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How to DPS in FFXIV

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Comments

  • goboygogoboygo Posts: 1,399Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by donpopuki
    I think the problem is you have a lot of new people playing an MMO for the first time because of the console crossover.

    Are you implying that most console players are completely ignorant to group play, and would rather eat Cheetos and pull bong loads from the sofa?

    Is that what your trying to tell me man!!!!!

     

    edit:  I spelled bong wrong, imagine that.

  • AldersAlders Jack Burton'sPosts: 2,086Member Uncommon

    It's not as black and white as blaming stupid DPS.

    When there's no system in place to punish stupid play, then players will do what they will.

    DPS don't have to hold back on trash pulls in XIV because it honestly doesn't matter, unless you have a bad healer.  For bosses sure, but everything else can be managed by almost any class up to a point.  That's the problem.

    Want to discourage or prevent this?  Make mobs, even trash pulls, one-shot anyone not a tank and provide some negative "reward" for doing so.  Watch how quickly DPS pay attention and follow orders.

  • goboygogoboygo Posts: 1,399Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Alders
    It's not as black and white as blaming stupid DPS. When there's no system in place to punish stupid play, then players will do what they will. DPS don't have to hold back on trash pulls in XIV because it honestly doesn't matter, unless you have a bad healer.  For bosses sure, but everything else can be managed by almost any class up to a point.  That's the problem. Want to discourage or prevent this?  Make mobs, even trash pulls, one-shot anyone not a tank and provide some negative "reward" for doing so.  Watch how quickly DPS pay attention and follow orders.

    You are right.

    Why are non dungeon trash mobs in this game like kicking over my little sister?  

    I actually love using WoW comparisons.  In WoW if you pulled agro on trash you were pretty much three shotted, people learned quick.  There is no reason not to pull agro in this game, non boss mobs are harmless.

    It makes no sense at all.

  • SephirosoSephiroso Marietta, GAPosts: 1,323Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by CowboyHat
    ITT: Elitist rage   You have to remember not everyone grew up on MMO's some people on the console. Most people will listen to you if you explain what to do. Seems like you'd rather sit on your high horse then explain mechanics to new people though. Going into an instance with the attitude you have is a poor idea. Maybe PUGs aren't for you.

    In what way is the OP raging like an elitist? He gave very basic tips to dps that should be common sense, it doesnt matter if this is someones first mmo or not, tips are tips. It's not like he was name calling or calling people downright retarded for not following them.

    image
    Be the Ultimate Ninja! Play Billy Vs. SNAKEMAN today!

  • aRtFuLThinGaRtFuLThinG MelbournePosts: 1,245Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by CowboyHat
    ITT: Elitist rage   You have to remember not everyone grew up on MMO's some people on the console. Most people will listen to you if you explain what to do. Seems like you'd rather sit on your high horse then explain mechanics to new people though. Going into an instance with the attitude you have is a poor idea. Maybe PUGs aren't for you.

    I don't know what he said is really considered elitist rage or not but I certainly find pve rage laughable.

     

    You are playing against AI lol. Calm down.

  • GravargGravarg Harker Heights, TXPosts: 3,399Member Uncommon
    As a paladin main, I gotta say, good post from OP hehe.  I think people haven't played a MMO where you had to worry about agro in awhile.
  • PsistormPsistorm SomeplacePosts: 39Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Sephiroso
    Originally posted by CowboyHat
    ITT: Elitist rage   You have to remember not everyone grew up on MMO's some people on the console. Most people will listen to you if you explain what to do. Seems like you'd rather sit on your high horse then explain mechanics to new people though. Going into an instance with the attitude you have is a poor idea. Maybe PUGs aren't for you.

    In what way is the OP raging like an elitist? He gave very basic tips to dps that should be common sense, it doesnt matter if this is someones first mmo or not, tips are tips. It's not like he was name calling or calling people downright retarded for not following them.

    Pretty much this.

    I decided to use FF14 to get some more practice with tanking, since I rolled DPS in most games, but on one hand wanted something more, and on the other hand like ability to be more useful to my party. The insta-queues are nice too at that.

    Most the time I run dungeons with two friends, one being pretty good heals, the other seasoned dps. So only one pug at a time, but still we find people who simply will not learn from their mistakes. During ifrit, I had an archer who was pulling so much aggro that my flash, provoke and shield lobs were doing nothing whatsoever to peel from that guy. He just kept dpsing until I finally got the mob back. I think i lost this mob 2-3 more times to the archer, and he just kept dpsing hardcore.

    Of course who didn't kill the nail the first time around despite me marking it? Yup, the archer.

    So yeah, some good, honest advice in the OP. The dungeons so far are anything but hard and easy to understand, so people really need to pay a little more attention to at least the very basic mechanics.

  • Dragonsfire9Dragonsfire9 knoxville, TNPosts: 85Member Uncommon
    I play a healer and use the DF quite regularly.  I have to say the most ignorant tools I have run into have all been tanks.  Many are clueless on how to hold hate or they don't even try because they want to teach the overeager dps a lesson rather than 'splain it to them.  There are definitely some good tanks to be found via the duty finder but those are the ones that are calm and take the time to explain to everyone what to do to make the run easier for us all.  Not dumbasses that would afk and waste everyones time because they are too immature to work with someone that is not perfect.
  • kartoolkartool Hamilton, ONPosts: 485Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Grailer
      Lately I've been seeing some of the worst DPS that I've seen in 15 years of gaming .   So as I sit AFK at start of dungeon refusing to tank with players who are blantantly trying to make my gaming experience hell. ( I could leave but why should I get 15 minute penalty ? )   So what  to do as DPS . Tips:   1.  When you see numbers on top of mobs that the tank has marked  , and the tank is hitting those numbers in order you also hit those numbers in order. 2. When tank runs towards mobs that doesn't mean open fire as fast as possible on any random creature , give tank time to hit the mob at leave once . 3. If you take agro because you didn't follow tip number 1 or 2 above, don't start doing MORE dps and think "YEAH BABY IM TANKING WOOHOO!"  , instead you should cease DPS on that mob until the tank regains agro . 4. If healer sleeps a mob that the tank isn't fighting that doesn't mean "WOOHOO TIME TO ANNOY THE HEALER" and hit that target.  It means you follow tip 1 and 2 .     I have a lot more tips but those are the basics .

    I'm playing as a BLM and you could easily make this list for any class in the game. That being said, I don't disagree with you. I have seen this behaviour.

    Tanks - it's your job to get aggro. Don't get aggro on one mob and leave the rest to attack your healer. It's even worse when I sleep the mobs attacking the healer and then the other DPS or the healer himself attacks those mobs. Also, I have played with two kinds of tanks. One, I can open fire on his target and never have to worry about getting aggro, even if I tried. The other, are the ones that can't hold aggro at all. Healer of DPS will always end up getting smoked even if they just stand there. Also, Tanks should always mark their damn targets. I'm not a mind reader and if you suddenly decide to switch to another target I'm not always going to notice right away. Then, because I can't see what the hell is going on because of all the awesome effects and nothing is marked - I have to tab through the targets to see which ones health is dropping. 

    Healer - it's not your job to tank or do DPS. Concentrate on keeping yourself, the tank and finally the 2 DPS alive. If possible, do a little CC.

    DPS - you pretty much said it all OP. 

    Some general suggestions:

    All non-Tanks classes, if you do get aggro, run to the damn tank. If he hasn't noticed you have something on you, run on over and show him and likely he will take care of it.

    Every job that can pick up a healing skill - should. I can't tell you the number of times having Physick on my mage has saved my ass when the healer wasn't paying attention or on those occasions when the Tank has a hard time. 

    When a window pops up with instructions, read them. It is explaining the fight mechanics to you so someone doesn't have to explain it to you after you wipe 4 times because you didn't know to stay out of the red spots, or not kill the enemy that needs to die first.

    Regardless of your class, learn to play it. People will like playing with you and you'll get to successfully experience more of the game without people rage quitting on you.

  • FlyByKnightFlyByKnight Algo Star SystemPosts: 1,177Member Rare
    Apparently tanks can only hold agro on 1 enemy out of a set of mobs at a time. Don't use AoEs because  tanks don't like chewing gum and walking at the same time.
  • TwoThreeFourTwoThreeFour SwedenPosts: 2,153Member Uncommon

    Another tip since I am now playing tank too:

     

    * If your tank is able to keep AoE aggro and survive, then use your AoE skills and do not use knockback abilities to make one enemy get out of AoE range.

  • TwoThreeFourTwoThreeFour SwedenPosts: 2,153Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Dragonsfire9
    I play a healer and use the DF quite regularly.  I have to say the most ignorant tools I have run into have all been tanks.  Many are clueless on how to hold hate or they don't even try because they want to teach the overeager dps a lesson rather than 'splain it to them.  There are definitely some good tanks to be found via the duty finder but those are the ones that are calm and take the time to explain to everyone what to do to make the run easier for us all.  Not dumbasses that would afk and waste everyones time because they are too immature to work with someone that is not perfect.

    There are also tanks who don't speak a word about mechanics, and only explain when there is an actual failure :)

  • SephirosoSephiroso Marietta, GAPosts: 1,323Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
    Originally posted by Dragonsfire9
    I play a healer and use the DF quite regularly.  I have to say the most ignorant tools I have run into have all been tanks.  Many are clueless on how to hold hate or they don't even try because they want to teach the overeager dps a lesson rather than 'splain it to them.  There are definitely some good tanks to be found via the duty finder but those are the ones that are calm and take the time to explain to everyone what to do to make the run easier for us all.  Not dumbasses that would afk and waste everyones time because they are too immature to work with someone that is not perfect.

    There are also tanks who don't speak a word about mechanics, and only explain when there is an actual failure :)

    Because people dont know how to speak up and say "hey i'm new and dont know the fights"

     

    If no one says anything, its assumed you know the fight.

    image
    Be the Ultimate Ninja! Play Billy Vs. SNAKEMAN today!

  • TwoThreeFourTwoThreeFour SwedenPosts: 2,153Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Sephiroso
    Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
    Originally posted by Dragonsfire9
    I play a healer and use the DF quite regularly.  I have to say the most ignorant tools I have run into have all been tanks.  Many are clueless on how to hold hate or they don't even try because they want to teach the overeager dps a lesson rather than 'splain it to them.  There are definitely some good tanks to be found via the duty finder but those are the ones that are calm and take the time to explain to everyone what to do to make the run easier for us all.  Not dumbasses that would afk and waste everyones time because they are too immature to work with someone that is not perfect.

    There are also tanks who don't speak a word about mechanics, and only explain when there is an actual failure :)

    Because people dont know how to speak up and say "hey i'm new and dont know the fights"

     

    If no one says anything, its assumed you know the fight.

    I saw it is a more positive thing: they don't want to spoil the fight, so they choose to not speak until you actually wipe XD.

  • HabitualFrogStompHabitualFrogStomp SydneyPosts: 370Member Uncommon

    Anytime there is a player like OP in my PUG, I dont handle it delicately or try to keep the peace, I antagonize them more. I havent had one single tank or healer last more than 3 minutes after I start on them. Without fail, they have some futile rage menstruation cycle thing and drop group. And without fail me and the remaining players will talk about how pathetic they are whilst we wait for a new...whatever.

    Yeah, cross server grouping so it doesnt really matter, its only a matter of time before these peoples names are garbage on their own server. If they're so good, where is their guild at anyways? I thought uber awesome guys were supposed to run in massive guilds that have people on 24/7? No? Then stfu, you're not good.

    I know how to play my class too, but dont think for a second that this type of attitude is limited to simply anger over aggro mechanics or something for it to really start showing. Its a social disease, and scarcely needs a reason to show its face. I guess I just like exposing how small your egos really are for my own personal amusement. I dont care about this stupid dungeon were about to do. Whatever display you're going to put on is no doubt infinitely more interesting than killing a boss for 3rd time today. Have your little meltdown, we'll wait.

  • RabidMouthRabidMouth Charlotte, NCPosts: 196Member
    Originally posted by Sephiroso
    Originally posted by CowboyHat
    ITT: Elitist rage   You have to remember not everyone grew up on MMO's some people on the console. Most people will listen to you if you explain what to do. Seems like you'd rather sit on your high horse then explain mechanics to new people though. Going into an instance with the attitude you have is a poor idea. Maybe PUGs aren't for you.

    In what way is the OP raging like an elitist? He gave very basic tips to dps that should be common sense, it doesnt matter if this is someones first mmo or not, tips are tips. It's not like he was name calling or calling people downright retarded for not following them.

    Simple. This is nothing but an angry post. He quits playing because new players don't listen to him. most people that are new don't even come to these forums so his "tips" are not of much use. I'd be willing to bet most people on these forums know how to not steal aggro and dps properly.

    You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into.

  • vandal5627vandal5627 Jersey City, NJPosts: 714Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by donpopuki
    I would also like to add that I prefer playing with newbs than with elitist jerks. I rather play with someone who is clueless but is willing to learn than with an elitlist a-hole that trash talks your every move.

    This, I find it alot more fun.  Who cares if i wipe, as long as i'm having fun.

  • silverreignsilverreign Whitehouse, TXPosts: 437Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by donpopuki
    I would also like to add that I prefer playing with newbs than with elitist jerks. I rather play with someone who is clueless but is willing to learn than with an elitlist a-hole that trash talks your every move.
    AMEN good sir

    image

  • GrailerGrailer Posts: 891Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by HabitualFrogStomp
    Anytime there is a player like OP in my PUG, I dont handle it delicately or try to keep the peace, I antagonize them more. I havent had one single tank or healer last more than 3 minutes after I start on them. Without fail, they have some futile rage menstruation cycle thing and drop group. And without fail me and the remaining players will talk about how pathetic they are whilst we wait for a new...whatever. Yeah, cross server grouping so it doesnt really matter, its only a matter of time before these peoples names are garbage on their own server. If they're so good, where is their guild at anyways? I thought uber awesome guys were supposed to run in massive guilds that have people on 24/7? No? Then stfu, you're not good. I know how to play my class too, but dont think for a second that this type of attitude is limited to simply anger over aggro mechanics or something for it to really start showing. Its a social disease, and scarcely needs a reason to show its face. I guess I just like exposing how small your egos really are for my own personal amusement. I dont care about this stupid dungeon were about to do. Whatever display you're going to put on is no doubt infinitely more interesting than killing a boss for 3rd time today. Have your little meltdown, we'll wait.

    Don't worry mate , whatever stunt you pull I've seen it all .   I just alt tab and watch a movie or play a few hands of online poker  , there is a lot of things I can do that are more fun that don't require me to quit a group . The funny things is  I know that getting another tank would take a lot longer than 15 minutes so quiting group would probably be the end of the group anyway. Not many tanks click join a party in progress because they don't have to they get group instantly regardless .

    Right now Ive been in dungeon finder DPS que for over 30 minutes,   I've qued for 3 dungeons . So troll away my DPS friend the only time you are wasting is your own .   

  • HatefullHatefull Posts: 1,123Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by acidblood
    1.  When you see numbers on top of mobs that the tank has marked  , and the tank is hitting those numbers in order you also hit those numbers in order. Actually you hit those numbers in order regardless of what the tank is doing; good tanks don't get target fixation. 2. When tank runs towards mobs that doesn't mean open fire as fast as possible on any random creature , give tank time to hit the mob at leave once .You mean 'at *least* once', but yeah, DO NOT get the first hit in, and DO NOT front load your damage (looking at Archers especially), open with DoTs / debuffs / CC, and use the enmity meters (over class icons on the party UI). Pulling aggro at the start just makes tank waste time running around that could be spent building enmity, and ultimately the encounter takes longer.3. If you take agro because you didn't follow tip number 1 or 2 above, don't start doing MORE dps and think "YEAH BABY IM TANKING WOOHOO!"  , instead you should cease DPS on that mob until the tank regains agro .
    You forget DO NOT RUN AWAY FROM THE TANK (ideally stop attacking and run at them), seriously, I WILL let you die. The one caveat to this is if a mob is almost dead (like 2-3 hits), then just finish it off.

    4. If healer sleeps a mob that the tank isn't fighting that doesn't mean "WOOHOO TIME TO ANNOY THE HEALER" and hit that target.  It means you follow tip 1 and 2 .


    Yep, you wake it you tank it, and again, I WILL let you die.


    Pretty much exactly. So simple, yet people (even after being taught) still refuse to do it. And yes, I too have no issue letting a Dps die.

    If you want a new idea, go read an old book.

  • GrailerGrailer Posts: 891Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
    Another tip since I am now playing tank too:   * If your tank is able to keep AoE aggro and survive, then use your AoE skills and do not use knockback abilities to make one enemy get out of AoE range.

     

    Funny you mention that , Ive seen a lot of healers use that knockback ability for no reason at all ,  they just walk up to mob a tank is hitting and knock it back .. weird lol .

     

    Some tips :  If you are warrior use cross class ability Flash when mobs are asleep since it will get agro and not break sleep to keep healer from getting wtfpwned when sleep breaks .

     

    You only really need to put 1 number on mobs   .  The one you are tanking  ,  unless DPS is using AOE in which you don't need any numbers at all .

    I hotkey sign 1  so I'll switch targets just before they die so dps can pick up next mob .  Remember only 1 mob will show up on the dps list at the left hand side whereas the tank should have a list of all the mobs if they use flash or overpower.

    Cycling through the mobs you will see next to healer name the agro on them will go up every heal , so for every heal or 2 you should use flash or OP . 

     

     

     

  • MagikrorriMMagikrorriM Binghamton, NYPosts: 196Member Uncommon

    Healers have it tough in this game. However running to the tank is the best advice, put the tank between you and the mob. For tanks, communicate with your team, let them know that you'll be using a kill order. What's really bad about dps doing random killing, is it puts the healer in jeopardy.

    Last but not least, don't be an ass when explaining what to do. Not everyone has played mmos, and you have to communicate for the lowest common factor. I think the biggest problem with random groups is communication, either the lack of, or really harsh, anti-social tones.

    Personally I think there is a need to seperate new, casual, progression, and farm.  Often time elitism ruins the game for everyone else, to the point where no one wants to listen to any one.

  • AldersAlders Jack Burton'sPosts: 2,086Member Uncommon

    I'm constantly amazed at how many tanks don't know how Flash works.

    I've lost count of the times i see tanks hit this ability before engaging mobs or even being anywhere near them.

  • Mr.KujoMr.Kujo SwinoujsciePosts: 383Member
    Originally posted by TheSlither
    I have also tip for you:   Play with friends not with pugs.

     

    But, but I play mmos because I dont have any friends :(

  • AkulasAkulas GoldcoastPosts: 1,845Member Uncommon

    It's DPS. How can anyone stuff that up? Wait for tank to get agro, attack marked mobs in order. The easiest role in a game. You'd think people would know.

     

    I don't like tanking unless it's a dungeon I've done before. I always do a shield chuck before a flash I hope that's right. I only usualy do a tank class when solo'ing or open world.

    This isn't a signature, you just think it is.

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