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Who really wants to play a free game ..?

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  • JasonJJasonJ New Port Richey, FLPosts: 395Member
    Originally posted by Phelcher

    That is the difference between a 17 year old (just starting out in life teenager)  VS   a 43 year old  who is a 18 year MMO veteran.

    Simply put, someone making $50~$100k a year, a person is not concerned Or defined by a $5 trinket in a game. They are looking for the challenge & adventure...   adults can already go to the mall and buy all the crap we want, no need to do it in game. 

     And the difference between a 43 year old that doesn't concern himself about tossing away small amounts of money and one who does is a 43 year old with a ton of money he is reinvesting so he can retire by the time he is 50.

    Have fun working until you die.

    Man, I really love people who think so highly of themselves yet put so little thought into life. So please, come back with $15 doesn't make a difference in the long run so I can come back and point out how you obviously don't limit your foolish spending to just MMOs.

    Simply put, a fool and his money are soon parted.

  • AdalwulffAdalwulff Sacramento, CAPosts: 1,152Member

    You hit it out of the park OP!!

    I am one of those people you speak of, I have enough cash to fuel my gaming addiction, I just spent a few thousand on a trick new PC

    It does seem odd that they forgot about us. They wont have to nickel and dime us, we are willing to pay up front!

    Anyway, great post!

    image
  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by Adalwulff

    You hit it out of the park OP!!

    I am one of those people you speak of, I have enough cash to fuel my gaming addiction, I just spent a few thousand on a trick new PC

    It does seem odd that they forgot about us. They wont have to nickel and dime us, we are willing to pay up front!

    Anyway, great post!

    They didn't. You have the potential to be the perfect whale.

  • PhelcherPhelcher Boston, MAPosts: 1,053Member
    Originally posted by JasonJ
    Originally posted by Phelcher

    That is the difference between a 17 year old (just starting out in life teenager)  VS   a 43 year old  who is a 18 year MMO veteran.

    Simply put, someone making $50~$100k a year, a person is not concerned Or defined by a $5 trinket in a game. They are looking for the challenge & adventure...   adults can already go to the mall and buy all the crap we want, no need to do it in game. 

     And the difference between a 43 year old that doesn't concern himself about tossing away small amounts of money and one who does is a 43 year old with a ton of money he is reinvesting so he can retire by the time he is 50.

    Have fun working until you die.

    Man, I really love people who think so highly of themselves yet put so little thought into life. So please, come back with $15 doesn't make a difference in the long run so I can come back and point out how you obviously don't limit your foolish spending to just MMOs.

    Simply put, a fool and his money are soon parted.

     

     

    The difference between an adolescent looking up and being an adult, is...  knowing an adult's retirement is not based on whether or not he spent $300/year on a roleplaying game. How absurd!

     

     

    Ten years @ $300/year is only $3k. (for ten years of entertainment)

    I can spend $150 in one day attending an NFL ~ MLB game..   So, the cost of a premium game to an actual adult is miniscule. Specially if the've just spent $600 on their kids back-to-school garbage.

     

     

    Don't you agree?

    Or are you still trying to conceptualize a premium game from a child's perspective.. where the cost of the game is a concern? The people I am discussing and the market a premium game would pull are for those who have zero concern with the price,(no matter how high) & again, is the least of that player's concern.

     

     

     

     

    What if there are elite games, that have a $1k buy-in...  no handbook, nothing your in... phucking play!

    That's premium!

     

     

    "No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."


    -Nariusseldon

  • CorehavenCorehaven Colorado Springs, COPosts: 1,538Member

    I do. 

     

    I'm 31 years old. 

     

    I like Pirates of the Burning Sea, Star Trek Online, GW2 (or I used to), World of Tanks, and World of Planes. 

     

    Have a good deal of fun in all of them.  My best friend from way back in college likes some of them too, and we play together some when we both have time.  I've also paid for games or paid monthlies.  However I didn't see a great divide in entertainment value between the two ( F2P and monthly ).  

     

    I do like there are games I can download that day, and dive into without paying a red cent.  Once upon a time, that wasn't even a daydream.  It just wasn't a thing.  So it's pretty cool as far as I'm concerned.  No harm in it. 

  • Dreamo84Dreamo84 Niagara Falls, NYPosts: 3,436Member Uncommon

    Check out Final Fantasy XIV's premium service...particularly the "premium" servers. I just love the way the OP is using the word premium to make P2P MMOs sound better. FFXIV is a fun game though, hoping the issues are finally fixed.

    In this day and age there is zero difference in quality as a whole between P2P and F2P or B2P it all comes down to the individual game.

    Lastly, why are they going F2P? Take a look, most of them started as P2P and weren't making enough money so they went F2P. And I am seriously sick of the "little kids taking daddy's credit card" remarks with F2P, why can't they do that with P2P too then?

    Plenty of adults play F2P games. Sorry to burst your bubble. But you seem to think everyone plays a game because of it's payment model. But a lot of people (like me) could care less. I will play any good game regardless of pay structure.

    image
  • Dreamo84Dreamo84 Niagara Falls, NYPosts: 3,436Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Phelcher
     

    What if there are elite games, that have a $1k buy-in...  no handbook, nothing your in... phucking play!

    That's premium!

     

     

    I agree that price is premium, but the service would likely be awful for all 100 people crazy enough to pay that price lol.

    image
  • JasonJJasonJ New Port Richey, FLPosts: 395Member
    Originally posted by Phelcher
    Originally posted by JasonJ

     And the difference between a 43 year old that doesn't concern himself about tossing away small amounts of money and one who does is a 43 year old with a ton of money he is reinvesting so he can retire by the time he is 50.

    Have fun working until you die.

    Man, I really love people who think so highly of themselves yet put so little thought into life. So please, come back with $15 doesn't make a difference in the long run so I can come back and point out how you obviously don't limit your foolish spending to just MMOs.

    Simply put, a fool and his money are soon parted.

     

    The difference between an adolescent looking up and being an adult, is...  knowing an adult's retirement is not based on whether or not he spent $300/year on a roleplaying game. How absurd!

     

     

    Ten years @ $300/year is only $3k. (for ten years of entertainment)

    I can spend $150 in one day attending an NFL ~ MLB game..   So, the cost of a premium game to an actual adult is miniscule. Specially if the've just spent $600 on their kids back-to-school garbage.

     The difference between and adult and a responsible adult is to at least have reading comprehension skills. Underlined the part of my post just for you...thanks though for proving I got you spot on.

    As for the last part. 3k x (the many other things you waste your money on) will be over 50k for that 10 years. 50k invested by even a below average investor that can earn you around 30% of your investment a year can bring your 50k to 300k with no problems. And that is just with the money you throw away. I have been doing this for 20 years, taking the money I DONT NEED TO SPEND and re-investing it along side money I have been putting away normally.

    Guess that's why I have a Model X ordered and am still looking to retire in 10 years...

    50k x 30% = 15k,  65k x 30% = 19.5k,  84.5k x 30% = 25,350, 109,850 x 30% = 32,955, 142,805 x 30% = 42,841

    5 years and 50k turns into 185,646. Subtract the 15% capital gains tax and you end up with 115,300 more. With just 5 years of investing...the more you have, the faster the gain. So much with your high opinion of being able to toss small amounts of money away without a thought.

  • c0existc0exist Round Rock, TXPosts: 192Member
    I have been trained since mmorpg's existed that you pay a monthly sub.  When i see f2p I immediately get a sour taste for the game.  Its the main reason i am not considering EQN.  I pay to play an mmorpg just like a pay monthly for my car or my house.  Its a monthly bill when i play.  f2p is a gimmick and is for kids or those that just want instant fun from a random game.  An mmorpg is a game i stick with for years not days or weeks and you can only find that longevity from a sub game.  Not all sub games have longevity but any games with longevity have the sub and its not a coincidence.
  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Posts: 5,290Member Uncommon

    I prefer not to pay monthly for my car, just save a few years and buy it for cash.

    The idea of buying my house twice over a twenty year period really really bugs me.

    Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by c0exist
    I have been trained since mmorpg's existed that you pay a monthly sub.  When i see f2p I immediately get a sour taste for the game.  Its the main reason i am not considering EQN.  I pay to play an mmorpg just like a pay monthly for my car or my house.  Its a monthly bill when i play.  f2p is a gimmick and is for kids or those that just want instant fun from a random game.  An mmorpg is a game i stick with for years not days or weeks and you can only find that longevity from a sub game.  Not all sub games have longevity but any games with longevity have the sub and its not a coincidence.

    For you may be. Others play D2 for years ... it has no sub .. and it is not even a MMO.

    F2P is the only reason i will check out EQN.

  • DrakynnDrakynn The Pas, MBPosts: 2,030Member
    Originally posted by VengeSunsoar

    I prefer not to pay monthly for my car, just save a few years and buy it for cash.

    The idea of buying my house twice over a twenty year period really really bugs me.

    Your car analogy actually fits the P2P model.

    Buying your car is the upfront cost.The ongoing costs of maintenance,licensing and Insurance is your sub fee paid in installments or in larger multi-monthly or yearly amounts.

  • spaniard81spaniard81 San Antonio, TXPosts: 59Member
    Originally posted by c0exist
    I have been trained since mmorpg's existed that you pay a monthly sub.  When i see f2p I immediately get a sour taste for the game.  Its the main reason i am not considering EQN.  I pay to play an mmorpg just like a pay monthly for my car or my house.  Its a monthly bill when i play.  f2p is a gimmick and is for kids or those that just want instant fun from a random game.  An mmorpg is a game i stick with for years not days or weeks and you can only find that longevity from a sub game.  Not all sub games have longevity but any games with longevity have the sub and its not a coincidence.

    If we lived according to that philosophy with regards to all aspects of our lives, we would still be living in caves as hunter-gatherers; who needs a wheel when you can just hand carry food and rocks!

    You guys can keep paying your fees, I'll play my F2P games (I do realize that GW2 is not technically F2P, since there is a one-time initial purchase fee; having said that, I play more than just GW2, all F2P though).

    The notion that for a game to be worth playing it requires a monthly fee I think is currently being debunked by Anet. I believe that the future of mmorpgs is not P2P but a combination of B2P/F2P with cash shop. As to whether the cash shop ruins gameplay will depend on the studio developing the game; GW2 is a good example of a cash shop that does not ruin gameplay.

     

    Play and let play!

  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Posts: 5,290Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Drakynn
    Originally posted by VengeSunsoar

    I prefer not to pay monthly for my car, just save a few years and buy it for cash.

    The idea of buying my house twice over a twenty year period really really bugs me.

    Your car analogy actually fits the P2P model.

    Buying your car is the upfront cost.The ongoing costs of maintenance,licensing and Insurance is your sub fee paid in installments or in larger multi-monthly or yearly amounts.

    Sorry no.

    He pays his car in monthly installments - the p2p model.

    I pay my car at once - the b2p model.  Every once in awhile I need to do something to it - the cs or paid expansion model.

    There is no monthly fee.

    Licensing is once every 5 years, insurance is once a year - the cs/expansion model.

    Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  • spaniard81spaniard81 San Antonio, TXPosts: 59Member
    Originally posted by Drakynn
    Originally posted by VengeSunsoar

    I prefer not to pay monthly for my car, just save a few years and buy it for cash.

    The idea of buying my house twice over a twenty year period really really bugs me.

    Your car analogy actually fits the P2P model.

    Buying your car is the upfront cost.The ongoing costs of maintenance,licensing and Insurance is your sub fee paid in installments or in larger multi-monthly or yearly amounts.

    You miss the point. The initial analogy was not with regards to the ongoing costs associated with owning a paid-off car, but with monthly payments prior to fully owning the car.

    In other words, why continue to pay for ownership when you either pay nothing for a F2P model or only pay a one-time initial fee for a B2P model.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by spaniard81

    The notion that for a game to be worth playing it requires a monthly fee I think is currently being debunked by Anet. I believe that the future of mmorpgs is not P2P but a combination of B2P/F2P with cash shop. As to whether the cash shop ruins gameplay will depend on the studio developing the game; GW2 is a good example of a cash shop that d

    "Worth playing" is obviously subjective.

    However, giving the huge number of players in F2P MMOs, and that they are making more money than sub-only, i would say many would think that F2P MMOs are "worth playing".

    Personally i don't play sub-only games anymore. Why should i pay even 1 cent if i can get the same amount of fun for free?

    It is not about affordability, it is about better alternatives.

     

  • p4ttythep3rf3ctp4ttythep3rf3ct Austin, TXPosts: 120Member

    I try F2P games all the time and then intermittently quit.  None of them, to me, have that something special that games of old had.  Maybe it's a problem with the genre, I dunno.

     

    But sure, I download em, play for a bit, get fed up with the lack of fun any of them have turned out to be (for me) and delete them.  A few months later I'll be bored again, already having gone from F2p to F2p to F2p, and I'll reinstall the original F2P game and repeat the entire process.

     

    It's all a waste of time to me.  I think I'm just waiting for a good game to come out, and from my memories, the last great MMOs were P2P.  EQN may hold me, I'm an original EQer, but the F2P portion turns me off.  More so, the fact that EA destroys everything turns me off even more.

     

    Here's hoping CU turns out to be what I'm looking for in a MMORPG.

     

    Before I leave though, 2 F2P games that I love: Tribes and Planetside 2.  Notice they are FPS .... beyond that I'd give GW2 a runner up, but that's B2P, so it doesnt even count in this discussion.

    That's just, like, my opinion, man.

  • spaniard81spaniard81 San Antonio, TXPosts: 59Member
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by spaniard81

    The notion that for a game to be worth playing it requires a monthly fee I think is currently being debunked by Anet. I believe that the future of mmorpgs is not P2P but a combination of B2P/F2P with cash shop. As to whether the cash shop ruins gameplay will depend on the studio developing the game; GW2 is a good example of a cash shop that d

    "Worth playing" is obviously subjective.

    However, giving the huge number of players in F2P MMOs, and that they are making more money than sub-only, i would say many would think that F2P MMOs are "worth playing".

    Personally i don't play sub-only games anymore. Why should i pay even 1 cent if i can get the same amount of fun for free?

    It is not about affordability, it is about better alternatives.

    Absolutely!

    Though there are some forms of semi-objective profesisonal rating schemes, the value of a game is ultimately subjective depending on the individual player who is actually playing the game. We can all state our own opinions (I've made mine very clear), but ultimately, its all relative.

    Some people prefer monthly fees, others like myself, prefer B2P/F2P... and that's just how the cookie crumbles

     

    Play and let play!

  • PhelcherPhelcher Boston, MAPosts: 1,053Member
    Originally posted by JasonJ
    Originally posted by Phelcher
    Originally posted by JasonJ

     And the difference between a 43 year old that doesn't concern himself about tossing away small amounts of money and one who does is a 43 year old with a ton of money he is reinvesting so he can retire by the time he is 50.

    Have fun working until you die.

    Man, I really love people who think so highly of themselves yet put so little thought into life. So please, come back with $15 doesn't make a difference in the long run so I can come back and point out how you obviously don't limit your foolish spending to just MMOs.

    Simply put, a fool and his money are soon parted.

     

    The difference between an adolescent looking up and being an adult, is...  knowing an adult's retirement is not based on whether or not he spent $300/year on a roleplaying game. How absurd!

     

     

    Ten years @ $300/year is only $3k. (for ten years of entertainment)

    I can spend $150 in one day attending an NFL ~ MLB game..   So, the cost of a premium game to an actual adult is miniscule. Specially if the've just spent $600 on their kids back-to-school garbage.

     The difference between and adult and a responsible adult is to at least have reading comprehension skills. Underlined the part of my post just for you...thanks though for proving I got you spot on.

    As for the last part. 3k x (the many other things you waste your money on) will be over 50k for that 10 years. 50k invested by even a below average investor that can earn you around 30% of your investment a year can bring your 50k to 300k with no problems. And that is just with the money you throw away. I have been doing this for 20 years, taking the money I DONT NEED TO SPEND and re-investing it along side money I have been putting away normally.

    Guess that's why I have a Model X ordered and am still looking to retire in 10 years...

    50k x 30% = 15k,  65k x 30% = 19.5k,  84.5k x 30% = 25,350, 109,850 x 30% = 32,955, 142,805 x 30% = 42,841

    5 years and 50k turns into 185,646. Subtract the 15% capital gains tax and you end up with 115,300 more. With just 5 years of investing...the more you have, the faster the gain. So much with your high opinion of being able to toss small amounts of money away without a thought.

    Tell us more...^^

    (but in another thread please)

    "No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."


    -Nariusseldon

  • PhelcherPhelcher Boston, MAPosts: 1,053Member
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by spaniard81

    The notion that for a game to be worth playing it requires a monthly fee I think is currently being debunked by Anet. I believe that the future of mmorpgs is not P2P but a combination of B2P/F2P with cash shop. As to whether the cash shop ruins gameplay will depend on the studio developing the game; GW2 is a good example of a cash shop that d

    "Worth playing" is obviously subjective.

    However, giving the huge number of players in F2P MMOs, and that they are making more money than sub-only, i would say many would think that F2P MMOs are "worth playing".

    Personally i don't play sub-only games anymore. Why should i pay even 1 cent if i can get the same amount of fun for free?

    It is not about affordability, it is about better alternatives.

     

     

    What about those who cannot get the same amount of fun..?

     

    O.o ..  Ever think about those people's point of view and their pocket book..?

     

    "No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."


    -Nariusseldon

  • DrakynnDrakynn The Pas, MBPosts: 2,030Member
    Originally posted by spaniard81
    Originally posted by Drakynn
    Originally posted by VengeSunsoar

    I prefer not to pay monthly for my car, just save a few years and buy it for cash.

    The idea of buying my house twice over a twenty year period really really bugs me.

    Your car analogy actually fits the P2P model.

    Buying your car is the upfront cost.The ongoing costs of maintenance,licensing and Insurance is your sub fee paid in installments or in larger multi-monthly or yearly amounts.

    You miss the point. The initial analogy was not with regards to the ongoing costs associated with owning a paid-off car, but with monthly payments prior to fully owning the car.

    In other words, why continue to pay for ownership when you either pay nothing for a F2P model or only pay a one-time initial fee for a B2P model.

    I concede the point as even if yous top paying licensing and insurance yous till own the actual car...you can't legally use it but you still own it.

    Of course according to the game industry wee don;a actually own any games at all regardless of the payment model.We only own the box and disc it comes on in retail and not even that with digital sales.

    My experience is different from yours though I try just about every F2P game that comes out and have found none worth my time beyond a couple weeks to a month whether I pay anything or not.GW2 lasted a bit longer but was ultimately not a long term prospect for me.

    But if you and Venge are having a blast with these games more power to ya.I'll just move on and wait to see if something does come out I want to play long term, no biggie they are only games.

  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Posts: 5,290Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Phelcher
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by spaniard81

    The notion that for a game to be worth playing it requires a monthly fee I think is currently being debunked by Anet. I believe that the future of mmorpgs is not P2P but a combination of B2P/F2P with cash shop. As to whether the cash shop ruins gameplay will depend on the studio developing the game; GW2 is a good example of a cash shop that d

    "Worth playing" is obviously subjective.

    However, giving the huge number of players in F2P MMOs, and that they are making more money than sub-only, i would say many would think that F2P MMOs are "worth playing".

    Personally i don't play sub-only games anymore. Why should i pay even 1 cent if i can get the same amount of fun for free?

    It is not about affordability, it is about better alternatives.

     

     

    What about those who cannot get the same amount of fun..?

     

    O.o ..  Ever think about those people's point of view and their pocket book..?

     

    What are you arguing for here?

    If they can't afford to play a game free, there is no way they can afford a monthly fee.

    Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  • JasonJJasonJ New Port Richey, FLPosts: 395Member
    Originally posted by Phelcher

    Tell us more...^^

    (but in another thread please)

     Sure, the moment your assumptions are turned on you showing you don't have a clue, ask for it to be taken someplace else...how "adult" of you.

    But I will be sure to let everyone know that they aren't a real adult unless they throw their money away just for you.

  • spaniard81spaniard81 San Antonio, TXPosts: 59Member
    Originally posted by Phelcher
    Originally posted by JasonJ
    Originally posted by Phelcher
    Originally posted by JasonJ

     And the difference between a 43 year old that doesn't concern himself about tossing away small amounts of money and one who does is a 43 year old with a ton of money he is reinvesting so he can retire by the time he is 50.

    Have fun working until you die.

    Man, I really love people who think so highly of themselves yet put so little thought into life. So please, come back with $15 doesn't make a difference in the long run so I can come back and point out how you obviously don't limit your foolish spending to just MMOs.

    Simply put, a fool and his money are soon parted.

    The difference between an adolescent looking up and being an adult, is...  knowing an adult's retirement is not based on whether or not he spent $300/year on a roleplaying game. How absurd!

    Ten years @ $300/year is only $3k. (for ten years of entertainment)

    I can spend $150 in one day attending an NFL ~ MLB game..   So, the cost of a premium game to an actual adult is miniscule. Specially if the've just spent $600 on their kids back-to-school garbage.

     The difference between and adult and a responsible adult is to at least have reading comprehension skills. Underlined the part of my post just for you...thanks though for proving I got you spot on.

    As for the last part. 3k x (the many other things you waste your money on) will be over 50k for that 10 years. 50k invested by even a below average investor that can earn you around 30% of your investment a year can bring your 50k to 300k with no problems. And that is just with the money you throw away. I have been doing this for 20 years, taking the money I DONT NEED TO SPEND and re-investing it along side money I have been putting away normally.

    Guess that's why I have a Model X ordered and am still looking to retire in 10 years...

    50k x 30% = 15k,  65k x 30% = 19.5k,  84.5k x 30% = 25,350, 109,850 x 30% = 32,955, 142,805 x 30% = 42,841

    5 years and 50k turns into 185,646. Subtract the 15% capital gains tax and you end up with 115,300 more. With just 5 years of investing...the more you have, the faster the gain. So much with your high opinion of being able to toss small amounts of money away without a thought.

    Tell us more...^^

    (but in another thread please)

    I think the both of you have gone off the deep end. We're talking about gaming payment models, not the difference between responsible/irresponsible adults and adolescents. Don't get me wrong, by all means, knock yourselves out for all I care, but it makes for poor reading on this thread.

    You guys obviously disagree and instead of insinuating passive-agressive insults at each other, as painful as it is to read for the rest of us, try returning to the topic at hand and contribute to the overall discussion.

    Play and let play!

    P.S. before you decide to attack my grammar and sentence structure, please keep in mind that english is not my first language, thanks!

  • JasonJJasonJ New Port Richey, FLPosts: 395Member
    Originally posted by Phelcher
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by spaniard81

    The notion that for a game to be worth playing it requires a monthly fee I think is currently being debunked by Anet. I believe that the future of mmorpgs is not P2P but a combination of B2P/F2P with cash shop. As to whether the cash shop ruins gameplay will depend on the studio developing the game; GW2 is a good example of a cash shop that d

    "Worth playing" is obviously subjective.

    However, giving the huge number of players in F2P MMOs, and that they are making more money than sub-only, i would say many would think that F2P MMOs are "worth playing".

    Personally i don't play sub-only games anymore. Why should i pay even 1 cent if i can get the same amount of fun for free?

    It is not about affordability, it is about better alternatives.

     

    What about those who cannot get the same amount of fun..?

     

    O.o ..  Ever think about those people's point of view and their pocket book..?

     O.o

    One opinion is some being all inclusive, the other, the persons you are responding to are giving the opinion that it is NOT all inclusive.

    Not that you would understand that going by your long winded posts about who is or is not an adult going by how much money they are willing to throw in the trash...

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