Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Fuzzy Avatars Solved! Please re-upload your avatar if it was fuzzy!

General: SOE Layoffs Announced

2

Comments

  • CalerxesCalerxes LondonPosts: 1,630Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Distopia
    You folks have it wrong IMO (the two posters above me), I think it's the ability to make decisions like this that solidifies Smed's position, a truly moral CEO would grind tooth and nail to keep their teams together, and in turn crash the company entirely in trying to do so. The job of a CEO is first and foremost to ensure the best profitability of a company and ensure the least amount of overhead. We're not talking videogames here, we're talking corporate level decision making. If Smed didn't do his job he'd be gone in a heart beat, Sony is no stranger to executive level restructuring, they do it quite often actually.

     

    Well with Sony Corporation being usurped by Samsung and LG as the premier electronics company I see the whole top management being to blame then because Sony have been unprofitable for years. Releasing unfinished, buggy, no content games over and over again and laying people off year on year isn't really doing your job properly is it? if you are making less and less money and have to lay off staff where is the shortfall coming from as the parent company has no money? it means you are having to release unfinished buggy games as you don't have development funds to do it properly. Does that sound familiar? 

     

    This doom and gloom thread was brought to you by Chin Up™ the new ultra high caffeine soft drink for gamers who just need that boost of happiness after a long forum session.

  • CalerxesCalerxes LondonPosts: 1,630Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

    A company like SOE works in project teams, some projects are shrinking in  size, others are growing, most of the time its not possible to transfer all employees to other project teams, because there might not be a need for the employees quallities there..

     

    Anouncements like this are mostly misunderstood by simple minds like gamers..

     

    Blimey you have a high opinion of yourself, I'd learn to use a spell checker first even if your first language isn't English, before throwing insults around. A company laying off staff year on year and publicly announcing it, releasing poor game after poor game, common sense tells you something is not right and that's usually upper management.

    This doom and gloom thread was brought to you by Chin Up™ the new ultra high caffeine soft drink for gamers who just need that boost of happiness after a long forum session.

  • jinxitjinxit Belfast (Northern Ireland)Posts: 863Member
    SOE just took all the DCUO expansions off the station cash shop, now only purchasable with cold hard cash.
  • usuckmmorpgcomusuckmmorpgcom c, KYPosts: 1,348Member
    If they canned Smedley I would probably take a second look at EQN. I just don't trust the guy. Too many lies and manipulation over the years. My gut says EQN will be another bottle of snake-oil. 
  • DMKanoDMKano Gamercentral, AKPosts: 8,575Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by grimgryphon
    If they canned Smedley I would probably take a second look at EQN. I just don't trust the guy. Too many lies and manipulation over the years. My gut says EQN will be another bottle of snake-oil. 

    Smed is a part of the "good ol boys" inner circle at SoE, there are a dozen of them that are above the law at SoE. Many game companies are in the same boat, having upper mgmt click of folks who have not changed for many years. SoE needs to do what Trion did - get rid of all upper mgmt click, replace the CEO and refocus the company.

    CU is also doing it right - get a young new team full of creativity and new energy to build the game. Watch any of EQN videos - there is not a single person shown on EQN team videos in their 20s, interesting isn't it?

     

  • ShadanwolfShadanwolf Posts: 2,114Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by DMKano
    Originally posted by grimgryphon
    If they canned Smedley I would probably take a second look at EQN. I just don't trust the guy. Too many lies and manipulation over the years. My gut says EQN will be another bottle of snake-oil. 

    Smed is a part of the "good ol boys" inner circle at SoE, there are a dozen of them that are above the law at SoE. Many game companies are in the same boat, having upper mgmt click of folks who have not changed for many years. SoE needs to do what Trion did - get rid of all upper mgmt click, replace the CEO and refocus the company.

    CU is also doing it right - get a young new team full of creativity and new energy to build the game. Watch any of EQN videos - there is not a single person shown on EQN team videos in their 20s, interesting isn't it?

     

    I was wondering how Smedley has kept his job .This would also explain why the top SWTOR management hasn't been replaced.

  • AsamofAsamof La Canada, CAPosts: 738Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by grimgryphon
    If they canned Smedley I would probably take a second look at EQN. I just don't trust the guy. Too many lies and manipulation over the years. My gut says EQN will be another bottle of snake-oil. 

     

    People aren't going to realize this until after they buy EQN and have their first real experience with SOE

  • ste2000ste2000 londonPosts: 4,706Member Uncommon
    PS2 is not doing as good as expected............ that's my translation. Also with Rift F2P I am sure many EQ2 players migrated there. Rift has a far better F2P model than any SoE game. SoE needs to stop being too greedy. If they want people money they need to be fair.
    Trying to FORCE people spending their money is not a good business strategy.
  • ignore_meignore_me Apple Valley, CAPosts: 1,987Member
    Stylized graphics and MOBA combat are responsible for this layoff. Or put in whatever you want to link the layoffs with your favorite cause.

    Survivor of the great MMORPG Famine of 2011

  • rwyanrwyan raleigh, NCPosts: 461Member

    I also have a hard time believing DCUO is performing poorly....  For one, they keep pumping resources into it in the form of additional DLC packs.  It is sort of hard to believe they would continue that model for as long as they have if it wasn't working too well for them (especially since it seems their output has increased as time has gone on).  

     

    We've seen what SOE does to games that aren't performing.... (Vanguard, MxO, Pirates, etc...).  DCUO is far from maintenance mode.

     

    I also remember comments from SOE that the PS3 version does better (or maybe it just gets more players? ) than the PC version which would make sense considering they're attempting to be there for the PS4 launch.  If the game wasn't performing, they wouldn't be spending resources on having a port done.

     

     

  • MendelMendel Marietta, GAPosts: 931Member Uncommon
    Condolences to all the new ex-employees who have hauled barges and lifted bales at SOE.  It isn't fun being laid off, it isn't the end of the world, either.  It's the nature of any business that the front line are the first to go when times get tough.  The Indians suffer, and the Chiefs survive.   Those affected aren't the problem, they're just the ones least protected by a corporate mindset that never looks at internal problems realistically.

    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • NirrtixNirrtix Friendswood, TXPosts: 173Member
    Originally posted by Comaf
    Originally posted by Saryk
    Originally posted by Calerxes
    Sony as a corporation has been doing badly for years only just about making a profit in the last quarter, that's the reason for the gamers first approach to flogging the PS4, they need it to succeed badly. This means there must be a knock on effect to their gaming divisions especially one that fails to release quality games time and time again. Have SOE ever released a fully working, full of content MMO ever? and how the hell does John Smedley still have a job with failure after failure? that has puzzled me for a while, its seems they keep on laying off the wrong people, how about looking at leadership first? I'm expecting EQN to be a half arsed, half finished, rushed release (in time to beat TESO to market?) because history tells us that's all SOE are capable of releasing.

    You know what , I agree! However at least EQnext will be F2P..........

    Pray it doesn't go F2P - nothing says "We can't hold this game by subs alone," like F2P which depends on 1 out of every 1,000 players to be just crazy enough to spend enough to cover 1,000 subscriptions in silly purchasing. 

     

    I have yet to see a "good" mmorpg that has a F2P model.  WoW might be losing subs, but they still trump every mmorpg I've played outside of Dark Age of Camelot (a sadly dated, EA ruined gem of a game).

    I agree about FTP MMO's. It is unfortunate because FTP games that are not MMO's often are very good DOTA 2 and Tribes Ascend are 2 examples. FTP, however opens too many bad things in an MMO like Botting and multi boxing (which I am against and is easy when you do not need to pay for an account)

    As to SOE they have destroyed their gems like EQ1. Even Everquest 2 was a good game at one point. SOE completely ruined that too.

    TO those who think that SOE has anything to do with the PS4 is wrong SOE is a separate entity in Sony that deals with online games. They did not make the PS4.

    Nirrtix
    ALPHAs:
    -Pantheon
    -Shroud of the Avatar
    -Camelot Unchained
    BETAs:
    -World of Warcraft
    -City of Heroes
    -Star Wars Galaxies
    -Saga of Ryzom
    -Homeworld
    -Starcraft II
    -Warcraft III
    -Hearthstone
    -Star Wars The Old Republic
    -Vanguard Saga of Heroes

  • Brabbit1987Brabbit1987 Ontario, CanadaPosts: 729Member Uncommon

    Layoffs are a very common thing in the game industry. I don't think most people realize how hard and unstable a job as a game developer is. One day you can be hired by a large corporation and the next day you could be looking for another job.

    As a game developer, it's always smart to keep a back up plan at all times. Always be in contact with possible employers. 

    One could say layoffs happen a lot in every industry, which isn't incorrect. However, in the game industry, it can happen to a person who is pretty good at their job. So you can save yourself by performing well, like most jobs.

    However, you are likely to be able to stay put if your able to get into a permanent position in a well known team. Though that is actually pretty hard to do.

    I don't think Sony is doing "bad." At least not as bad as some make it out to be. I suppose they could be doing better though. However, as I said, layoffs are fairly normal.

  • RazeeksterRazeekster Solon, MEPosts: 2,201Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by evilastro
    You guys realise this has nothing to do with EQN? DCUO is just obviously under-performing.

    I don't know how. It's one of the only good superhero MMOs out there.

    Smile

  • gatherisgatheris Charlotte, MIPosts: 996Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by ste2000
    PS2 is not doing as good as expected............ that's my translation. Also with Rift F2P I am sure many EQ2 players migrated there. Rift has a far better F2P model than any SoE game. SoE needs to stop being too greedy. If they want people money they need to be fair.
    Trying to FORCE people spending their money is not a good business strategy.

    greed yes, but weird greed

     

    about a month ago i decided i wanted to jump back into EQII and planned on getting a years worth of all access to the tune of $180 - add to that whatever the most recent expansion was to get get all caught up on current in game content $40 - also was interested in the Age of Discover expansion that for some reason is a completely seperate expansion for another $40

    to take advantage of the all access i wanted PS2 included which for some reason i registered under a different email address then my main station account - well, after posts on forums and emails to support and a phone call it turns out they also wanted to charge for a simple account consolidation - that was over the top for me for some reason but it was a fee they insisted on - so for the want of $25 they turned down my $260 - weird

     

    image

  • TobrukTobruk St Paul, MNPosts: 40Member
    Originally posted by Calerxes
     Have SOE ever released a fully working, full of content MMO ever?

    uhhh yeah, it was called Everquest and Everquest 2.

  • mCalvertmCalvert Tallahassee, FLPosts: 1,283Member
    Notice they never actually prove to us that X MMO is doing well by posting number of users, revenue, etc.
  • noncleynoncley LondonPosts: 648Member Uncommon
    I wonder if Smedley, the genius behind the Matrix Online, SWG, POTBS, Vanguard and now EQN, will be taking a cut in salary?
  • SlampigSlampig Chantilly, VAPosts: 2,376Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Comaf
    Originally posted by Saryk
    Originally posted by Calerxes
    Sony as a corporation has been doing badly for years only just about making a profit in the last quarter, that's the reason for the gamers first approach to flogging the PS4, they need it to succeed badly. This means there must be a knock on effect to their gaming divisions especially one that fails to release quality games time and time again. Have SOE ever released a fully working, full of content MMO ever? and how the hell does John Smedley still have a job with failure after failure? that has puzzled me for a while, its seems they keep on laying off the wrong people, how about looking at leadership first? I'm expecting EQN to be a half arsed, half finished, rushed release (in time to beat TESO to market?) because history tells us that's all SOE are capable of releasing.

    You know what , I agree! However at least EQnext will be F2P..........

    Pray it doesn't go F2P - nothing says "We can't hold this game by subs alone," like F2P which depends on 1 out of every 1,000 players to be just crazy enough to spend enough to cover 1,000 subscriptions in silly purchasing. 

     

    I have yet to see a "good" mmorpg that has a F2P model.  WoW might be losing subs, but they still trump every mmorpg I've played outside of Dark Age of Camelot (a sadly dated, EA ruined gem of a game).

    Lets see, Mythic released Trials of Atlantis, which many people consider to be the downfall of Dark Age of Camelot in 2003. EA purchased Mythic in 2006. Credibility is an important thing, otherwise it just looks like more complaining for complainings sake... 

    Companies lay workers off all the time and not every time does that fortell doom and gloom. People on this site have an annoying habit of wishing the worst on others. We are talking about games people, some of you could do well to remember that.

    That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!

  • MathadarMathadar San Diego, CAPosts: 23Member
    Keep making f2p games SOE, apparently it is working out great for you.
  • JasonJJasonJ New Port Richey, FLPosts: 395Member
    Originally posted by Comaf
    Originally posted by Saryk
    Originally posted by Calerxes
    Sony as a corporation has been doing badly for years only just about making a profit in the last quarter, that's the reason for the gamers first approach to flogging the PS4, they need it to succeed badly. This means there must be a knock on effect to their gaming divisions especially one that fails to release quality games time and time again. Have SOE ever released a fully working, full of content MMO ever? and how the hell does John Smedley still have a job with failure after failure? that has puzzled me for a while, its seems they keep on laying off the wrong people, how about looking at leadership first? I'm expecting EQN to be a half arsed, half finished, rushed release (in time to beat TESO to market?) because history tells us that's all SOE are capable of releasing.

    You know what , I agree! However at least EQnext will be F2P..........

    Pray it doesn't go F2P - nothing says "We can't hold this game by subs alone," like F2P which depends on 1 out of every 1,000 players to be just crazy enough to spend enough to cover 1,000 subscriptions in silly purchasing. 

     

    I have yet to see a "good" mmorpg that has a F2P model.  WoW might be losing subs, but they still trump every mmorpg I've played outside of Dark Age of Camelot (a sadly dated, EA ruined gem of a game).

     What a wasteful rant based on limited knowledge of the genre. DAoC wasn't even in the top 5 most popular MMORPGs during its peak. And Nexon would disagree with your assessment of what a good F2P model is seeing as how more than half their revenue comes from F2P games and they are the #3 game maker in terms of profits behind only EA and Activision/Blizzard.

    And when you look at how many games those two companies make...that's saying a shit ton about how much money Nexon makes off of F2P. Deal with reality, the reality that you don't know much about MMORPGs.

  • niceguy3978niceguy3978 Gainesville, FLPosts: 2,000Member
    Originally posted by Shadanwolf
    Originally posted by DMKano
    Originally posted by grimgryphon
    If they canned Smedley I would probably take a second look at EQN. I just don't trust the guy. Too many lies and manipulation over the years. My gut says EQN will be another bottle of snake-oil. 

    Smed is a part of the "good ol boys" inner circle at SoE, there are a dozen of them that are above the law at SoE. Many game companies are in the same boat, having upper mgmt click of folks who have not changed for many years. SoE needs to do what Trion did - get rid of all upper mgmt click, replace the CEO and refocus the company.

    CU is also doing it right - get a young new team full of creativity and new energy to build the game. Watch any of EQN videos - there is not a single person shown on EQN team videos in their 20s, interesting isn't it?

     

    I was wondering how Smedley has kept his job .This would also explain why the top SWTOR management hasn't been replaced.

    But the upper management/ownership of Bioware did leave within a few months of TOR launching.  That is the equivalent of Smedly's position.  He was what started the online gaming portion of Sony which spun off to Verant, and then was brought back into the fold of Sony under SOE.  He was essentially the founder of Everquest, not necessarily from the creative standpoint but from the "put the team together" which would lead to an entirely new division/company standpoint.

  • PrecusorPrecusor PalmaPosts: 4,733Member Uncommon
    I guess their f2p MMos isn't working out so well.
  • niceguy3978niceguy3978 Gainesville, FLPosts: 2,000Member
    Originally posted by noncley
    I wonder if Smedley, the genius behind the Matrix Online, SWG, POTBS, Vanguard and now EQN, will be taking a cut in salary?

    This made me go huh?  They published Matrix for Warner Bros, and then bought it from them when it was failing, the published vanguard, then bought it from them when it was failing (granted you could question his judgement for buying failed games, but I believe the Matrix online was part of a deal for getting the rights to make DC Universe (which he was at least partially responsible for and you didn't list despite its overall failure) POTBS was published by SOE but wasn't bought like MO and Vanguard.  SWG was the most popular of the games listed and while I know it is viewed that they ruined the game, they also created the game that "everyone" loved to begin with.  You're overall point, though, I think is very valid.  He is essentially riding the coat-tails of a 14 year old game.

  • csthaocsthao Saint Paul, MNPosts: 1,111Member Common
    As rumors and speculations go...There are 2 GMs in Vanguard, and both were let go...I dont know if its 100% accurate, but there wasnt any GMs on when I was playing, and was talking to some friends online who heard they were let go...Sad Indeed...
2
Sign In or Register to comment.