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To the person who said "SLOW is not the same as thoughtful"it might not carry the same definition but it most certainly goes hand in hand.
Confusing IF you have no open mind and have locked your thinking into one game such as Wow.If you think EVERY game should follow the exact same design and setup as your last game or favorite game,then you are not open minded.
Two or three shotting an enemy will NEVER have any thought to it,you have to have slower combat to have better combat,there is absolutely no argument for it.You have to have time to form reactions and reactions in combat,if there is not enough time,then it becomes nothing more than a full max dps game with little if any thought.
I can use a simple example from my FFXI combat.
You would start with casting spells like Paralyze then Slow,then Blind,then you need time to heal ,time to Haste players.Then certain fights might have you constantly casting Utsusemi for shadows or Gravity/Bind/Sleep for kiting or recovery.None of that can happen if combat is too fast.Imo going say a direction like GW2 adding in multiple actions under one click is a poor design,it cheapens combat.No way could i ever see any realism in dodging and getting some buff from it,you should be forced to cast or use a buff to get it.
There is so much to comment on that i see people simply don't understand game design.You can't plot 30 mobs in close proximity and all have brilliant AI and movement,it just can't happen.There are most certainly mobs in game that do move around.There is no better game for AI than FFXI,so not sure what game we are comparing to when talking 1999?Wow mobs are stagnant,EQ2 mobs are stagnant,Rift,GW2,Aion all the same.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Originally posted by Wizardry As good as it is,the game still is not as good as FFXI,i cannot pry myself from FFXI to play FFXIV just yet. The game does deserve some credit,it is well done but not as in depth as i would like it.It is still a VERY early game and already has more going for it than some games that have been around for years.I expect the ideas and content to grow decently over the coming years.This game unfortunately had to spend the last year fixing and tweaking the existing game for the relaunch,so the team has not been able to move forward just yet. My feeling is they made a mistake on the core design when comes to combat/class and going for solo/group content.There is too much push on solo,FFXI was better served with zero solo content,no questing xp,no dailies or this FATE system.As soon as Square started to get greedy and try and copy other games,it started down the wrong path.You retain longevity with a niche game,not a mainstream game.Wow is ALWAYS a bad example to compare,that game garnered brand new gamer's,it was their first mmorpg ever,so to them it was different than anything they ever played.That will never happen again,so you need to be different. I guess for those that never played FFFXI,they will never see the comparison,in those cases FFXIV definitely can be seen as a rally good game and a much better looking game as well.It is that core design however that i feel will bottleneck this game from improving to where i want to see it go.I never got to higher levels to see if it reaches that pinnacle but when i play FFXI ,i actually have more fun at lower levels,i don't like to wait to have fun.
Its a good game 1-50, aesthetics are the strong point.
At the same time, FF14ARR is a deeply flawed game as well:
1. The server checks clients actions every 300ms, which makes combat basically on a 300ms delay in addition to your latency to server. Huge problem. Whatever you see on your screen, like dodging a red circle of death in a boss fight - the server won't see your action for 300ms which unless you react early to offset this will equal to your character's death
2. Leveling is very fast, you can exhaust all endgame content in less than a month
3. Small game world
4. Fate grinding once quest content is exhausted can be mind numbing
5. Uninteresting item progression - +1 stat system
6. One main important stat for many classes - makes the classes feel one dimensional.
I can't say this review is very useful, since it looks like you only took under consideration your own personal preferences when writing those pros and cons.
Praising the graphics is already a sign of the lack of objectivity, since technically there is nothing special about them even for a mmo in 2013, and impressions on design depend on personal taste.
I never understand the argument that controls are tight and responsive. It's been 10 years I think since I played a game that had any lag in controls, and I don't even know what "tight" means when talking about controls.
Like someone said here, speed doesn't determine complexity and difficulty. Is something is fast, it doesn't mean it is easy or brainless, and also if something is slow it doesn't mean it is automatically more interesting and strategic. It can be just slow, and that is my personal impression in that game.
Should I praise a role playing game for having roles? All the other pros you wrote is just praising mmorpg for being mmorpg. It does not belong to "pros" just because it is. Like writing in "pros" of FPS "you can shoot".
I always go offensive mode, when I see someone sharing his feelings instead of writing solid review.
You should at least try to approach complaints that are all over the forum, instead of avoiding them and just writing what you felt.
Your conclusion is also irritating, if you want to be treated seriously you shouldn't write ridiculous things like "buy the game" because you liked it. Just my five cents.
Originally posted by Mr.Kujo
-a bunch of stupid stuff followed by...- You should at least try to approach complaints that are all over the forum, instead of avoiding them and just writing what you felt.
Pray tell, what exactly is a review other than the factual sharing of thoughts, experiences, and opinion of in-game functions?
Originally posted by Elderknight Got warning for saying i dislike this game, so will go into detail why, other then just saying no ! 1. Gold spamers 2. No end game 3. No Pvp 4. Server lag issues with aoe, or Dodge the red dots problem. 5. smal zones, invis walls all over. 6. Leves = more solo instance. 7. not 1 open world dungeon all instanced. 8. Loot seems bland, not many options even the unique gear out the dungeons, just not many items. 9. after 3 weeks, had hard time even wanting to log back into game, donated my gil to the guild, and didn't reup my monthly. 50 WHM, Crafting 50 Alch with lots of other clases lvled some, was going to max Paladin but just got boring lvled up my glad to 22. Got pulled into the hype, was it worth 30$ myb.
Hafta agree. And could add a few other things. Such as the worst map I have ever seen in an MMO. The armor looks almost comical at times, and often bland and looks the same all over.
Got pulled into the hype myself and found myself once again feeling a bit ripped off. I wouldn't even say worth the 30 bucks. Right now could jump into any F2P MMO with as many options and as much gameplay as this one offers.
As for the title of this post aimed at the MMO vets...I been on almost every MMO since 98 in Ultima online and EQ. So I do count myself as an MMO vet. And the review was pretty one sided almost sounding to me like someone very limited in playing MMOs.
Originally posted by rojo6934 Originally posted by Hyanmen Originally posted by rojo6934
Replace sidequests with giving experience by doing other things outside of "questing and fates".
With a concrete example like that, now it's just up to the devs to change it!
The same way that GW2 gives experience by doing anything, that is a good way to replace side quests. Any player activity they can come up with that doesnt involve questing can earn experience and effectively replace the nonsensical side quests.
Stop it .. its the same exact filler stuff in GW2 as every other game .. you just dont have the quest in alog .. they kepp it for you behind the game .. But when you approach an area and " Mary the Farmer " needs help to squash worms , put out fires .. collect apples , and you are getting xp for those actions .. its the same exact thing..GW2 does nothing special at all ..
The game might be very well good, but the question is (at least in my case) what does it do that differentiates from you typical run of the mill MMO? Rift is a good MMO, but it's a rehash of the same ol' same ol' so it never could keep my attention. I've seen whats be regurgitated as a "yet another on rails themepark" MMO with FF XIV ARR. What I want is a new MMO that does not rehash so many of the old concepts and brings nothing new to the table.
CU, SotA, and PFO have my interests perked because they are actually designing a game that veers off the well beaten path of MMOs. Will they be successful? Who knows, but am willing to support em to find out. WS looks very good but I fear it's like ARR in that it's just a rehash of the same ol' same ol' without enough innovative ideals. Combat looks fun but that can get old real quick. ESO relies too heavily on an IP and is questionable of how the game will turn out.
Also the sub is not "cheap," it is the standard fare which it does not allow a PLEX equivilent system. Unless they changed it.
Originally posted by tristanryan If you haven't tried it yet and are on the fence, you should definitely try it. Its only 30.00$ USD. Mini review incoming; Cons; -A growing elitist community at max. This can also be seen as a positive aspect. Even if you don't agree with certain attitudes or playstyles it still makes competitiveness in the community which is absolutely needed in an MMO.
as soon as you said this it was a big fat NO. F those elitist pigs
Originally posted by Alamareth Originally posted by Mr.Kujo
-a bunch of stupid stuff followed by...-
That is definately a "smart" way to start a conversation....
I think maybe some need to upgrade their systems.. or update software... or change ISP.
I get zero delay. Its not that i don't notice a 300ms delay either. There isn't any. As said in the OP, its tight and responsive. Im referring to open world and dungeon play, as well as in a crowded city with players all over the place. Im not doubting people get performance issues, im just stating its definitely not this way for everyone.
And 2nd, on the exact same note. The graphics are *stunning*. There is nothing about these graphics that feel "low pixel" or second rate. If i can stand in a field while in a forest, and see individual swaying of foliage moving with the wind, at the exact same time the trees are alive as well, with godrays of sunshine coming down upon it all and you say this is "average for the typical mmo"......
You can even get close to the mobs in the game and see the detail. As gamers we over look this and just mow down everything killing as fast as possible. Next time stop and check it out. There is also weather in the zones, ive noticed rain in several places. Fog as well. The night time sky is VERY well done.
Lol come on guys. Give me a specific game and we will debate...
The game has its issues (we all agree) but some of the misinformation being posted isn't fair.
Originally posted by tristanryan I think maybe some need to upgrade their systems.. or update software... or change ISP. I get zero delay. Its not that i don't notice a 300ms delay either. There isn't any. As said in the OP, its tight and responsive. Im referring to open world and dungeon play, as well as in a crowded city with players all over the place. Im not doubting people get performance issues, im just stating its definitely not this way for everyone.
You are getting a 300ms delay. Everyone is. SE/Yoshi-P has stated, quite plainly, that it's there.
Don't confuse "I'm not noticing it" with "it isn't there".
It's one thing to contradict the claims of other players. But when you're contradicting the words of the Game's Director/Producer themself... Well, you start to look rather silly.
Originally posted by TangentPoint Originally posted by tristanryan I think maybe some need to upgrade their systems.. or update software... or change ISP. I get zero delay. Its not that i don't notice a 300ms delay either. There isn't any. As said in the OP, its tight and responsive. Im referring to open world and dungeon play, as well as in a crowded city with players all over the place. Im not doubting people get performance issues, im just stating its definitely not this way for everyone.
I have zero delay.. Melee or spellcasting. I do queue skills, maybe thats why i have no delay. And also can you provide a link with Yoshi saying no matter the player, operating system, ISP, or PC specs every player will have a delay? Please link.
You say i look silly? You are trying to tell me how my game performs from my living room. Im telling you my experience and you are coming behind me and saying no no, this is not your experience you look silly.... And you think Im the one that looks silly? lol
Zero delay, and link please if you have the time.
I found some info and it looks like you are correct that there is an issue in specific dungeons that is being corrected. Ill provide a few links for anyone curious. But, just to reiterate, it hasn't effected my gameplay at all (yet). Hopefully for those experiencing this it will be fixed soon!
Originally posted by tristanryan Originally posted by TangentPoint Originally posted by tristanryan I think maybe some need to upgrade their systems.. or update software... or change ISP. I get zero delay. Its not that i don't notice a 300ms delay either. There isn't any. As said in the OP, its tight and responsive. Im referring to open world and dungeon play, as well as in a crowded city with players all over the place. Im not doubting people get performance issues, im just stating its definitely not this way for everyone.
Okay, so you're determined to look silly. I'll keep that in mind when reading your future posts.
Your attempt to pre-emptively move the goal-post is both extremely obvious (listing a bunch of specific criteria to "convince" you), and pointless. The issue is happening at SE's end, so none of those things you're listing would make a difference anyway. They'd exacerbate the situation, but they wouldn't create it.
Your "demands" succeed only in demonstrating your ignorance of the situation, and your obstinance in refusing to accept that you're mistaken.
Yes, I'm saying you look rather silly by insisting a delay that has been officially acknowledged as being present by the Producer/Director themself somehow isn't there for you. I'm suggesting that you may not notice it, which is fine. However, "not noticing it" does not mean "it's not there".
As you wish.
From this post.
Thing of interest - "Being an online game, there will always be a minimal delay when input is received from the player and sent back after being processed by the server. In FFXIV: ARR, your position is checked by the server once every 0.3 seconds. This timing is synced and processed according to the servers to prevent lag between your input and what you see."
So, there is a .3 second delay between the server and the client designed into the game.
Ergo, you - like everyone - are experience an at least .3 second delay when you are playing. It's intended to offset any delays in the connection, but it can also *cause* delay where none might otherwise exist.
As I said before, whether or not you "notice" it in your living room, or anywhere else, regardless of your hardware, is irrelevant. It's there.
Originally posted by tristanryan I think maybe some need to upgrade their systems.. or update software... or change ISP. And 2nd, on the exact same note. The graphics are *stunning*. There is nothing about these graphics that feel "low pixel" or second rate. If i can stand in a field while in a forest, and see individual swaying of foliage moving with the wind, at the exact same time the trees are alive as well, with godrays of sunshine coming down upon it all and you say this is "average for the typical mmo"...... Lol come on guys. Give me a specific game and we will debate...
Just a note, if something is working fine on your PC it doesn't mean it will work on all possible PC component combinations, worse or better than yours. You can't blame other people connections and PCs if something is not working for them, only because it is not happening to you. Games tend to work differently on different rigs and it is developers job to eliminate incompatibility issues and bugs.
I will give you specific example about the graphics, I am saying that graphics are technically the same as in any other recent game, so the difference comes down to execution, which is completely subjective thing.
I personally don't like the absence of metal or any other material types in the game, every character looks like it is made out of playdoh on every game settings. Skin, clothing, metal are all matte.
I know it is not technical limitation, just weird choice in design. The effect is even more intensified because environment tries to be as realistic as possible, yet characters are stylized to plastic and look out of place. It probably doesn't bother you, and you probably didn't noticed, yet it annoyed the hell out of me, so like I said...personal taste, but saying "graphics are incredible" is highly subjective.
Played: AA, AC1, AC2, Aion, AO, AoC, CO, CoX, DAoC, DCUO, DN, EVE, EQ1, EQ2, ESO, FE, FFXI, FFXIV, FF, GW1, GW2, Istaria, L2, LoTRO, MO, MxO, NW, Rift, RoE,Ryzom, SB, SWG, SWTOR, TERA, TSW, WAR, WoW, WURM...
I followed up my post with actual links to that conversation (that you chose to ignore). Pulling a few paragraphs and posting them to reddit without the full conversation is hardly proof lol. The original post, is in the links i provided btw.
Also, those posts are months old, with the actual fixes being discussed by the producer in the very post. The "delay" you are referring to is commonplace in all MMO games. We are talking .1 to .3 seconds here. Given this, with how SE designed certain boss fights and AoE it caused issues. If you actually read the link you posted, or the ones i posted before that, certain fixes have already been implemented with more on the way.
Im sure there will be responses saying "blah blah this is only FFXIV" and to that i say every single MMO on the planet communicates with their respective data server.
My feeling is that a lot of us are just plain jaded and have come to a point to where we will literally look for anything we can complain about.
I enjoy the game and advise others to give it a try!
I would say FFXIV is a good game. It's technically responsive, it's balanced, it's got a decent musical score, etc.
I would also say that it's a short game that lacks foresight, innovation, an end-game, and a fun-factor once you complete it.
I think the title is inaccurate because if you're an MMO vet, you'll get hit with the "Been there, done that" feeling very early on. However, for MMO amateurs and first-timers, this would be a great investment.
Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Originally posted by Cymdai I would say FFXIV is a good game. It's technically responsive, it's balanced, it's got a decent musical score, etc. I would also say that it's a short game that lacks foresight, innovation, an end-game, and a fun-factor once you complete it. I think the title is inaccurate because if you're an MMO vet, you'll get hit with the "Been there, done that" feeling very early on. However, for MMO amateurs and first-timers, this would be a great investment.
MMO vet here since Ashrons Call enjoying the game as well as my whole free company who are MMO vets as well but at least you said I think.
So far I've been enjoying my game life in sub 50 content. I'm tired of the get to the end and run the treadmill type of game, while the FFXIV has that as well, there is plenty to mess with before that is all there is. By time i'm done with leveling all combat/craft/gather classes, 2.1 should be here or near.
Originally posted by tristanryan If you haven't tried it yet and are on the fence, you should definitely try it. Its only 30.00$ USD. Mini review incoming; Pros; -Amazing graphics for a MMO. I play on a PC, i cant comment on PS3. The foliage. The fauna. Water and ripple effects. Night skies. Cities. Armors. Weapons and spell effects. The godrays of sunshine. Day/night cycles. Your robe blowing in the wind. The sparks flying off of ore when mining, splinters off trees... etc etc. Spell effects are quite impressive. Its polished, immersive... and... its optimized. -Music. Its immersive, and fitting. Its not constant, but there when needed. Its pretty clear they put effort into it. The different lands have different tunes and i like it. Its one of the few games i wont turn the sound off after a couple of hours to play my own, which is rare. I like it. -Controls are tight and responsive. This is one of the things that i really like. I don't get any lag or delay.. ever. Its akin to WoW. When i jump my character jumps. Not .006 seconds later, its now. When i cast, my cast bar is up, right away. Melee is also just as responsive in dungeons or open world, even while neat effects are going on, there isn't that millisecond delay I have become accustomed to with so many recent games. -The GCD. Its 2-2.5 seconds. At first you might feel this is a detriment and amateur like i did, but it isn't. It makes the game feel more old school. Your brain has time to process what you are doing and what you want to do. You aren't just spamming buttons because you can. You make use of every GCD and if you don't you can feel it, and it shows as well. -The Crafting. Just... wow. I'm still wrapping my head around it. If you include gathering (i do) its not just an afterthought. It adds another game within the game. Its not quick and its not brain dead easy. Any one who says it is already gave up and doesn't understand the underlying mechanics and how everything fits together. To give an example, I have met more than one player thats a crafter, and crafter alone. Some people seem to have zero interest in the combat side of the game, quite a few actually. -Defined Roles with developer pre determined approved cross class skills. This is another thing i really enjoy. I like working on another class (on the same character) to see just how well "that skill" would work for my playstyle. -Population. There are *a lot* of people playing and enjoying the game. I like this. Im tired of dead worlds after the first 2-4 weeks. -Pre determined rulesets. You can't just mail your alt gil. You can't just mail your alt items and armor. I was told they did this because of RMT. I despised it at first with the impression of "wow, what a misplaced oversight". But after a bit, it adds more value and commitment to my character.. which strangely is appealing to me. Of course you can have multiple accounts, or if you are a high rank in your FC you can add items to the vault and remove on another character, but... the barrier is definitely felt, imo. -Teamwork. Without teamwork and communication in these dungeons you aren't going anywhere. Don't let the 13 year old elitist "mmo vet" sway your judgement. The higher you go, the more fun and involved it gets. At max there is definitely an "elitist" attitude going around, with small groups of hardcore players even *selling* runs for harder content. -Economy. -The Market. Its a feeling of accomplishment when you sell something and make a profit. Gil (gold) doesn't fall out of the sky here. Even the gold sellers are a bit more expensive in their advertising than what I have seen in the last several games over the years. I like playing the market and making money. Even purchasing items off of select NPCs and replacing on the market board can yield a profit sometimes... -Cheap purchase and cheap subscription. -Pet System. Your chocobo can be more than just amount. Highly recommend you read up on this.. And not just that, but with their own form of advancement that the player chooses. As well as upcoming content that includes chocobo breeding etc. There are other mounts as well. -Upcoming PvP and Player Housing, as well as more end game content. I look forward to all of this stuff. Cons; -A growing elitist community at max. This can also be seen as a positive aspect. Even if you don't agree with certain attitudes or playstyles it still makes competitiveness in the community which is absolutely needed in an MMO. -Possible Confusion. For someone like myself that hasn't played FF games before (correct me if im wrong) you might find the class systems or even crafting commitment daunting or even a turn off at first without further research or reading. -The Map and layout. This can be confusing at first as well... -The GCD. This i listed as a Pro. But at first, many will absolutely not agree. -Apparently low end systems can struggle in certain environments...? -Gil Sellers. Its so bad you will quickly learn to ignore the chat box completely. Its... pretty obvious these guys are desperate for a sale, even more than usual. These same individuals also seem to be able to "hack" the game and travel underground from point to point to harvest and gather. Why they do this im unsure because someone else tapping the same node you do has no effect on you or yours, but its definitely happening. SE is clearly working on a fix. They seem to take a strong handed ban now and explain later state of mind, which im perfectly ok with. -Limited customer service. Conclusion; Buy it.
I really enjoyed FFXIV for the first month. I got 50 PLD, BLM, armorer, mining, and i'm done. The Game just felt too much of a Box. I got my Relic weapons on my PLD and my Magitek mount but that's it. I recommend the game to everyone, but at caution.
"Its better to look ugly and win than pretty and lose"