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WoW devs call MoP a success...

VutarVutar BaghdadPosts: 773Member Uncommon

"Mists of Pandaria was the first push to appeal to more casual players and it was very successful. If they had not done so, the game would be in bad shape."  (on mmochamp)

 

Here is the actual article.

http://www.polygon.com/2013/8/23/4650246/world-of-warcraft-would-be-in-bad-shape-without-embracing-the-casual

 

Apparently losing millions of players is a "success," for expansions these days. I was not aware of those new standards.

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Comments

  • RocknissRockniss Youngstown, OHPosts: 1,034Member
    People dont speak of mop like they do Cata. I would have to agree mop is a success. It has extended the life of WoW and overall people are enjoying it. When a game is that old, how can you attribute losing subs to a bad expansion exclusively? You can't, so you when your in Blizzards shoes determining success is a matter of perspective and not one that you have in common with them. Would you call it a failure?
  • DemrocksDemrocks wonderlandPosts: 124Member

    I dont get it how they can say its a succes when millions of players are leaving WoW ?

    Many people quited due to the nature and theme of the panda's.

    Some love it and many hate it.

     

    Cataclysm and MoP are both the worse expansions ever created for WoW.

    I think Ghostcrawler is losing reality.....

  • expressoexpresso mePosts: 2,183Member Uncommon
    A game that is 9 years old and still has 7+ million subs is a success in any way you want to look at it.  MOP was a fantastic expansion too bad some decided to skip it cus' they were apparently too "mature" for panda's and just acted liked like little kids, the same thing is happening now in EQN.   
  • mithossmithoss Sankt AugustinPosts: 199Member Uncommon
    first of all, thank you for taking your time to create a account just to correct blizzards ineptness. Those lamers at blizzard couldnt even hold the attention of 12 million users for measly 9 years. I mean, its not like dozens of other mmos were created in those years, or people got older and buys with work and other matters. Shame on you blizzard!
  • VutarVutar BaghdadPosts: 773Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by mithoss
    first of all, thank you for taking your time to create a account just to correct blizzards ineptness. Those lamers at blizzard couldnt even hold the attention of 12 million users for measly 9 years. I mean, its not like dozens of other mmos were created in those years, or people got older and buys with work and other matters. Shame on you blizzard!

     

    Employee: Good news, our product was quite successful, we lost millions of customers!

    Boss: What?

    Employee: Oh don't worry, we had so many customers we simply couldn't keep them all.

    Boss: Well, how  many have we lost?

    Employee: Over five million or so...

    Boss: out of how many?

    Employee: 12 million.

    Boss: Wait, so you have lost close to half our player base with your newest products?

    Employee: Yes.

    Boss: Your fired.

     

     

  • NBlitzNBlitz ZwollePosts: 1,904Member

    Would WoW have kept almost all the subs it had if it had stayed the course? Or would the loss of subs have been greater had they not done something radical?

    Could it be that MoP prevented a much greater loss?

    I'm afraid people are looking at it too black/white. Look at how many subs they still have. 

  • VutarVutar BaghdadPosts: 773Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by NBlitz

    Would WoW have kept almost all the subs it had if it had stayed the course? Or would the loss of subs have been greater had they not done something radical?

    Could it be that MoP prevented a much greater loss?

    I'm afraid people are looking at it too black/white. Look at how many subs they still have. 

     

    Yes, that is how the PR department spins things. It would be crazy to think that releasing a quality xpac would keep the game from losing subs or even increase them. No, the only answer is that MoP was a wonderful success and it "saved" WoW.

  • RusqueRusque Las Vegas, NVPosts: 2,228Member Uncommon

    That's not quite what happened Vutar . . .

     

    WoW dropped to about 8 million subs before MoP launched. Then it bounced back up to 10 million for a while and dropped down to 7 million.

    So MoP brought back 2 million who had left and as the cycle always goes, people stop playing over time during each expansion. So maybe their projections were showing that they would be down to 5 or 6 million, but instead have managed to maintain 7 million and that means success to them.

     

    Remember, they don't look at the game the same way gamers do. Any sane business would be expecting a certain level of downturn in such an old product - while gamers have the expectation that things keep growing. Blizzard has been and will continue to expect WoW's playerbase to shrink. It's in a very competitive and saturated market and they have to fight for every sub as people can just pick another game to play at any point.

    I know people point to EVE as the MMO that keeps growing, but there's some key differences - Space sim MMO market has essentially no competition at this point in time. You want strategy based space sim? EVE is the only one on the list. You want twitch based space combat? There's a few and a couple more up and comers. Also, EVE doesn't have nearly as many unique players as it does subs 500k subs but based on prior reports something like 44k of those were trial accounts and many people have multiple accounts and use PLEX to maintain those. So the one guy who was posted on this site that had 70 accounts to himself counts as 70 subs. Now that is an extreme version, but if one guy has 70, it's not unreasonable to think others have 2-3 accounts.

     

    So was MoP a success? Well that depends on your metrics.

     

  • NadiaNadia Canonsburg, PAPosts: 11,866Member Common
    Originally posted by Rusque

    WoW dropped to about 8 million subs before MoP launched. Then it bounced back up to 10 million for a while and dropped down to 7 million.

    So MoP brought back 2 million who had left and as the cycle always goes, people stop playing over time during each expansion. So maybe their projections were showing that they would be down to 5 or 6 million, but instead have managed to maintain 7 million and that means success to them.

    So was MoP a success? Well that depends on your metrics.

    MOP brought back 1 million for a month or two

     

    wow was 9.1 million before MOP  (Aug 2012)

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/2872-WoW-Loses-1-1-Million-Subscibers-Down-to-9-1-Million

    with MOP hit over 10 milllion

    http://www.ign.com/articles/2012/10/04/mists-of-pandaria-pushes-warcraft-subs-over-10-million

    and dropping back for  Q4  (Oct-Dec 2012)

    http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/02/07/world-of-warcraft-subs-drop-to-9-6-million/

  • RusqueRusque Las Vegas, NVPosts: 2,228Member Uncommon
    Nadia with more accurate numbers.
  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member

    It's either one of two things. Typical corporate BS, or they have a rational understanding of what a game released in 2004 can reasonably do.

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • RocknissRockniss Youngstown, OHPosts: 1,034Member
    @OP - why does this even matter to you?
  • NadiaNadia Canonsburg, PAPosts: 11,866Member Common
    Originally posted by lizardbones

    It's either one of two things. Typical corporate BS, or they have a rational understanding of what a game released in 2004 can reasonably do.

    the world is wide open

     

    when Cata released, wow was 6 year old game and Cata made record numbers

    I dont see a big difference between a 6 year old game and 8 year old game (MOP launch)

     

    I think Blizzard can re-capture some glory but it needs to be more enticing than MOP

  • tordurbartordurbar Alexandria, VAPosts: 429Member

    This attitude saddens me. WOW is still successful with 7 million subs but is MOP a success? No. I do not have the links but until CATA the number of WOW subs grew every year. CATA was the first expansion where the numbers dropped. MOP followed the same pattern. If the devs feel that MOP is a success, even after WOW lost 5 million subs (12 mil to 7 mil) then I really fear for the next expansion.

     

      

  • IllunariIllunari Aurora, COPosts: 14Member
    Being the most successful MMO ever I guess you can lose millions of people and still be ok with it. Sooner or later they had to lose subs, WOW can't last forever... but in reality if they made a fresh game and just slap WOW 2 on the title they would have all those subs back. Blizz is just milking the last of that cash cow anyway they can....and still making millions regardless. Maybe they lay off some people and scrap all the interns but someone is still getting rich. 
  • NikopolNikopol The ZonePosts: 626Member Uncommon

    I think it's a failure on the Blizzard scale. That doesn't mean the game itself is a failure, but this last expansion could do better in my opinion.

    It does seem they went for some new blood in terms of the playerbase, but from what I've seen, that might have cost them their own "buy the expansion, level cap, stick around for a couple of months and end subscription" players.

  • Quazal.AQuazal.A PrestonPosts: 498Member Uncommon

    I sometimes think people way over think things

     

    Simple terms really

     

    Game / Expansion etc costs £10mill  to make and release

    Game / Expansion Makes £20mill in sales regardless of anything else

     

    = Game / Expansion success a 100% profit after all costs is pretty impressive, so until the exact figures are released (they never will be we would need to cost of everything to build and release ) we cannot commend on what blizz consider a success or not

    The fact the subs are dropping does not impact on wether a release was succesfull or not, all that matters is that MoP has made more after costs than it cost to build / release

     

     

    nb my numbers are just random figures

    This post is all my opinion, but I welcome debate on anything i have put, however, personal slander / name calling belongs in game :) were of course your welcome to call me names im often found lounging about in EvE online.
    Use this code for 21days trial in eve online https://secure.eveonline.com/trial/?invc=d385aff2-794a-44a4-96f1-3967ccf6d720&action=buddy

  • NephelaiNephelai SydneyPosts: 183Member Uncommon

    I wouldn't call it a success. I see it as one great big convoluted ball of band aids now days. Back in vanilla it basically went like this:

    • Level you char by completing all quests in a zone and dungeons appropriate for your level
    • Level your trades
    • Run dungeons to build you BLUE dungeon set AT YOUR OWN PACE
    • Raid

     

    Now it goes like this:

    • Level your char skipping most quests in each zone and zerging dungeons
    • Level your trades at the auction house
    • Run normal Dungeons
    • Run heroic Dungeons
    • Re run daily quest hubs x forever to get over reputation gates
    • Run 4 tiers of lfr ONCE PER WEEK battling rng to build your PURPLE tier set
    • Raid
    • Play Pokemon when bored
     
    I don't see it as an improvement I see it a a longer drawn out grind however each to their own.
  • C_GlassC_Glass That one place, MEPosts: 29Member

    lol people are faulting blizzard for not doing the impossible and keeping over 10 mill subs on a game thats nearly ten years old? Seriously? 

     

  • IllunariIllunari Aurora, COPosts: 14Member
    Originally posted by Nephelai

    I wouldn't call it a success. I see it as one great big convoluted ball of band aids now days. Back in vanilla it basically went like this:

    • Level you char by completing all quests in a zone and dungeons appropriate for your level
    • Level your trades
    • Run dungeons to build you BLUE dungeon set AT YOUR OWN PACE
    • Raid

     

    Now it goes like this:

    • Level your char skipping most quests in each zone and zerging dungeons
    • Level your trades at the auction house
    • Run normal Dungeons
    • Run heroic Dungeons
    • Re run daily quest hubs x forever to get over reputation gates
    • Run 4 tiers of lfr ONCE PER WEEK battling rng to build your PURPLE tier set
    • Raid
    • Play Pokemon when bored
     
    I don't see it as an improvement I see it a a longer drawn out grind however each to their own.

    ^^  What this guy said. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFWh9aY4pas Pretty much explains it.

  • NadiaNadia Canonsburg, PAPosts: 11,866Member Common
    Originally posted by C_Glass

    lol people are faulting blizzard for not doing the impossible and keeping over 10 mill subs on a game thats nearly ten years old? Seriously? 

    I'm claiming MOP had poor retention - even Christmas sales didnt help it

     

    MOP launched in late september and the next quarter sales (Q4) saw a significant drop

  • ArthasmArthasm LoznicaPosts: 754Member Uncommon
    It's sad that 7.7m people paying 15$ per month just to play pokemon battles in 10y old game, with so many successful F2P and B2P games out there...
  • PurutzilPurutzil East Stroudsburg, PAPosts: 2,924Member Uncommon

    Yeah... hes a little crazy. Never have I seen an MMO annoy so many people before rather then MoP. It gained SO much hate that its crazy. MoP is FAR from a success in terms of bringing players into wow and keeping them. From the dislike for pandas (which I actually disagree with as being that bad) to their design choices (which I feel only got worst.... somehow) it just displeased a lot of players who just gave up far quicker on it then normal.

    Old mmos like Everquest or FF11 had far better chances holding player numbers in with expansions, managing to keep people drawn in. WoW just doesn't have that anymore. It gains curious players though they are far quicker to drop. 

  • NikopolNikopol The ZonePosts: 626Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Nadia
    Originally posted by C_Glass

    lol people are faulting blizzard for not doing the impossible and keeping over 10 mill subs on a game thats nearly ten years old? Seriously? 

    I'm claiming MOP had poor retention - even Christmas sales didnt help it

     

    MOP launched in late september and the next quarter sales (Q4) saw a significant drop

     

    And it's not just about retention but sales as well.

    With a really attractive setting and some smart game design decisions, I wouldn't be surprised at all if WOW broke 12 million again in a future expansion. Even when it's 12-13 years old.

  • SlampigSlampig Chantilly, VAPosts: 2,376Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Vutar

    "Mists of Pandaria was the first push to appeal to more casual players and it was very successful. If they had not done so, the game would be in bad shape."  (on mmochamp)

     

    Here is the actual article.

    http://www.polygon.com/2013/8/23/4650246/world-of-warcraft-would-be-in-bad-shape-without-embracing-the-casual

     

    Apparently losing millions of players is a "success," for expansions these days. I was not aware of those new standards.

    "Awesome" post, really needed ANOTHER WoW bashing thread...

    That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!

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