Originally posted by Gardavsshade Originally posted by MortemiaI haven't really been following TESO's features that closely, but the sad fact is that I'm probably going to buy it anyway, with or without cash shop. Guess I really don't care that much if someone likes to sink more money in the game.If someone wants vanity stuff, exp boost, healing potions, silly little pets etc. it really doesn't bother me. It's weird how people can be on the edge with something like this. And I'm not talking about TESO only, just mmorpgs in general.
People say this all the time, that "I don't/won't use the Cash/Item Shop but I don't care if others do or if there is one".
Don't be too sure about that one. I speak from experience with SWTOR. I don't use the Cartel Market (cash shop) there, and I even stay away from almost all CM items up for sale on the GTN (auction hall), but when you see Patch after Patch crammed full of Cash Shop items it begins to get on your nerves.
I understand completely how some potential future Players of TESO might get worried by what some people thought was said.
that is because SWTOR has a F2P option. i honestly think people are getting all worked up for nothing, but that isn't anything new around here, is it?
Originally posted by MortemiaI haven't really been following TESO's features that closely, but the sad fact is that I'm probably going to buy it anyway, with or without cash shop. Guess I really don't care that much if someone likes to sink more money in the game.If someone wants vanity stuff, exp boost, healing potions, silly little pets etc. it really doesn't bother me. It's weird how people can be on the edge with something like this. And I'm not talking about TESO only, just mmorpgs in general.
People say this all the time, that "I don't/won't use the Cash/Item Shop but I don't care if others do or if there is one".
Don't be too sure about that one. I speak from experience with SWTOR. I don't use the Cartel Market (cash shop) there, and I even stay away from almost all CM items up for sale on the GTN (auction hall), but when you see Patch after Patch crammed full of Cash Shop items it begins to get on your nerves.
I understand completely how some potential future Players of TESO might get worried by what some people thought was said.
that is because SWTOR has a F2P option. i honestly think people are getting all worked up for nothing, but that isn't anything new around here, is it?
Agreed. It was irrational to get worked up over "fun stuff". People started to make up keywords that Firor never said such as "Cash shop" "Ingame store" and "Trinkets".
Although, I have heard a rumour that beta testers are getting a pet monkey in the game. Not quite sure why they would give that out considering that beta testers were just lucky to get in. It wasn't actually a reward for pre-purchase or anything. Seems strange. I doubt it is true, really. And if it is, I'm pretty sure it won't be exclusive to beta testers anyhow.
Don't mind paid for account services. That's fine. Want to hop servers or change your name...go for it, pay $25 or whatever for it.
Things like deco pets...could care less about so long as there was a good variety in game.
Cosmetics/mounts...getting into the WTF zone.
for a sub just about everything in game should be available in game, I don't mind having limited edition deco pets for sale...
Its really nice the game im in now has nothing to offer but account services. its nice to have every pet in game available to me...even though I hardly use them
I really do prefer the p2p games, it really irks me to see some use a cash shop like it was an NPC merchant..i remember TSW did that prior to going box price and cash shop only. GW2 sells as a b2p but its just a box price cash shop game as well. Wish there were b2p games, and I would have thought TESO would be the one since they typically do box price and DLC content for their single player games. B2P works for me if there isn't a damn cash shop....and I don't mind paying $30 for content like with their single player games.
In the end, it would have been nice to see them make a real b2p work, but I think that might be bit risky for a higher budget mmorpg...and im glad they went p2p.
Don't mind paid for account services. That's fine. Want to hop servers or change your name...go for it, pay $25 or whatever for it.
Things like deco pets...could care less about so long as there was a good variety in game.
Cosmetics/mounts...getting into the WTF zone.
for a sub just about everything in game should be available in game, I don't mind having limited edition deco pets for sale...
Its really nice the game im in now has nothing to offer but account services. its nice to have every pet in game available to me...even though I hardly use them
I really do prefer the p2p games, it really irks me to see some use a cash shop like it was an NPC merchant..i remember TSW did that prior to going box price and cash shop only. GW2 sells as a b2p but its just a box price cash shop game as well. Wish there were b2p games, and I would have thought TESO would be the one since they typically do box price and DLC content for their single player games. B2P works for me if there isn't a damn cash shop....and I don't mind paying $30 for content like with their single player games.
In the end, it would have been nice to see them make a real b2p work, but I think that might be bit risky for a higher budget mmorpg...and im glad they went p2p.
Limited edition pets and such is kind of a nice feature. Stuff included in Collector's Edition and such. But otherwise I think it is silly. I rarely collect pets but I still like to see CE pets and such in game. Other than that I think that all other pets, cosmetic and mounts have no place in P2P MMOs.
For example, suppose that WoW sold their mounts in Vanilla. It would be a disaster since it could take such a long time to farm up to one and it felt great when you did. If someone who had paid 30 quids for it suddenly runs past you I can see how it might be a bit of a disappointment. But account services should in my opinion be paid for. And they should have a pretty hefty price tag on them. Server changes won't exist I'm afraid but it is nice to know who your friends are. I remember in Rift how some of my friends just suddenly changed server every 7 days. Although I didn't quite like that game is it was, it still bothered me.
they wont call it a cash shop because it is a subscription game and they know people will have bad reactions. They said they will sell account services, which is good. They also said they will sell "fun stuff" and Trinkets" that arent part of the core game. Fun stuff and trinkets that arent part of the core game can easily translate to convenience items that belong to a cash shop.
OP, you are saying that people who reacted bad to this are lazy but you defend Zenimax's stand because they never called it a cash shop when you know they will never call it a cash shop because it will sound bad for them..... sigh.
Lets just wait for the game to launch and see what "fun stuff" and "trinkets" actually mean on their "store"
Listen to the podcast. Paul came out and announced that there would be nothing like that in the game. So I guess your reaction was bad because you were too lazy to read through the post properly.
I guess you proved my point by yourself.
actually he tip-toes around the question and says he doesn't know if it will be in-game or not. this interview neither confirms or denies the existence of a cash shop.
they wont call it a cash shop because it is a subscription game and they know people will have bad reactions. They said they will sell account services, which is good. They also said they will sell "fun stuff" and Trinkets" that arent part of the core game. Fun stuff and trinkets that arent part of the core game can easily translate to convenience items that belong to a cash shop.
OP, you are saying that people who reacted bad to this are lazy but you defend Zenimax's stand because they never called it a cash shop when you know they will never call it a cash shop because it will sound bad for them..... sigh.
Lets just wait for the game to launch and see what "fun stuff" and "trinkets" actually mean on their "store"
Listen to the podcast. Paul came out and announced that there would be nothing like that in the game. So I guess your reaction was bad because you were too lazy to read through the post properly.
I guess you proved my point by yourself.
actually he tip-toes around the question and says he doesn't know if it will be in-game or not. this interview neither confirms or denies the existence of a cash shop.
Listen to it again. He says that it won't be a cash shop. A service shop to provide services such as name change might be in the game, though. That's what he tip-toes around. It clearly denies the existence of a cosmetic cash shop.
Paul Sage:
"...what Matt was talking about was really just: "Are there things, like can I pay for name change? Can I pay for things that I cannot do in the course of the game." So we want the game that you get to be a Full Game experience. But there are other things like server things, things that wouldn't naturally be in the game. They are things we call "out-of-the-way" things. And that's what Matt was talking about. We might have things like that, like extra service things. To my knowledge there isn't a little vendor in the game saying "give me the cash".
Then the off the record guys ask:
"So it's exactly like we were discussing. That it is actually a services tab ingame, like you would see in every MMO previous but where in every previous MMO you actually had to log on to their site, this one is conveniently ingame for the first time?"
Paul Sage replies:
"I honestly don't know if it is going to be in game or not. There's nothing hooked up right now. It could be on the web. We just want to be providing a really high quality service."
I do not understand why people get mad if there is a cash shop. If you do not like it do not use it. pretty simple. those that do use it are not going to be better players or have any advantage over you. they are not getting better weapns or armor or access to different spells so who cares.
Originally posted by darkbalth I do not understand why people get mad if there is a cash shop. If you do not like it do not use it. pretty simple. those that do use it are not going to be better players or have any advantage over you. they are not getting better weapns or armor or access to different spells so who cares.
I can't understand why people can't read my post properly. There won't be a cash shop. And even if there was it is still annoying for people when you work really hard for good looking gear and then you see twenty noobs run past you with cosmetic armour bought from the cash shop.
Personally I don't mind if it is well implemented, but if you're subbing you do not want a cash shop like that.
Er... can you really blame people when the lead dev comes out and says there's a cash shop?
No, but we can blame people for not understanding the difference between an actual cash shop and a cosmetic/fluff/service shop. He made it pretty clear what kind of services and items the shop would carry, and yet people still rushed too conclusions and lost their mind.
Er... can you really blame people when the lead dev comes out and says there's a cash shop?
No, but we can blame people for not understanding the difference between an actual cash shop and a cosmetic/fluff/service shop. He made it pretty clear what kind of services and items the shop would carry, and yet people still rushed too conclusions and lost their mind.
Indeed. And since the shop won't be anything but a service store (most likely) outside the game I think that there isn't much on the "greedy corporate" side of things to complain about.
Er... can you really blame people when the lead dev comes out and says there's a cash shop?
No, but we can blame people for not understanding the difference between an actual cash shop and a cosmetic/fluff/service shop. He made it pretty clear what kind of services and items the shop would carry, and yet people still rushed too conclusions and lost their mind.
Agreed, a service shop is nothing to get riled up over
Even if the shop sells some cosmetic fluff, whats the big deal?
I have seen so many people rage over this. If they pay a sub, they want access to the fluff or no deal!
They go out of their way to rage on the forums for days.... over fluff!! (smh)
Er... can you really blame people when the lead dev comes out and says there's a cash shop?
No, but we can blame people for not understanding the difference between an actual cash shop and a cosmetic/fluff/service shop. He made it pretty clear what kind of services and items the shop would carry, and yet people still rushed too conclusions and lost their mind.
Agreed, a service shop is nothing to get riled up over
Even if the shop sells some cosmetic fluff, whats the big deal?
I have seen so many people rage over this. If they pay a sub, they want access to the fluff or no deal!
They go out of their way to rage on the forums for days.... over fluff!! (smh)
Well, doesn't matter since we're getting the fluff anyhow. Although, I think that if you sub you should have access to most things. Mainly because back in WoW they added crazy flying particle clouds of mounts to the game and suddenly everyone bought one and it was impossible to see anything but particle effects on the screen.
However, I wouldn't mind if people could pay 5 dollars for horse armour
Er... can you really blame people when the lead dev comes out and says there's a cash shop?
No, but we can blame people for not understanding the difference between an actual cash shop and a cosmetic/fluff/service shop. He made it pretty clear what kind of services and items the shop would carry, and yet people still rushed too conclusions and lost their mind.
Agreed, a service shop is nothing to get riled up over
Even if the shop sells some cosmetic fluff, whats the big deal?
I have seen so many people rage over this. If they pay a sub, they want access to the fluff or no deal!
They go out of their way to rage on the forums for days.... over fluff!! (smh)
Well, doesn't matter since we're getting the fluff anyhow. Although, I think that if you sub you should have access to most things. Mainly because back in WoW they added crazy flying particle clouds of mounts to the game and suddenly everyone bought one and it was impossible to see anything but particle effects on the screen.
However, I wouldn't mind if people could pay 5 dollars for horse armour
If the horse armor has stats, then its wrong. That would be a P2W situation
I'm talking pure fluff.
I am fully aware there are lots of players who will rage over that fluff, I just think its ridiculous.
Er... can you really blame people when the lead dev comes out and says there's a cash shop?
No, but we can blame people for not understanding the difference between an actual cash shop and a cosmetic/fluff/service shop. He made it pretty clear what kind of services and items the shop would carry, and yet people still rushed too conclusions and lost their mind.
Agreed, a service shop is nothing to get riled up over
Even if the shop sells some cosmetic fluff, whats the big deal?
I have seen so many people rage over this. If they pay a sub, they want access to the fluff or no deal!
They go out of their way to rage on the forums for days.... over fluff!! (smh)
Well, doesn't matter since we're getting the fluff anyhow. Although, I think that if you sub you should have access to most things. Mainly because back in WoW they added crazy flying particle clouds of mounts to the game and suddenly everyone bought one and it was impossible to see anything but particle effects on the screen.
However, I wouldn't mind if people could pay 5 dollars for horse armour
If the horse armor has stats, then its wrong. That would be a P2W situation
I'm talking pure fluff.
I am fully aware there are lots of players who will rage over that fluff, I just think its ridiculous.
I was joking. The joke being that Oblivion sold worthless horse armour as a DLC for 5 dollars.
Er... can you really blame people when the lead dev comes out and says there's a cash shop?
No, but we can blame people for not understanding the difference between an actual cash shop and a cosmetic/fluff/service shop. He made it pretty clear what kind of services and items the shop would carry, and yet people still rushed too conclusions and lost their mind.
Agreed, a service shop is nothing to get riled up over
Even if the shop sells some cosmetic fluff, whats the big deal?
I have seen so many people rage over this. If they pay a sub, they want access to the fluff or no deal!
They go out of their way to rage on the forums for days.... over fluff!! (smh)
Well, doesn't matter since we're getting the fluff anyhow. Although, I think that if you sub you should have access to most things. Mainly because back in WoW they added crazy flying particle clouds of mounts to the game and suddenly everyone bought one and it was impossible to see anything but particle effects on the screen.
However, I wouldn't mind if people could pay 5 dollars for horse armour
If the horse armor has stats, then its wrong. That would be a P2W situation
I'm talking pure fluff.
I am fully aware there are lots of players who will rage over that fluff, I just think its ridiculous.
I was joking. The joke being that Oblivion sold worthless horse armour as a DLC for 5 dollars.
Oh I see
Sorry, jokes and sarcasm don't translate well on the internet for me
But yes, that is seriously messed up buying armour with real money only to find out its worthless.
Er... can you really blame people when the lead dev comes out and says there's a cash shop?
No, but we can blame people for not understanding the difference between an actual cash shop and a cosmetic/fluff/service shop. He made it pretty clear what kind of services and items the shop would carry, and yet people still rushed too conclusions and lost their mind.
Oh really? All I read or saw in that original video was the rather vague offering of "fun stuff and services too, like name changes and things like that". Can you point me to where he clearly stated what items would be in the shop? I'd love specifics.
Also, can you tell me what the difference is between a 'Cash Shop' and an online store that sells cosmetics, fluff, and services in a video game for real world currency? Because to me it sounded like you just said the same thing twice using different words. You know, like going to the mall and saying one place is a Clothing Store, but that other place over there is just room where people buy fabric designs that are preconstructed to fit around your body in a stylish fashion.
Er... can you really blame people when the lead dev comes out and says there's a cash shop?
No, but we can blame people for not understanding the difference between an actual cash shop and a cosmetic/fluff/service shop. He made it pretty clear what kind of services and items the shop would carry, and yet people still rushed too conclusions and lost their mind.
Oh really? All I read or saw in that original video was the rather vague offering of "fun stuff and services too, like name changes and things like that". Can you point me to where he clearly stated what items would be in the shop? I'd love specifics.
Also, can you tell me what the difference is between a 'Cash Shop' and an online store that sells cosmetics, fluff, and services in a video game for real world currency? Because to me it sounded like you just said the same thing twice using different words. You know, like going to the mall and saying one place is a Clothing Store, but that other place over there is just room where people buy fabric designs that are preconstructed to fit around your body in a stylish fashion.
The only difference really is in immersion-breaking in-game marketing or not. If it's an innocuous T-shirt and mug shop, it should be outside the game. If it's name changes, that should be in the out-of-game account management page.
An argument could be made that it's more convenient to have them in-game but I don't like that. Just like I don't like an in-game web browser or FB, Twitter and IM integration from within the game. Those sorts of things are more tolerable in Scifi or current day MMOs (like TSW) but, IMHO, they have no excuse for being in a medieval fantasy MMO.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Comments
Don't be too sure about that one. I speak from experience with SWTOR. I don't use the Cartel Market (cash shop) there, and I even stay away from almost all CM items up for sale on the GTN (auction hall), but when you see Patch after Patch crammed full of Cash Shop items it begins to get on your nerves.
I understand completely how some potential future Players of TESO might get worried by what some people thought was said.
that is because SWTOR has a F2P option. i honestly think people are getting all worked up for nothing, but that isn't anything new around here, is it?
Agreed. It was irrational to get worked up over "fun stuff". People started to make up keywords that Firor never said such as "Cash shop" "Ingame store" and "Trinkets".
Although, I have heard a rumour that beta testers are getting a pet monkey in the game. Not quite sure why they would give that out considering that beta testers were just lucky to get in. It wasn't actually a reward for pre-purchase or anything. Seems strange. I doubt it is true, really. And if it is, I'm pretty sure it won't be exclusive to beta testers anyhow.
Don't mind paid for account services. That's fine. Want to hop servers or change your name...go for it, pay $25 or whatever for it.
Things like deco pets...could care less about so long as there was a good variety in game.
Cosmetics/mounts...getting into the WTF zone.
for a sub just about everything in game should be available in game, I don't mind having limited edition deco pets for sale...
Its really nice the game im in now has nothing to offer but account services. its nice to have every pet in game available to me...even though I hardly use them
I really do prefer the p2p games, it really irks me to see some use a cash shop like it was an NPC merchant..i remember TSW did that prior to going box price and cash shop only. GW2 sells as a b2p but its just a box price cash shop game as well. Wish there were b2p games, and I would have thought TESO would be the one since they typically do box price and DLC content for their single player games. B2P works for me if there isn't a damn cash shop....and I don't mind paying $30 for content like with their single player games.
In the end, it would have been nice to see them make a real b2p work, but I think that might be bit risky for a higher budget mmorpg...and im glad they went p2p.
Limited edition pets and such is kind of a nice feature. Stuff included in Collector's Edition and such. But otherwise I think it is silly. I rarely collect pets but I still like to see CE pets and such in game. Other than that I think that all other pets, cosmetic and mounts have no place in P2P MMOs.
For example, suppose that WoW sold their mounts in Vanilla. It would be a disaster since it could take such a long time to farm up to one and it felt great when you did. If someone who had paid 30 quids for it suddenly runs past you I can see how it might be a bit of a disappointment. But account services should in my opinion be paid for. And they should have a pretty hefty price tag on them. Server changes won't exist I'm afraid but it is nice to know who your friends are. I remember in Rift how some of my friends just suddenly changed server every 7 days. Although I didn't quite like that game is it was, it still bothered me.
actually he tip-toes around the question and says he doesn't know if it will be in-game or not. this interview neither confirms or denies the existence of a cash shop.
Listen to it again. He says that it won't be a cash shop. A service shop to provide services such as name change might be in the game, though. That's what he tip-toes around. It clearly denies the existence of a cosmetic cash shop.
Paul Sage:
"...what Matt was talking about was really just: "Are there things, like can I pay for name change? Can I pay for things that I cannot do in the course of the game." So we want the game that you get to be a Full Game experience. But there are other things like server things, things that wouldn't naturally be in the game. They are things we call "out-of-the-way" things. And that's what Matt was talking about. We might have things like that, like extra service things. To my knowledge there isn't a little vendor in the game saying "give me the cash".
Then the off the record guys ask:
"So it's exactly like we were discussing. That it is actually a services tab ingame, like you would see in every MMO previous but where in every previous MMO you actually had to log on to their site, this one is conveniently ingame for the first time?"
Paul Sage replies:
"I honestly don't know if it is going to be in game or not. There's nothing hooked up right now. It could be on the web. We just want to be providing a really high quality service."
I can't understand why people can't read my post properly. There won't be a cash shop. And even if there was it is still annoying for people when you work really hard for good looking gear and then you see twenty noobs run past you with cosmetic armour bought from the cash shop.
Personally I don't mind if it is well implemented, but if you're subbing you do not want a cash shop like that.
No, but we can blame people for not understanding the difference between an actual cash shop and a cosmetic/fluff/service shop. He made it pretty clear what kind of services and items the shop would carry, and yet people still rushed too conclusions and lost their mind.
Indeed. And since the shop won't be anything but a service store (most likely) outside the game I think that there isn't much on the "greedy corporate" side of things to complain about.
Agreed, a service shop is nothing to get riled up over
Even if the shop sells some cosmetic fluff, whats the big deal?
I have seen so many people rage over this. If they pay a sub, they want access to the fluff or no deal!
They go out of their way to rage on the forums for days.... over fluff!! (smh)
Well, doesn't matter since we're getting the fluff anyhow. Although, I think that if you sub you should have access to most things. Mainly because back in WoW they added crazy flying particle clouds of mounts to the game and suddenly everyone bought one and it was impossible to see anything but particle effects on the screen.
However, I wouldn't mind if people could pay 5 dollars for horse armour
If the horse armor has stats, then its wrong. That would be a P2W situation
I'm talking pure fluff.
I am fully aware there are lots of players who will rage over that fluff, I just think its ridiculous.
I was joking. The joke being that Oblivion sold worthless horse armour as a DLC for 5 dollars.
Oh I see
Sorry, jokes and sarcasm don't translate well on the internet for me
But yes, that is seriously messed up buying armour with real money only to find out its worthless.
Oh really? All I read or saw in that original video was the rather vague offering of "fun stuff and services too, like name changes and things like that". Can you point me to where he clearly stated what items would be in the shop? I'd love specifics.
Also, can you tell me what the difference is between a 'Cash Shop' and an online store that sells cosmetics, fluff, and services in a video game for real world currency? Because to me it sounded like you just said the same thing twice using different words. You know, like going to the mall and saying one place is a Clothing Store, but that other place over there is just room where people buy fabric designs that are preconstructed to fit around your body in a stylish fashion.
The only difference really is in immersion-breaking in-game marketing or not. If it's an innocuous T-shirt and mug shop, it should be outside the game. If it's name changes, that should be in the out-of-game account management page.
An argument could be made that it's more convenient to have them in-game but I don't like that. Just like I don't like an in-game web browser or FB, Twitter and IM integration from within the game. Those sorts of things are more tolerable in Scifi or current day MMOs (like TSW) but, IMHO, they have no excuse for being in a medieval fantasy MMO.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED