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What games most shaped your outlook on what your ideal MMORPG should be?
Vermillion_Raventhal
Member EpicPosts: 4,198
I would have to say that Ultima 7: Black Gate was the guide. My experience in that game is what lead me to look for online multiplayer games literally. A search for a mod to play multiplayer is how I found UO. I love the NPC that had lives and made me wonder what a game would be like with everyone living out there lives online.
UO would be the number one MMORPG. I expected all games to be like UO after playing it. A wonderful virtual world. This was what set my taste for Sandboxes. It was flawed but it was fun.
EQ is a mixed bag for me. Back then it seemed like a step back to just a leveling treadmill game. I was not enamored with the game like a lot of people. But I've come to appreciate a lot of the things it brought such has cooperation, factions, lore, and challenge that are lacking today.
I would say Horizons. The original vaporware version not the Istaria: Chronicles of the Gifted it became. Back then I used to follow games with a naive gleam in my eyes and dream of these ultimate games that would never be. It was bringing all that was UO together with the best of EQs races, lore etc. The game was supposed to have craftable player events to unlock content I guess similar to EQ:Next Rally Calls. Dynamic invasion from monsters controlled by DM. Races that were supposed to be always at war. Rare races that were only obtainable by rolling for them at creation. Player built kingdoms and deep crafting. Never got anywhere near that though.
Lastly, I would say WoW. WoW simply for its presentation of UI and quest. Its polish and refinement were unmatched at release. It's the ground level of what you expect for a modern MMO to play like.
Comments
SWG without hesitation. I thought all mmos would be like that in the future haha!
I forget SWG. Not the game but so much of my interactions and discussion with Raph during the prebeta and early beta phase. The crafting part of the game was genius.
Yup same here, I felt we gotten a step closer to having virtual sci-fi/fantasy worlds. Even though I started with Meridian59, followed by UO and EQ I did try a couple of times but it just didn't really click with me. Then SWG came and a complete new type of gameworld was created, finaly one I was free in what ever I wanted within the basic rules of the Star Wars Galaxies. I thought this genre would gofar beyond it's virtual world promise we already had a taste of.....
Mannnn was I wrong............
Lineage 1/2 , DAOC, Shadowbane, and EVE are the core games that influence my desire for MMORPGs with territory/resource control and denial of same to others.
It wasn't until I played WOW that I realized there were alternate game designs that focused on raiding and gear grinding.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Honestly for me it was two games: SWG and Vanilla WoW
When I played those two titles I envisioned a truly AAA polished MMORPG with the accessibility, ease of learning of WoW, the depth and broad scope of SWG and the wonderful gameworld and lore of both (not both worlds just that quality of IP). Unfortunately we all saw how that went but my dream lives on....
They made me envision the sort of game that would expand to have features like the kind I listed in my thread:
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/397689/15-Things-I-Really-Want-In-An-MMO.html
UO and WoW, with some GW2 sprinkled on it. Which can seem funny to some, since for those some, they seem to be polar opposites.
UO brings the sandbox aspect, the high interaction between the players, the 100% skill based character development without classes, and the non-instanced world, and WoW brings the polish, the comfort features (mail, AH, etc...) and the true 3D world, as well as the excellent group encounter designs, while GW2 brings the dynamic world and world content instead of the boring static questing and heavy instancing of Wow and clones.
It's also funny some mention DAoC for "resource/territiorial control" when AO (Anarchy Online) did this 100x better in Notum Wars... what DAoC did to the genre is in my opinion quite bad, it introduced instanced/zoned PvP and battleground, worst thing that happened to PvP in MMO history so far.
My computer is better than yours.
Ragnarok Online
open world and no channels that segregate players
i was able to make so many friends in that game
UO - For the more sandboxish game play, housing options.
EQ - 3D, group play, continual system with AAs, raiding, leveling pace (could be a little faster, but mmos now are way too fast), and my con from EQ and it sticks with me is I got to really dislike instances when it went too far in that direction imo.
DAoC - RvR
VG - Crafting/Harvesting/Diplomacy
Ultima Online for the sheer amount of options that could be in a MMORPG. The systems/choices were many and pretty complex if I remember right. Also, I loved the housing.
Everquest for building relationships and setting a great pace to enjoy the game. This game showed me how it's possible to build and encourage deep relationships with other players. It also felt like the perfect pace. It was slow enough that I could sit and chat with friends while playing (In-game, actual typing, no mic) and still enjoy it while solo.
World of Warcraft for accessibility and combat. They made the game and its options easy enough to understand and use without having to read a large manual or put in an insane amount of hours to 'get it'. Also, the combat FEELS great, it's very responsive.
Final Fantasy XI for charm. Something about the story/setting that made it feel really nice to be in that world. It felt alive and deep and very simply, fun.
Guild Wars 2 for polish. This game shined on day one of release. They did a great job of making the game feel very polished and complete. Nothing in the game felt half-ass.
The Secret World for storytelling. I want novels and movies based on this game. I think it's genius. This is a story that simply feels too good for a MMORPG.
That's all I can think of at the moment. These games set the bar for me in those categories and continue to influence how I view new games.
Anarchy Online: Territorial warfare, public dungeons, a huge and complex character development system, solid lore... Other than polish, AO succeeded at a lot of things. Too bad FunCom abandoned it in favor of the floppy AoC.
Guild Wars: While not a real MMO, GW has the best progression I've ever seen. It's fast, it's fair and it's long. ANet made some mistakes later in the development with the introduction of grindy PvE skills, but it's still a great system I'd hope more games to use. Also: monsters using the same skills as you and hunting specific bosses for elite skills.
WoW: I suppose it's influenced everyone by now. I'm not a WoW fan and never have been, but it's still a notable game, especially in its indirect influence on other games.
SWTOR: Showed me what my ideal MMORPG wouldn't be like.
Guild Wars 2: Dynamic Events are an excellent addition to typical PvE and GW2 is the first game to do them well. It screwed up most of what made GW1 special, but added lots of nice touches and is still full of potential. Unfortunately, ANet seems to just sit on that potential. Here's hoping for an expansion.
swg showed me community crafting and what a sandbox could be like
wow showed me what structured PvE content could be like
SWTOR showed me what a personal story could be like
TERA showed me what mmo combat should be like
Those are the games that have had the biggest positives for me.
Negatives would be
EvE showed me I don't really like space pvp sandbox games, and that really mmo pvp just isn't for me.
Neverwinter showed me I don't like a world that is all instances with no open world.
uncharted waters showed me I don't like..nor am I capable of competing against hard core asian grinders :P
A lot of my perceived ideal is elements that MMOs haven't really touched greatly upon yet.
One MMO that did impact me pretty greatly was Planetside, because I followed that title from it's early development into it's release. The technology, ideas, and implementation they had for that game were quite varied and very interesting. Timing was poor however, as their ambitions outweighed the capability of the hardware, and elements of the game were straight up removed to make it stable enough to play.
That game showed me though that an action based game play with a open and interactive world was possible. With progress, the hardware could catch up to the aspirations of such developers, and we could see world with great conflicts between armies, with players leading the charge among AI soldiers and not simply siege bases, but wage war against towns, cities, and onward.
In that same vein. Star Wars Battlefront dosplayed a part of the direction I wished to see such things integrate. The ability to unify and seamlessly transition between terrestrial conflicts into battles in space between fleets, and have both directly and indirectly influencing one another.
Kingdom Under Fire and Mount & Blade would be other war games that I found desire to see features merged with. Layered gameplay mechanics that let you control a war on a macro scale as well as on a micro scale through your avatar. Dungeon Keeper 2 being another iteration I am fond of.
Saga of Ryzom is a second MMO of great influence. An MMO with an ecosystem, seasons and weather, and a skill mechanic predicated not simply on learning any mix of things, but customizing the very abilities you wield.
Spore as well was a title that I look at for the kind of things I want. Not the gameplay itself so much as all the tools that enabled the gameplay. The creature creation, item and vehicle designs, buildings, and the scalability it offered.
All these games showed me elements that could stack and interact with one another to provide different forms of gameplay that all integrate into the same world for a broader experience.
"The knowledge of the theory of logic has no tendency whatever to make men good reasoners." - Thomas B. Macaulay
"The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." - Daniel J. Boorstin
WoW - smoothness and Blizzard's efficiency of implementing ideas.
EVE - Depth of systems
Age of Wushu - Meaningful pvp woven into the fabric of the game. No region locks. A true cultural exchange.
Diablo .. the first one.
It shows that a game can be extra good if it focuses, and not try to put everything into it.
first and foremost....EvE Online. Still the best MMO out there.
DF1-the idea/concept was awesome. Implementation...not so much. Still, enjoyed my time for the most part.
Pirates of the Burning Seas- personally enjoy pirate themed games, like the character creation, enjoyed the world...maybe the worst combat I've ever played. Sid Meier's Pirates! had better fighting and that is older than many of the people playing PotBS.
Saga of Ryzom-loved the weather/climate changes, crafting your own abilites was pretty cool, the world was damn near dead back when I played it.
City of Heroes-Fun characters to build and play. Got old fast. PvP was pretty bad after CoX came out. Didn't stick around to see it all.
LoTRO-beautifully crafted world, nice community, started to realize why I hated gold question marks over peoples heads after a week. Crafting was interesting.
Age of Conan-another beautifully crafted world. First 20 levels(starter Island) was awesome. Seemed to try to cater visually to a more mature crowd. Couldn't find hardly anyone to play with. Crafting was terrible. f2p options restricted all but 4 character choices which was counter productive to me. *this has been changed apparently*
If I could find a MMO that was like DF or even a pirate or a wild west themed open world sandbox...I would be all in.
World of Darkness is like waking up after going out and remembering you had the sexiest girls number in the club written on your hand and now it's smudged off. It's out there, you just can't find it.
Playing: BF4/BF:Hardline, Subnautica 7 days to die
Hiatus: EvE
Waiting on: World of Darkness(sigh)
Interested in: better games in general
Like many others who have posted....UO would be mine. Second by SWG. Those two games had everything virtual worlds should have. No follow the yellow brick road laid out for you. Just wonder around, adventure, create the style of character that suited your own personal playstyle. Combat, crafting, personal housing, boats (UO), space flight (SWG),pvp and pve all combined created great communities.
A warrior was dependant on the crafter to make weapons. The crafter was dependant on the resource gatherer to sell the crafting material. Every role was important and mattered.
Though I played a few MMOs before WoW, such as Neocron, Earth and Beyond, SWG, and EVE, I still think Vanilla WoW was my ideal MMO. Not for the raiding, trinity, quest hubs, or gear grind. Mainly becuase of the two distinct faction PVP rule set that forced the two factions to eventually cross paths during the leveling up part of the game. The world pvp at WoW's launch was some of the most fun I have had in a game. I also actually liked their BGs when they first put them in as well and getting my pvp rank to lieutenant commander. I also loved WoW's world and sound design. Simply brilliant.
Judging by that one would think Wildstar would be up my alley, but I will probably pass on that one for various reasons.
"If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor
EQ did for a lot of reasons for me. The non instanced spawn camping dungeons are better than what we see these days in every way imo. The scope of the world, the fact it was hard to get around. The fact you had tough mobs mixed in with the normal ones. The overall difficulty of the mobs compared to the solo player etc. Not to mention it was the best PvP experience I ever had, which is just pathetic since they spent no time at all on balancing it. PvP to control PvE is just so much better than PvP in a box.
I will give props to UO here because it had a ton of great ideas. The problem is the coding itself and the basic game design were just horrible, the game was so exploitable and buggy that it was hard to play it for me.
WoW for the smoothness of gameplay. Very few games have matched it since with GW2 being one of the rare ones. Things like Rift, Aion, SWTOR are just so darn clunky compared to WoW (not to mention disasters like WAR).
For the non MMORPG I'd also bring up Dragon's Gate and Dragonrealms. Two MUDs that I played heavily before the market moved to a graphical based game. Also AD&D and Rolemaster which got me into these types of games in the first place.
Finally I'll give a shout out to Star Fleet Battles. That is the game that made me love tactical combat, something almost every MMORPG made has completely failed at sadly, they just keep making them more and more simplistic instead of more complex. Makes no sense to me.
___________________________
Have flask; will travel.
EQ comes to my mind first. It wa my first MMORPG, after all. What it had was actual conversations between players and NPCs. You actually typed on the keyboard what you wanted your character to say, with little [hints] given by the NPCs for the keywords they were looking for. Wanted to be snarky? You could do it. Wanted to be nice? Easy as pie. Being evil was just typing the appropriate words on the keyboard. Of course, the NPCs did not react to anything but the keywords needed. They cared not HOW a player said things.
The typing out a character's words was one aspect, another being languages. Being able to learn over 20 languages in EQ was a great "time sink" for me! Sitting in language groups was great fun for me as the gibberish others were typing slowly started to make sense as you learned the language
Once learned, you could understand other players using different languages instead of seeing gibberish on the screen.
EQ's death penalty helped form my ideal of failure in battle in MMORPGs. I enjoyed corpse runs (usually), and found players to help me when the need arose. The death penalty was the reason I rolled my first Monk character. Don't need a weapon to fight with a monk class
The last thing EQ set in my mind as "this is an MMORPG" was the combat. It took forever, compared to today's swipe, bash, stab, dead combat. I found myself patting myself on the back if the combat music did not restart during a fight in solo play. Unless you were a spell user, you had at best 4-6 abilities, some of them tied to the same global cool down. Monks had lots of kicks and punches. But they were all on the same cool down timer. Fighters had a bash ability if they had a shield and a kick ability. Dodge abilities came up as a dice roll and you kept an eye on the combat dialogue to see if someone dodged, blocked, or parried. No button mashing there. Players actually talked during fights with groups. This was pre-teamspeak, et al. Downtime after fights was a good time to rest, recover, plan, and chat.
EQ tainted my MMORPG experience by making it very, very hard to play without others to help after about level 15-20. Some players were good and some classes were better suited to solo play than others, but for the normal player, soloing was not a good or viable option.
City of Heroes helped expand on the solo aspect. Soloing was very viable in this MMORPG, with few exceptions (like the Controller archetype). Grouping was fun because you wanted to group, not because you had to in order to play. You were able to be more picky with whom you grouped with instead of taking any old group, just to be able play the game.
CoH also showed me that MMOs could have good graphics, like trees that swayed with the wind instead of static bulky things, physics that had models flying across the screen with massive hits, girders on elevated railways that a player could actually fly through!
CoH also brought to me the reactions of NPCs and what a player did in the game. Random NPCs would make comments as you walked, ran, leaped, or flew by them about your adventures and achievements. Some even wanted to elect you President!
Those were the 2 most influential MMORPGs that shaped my outlook on MMORPGs as a whole and what they could be.
I have yet to play an MMORPG that has shown me good crafting.
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.- FARGIN_WAR