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[Column] Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning: A WAR Worth Fighting For?

SBFordSBFord Associate Editor - News ManagerThe Land of AZPosts: 16,619MMORPG.COM Staff Uncommon

The news that Warhammer Online: Age of Recknoning is closing in December has come as a shock to some. In today's Devil's Advocate, we peer into the crystal ball to examine things that just might have prevented this sad happening. See what we think before leaving your own ideas in the comments.

Since Games Workshop isn’t renewing the license for WAR, and since attention for a Warhammer MMO seems focused more on the Warhammer 40K: Eternal Crusade massive action RPG, I think it’s time for a short thought experiment.

My question to myself is simple: if things turned out differently, what could have been done to make Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning a WAR worth fighting for?

Read more of Victor Barreiro Jr.'s The Devil's Advocate: A WAR Worth Fighting For?

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Associate Editor: MMORPG.com
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Comments

  • ThumbtackJThumbtackJ columbus, OHPosts: 539Member Uncommon

    Such a mismanaged game, and the finger can be pointed at everyone (Mythic, EA, GW, etc). =/ Easily my biggest letdown of the last decade. 

     

    If only they had used the funds that were spent to make the garbage that was Wrath of Heroes (just my opinion, I'm sure there were a few who enjoyed it) on a WAR Free to Play transition. Making WAR F2P wouldn't give it a bajillion players or anything like that, but it likely would have brought in those looking for a PvP/RvR fix and generated some revenue from a cosmetic cash shop (renown/exp boosts, costumes, mounts, pets, etc). Those funds then could have been spent on adding more content, fixing bugs, etc. WAR was very unique and there is not another game out there (that I'm aware of, aside from maybe DAoC) that gave you a sense of rivalry as well as some awesome PvP/RvR like WAR does.

     

    Could have, should have, would have, I suppose. It is what it is. I'll be playing on and off on an endless trial account doing some Tier 1 RvR until December 4th or so, when I'll activate my 14 free days to come back for one last WAAAGH with everyone else when the lights go out.

  • kragekrage Miami, FLPosts: 419Member
    Originally posted by ThumbtackJ

    Such a mismanaged game, and the finger can be pointed at everyone (Mythic, EA, GW, etc). =/ Easily my biggest letdown of the last decade. 

     

    If only they had used the funds that were spent to make the garbage that was Wrath of Heroes on a WAR Free to Play transition. Making WAR F2P wouldn't give it a bajillion players or anything like that, but it likely would have brought in those looking for a PvP/RvR fix and generated some revenue from a cosmetic cash shop (renown/exp boosts, costumes, mounts, pets, etc). Those funds then could have been spent on adding more content, fixing bugs, etc. WAR was very unique and there is not another game out there (that I'm aware of, aside from maybe DAoC) that gave you a sense of rivalry as well as some awesome PvP/RvR like WAR does.

     

    Could have, should have, would have, I suppose. It is what it is. I'll be playing on and off on an endless trial account doing some Tier 1 RvR until December 4th or so, when I'll activate my 14 free days to come back for one last WAAAGH with everyone else when the lights go out.

    QFT

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  • Crusix221Crusix221 Richmond, VAPosts: 100Member
    I just started playing again >:(
  • beej1986beej1986 Marion, ARPosts: 74Member
    I will miss the white lion such a unique class mechanic.

    CENTER]image[/CENTER]

  • alkarionlogalkarionlog SPosts: 1,125Member Uncommon
    so I belive they fixed the major problems with class inbalances like bright mages killing everyone and chaos side having the best char models on and pretty much everyone flocking to chaos side, to anyone even feel sad a game will be closed or no?

    FOR HONOR, FOR FREEDOM.... and for some money.
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  • SnarlingWolfSnarlingWolf Thereiam, ARPosts: 2,697Member

    Is this type of conversation required every time a failing MMO is shut down?

     

    What could have been done? It could have been made properly. Since it wasn't, just about everyone hated it and it wasn't profitable. End of same old story.

  • Po_ggPo_gg Twigwarren, WestfarthingPosts: 2,718Member Uncommon
    I think the key sentence from Victor is: "there weren’t many compelling reasons to keep coming back to it unless you enjoyed PVP battling." That's simpy not enough, or as SnarlingWolf writes above, not profitable enough.
  • EolexEolex Winnetka, CAPosts: 20Member

    The problem with the game was apparent fro day 1. Mythic went to big in all the wrong directions. If it were me calling the shots, i would have done the following.

    1.) 3 factions. If armies and classes were already mirrored, how hard would of been to add some cosmetics and classes of other races, a dogs of war faction if you will.

    2.)  shrink the rvr pools. There is no need for 3 different pools per tier. While we are at it, they should have done away with scenarios. Either pick open rvr or set size battlegrounds, but quit splitting your player base up. Its a niche game, so let it be niche. Which brings me to my next point.

    3.) too much focus on pve and public quests. Your an rvr game from a company that has success doing rvr stuff. Wile im not saying hay make daoc 2.0, they would of been better off making daoc with a warhammer skin. I know a lot of people that feel this way about it.

    4.) 1 capital city was fine, no need to spread out your social hubs either. The fact that got chopped was a god send to the social aspect of the game.

    Such a Strong platform wasted on weak developers, who have shown success in the genre!!!  I for one am so glad we have a new direction of game making that has been presented by the likes of SOE. Its apparent this day and age that developers and publishers are so disconnected from their audience that we keep getting served up crap. I honestly feel like picking a modern MMO to play is like picking a flavor of a turd. At the end of the day its still a turd! So looking forward to developers reaching out to us consumers from here on out. 

     

  • orbitxoorbitxo fort lauderdale, FLPosts: 1,408Member Uncommon
    warhammer  franchise is always worth fighting for!
  • TimothyTierlessTimothyTierless Columnist M, ORPosts: 2,163Member Uncommon
    This one was too bad for too long. It just need to be put down. I'll miss my Orcs but this one needs to go.
  • KyleranKyleran Tampa, FLPosts: 19,998Member Uncommon

    OK, I'll shed a crocodile tear for what the game could have been. image

    But for what was actually delivered, let's just say good riddance and leave it at that.  image

     

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.
    "I don't have one life, I have many lives" - Grunty
    Still currently "subscribed" to EVE, and only EVE!!!
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  • ComafComaf Chicago, ILPosts: 1,154Member Common
    Originally posted by SBFord

    The news that Warhammer Online: Age of Recknoning is closing in December has come as a shock to some. In today's Devil's Advocate, we peer into the crystal ball to examine things that just might have prevented this sad happening. See what we think before leaving your own ideas in the comments.

    Since Games Workshop isn’t renewing the license for WAR, and since attention for a Warhammer MMO seems focused more on the Warhammer 40K: Eternal Crusade massive action RPG, I think it’s time for a short thought experiment.

    My question to myself is simple: if things turned out differently, what could have been done to make Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning a WAR worth fighting for?

    Read more of Victor Barreiro Jr.'s The Devil's Advocate: A WAR Worth Fighting For?

    image

    Paul Barnett's clown act aside as a used car salesman with similar savvy...

     

    They ignored their DAoC community while bragging that they were  utilizing DAoC concepts (Land of The Dead was a crapfest attempt to give us something like Darkness Falls...which we asked for and got...Land of the Dead instead.../RvR with TWO realms??? yet it's three realms that adds a wild card approach that today's gamers won't see until they play Elder Scrolls Online - so I suppose they really didn't know what they were missing...but we did...)

     

    They didn't listen when we threw life jackets in the first year.

    Now they will drown and I will drink to their deaths.

    Time to refocus on Dark Age...Mythic.  Thank you.

    image
  • eric_w66eric_w66 North Richland Hills, TXPosts: 1,006Member Uncommon
    Let us remember that DAOC wasn't a success, so designing a game based on a game that didn't have success was the first strike against it.
  • DMKanoDMKano Gamercentral, AKPosts: 8,541Member Uncommon

    Things that made WAR not enticing to players

    1. Unoptimized crappy engine - laggy, unresponsive just all around bad

    2. Diajointed design - pvp pairings broken up into multiple fronts, is it an rvr game a pve game, what the hell is going on? Confusing

    3. Fun RvR instances early on, but instead of getting better as you leveled up it got worse

    4. Unbalanced gear unbalanced PvP

  • psiicpsiic Tampa, FLPosts: 943Member Uncommon

    Sometimes I wonder about the legality of these companies pulling the plug on games.

     

    Federal court has ruled time and again in favor of the consumer.

     

    1) Digital goods and all rights associated with those goods belong to the consumer.

    2) Seller is required by law to provide reasonable access to said digital property.

    3) Seller can not impede, infringe, restrict transfer of said digital goods.

     

    That being said for a company that is not going out of business to just turn off  a game that I purchased, I have to wonder just how legal that is.

    I would think at the very least that if they decide to no longer provide me with access, that they should at the very least have to provide me the server source code so that I can provide my own access.

  • Baramos79Baramos79 Indianapolis, INPosts: 73Member
    Originally posted by Eolex

    Wile im not saying hay make daoc 2.0

     

    I would have said it.

  • ComafComaf Chicago, ILPosts: 1,154Member Common
    Originally posted by Baramos79
    Originally posted by Eolex

    Wile im not saying hay make daoc 2.0

     

    I would have said it.

    The company that creates DAoC 2.0 will literally obliterate the competition.  EA knew this - this is why they bought and locked all ALL development of Dark Age of Camelot including a new server that endless threads begged for - because they were unwilling to risk losing even more players from Warhammer (better known now as Failhammer).

     

    Perhaps someone will wake up and take the Dark Ages mmorpg that created Siege Warfare and 3 realm RvR with 44 races and 24 classes...to a new graphics engine.

     

    Literally 2.0 could just be a new graphics engine (and cut frontiers in half at least and force travel routes by land...).

    image
  • xwolf540xwolf540 San Francisco, CAPosts: 37Member
    Originally posted by Comaf
    Originally posted by Baramos79
    Originally posted by Eolex

    Wile im not saying hay make daoc 2.0

     

    I would have said it.

    The company that creates DAoC 2.0 will literally obliterate the competition.  EA knew this - this is why they bought and locked all ALL development of Dark Age of Camelot including a new server that endless threads begged for - because they were unwilling to risk losing even more players from Warhammer (better known now as Failhammer).

     

    Perhaps someone will wake up and take the Dark Ages mmorpg that created Siege Warfare and 3 realm RvR with 44 races and 24 classes...to a new graphics engine.

     

    Literally 2.0 could just be a new graphics engine (and cut frontiers in half at least and force travel routes by land...).

    Camelot Unchained?

  • VladamyreVladamyre South Shore, KYPosts: 225Member
    Originally posted by eric_w66
    Let us remember that DAOC wasn't a success, so designing a game based on a game that didn't have success was the first strike against it.

    It wasn't a success? It was the 2nd highest population mmorpg durings its prime. Only Everquest had more population the DAoC did back then. You really need to do some research before you open up and toss out some worthless crap.

    In a world of sharp knives, you would be a spoon.

  • HokieHokie Vancouver Wa.Posts: 1,063Member Uncommon

    VB youre too nice.

     

    1)  The number one reason was bad management of the game and I lay that firmly at the feet of Mark Jacobs. I love the man for bringing to life some of the most intense MMO experiences Ive ever had and one of my favorite MMO despite all its flaws and problems. But I think it was his bad decisions that lead to the games downfall.

    How much can I say was his fault with certainty, none. This is all conjecture and my opinion and what I could surmise from a game I was, and still, am passionate about. Since he was the top of the Mythic food chain so to speak, he gets to carry the blame.

     

    2)  The desync as someone else said. This game had really, really bad optimization at release and for a good six months afterwards. To the point they had to take some features out of the game because the code couldnt be fixed.

    This hurt the game pretty badly, the AI and pet pathing was truly borked, to put it nicely. And large battles would crash whole servers, then zones, then groups of players.

     

    3)  This is one of Mark biggest follies and in many ways should rank in with #1.

    Its where he put his foot in his mouth about how "merging servers was a sign of a MMO failure." He said this after Mythic kept having to add servers.

    And just so everyone knows WAR had a pretty damn good launch, and even tho it bled subs its nowhere like what happens today.

    Then Wrath of the Lich King released and WAR started bleeding, but not as bad as some might think. I know alot of people whowere dual subbed to WoW and WAR.

    And what did Mark do when servers started to lose players and in reality did become ghost towns...he did nothing, thats right not a fucking thing. Because to merge servers would to be to admit his game had failed, by his own definition.

    I personally had about 7 friends who said "fuck it, Im out" and went back to WoW full time because of it.

     

    4)  Class balance. Here something most people dont know. WAR had (shortly after release) 24 unique classes. Not like WoW where the mage as an example was mirrored on the Horde and the Alliance side. WAR had 24 unique classes. Its one thing I really loved about the game. And as you can imagine it was a bitch to balance.

    This cause problems and pissed people off. But guess what? Most people stuck with the game, because they could see the potential if Mythic would just listen.

    And guess what happened...? Mythic listened!!

    The people would were responsible for class balance/combat/pvp convinced the powers that be to open specific sub forums for "like" class balancing. And opened it to the player base to state why they thought there class was unbalanced and/or why they thought their "like" was over powered.

    They even went about it the right way. They said we are going to focus on one group at a time. The first being the Shaman vs the Archmage. And you know what, for the most part people on both sides were being very reasonable. A lot of progress was made, it wasnt about making one class OP it was about making it fair.

    It was one of the industry highlights of Dev to player base communication, both group coming together to make the game better for everyone.

    And then guess what happened. Mark opened his mouth and said something like"WAR will reach (or increse) is subs by yada, yada, yada, or I will step down."

    And all of a sudden this great Dev and player cooperation and communication stopped. As we found out later because the were more or less all focused on releasing WAR to the Korean market.

    Fuck fixing it and making it a better game, it became about whoring it out to as many people as they could.

    Guess what happened? Mark stepped down. Why? Who really knows. I mean all of this is, like I said, opinion and conjecture. But I personally think the fact that the Koreans didnt want to play a fucking broken game may had something to do with it.

     

    But like I said, what do I know.

     

    All that negativity I just wrote; I could write five times the amount of what I loved,  found positive, ground breaking, innovative, fun, and down right fucking awesome in the game, much less all the potential I saw in it.

     

    I cant talk about it much less write about it without becoming a sad, broken, bitter ex-Warhammer Online Age of Reckoning player. Fuck.

     

     

    To Mark if you happen to wander by and read this. Please dont hate me for what I wrote, as Im sure Ive got some or most of it wrong from your perspective. But I wrote what I wrote because that is how I seen it go down and deserved or not, you get to be Atlas, or Jesus if you prefer.

     

     

     

     

    "I understand that if I hear any more words come pouring out of your **** mouth, Ill have to eat every fucking chicken in this room."

  • travamarstravamars Dallas, TXPosts: 417Member Common
    Originally posted by psiic

    Sometimes I wonder about the legality of these companies pulling the plug on games.

     

    Federal court has ruled time and again in favor of the consumer.

     

    1) Digital goods and all rights associated with those goods belong to the consumer.

    2) Seller is required by law to provide reasonable access to said digital property.

    3) Seller can not impede, infringe, restrict transfer of said digital goods.

     

    That being said for a company that is not going out of business to just turn off  a game that I purchased, I have to wonder just how legal that is.

    I would think at the very least that if they decide to no longer provide me with access, that they should at the very least have to provide me the server source code so that I can provide my own access.

    Your logic does make sense. There should be SOME way to continue to provide what you paid for. But i guess thats where the EULA comes in play.

  • YizleYizle Atlanta, GAPosts: 517Member
    The game had a lot of potential and started out pretty good until Mythic and EA kept ruining it with each new patch and "rebalance". I still have my copy of the CE sitting here. Such a shame.
  • evilpreyevilprey CalafatPosts: 67Member Uncommon
    free to play model will saved for sure this game . In my opinion it will be best free to play on the market much better then Rift
  • YizleYizle Atlanta, GAPosts: 517Member
    Originally posted by evilprey
    free to play model will saved for sure this game . In my opinion it will be best free to play on the market much better then Rift

    Any actual proof of that? Guess not. Not too sure if I want a cash shop in a pvp game.

  • skeeter667skeeter667 holyoke, MAPosts: 55Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Vladamyre
    Originally posted by eric_w66
    Let us remember that DAOC wasn't a success, so designing a game based on a game that didn't have success was the first strike against it.

    It wasn't a success? It was the 2nd highest population mmorpg durings its prime. Only Everquest had more population the DAoC did back then. You really need to do some research before you open up and toss out some worthless crap.

    I'll back this up DAOC was a huge MMO when it launched it didn't start to die till WoW came out.

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