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7 Million subscribers pay 15/month? Lies!
Too bad China doesn't have a monthly fee model.
been there done that and paying subscription for years on end is just wrong.
WoW is a good game because it got the themepark right for the casual player.
But it also destroyed a up and coming market with making other companies wanting to try and gain that same success.
All other MMO's released after WoW all tried to copy the themepark and they all failed, one even tried to turn a sandbox game into a class and level based game. SWG anyone ?
Only now are we starting to see signs of the industry innovating new ideas and systems in mmo's because they now know there is no chance of creating the same experience without being WoW.
TSW is the first mmo in years to be daring and innovate new ideas. It is a really good game that got a lot of bad press which is a shame because it is unique and I love how they have done the missions and how you need to use google to research some of the answers to them. The game rewards you for exploration as well as you find new missions this way because not everything is handed to you on a platter like a themepark quest hubs.
ESO looks to be the next mmo out there that is going to break the themepark mold and try a hybrid type game style with a DAoC pvp system. Their skill system based on the single player games and a pvp system that has the ability to change the landscape people play in. I hate battlegrounds that WoW created it took the reason to pvp away.
Age of Wushu although F2P has also moved away from that WoW feel. And is trying something new, and it kind of works. It is also a nice game and being free to play everyone should at least give it a try.
Personally, I don't feel, myself, that it is due to any of the five specifically with me; partially them, but the big factor for me, is mostly just.. I find it boring. Truth be told, I've not found an MMO I enjoyed in many, many, many years; before WoW, the only one I played longer then three months was Ultima Online, and Mabinogi. I suppose maybe I'm a sandbox gamer; though it isn't just that, I'm certain. I find the gameplay to be over simplistic, very easy, and so on. Leveling up "skills" just means tossing out old ones, quests are so mindnumbingly easy, and directed, I mean.. I've tried it a good few times, but playing it, I feel like I should be reading a book instead; at least that's exciting, and doesn't require me to lazily push hotbar buttons.
Put simply; the reason for me is, well, it's not for me. That's it. I don't have a 'favorite game', UO died years ago for me, Mabinogi too. I'm not jeleous new games are doing bad, because put frankly, there's plenty of singleplayer/non-mmos I can enjoy.
I'd love it if a new game came along that I truly enjoyed, but, that doesn't seem likely; the mmo genre has to make a lot of.. well, sacrifices, to make everyone feel special, which is where my main issue tends to be. There's no immersion, because everyone uses the same skills, same items, same everything; anyone can get everything, nobody can make a difference, and so on. It's.. er, well, it doesn't feel like a game, it feels like some sort of demented race course, where nobody actually wins, people just waste more, or less time.
I'd truly love an MMO that isn't afraid to make actual 'feats' possible, the world to be changed, and some things really special. I wont claim that there should be loads of 1 of a kind items, as that'd be difficult to do, and that can be a little too rare; however, I do think there should be very hard to get things, and a large emphasis on exploration, and group content.
I mean, put frankly, why play an MMO that has a crappy story, bad gameplay, and no reason to actually 'play' with others? There isn't one, you can always just, you know, play a singleplayer game; at least those have good gameplay, and story.
Edit: Just as a disclaimer, as I can see how this post may come across as mildly hostile; to those who enjoy this game, or other MMOs, that's good, not bad. I wish I could too; I just haven't found one in ages that I could so much as bare for more then a couple days to a few weeks. There's just not good enough gameplay, I don't find the stories interesting enough, and they give me no reason to stick around/play with others. Or socialize, at all. Crafting tends to be worthless, when it should be used to bring people together; grouping should be a must, not because a quest says 'You have to group!', but because a quest wants you to slay a dragon, and that's certainly going to be tough without friends. You bring a rogue because he can disarm traps, not because he does good damage; and you bring a paladin because having a healer, and a holy man may be good against undead, not because he can "Tank" with some artificial taunting mechanic. I want a game where roles matter, and not because of damage, or healing, or even tanking; I want choices that matter, things that are hard to accomplish, and that much more rewarding when I do. If I wanted an easy game, I'll just play some bejeweled or something. If I wanted to play by myself, I'd play a singleplayer game. These should be worlds; massively MULTIPLAYER Games. Not singleplayer games with a bunch of people stuffed into a world geared towards one person. People should group because they want to, not have to. Also, I'm tired of these "Party UI", people should just stay near each other, and talk; there shouldn't be some fancy UI for your party. Just, you know, do stuff together.
Originally posted by Yamota How many times does this have to be said; Popular does not always equal quality. Is McDonalds food high quality? Are garbage tv like Kardashians high quality? Hell no! WoW may be popular but a high quality MMO, it is not. It is dumbed down POS, catering to the lazy, ignorant masses.
Thank you for this statement!
I have tried wow on trial several times over the years. Even when I was quite happy in SWG, I still gave it a chance.
It always felt like I ate something really bad and the aftertaste? Yikes, nasty!
OH DEAR! I left you over two years ago now, but still, i can't forgett you. We tried to be together one more time, but it did not work. I learned the hard way that your foremost interest is different from mine and that you always put your wellbeing first; why should i even bother.
There was a time, when we were young. You were so shiny, so mysterious, so .. appealing. I was unexperienced in this things, but you just smiled and took my hand! It was marvelous!
I was determined to invest a lot of my time in our relationship and you gave me so much fun in return. Well, actually i did not only give you time, but also my money. But doesn't real love always come with a pricetag? Nevermind...
But then you became everybody's darling, always in a hurry to please your fans. You streched yourself so thin, i could not recognise you anymore. I thought it would be ok if we just go on and try to live with it, but ultimatly we drifted appart.
Here am i now. Thinking about the old days, missing the feeling of your warm embrace. I had a view dates with other candidates since i left you. But i always compered them with you, or more precisely, with my memory of you...well, it didn't work.
You were my frist love you know? Now i know, that i will never have the same feeling again. I'm still looking for a stable relationship. One that gives and takes in equal parts. One that does not require one side to fully invest in the other. A more grown-up relationship were both have their special ways and still get along with each other.
I don't hate you, i don't love you. I remember the good days and the reasons why we parted. Thank you, for everything.
Seriously that these kinds of posts still exist on this site is mind blowing.
Listen dude: all the others already went for free food, WoW has the yearly price tag of a 3 star restaurant these days.
#4: "World of Warcraft has been 'dumbed down' from that standpoint but that's not all bad".
Opinions would vary here, particularly if you have a history with the game "before and after." Anyone today starting the game simply won't know any better.
#3: Ok. But this discussion point could be expanded considerably. Homogenization of the classes to silly degree, kidification of the game overall for that crowd. Of course, that was Bobby Kotick's design goal . . . so it is in fact "working as intended".
That's "the terrible evil WoW has created", propagated in the industry in the dollar search.
#2: Agreed, blind grinds a-plenty wear out online endurance levels.
#1: "Still, as said in the intro, World of Warcraft is the top dog, the game to beat, the standard against which every other MMO measures itself."
No it's not. It's been turned into a piece of Sauder particle-board furniture, if you will, that a lot of people buy. There are a lot of people that, yes indeed, simply like easy, etc. That's your "standard to beat"? /palmface
It's also a convenient target for inane talky-talk with no real point to it other than to talk. Sort of like this post, no offense intended.
You guys as MMODB don't even realize how important you are. What you could be doing as actual "journalists".
Exploring what technology has enabled in an avenue of entertainment, not only for the kiddie-pools like WoW (which has their place. Every school needs a playground full of yelling, running, jabbering kids hopping about) as well as what else could be seen. What should it be? What should it look like?
I'm also with Jagarid a bunch of posts up. I guess I'd fall into his viewpoint as well.
In the end this guy probably points it out better than anyone I've seen so far:
Sort of the level of thinking I wish we'd see more of with media reviews nowadays.
Wherever you go, there you are.
I think you missed one reason why people hate WoW: The need to be right.
Many of us have had fun with WoW for a long time, then left for another game that sounds better. For the first few weeks it's fun and you'll have more fun than in WoW. But playing longer, very few MMOs can match the quality and fun that WoW offers.
At that point, as humans we want to be right. We want our choice to leave WoW to be the right one. We can't fool ourselves about the quality of the new game for long, since we come into contact with it daily. But since we don't play WoW any more, we can look at its faults, forget its good points, and adjust the image we have of WoW until we dislike it, even hate it, and our decision to leave WoW is clearly the correct decision.
Hating WoW is our defense mechanism against being wrong.
So people hate how simple WOW has become yet they hate grinding. Seems to me that this is a catch-22. It is amusing that critics are always complaining about "there is no end game" in new mmos yet blast WOW grinding.
Yes it is a grind at end game and even more of a pain for solo players (like me). Still I like being able to get better gear if I work hard enough. I want my time played to produce something useful not just for achievements or cosmetic gear. WOW is still the best mmo for solo players at end game (well, maybe second best. SWTOR with the Legacy system is my favorite).
Bizzard put in the grind to keep players playing. It works. In spite of the dramatic drop of players recently, as mentioned above, there are still 7 million players subbed. I am one of them (for the third time). I quit after Cata was released over the talent system re-structure and quit again after MOP was released when Blizzard butchered the talent system further. For I time I too hated WOW yet once again - I am back. You can't live with them you can't live without them
WoW is dumbed down, simplified, easy or whatever word choice you choose to describe it's difficulty. There is nothing difficult about WoW, but instead, you see a lot of useless, pointless, time consuming grinding to achieve certain goals or aspects in the game. Ask yourself, why did Blizzard decide to give Horde Paladins and Alliance Shamans? Was it to make the game more interesting? Fuck no. It's cause Blizzard is fucking lazy when it comes to game design and balance.
WoW is stale, repetitive and boring and every new expansion proves more of the same. Sure, a new race is nice, but skills and abilities are affected how much by race? Minimal. Take Dark Age of Camelot for instance. A game with 3 factions, each faction consisting of about 6 races as well as about 15-16 classes. Even if the outcome of the different classes could be classified as mirror classes, at least you have some variation.
WoW got rid of the PvP ranks almost instantly which was another chip off the entertaining block. I'm sorry, but after playing WoW from Vanilla through WotLK, all I can say is, we have a lot more casual insta gratification players than old school EQ work for your achievemtns veterans.
So, is WoW a bad game? No. Is it meant to be enjoyed by everyone? Absolutely not. Which is why I thank every Indie Developer that tries to get away from what I consider a mockery of the original MMO genre. All WoW is in my opinion is an abomination and a plague, corrupting the minds of game developers with hopes and dreams of making it big. Man do I hate sheep.
I am far from ignorant and lazy and I enjoyed WoW for 2 years before quitting. The game was and to some still is a high quality MMO no matter how many times you tell your self it wasn't or isn't lol. Also before you spout some bs about it being my first MMO I am 41 years old and cut my teeth on Muds and then Meridian 59 followed by UO and EQ and pretty much every MMO since then.
You're entitled to your opinion obviously and now you know mine, have a good one
No signature, I don't have a pen
Originally posted by Lazarus71 Originally posted by Yamota How many times does this have to be said; Popular does not always equal quality. Is McDonalds food high quality? Are garbage tv like Kardashians high quality? Hell no! WoW may be popular but a high quality MMO, it is not. It is dumbed down POS, catering to the lazy, ignorant masses.
Ignore Yamota. That guy hasn't been happy since 2004. He'll just cry on his blog about how themeparks suck and there needs to be more sandboxes. Funny how all the people who post on this site complaining about themeparks and asking for sandboxes seem to ignore all the current sandbox games out there.
Originally posted by TheHavok Originally posted by Lazarus71 Originally posted by Yamota How many times does this have to be said; Popular does not always equal quality. Is McDonalds food high quality? Are garbage tv like Kardashians high quality? Hell no! WoW may be popular but a high quality MMO, it is not. It is dumbed down POS, catering to the lazy, ignorant masses.
Good advice that I usually follow when it comes to quite a few posters on this forum Havok
As you see I have a low post count and that's the way I like it, but some times the comments people make on this forum really get under my skin. You would think after being a member for so long I would be used to it lol.
I can't stand WoW tbh, but I will not deny that it is a quality product. I played for a few years and was able to spend time with friends and family while away in other countries because of the game. For me, it wasn't the quality that made me hate the game but the direction they were going in with classes and balance. My 2 favorite classes were paladin and shaman and I really enjoyed how different the classes were when doing the same job as healers or DPS. Now when they started homogenizing all of the classes, I started losing interest and when Cata came about and I had to sit through classes being raped to the point that all jobs played the same, I quit and haven't looked back. Fond memories but I don't agree with the direction they have been going in. Loved vanilla...
RIP Jimmy "The Rev" Sullivan and Paul Gray.
Agree in all points of OP. Maybe could add something more, but essentially is all there.
Originally posted by FlawSGI Originally posted by Lazarus71 Originally posted by Yamota How many times does this have to be said; Popular does not always equal quality. Is McDonalds food high quality? Are garbage tv like Kardashians high quality? Hell no! WoW may be popular but a high quality MMO, it is not. It is dumbed down POS, catering to the lazy, ignorant masses.
You pretty much just described the exact reasons I only played as long as I did. The game just changed more and more into a game I didn't enjoy any more.
I love it and I hate it... I love the stylized graphics, it lets me escape reality, into a fun and often dark world. I love the Forsaken, favorite MMO race of all time. I hate the gear grind with a passion. I hate my main class (rogue aka "rouge") being on a nerf/buff patch see-saw. Having said that, I love my undead rogue just about more than any other MMO character I have ever created. I generally hate theme parks and yet I love the open world feel of Azeroth.
The only other MMO I have loved more than WoW was SWG, and that was it's polar opposite pre-cu/nge. I loved/hated SWG as well!!
Does that make sense?
What a carefully calculated inflamatory post. "It's just cool to hate WoW cause they're the best".
No mention of the casualization of the entire market, and the crash of the genre, the two biggest reasons people hate WoW.
Originally posted by mCalvert Personally I hate it because its hyped reputation comes from people who have probably never played anything else. Its like Harry Potter. People who love that series have probably never read another book.
Except that Harry Potter was actually written well and dripping with creativity.
WoW has never done anything original.