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10 million Skyrim fans

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  • doodphacedoodphace Vancouver, BCPosts: 1,815Member
    Originally posted by Nadia
    Originally posted by doodphace

    XBOX and PS4 versions might as well be seperate games, seeing as there is no cross platform play....lets say the game sells 4 million copies accross all 3 platforms....that does not mean any 1 person has the ability to play with 4 million other players, which is all that matters when it comes to MMOs.

    thats not much different than playing on different servers, on the same platform

    unless there's cross server functionality (ie dungeon finder)

     

    no one plays w 4 million players on the same server

    I didnt say anyone would play will 4 mill on the same server. I they would have the potential to.

    In WoW for example, I can invite anyone from any server into my group, and do any raid tier, quests, PVP, anything with them. Which means, I have the potential to play with every single person who plays WoW, granted that are part of my faction ;)

    The same cannot be said with an MMO on 3 platforms with no cross platform play.

  • NadiaNadia Canonsburg, PAPosts: 11,866Member Common
    Originally posted by Iselin

    WOW  keep the Asia, NA, SA and Europe separate - it's like 4 games eh?

    sidetopic - thats one thing i find annoying about D3

     

    I have a friend in Kuwait who plays on Euro Servers

    D3 is a global game  - you can switch the region using your same BNET acct (unlike WOW)

    but you are not allowed to use your same characters on different regions

     

     

  • loulakiloulaki PatrasPosts: 918Member
    Originally posted by SavageHorizon
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

     I dont see them selling 10 million copies anytime soon... 

     

    But you had no problem predicting that ArenaNet would sell more copies of GW2 than Blizzard's WOW, right lol.

    Think you are underestimating the pull of the IP and it's followers. The last time we saw something like this was with WOW and battle.net fans never having played a MMO before but ended up playing WOW.

    Like the game or not, TESO will IMO be the first western MMO that get's close to the numbers of WOW.

    And unlike your other GW2 prediction, sub based mmo didn't die with the release of GW2. Many players have no problem paying a sub for a decent MMO. The pull of the IP will have people paying a sub without even thinking about it.

     

    well and many people i know around the twitter/facebook and the majority from those i know from real life, for all of them the monthly subscription is a serious issue.. and they are all around ages of 25-35 ... maybe for students and lower ages doesnt matter cause they dont paid for the sub, but for higher ages its a huge turn off .

    image

  • jinxxed0jinxxed0 columbia, SCPosts: 838Member

    I'm seeing a ton of people say stuff that was said about Star Wars The Old Republic..

     

    "The IP will pull in SO many people. star wars has a huge fan base, the game will never fail"

     

    People are pulling assumptions out of their butts without taking anything else into consideration except for the way they THINK the world works. This game will do fine in sales. So many casual players will buy the game because most people don't sit there and look at info for unreleased games for years, months or weeks. They see an ad for it or see it at a store, recognize it from seeing it (or something similar multiple times, it captures their eyes and they try it out. thats the only reason WoW became big. Not because of the name or anything, but because they had millions of dollars put into advertising which is STILL unheard of with western MMOs. It's very common with korean MMOs which is why many of those MMOs have 2-10 times the player base that WoW had at it's *peak*. Everyone acts like WoW is some sort of great MMO that can never be touched. It came be if publishers stop being complete idiots and invest heavily in a good marketing team.

     

    Watch. The next MMO Blizzard makes, they'll likely use the same marketing tactics and get just as many people or more. They'll easily reach all the people they've reached before and even more people who still don't know the concept of MMOs. Blizzard got to people who never heard of MMOs and never even thought they'd be playing games. The advertised on TV which is something only a few western MMOs have done. They're the ONLY ones to have done it with an extreme budget for it in the west. The social network Zwinky, ran an ad campaign for about a MONTH and their membership skyrocketed. Why didn't do it longer than that, I have no idea. Maybe they attracted people they didnt want playing their game? Who knows.

     

    But the point is, if TES advertised on mainstream media and not just to people who already freaking know about the game by running googling ads to gaming sites, then they'll reach a ton of people. I'd be willing to bet that more than 60% of all Skyrim and Oblivion etc players are not even slightly aware of a new TES game. Of the ones that do hear about it, about 5-10% will think it's just a new game made by the same people who made skyrim, and will be ignorant enough to try and pirate it. And like many MMOs all the torrent sites will have it for some reason and they'll wonder why they cant play it even though they downloaded it. Yahoo answers will be flooded with "can I play TES online in single player" and many variations of it. All of you people who came into MMOs after they became mainstream (post-WoW era) don't seem to get the fact that there billions of people out there who don't know what an mmo is. The millions of people WoW brought in is nothing compared to how many who still don't know "mmo" is. The collective people on this planet that play MMOs is very small. and made up mostly of asian players who play asian mmos.

     

     

    This game will likely trail off quickly like so many others. Game devs think that the mmo genre is the be all end all format for a world/story. The Matrix, Avatar, people think a pokemon mmo would be the best thing ever, etc etc. The very nature of MMOs puts restrictions on everything. And instead of letting you be a person that exists in the world, MMOs want everyone to be the single hero that saved the day. But that's another thing that's wrong with MMOs

  • deakondeakon birminghamPosts: 583Member
    Originally posted by jinxxed0

    I'm seeing a ton of people say stuff that was said about Star Wars The Old Republic..

     

    "The IP will pull in SO many people. star wars has a huge fan base, the game will never fail"

     

    People are pulling assumptions out of their butts without taking anything else into consideration except for the way they THINK the world works. This game will do fine in sales. So many casual players will buy the game because most people don't sit there and look at info for unreleased games for years, months or weeks. They see an ad for it or see it at a store, recognize it from seeing it (or something similar multiple times, it captures their eyes and they try it out. thats the only reason WoW became big. Not because of the name or anything, but because they had millions of dollars put into advertising which is STILL unheard of with western MMOs. It's very common with korean MMOs which is why many of those MMOs have 2-10 times the player base that WoW had at it's *peak*. Everyone acts like WoW is some sort of great MMO that can never be touched. It came be if publishers stop being complete idiots and invest heavily in a good marketing team.

     

    Watch. The next MMO Blizzard makes, they'll likely use the same marketing tactics and get just as many people or more. They'll easily reach all the people they've reached before and even more people who still don't know the concept of MMOs. Blizzard got to people who never heard of MMOs and never even thought they'd be playing games. The advertised on TV which is something only a few western MMOs have done. They're the ONLY ones to have done it with an extreme budget for it in the west. The social network Zwinky, ran an ad campaign for about a MONTH and their membership skyrocketed. Why didn't do it longer than that, I have no idea. Maybe they attracted people they didnt want playing their game? Who knows.

     

    But the point is, if TES advertised on mainstream media and not just to people who already freaking know about the game by running googling ads to gaming sites, then they'll reach a ton of people. I'd be willing to bet that more than 60% of all Skyrim and Oblivion etc players are not even slightly aware of a new TES game. Of the ones that do hear about it, about 5-10% will think it's just a new game made by the same people who made skyrim, and will be ignorant enough to try and pirate it. And like many MMOs all the torrent sites will have it for some reason and they'll wonder why they cant play it even though they downloaded it. Yahoo answers will be flooded with "can I play TES online in single player" and many variations of it. All of you people who came into MMOs after they became mainstream (post-WoW era) don't seem to get the fact that there billions of people out there who don't know what an mmo is. The millions of people WoW brought in is nothing compared to how many who still don't know "mmo" is. The collective people on this planet that play MMOs is very small. and made up mostly of asian players who play asian mmos.

     

     

    This game will likely trail off quickly like so many others. Game devs think that the mmo genre is the be all end all format for a world/story. The Matrix, Avatar, people think a pokemon mmo would be the best thing ever, etc etc. The very nature of MMOs puts restrictions on everything. And instead of letting you be a person that exists in the world, MMOs want everyone to be the single hero that saved the day. But that's another thing that's wrong with MMOs

     

    Your post is kind of missing the point of this thread tbh.

     

    The OP is asking specifically about box sales, so yes people mention the IP because that will be a big factor in box sales (as you yourself admit).

     

    Whether the game trails off quickly is down to content quality and speed of delivery, both these things games like SWTOR failed hard with

  • ShadanwolfShadanwolf Posts: 2,114Member Uncommon

    There is another segment that this game will appeal to

    -the segment of players that like faction conflict and pvp

    that pool of games is  large

    Matt Firor was one of the founders of DAOC..One would expect ESOL to be  a world class game  in that area.

     

  • nerovipus32nerovipus32 dublinPosts: 2,735Member
    The game would sell way more if it was b2p. I think zenimax have shot themselves in the foot with the subscription model.
  • nerovipus32nerovipus32 dublinPosts: 2,735Member
    Originally posted by Shadanwolf

    There is another segment that this game will appeal to

    -the segment of players that like faction conflict and pvp

    that pool of games is  large

    Matt Firor was one of the founders of DAOC..One would expect ESOL to be  a world class game  in that area.

     

    My bet is the factional pvp will be just as crappy as it was in swtor and gw2.

  • ZalmonZalmon Bloomington, INPosts: 319Member
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

    But for how many is the subscription a reason not to buy the game?

     

    I dont see them selling 10 million copies anytime soon... even tough next to the 10 million officially sold copies there are more then the double of that illegal copies roaming the world...

     

    The majority of casual gamers still has a problem paying a monthly subscription for online gaming...

     

    How many copies do they plan to sell in the first year after release?

    Yes because ESO isn't releasing on consoles. Duh!

  • SavageHorizonSavageHorizon ParisPosts: 2,067Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Shadanwolf

    There is another segment that this game will appeal to

    -the segment of players that like faction conflict and pvp

    that pool of games is  large

    Matt Firor was one of the founders of DAOC..One would expect ESOL to be  a world class game  in that area.

     

    Bragging rights PVP with no consequences get's boring real quick, just an endless cycle of the same old same old.

    Oh wait, someone can be emperor, okay.

    TESO is not DAOC no matter who's making the game.

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  • SovrathSovrath Boston Area, MAPosts: 18,453Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by nerovipus32
    The game would sell way more if it was b2p. I think zenimax have shot themselves in the foot with the subscription model.

    not at all they will need a certain amount of months' subs to help them make back their investment.

    If at any time those subs fall dangerously low then I can imagine that they will change the payment model.

  • JakdstripperJakdstripper logan lake, BCPosts: 2,126Member Uncommon

    it all depends on quality. if this game does indeed bring you into the TES world, and does feel like Skyrim it will be very popular. if it's just a recycled War/AcC/Rift/GW2/etc engine with a TES skin it will not. how many shortcuts were taken? how much care was taken to make it feel like the original single player game?

    TES became so incredibly popular because of quality. it's an incredibly well made game that has always pushed the graphical and immersive envelope.

     

    if this game is also incredibly well made it will be a success.

  • VorthanionVorthanion Laguna Vista, TXPosts: 2,117Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

    But for how many is the subscription a reason not to buy the game?

     

    I dont see them selling 10 million copies anytime soon... even tough next to the 10 million officially sold copies there are more then the double of that illegal copies roaming the world...

     

    The majority of casual gamers still has a problem paying a monthly subscription for online gaming...

     

    How many copies do they plan to sell in the first year after release?

    How many of them are fans on the console side?  Traditionally, console gamers do not embrace MMOs.

    image
  • TorvalTorval Oregon CountryPosts: 7,197Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

    Originally posted by Sleepyfish
    Originally posted by Torvaldr
    I think this game will sell well with MMO ESO fans. I don't think it's going to go over well with the non-mmo ESO fans. I don't know any ESO fan, among friends and family, that plan on playing this. Only one of them is an MMO player, but he doesn't plan on playing this one.

    I don't know many ESO fans who are MMO fans, I know a few DAOC and GW2 fans who like the idea of a DAOC clone with ESO graphics and races. I think most people understand that which is why despite the IP the Hype is not very high for this game. 

    Strange, i do not know many mmo players that did not play Skyrim....

     

    I have learned one thing, if the game is good enough and word gets around, people will buy despite the price...

    I do think many more people will buy the game than will subscribe. That's just a given.

    However, saying that you don't know many MMO players who didn't play Skyrim sort of supports the point I was making. If you're relying on that pool then the sales are going to be constrained. Most PC and console gamers I know don't play subscription games at all. They buy box fee games with DLC packs. I'm not saying they won't support the box fee (and likely free 30 days that comes with it), but I think it will detract from sales.

    It's not hard to conclude that a reasonable pool of the PC and Console gamers will not pick up a box title where they have to pay a subscription. I already expect that most MMO players will pick up the box and either play the free month or buy a 3 month sub. MMO gamers throw their money at any new release and then bitch about it later. That money is pretty much a given.

    In a round about way I'm sort of supporting your original premise that there is no way they're going to sell 10M+ copies like D3.

  • TorvalTorval Oregon CountryPosts: 7,197Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Jakdstripper

    it all depends on quality. if this game does indeed bring you into the TES world, and does feel like Skyrim it will be very popular. if it's just a recycled War/AcC/Rift/GW2/etc engine with a TES skin it will not. how many shortcuts were taken? how much care was taken to make it feel like the original single player game?

    TES became so incredibly popular because of quality. it's an incredibly well made game that has always pushed the graphical and immersive envelope.

     

    if this game is also incredibly well made it will be a success.

    TES became popular because the community could mod the poor quality production release. Could you imagine if Oblivion and Skyrim couldn't be modded?

    You're basically saying if they don't make it an mmo it will be popular. Of course if a game is well made it will be popular. What makes us think it will be any more well made than any other MMO in the last 10 years?

  • NadiaNadia Canonsburg, PAPosts: 11,866Member Common
    Originally posted by Torvaldr

    It's not hard to conclude that a reasonable pool of the PC and Console gamers will not pick up a box title where they have to pay a subscription.

     I'm sort of supporting your original premise that there is no way they're going to sell 10M+ copies like D3.

    true but D3 sales were PC only

    when Skyrim shipped 10 million units, it was across all platforms

    http://www.vg247.com/2011/12/16/skyrim-ships-10-million-units-worldwide-sets-steam-record/

     

    i agree w you

    its largely unknown how many console gamers are willing to maintain a monthly sub

  • ShadanwolfShadanwolf Posts: 2,114Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by nerovipus32
    Originally posted by Shadanwolf

    There is another segment that this game will appeal to

    -the segment of players that like faction conflict and pvp

    that pool of games is  large

    Matt Firor was one of the founders of DAOC..One would expect ESOL to be  a world class game  in that area.

     

    My bet is the factional pvp will be just as crappy as it was in swtor and gw2.

    The SWTOR and GW2 devs did not make DAOC.Matt F did.

    Faction conflict is a key core feature of ESOL.Faction conflict is not a core feature of SWTOR or GW2.Both are essentially pve games with pvp as a side feature.There is a difference. Firror knows world class rvr/pvp.He helped make the best rvr game ever made.

    Look at all the players who like to fight...world of tanks has over 60 million registered users

    League of legends over 70 million registered players

     

    the potential for ESOL is enormous.

  • SovrathSovrath Boston Area, MAPosts: 18,453Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Torvaldr
     

    TES became popular because the community could mod the poor quality production release. Could you imagine if Oblivion and Skyrim couldn't be modded?

    You're basically saying if they don't make it an mmo it will be popular. Of course if a game is well made it will be popular. What makes us think it will be any more well made than any other MMO in the last 10 years?

    Considering that the majority of sales were consoles, that don't have mods, I don't agree with your assessment at all.

    Both games are fine without mods. They have their issues, don't get me wrong, but most mods just change things to be "different" which is not the same as "Poor Quality".

    Now, there is some poor quality and we do have mods that address a few of those issues.

    But these games are completely playable without mods and the significantly larger console player base shows this.

  • TorvalTorval Oregon CountryPosts: 7,197Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Sovrath
    Originally posted by Torvaldr
     

    TES became popular because the community could mod the poor quality production release. Could you imagine if Oblivion and Skyrim couldn't be modded?

    You're basically saying if they don't make it an mmo it will be popular. Of course if a game is well made it will be popular. What makes us think it will be any more well made than any other MMO in the last 10 years?

    Considering that the majority of sales were consoles, that don't have mods, I don't agree with your assessment at all.

    Both games are fine without mods. They have their issues, don't get me wrong, but most mods just change things to be "different" which is not the same as "Poor Quality".

    Now, there is some poor quality and we do have mods that address a few of those issues.

    But these games are completely playable without mods and the significantly larger console player base shows this.

    You have some good points. However, the game actually worked well on the console and the controls were suited towards the platform.

    Even though console sales were huge, I think the overall success of the IP is heavily influenced by the modding community. The modding community drove a larger interest in the game. I don't think those console sales would have been nearly so high or the IP relevant without the modding community. I could be wrong and my opinion is subjective, but it does seem reasonable and the influence modding has on keeping an IP relevant has been acknowledged across other games.

    That shouldn't be construed that the game won't be successful though, but just tempered by how the single player PC and console gamers work. MMO gamers, overall, I expect to eat the IP up. It will be interesting to see the rest of the gamer demographic respond to a beloved game IP going traditional MMO.

  • SovrathSovrath Boston Area, MAPosts: 18,453Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Torvaldr
    Originally posted by Sovrath
    Originally posted by Torvaldr
     

    TES became popular because the community could mod the poor quality production release. Could you imagine if Oblivion and Skyrim couldn't be modded?

    You're basically saying if they don't make it an mmo it will be popular. Of course if a game is well made it will be popular. What makes us think it will be any more well made than any other MMO in the last 10 years?

    Considering that the majority of sales were consoles, that don't have mods, I don't agree with your assessment at all.

    Both games are fine without mods. They have their issues, don't get me wrong, but most mods just change things to be "different" which is not the same as "Poor Quality".

    Now, there is some poor quality and we do have mods that address a few of those issues.

    But these games are completely playable without mods and the significantly larger console player base shows this.

    You have some good points. However, the game actually worked well on the console and the controls were suited towards the platform.

    Even though console sales were huge, I think the overall success of the IP is heavily influenced by the modding community. The modding community drove a larger interest in the game. I don't think those console sales would have been nearly so high or the IP relevant without the modding community. I could be wrong and my opinion is subjective, but it does seem reasonable and the influence modding has on keeping an IP relevant has been acknowledged across other games.

    That shouldn't be construed that the game won't be successful though, but just tempered by how the single player PC and console gamers work. MMO gamers, overall, I expect to eat the IP up. It will be interesting to see the rest of the gamer demographic respond to a beloved game IP going traditional MMO.

    I would agree that mods could have furthered sales however my thought about them is that they maintain the game's identity in the minds of gamers.

    So the launching of skyrim (or any elder scrolls game that had mods) isn't so much "fire and forget". They create a lifespan that is well beyond the launch of the main title as well as the dlc additions.

     

  • LpchaosLpchaos Calhoun, GAPosts: 8Member

    Let me set this straight. I am a HUGE skyrim fan. But I hate what this mess is.

    I'd take Skyrim + 4 player join in co-op over this garbage anyday.

  • Lord.BachusLord.Bachus Den HelderPosts: 9,064Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Lpchaos

    Let me set this straight. I am a HUGE skyrim fan. But I hate what this mess is.

    I'd take Skyrim + 4 player join in co-op over this garbage anyday.

    You obviously have no idea what you are writing about....  Calling an unfinished under NDA product garbish? sounds like you made your mind up not even knowing 10% of the facts, which in the world of grown ups makes you sound like a....

    Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)

  • SleepyfishSleepyfish Ashville, NCPosts: 363Member
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus
    Originally posted by Lpchaos

    Let me set this straight. I am a HUGE skyrim fan. But I hate what this mess is.

    I'd take Skyrim + 4 player join in co-op over this garbage anyday.

    You obviously have no idea what you are writing about....  Calling an unfinished under NDA product garbish? sounds like you made your mind up not even knowing 10% of the facts, which in the world of grown ups makes you sound like a....

    Are we pretending that there has been no information on the game at all and that know one knows its essentially a GW2 clone? If they are trying to hype and market this game now then its up to them to put the game in a positive light. If they have already tried to do so and it Still gets negative responses as is the case, then it stands to reason they probably made the wrong development decision.

  • deakondeakon birminghamPosts: 583Member
    Originally posted by Sleepyfish
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus
    Originally posted by Lpchaos

    Let me set this straight. I am a HUGE skyrim fan. But I hate what this mess is.

    I'd take Skyrim + 4 player join in co-op over this garbage anyday.

    You obviously have no idea what you are writing about....  Calling an unfinished under NDA product garbish? sounds like you made your mind up not even knowing 10% of the facts, which in the world of grown ups makes you sound like a....

    Are we pretending that there has been no information on the game at all and that know one knows its essentially a GW2 clone? If they are trying to hype and market this game now then its up to them to put the game in a positive light. If they have already tried to do so and it Still gets negative responses as is the case, then it stands to reason they probably made the wrong development decision.

    In what way is it a gw2 clone? They share hardly any mechanics what so ever, the only thing they share is 3 faction pvp, which was pioneered by DAoC, and guess what game the lead designer of teso is famous for?

  • GardavsshadeGardavsshade Cedar Springs, MIPosts: 756Member Uncommon

    In regards to those who say it is too early to decide about TESO I have this to say...

    I already know enough about TESO to know I am not interested in spending money and time on it. .... and the information I used during my decision making process is information publicly known that is NOT under the constraints of the NDA. For me this was enough. (I am not saying it won't be "good", I am just saying "not interested due to design". )

    However many other Players will want more info... and IT IS available. Now add to the already released public info more specific  information that is not widely known but available from sources such as.... Players who are beta testers but are not allowed to discuss their participation but have played and not liked what they saw,... leaked info concerning TESO that has "a way of getting around" and is available if you know the right "whom" and "where" to inquire, Beta Testers conferring "offline" between themselves, and etc., etc., and there you have it. Enough information for many People to decide already whether they are going to look forward to this new MMO or move on. NDA or no NDA there are a thousand ways any MMO beta info can and will be acquired by those who wish to do so.

    It is not unreasonable that some Players have already made their decision concerning this MMO in a mature and thoughtful manner. This is a good thing, a positive, as Players like me that would not be happy with the game will not purchase and play and then complain they don't like it.

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