has to do with indie games is beyond my understanding, sorry, wrong thread maybe?

     

  • TygranirTygranir Colordo Springs, COPosts: 741Member
    Originally posted by FlyByKnight

    "Hi, I have a player base of a millions. If you make some good optional content for it, I'll give you a 40% revenue share of the profits"  -Sony Online Entertainment

     

    "That's not fair, I should get 100% because I'm too dense to realize the part about the million+ player base and me not owning any copyrights of the title. What a scam" -MMORPG Genius

    This thread in a nutshell. If SoE offered nothing there would be no problem, but they pay you to have fun and it's not enough? I love this group of people.

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  • cnutempcnutemp Fairfax, VAPosts: 229Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by FlyByKnight

    "Hi, I have a player base of a millions. If you make some good optional content for it, I'll give you a 40% revenue share of the profits"  -Sony Online Entertainment

     

    "That's not fair, I should get 100% because I'm too dense to realize the part about the million+ player base and me not owning any copyrights of the title. What a scam" -MMORPG Genius

    +1

  • TissmogiTissmogi Portland, OHPosts: 177Member

    Originally posted by Aelious
    An SoE employee makes the newest cool looking sword for the marketplace. I wonder if they see 40% of the sales from that item?

    So we are now all employed by SOE and get a monthly paycheck when we buy the game? Because if we don't than you just made the most retarded argument i have yet seen in this thread.
     

    Originally posted by FlyByKnight

    "Hi, I have a player base of a millions. If you make some good optional content for it, I'll give you a 40% revenue share of the profits"  -Sony Online Entertainment 

    "That's not fair, I should get 100% because I'm too dense to realize the part about the million+ player base and me not owning any copyrights of the title. What a scam" -MMORPG Genius

    That would be ridiculous, 100% of the profits, outrageous! Haha, good one, you crack me up!

    However, how is this adding to the topic? Please, in the future, stay on topic.

     

  • AeliousAelious Portland, ORPosts: 2,854Member Uncommon
    OP thank you for bringing up TF2 which is indeed one of the first to sell player created items... with only 25% going to the creator

    http://www.teamfortress.com/contribute/legal.php

    You mentioned one time items that sell for much more, care to elaborate as I'm not familiar. Links would be great.
  • rojoArcueidrojoArcueid hell, NJPosts: 6,772Member Uncommon

    MMORPGs are supossed to be fun, not work. With that said, i would rather create some content and get 40% of the profit than grinding never ending raids for gear because thats all we have...

    image
  • TissmogiTissmogi Portland, OHPosts: 177Member
    Originally posted by Dihoru
    Originally posted by Tissmogi
    Originally posted by Dihoru
    The only noise I see is the OP trying to justify a lobsided, narrowminded and generally subjective point of view by bending over backwards in ways that would make a yoga guru blush just to prove his point (which is somehow that making shit in a game based on a IP that isn't yours, whom you aren't employed in making and who has nothing more to do with you than being a customer of it, makes you entitled to a larger cut of profits from the game than the developers, generously, give you, christ next you'll tell us EVE-Online players should be getting paid for supplying dynamic content).

    Hold on a minute there, son . . .

    So after accusing me of having an agenda against SOE:

    Originally posted by Dihoru  Now arguing with the OP is pointless because this thread isn't made for discussion merely either for the furthering of an agenda or misdirected hatred for a developer.

    Accusing me of breaking and bending facts:

    Originally posted by Dihoru  I came to this conclusion by you bending and breaking objective facts to fit your own opinion. 

    You are now calling me lobsided, narrowminded and subjective. While also saying i a feel entitled and want to make more profit when i CLEARLY STATE IN MY OP AND IN ALL REPLIES TO YOU that i am not a modder and i don't want to create any content.

    Seriously, please leave this thread alone if you do not have anything constructive to say about this topic other than attacking me.

    Thank you.

    I was giving you the benefit of a doubt but now I just see you're not even outraged, you're picking at straws trying to see what happens. Btw attacks go something like "I think the OP is a mouth drooling moron" not "I think the OP is being generally human" :) but then again you do seem like the person to miss the forest while looking at the trees.

    Considering you're not a modder, never have even been one, considering you have no interest in creating content (which means you will also not play this game because otherwise anything you do in a sandbox could potentially be content) and considering this topic is at best a tangential interest of yours in which you prove a completely lack of understanding for it lets just call it a day and cool off before you ruin your reputation on the forums (no quicker way to do that than to look like a dedicated savant in math critiquing classical poetry).

    I am glad we cleared that up to your liking, please stay away.

  • AvatarBladeAvatarBlade BucurestiPosts: 770Member Uncommon

    So, people that would probably do this anyway, for free, because they enjoy doing things like modding, have the chance to also get some money and you think it's wrong that they get 40%, instead of the 0% they would get usually. 

    These are not people quitting their jobs to make a living from selling their assets in SOE games. It's aimed at people that would do this anyway, for free, because they enjoy it. 

    Do they also hope that these people make more art assets than they usually would, without getting any money? Probably, but it is still a reward for an activity some find fun to do in their free time, that usually has no financial gain for the creator.

  • AeliousAelious Portland, ORPosts: 2,854Member Uncommon
    There's no need to call names OP, unless you don't think your point stands on its own. You made my point for me. We aren't employees and can leave without notice taking our "trade" with us. Employees are contracted more or less to stay for a period of time and devote themselves for a paycheck working on what ever they are given.

    My point is this: say a dev spends 10 hours making one sword that sells 1000 times for 5.00. That's 5000.00 or 500.00 an hour. You really think thy dev will get 2000.00 in return, 200.00 an hour?
  • EcocesEcoces Chicago, ILPosts: 879Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Tissmogi

     

    You are doing 100% of the work creating content, you get 40% of the sales.

    SOE does 0% of the work and gets 60% of the sales.

    Are you really saying this is fair?

    ANY other real money auction house where you sell to other players has a tax of around 10-15% not 60% SIXTY!

     

    you're not doing 100% of the work though, you are using tools THEY created in a world THEY created. as others have said you should be happy they are giving you the chance to make money off of this at all.

  • DrakynnDrakynn The Pas, MBPosts: 2,030Member

    Participation is voluntary,they aren't forcing you to create content and if the profit split turns out to be distasteful to the majority then SOE will either have to close down the program or keep changing the split more in favor of the creator until they find the sweet spot in this market.Just because this is the initial split doesn't mean it will remain if the market doesn't bear it.

    Also you don't need any of those additional tools mentioned to create content to sell,you can use just the tools provided in EQ:L to create items to sell using pre-existing basic assets.The tools mentioned are to create custom basic assets like textures etc if you so choose and is also voluntary.Presumably you could just sell that basic asset  to others to create items from or you coudl buy custom assets to create things with without ever having to touch tools outside the game.

    Added to that anything you do create to sell has to be vetted by SOE first and determined suitable for use.This is especially true if your going to try to sell items in EQN,I imagine the rules will be much more relaxed in EQ:L.

  • dandurindandurin Santa Clara, CAPosts: 493Member
    Originally posted by Tissmogi
    ...

    We shall see how much they really cost, at this point it is all speculation and we heard from posters that actually add to the discussion as opposed to you that there might be a different revenue model behind this.

     

     

     You are quite fond of stating that your opponents bring nothing to this thread.

    However, ironically, since you readily admit to having no interest in modding for cash, you yourself have nothing to contribute to whether 40% is the right number, and therefore nothing to contribute to a rant thread you yourself created.

     

     

    I agree, nothing to be outraged about. In the end i will maybe buy some of those assets or not. Never said SOE is greedy or brought moral into it. It's what it is.

    So what was your point making this post? 

     

    Nice backpeddelling.  You've edited the OP so many times I don't know what it originally said, but you later ranted against SOE posting in all caps with underlines and implying they weren't "fair", which is a moral judgement.

  • TissmogiTissmogi Portland, OHPosts: 177Member
    Originally posted by dandurin
    Originally posted by Tissmogi
    ...

    We shall see how much they really cost, at this point it is all speculation and we heard from posters that actually add to the discussion as opposed to you that there might be a different revenue model behind this.

     

     

     You are quite fond of stating that your opponents bring nothing to this thread.

    However, ironically, since you readily admit to having no interest in modding for cash, you yourself have nothing to contribute to whether 40% is the right number, and therefore nothing to contribute to a rant thread you yourself created.

    Are you for real? I asked modders for their opinion because i am not a modder, more insight into the topic and discussion about it. 

    I agree, nothing to be outraged about. In the end i will maybe buy some of those assets or not. Never said SOE is greedy or brought moral into it. It's what it is.

    So what was your point making this post? 

    Nice backpeddelling.  You've edited the OP so many times I don't know what it originally said, but you later ranted against SOE posting in all caps with underlines and implying they weren't "fair", which is a moral judgement.

    You did not answer my question, what is the point of your post? You add nothing to the discussion here, no facts, no opinion on the Topic. Why do you keep going on and on about how i am wrong and ... i don't know any more what the frack you want from me. How about posting something constructive, a genuine thought or insight maybe, but please stop it i can't take it any more and i will ignore any posts from you from here on.

  • thekandy2thekandy2 HerningPosts: 9Member
    Originally posted by dandurin
    Originally posted by Tissmogi
    ...

    We shall see how much they really cost, at this point it is all speculation and we heard from posters that actually add to the discussion as opposed to you that there might be a different revenue model behind this.

     

     

     You are quite fond of stating that your opponents bring nothing to this thread.

    However, ironically, since you readily admit to having no interest in modding for cash, you yourself have nothing to contribute to whether 40% is the right number, and therefore nothing to contribute to a rant thread you yourself created.

     

     

    I agree, nothing to be outraged about. In the end i will maybe buy some of those assets or not. Never said SOE is greedy or brought moral into it. It's what it is.

    So what was your point making this post? 

     

    Nice backpeddelling.  You've edited the OP so many times I don't know what it originally said, but you later ranted against SOE posting in all caps with underlines and implying they weren't "fair", which is a moral judgement.

    Go back a few pages or ten and there should be some insightful comments made by the OP, such as "Free content made by players should be free for the players" all in big font and orange for easy reading, and a tirade about how he doesn't wish to pay SOE 60% for the "overpriced" items, whatever that means, since he would be paying the full price to them anyway.

    I think his little song and dance about the modders not being paid enough is a nice little coverup for a much baser cause: His own wallet. Why all this malarchy about something he has no vested interest in whatsoever if not.

    One wonders why he doesn't just come out and say it, given the general opinion of SOE's pricing models here.

  • AeliousAelious Portland, ORPosts: 2,854Member Uncommon
    It's relevent to the conversation that players can indeed create structures, make blueprints of them and do what they want with the design. That includes giving it away, trading it, selling it in game or submitting it to SoE to sell on the marketplace.

    Just as those who want it free look out for thwie wallet, so do those that spend x hours creating something great. It works both ways.
  • TissmogiTissmogi Portland, OHPosts: 177Member
    Originally posted by thekandy2

    Go back a few pages or ten and there should be some insightful comments made by the OP, such as "Free content made by players should be free for the players" all in big font and orange for easy reading, and a tirade about how he doesn't wish to pay SOE 60% for the "overpriced" items, whatever that means, since he would be paying the full price to them anyway.

    I think his little song and dance about the modders not being paid enough is a nice little coverup for a much baser cause: His own wallet. Why all this malarchy about something he has no vested interest in whatsoever if not.

    One wonders why he doesn't just come out and say it, given the general opinion of SOE's pricing models here.

    What is it with people on this site desperately trying to find a sinister motive behind my posts? It's like posters are obsessed with finding something to discredit and anger anyone making a thread it's like an obsession yet there are little to no constructive posts at all.

    This forum is truly the sewer of all gaming forums, it's so vile and full of shit it's unbelievable.

  • thekandy2thekandy2 HerningPosts: 9Member
    Originally posted by Tissmogi
    Originally posted by thekandy2

    Go back a few pages or ten and there should be some insightful comments made by the OP, such as "Free content made by players should be free for the players" all in big font and orange for easy reading, and a tirade about how he doesn't wish to pay SOE 60% for the "overpriced" items, whatever that means, since he would be paying the full price to them anyway.

    I think his little song and dance about the modders not being paid enough is a nice little coverup for a much baser cause: His own wallet. Why all this malarchy about something he has no vested interest in whatsoever if not.

    One wonders why he doesn't just come out and say it, given the general opinion of SOE's pricing models here.

    What is it with people on this site desperately trying to find a sinister motive behind my posts? It's like posters are obsessed with finding something to discredit and anger anyone making a thread it's like an obsession yet there are little to no constructive posts at all.

     

    This forum is truly the sewer of all gaming forums, it's so vile and full of shit it's unbelievable.

    There has been plenty of constructive posts in this thread that should be more than enough to sate your curiousity for what the modders think. Yet it seems to remain a point that they should demand more even when it has been brought up that what is being offered for assets is much higher than the regular standard of artwork.

    You do not come off as wanting the feedback from modders if they do not support your view and setup, and you very much seem to have an agenda with this thread, whether it's simply a wish for affirmation, rabble-rousing or a veiled rant against microtransactions..

  • SlampigSlampig Chantilly, VAPosts: 2,376Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by slikeytre
    Why are they selling your art at such a huge cut? Is this the only place their making any money on the game?  I'm thinking 80/20 to be fair. Without people making things they wouldn't get the sale.

    How is it your art? Pretty sure the tools you use belong to them, as does the game itself. People complain about COMPANIES being greedy, here you get basically a free 40% cut just by using tools you don't even have to pay for and THEY are the bad guys... image

    That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!

  • ozmonoozmono Not tellingPosts: 1,211Member
    Originally posted by Tissmogi
    Originally posted by thekandy2
    Originally posted by Tissmogi
    Originally posted by thekandy2
    [mod edit]
    [mod edit]
    [mod edit]

    [mod edit]

     

    One thing I agree with which I think that poster was trying to say is you should just let it go. You should understand the reasons for doing so by now. I'm talking about the overly hostile nature of this place, the under developed arguments, people repeating similar things you've already argued against, people chiming in  without reading the whole thread or even the OP and than we have the attacks on your motives and so on as you just got. Now it's not all like that and there have been a lot of good post too but it's not worth it mate. Go be free, fly far from this place.

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