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How to kill a dragon ?

iixviiiixiixviiiix Member RarePosts: 2,256

Top class enemy in fantasy world ,

with big body monstrous heal and mana , skin harder than steel and an anti magic being.

It can fly and one breath can ruin a small town , each step of it make earth shake ect ect ...

So

How we defeat a dragon in a MMORPG ?

- Send a hero party to ambush when it sleep in nest

- Bring a  thousand men army

- Poison it food

- Cast death's spell (lol)

ect ect ...

So

Do you thing what's best way to defeat a dragon in MMORPG fantasy world ?

 

«1

Comments

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by iixviiiix

    How we defeat a dragon in a MMORPG ?

     

    Send the tank in to keep aggro. DPS players nuke. Healers try to keep everyone alive.

    How else?

  • BarrikorBarrikor Member UncommonPosts: 373

    The bravest, most heroic way possible:


    Roll a bolder over the entrance to the dragons lair, come back when it's starved to death.

  • Kevyne-ShandrisKevyne-Shandris Member UncommonPosts: 2,077
    Originally posted by iixviiiix

    So

    Do you thing what's best way to defeat a dragon in MMORPG fantasy world ?

     

     

  • irpugbossirpugboss Member UncommonPosts: 427

    I think for bosses like that it be more interesting to move away from the static roles of tanking, dps and healers. IMO it be fun for players to make a strategy using war machines, magic, and NPC troops to take down large monstrous creatures.

     

    Average humanoid vs humanoid I think its great to have combat how it is now in most MMOs with toe-toe combat, but I think with huge beasts and creatures we should have to rely more kiting, special magic, terrain, and war machines to down them.

     

    Imagine such a game was made, how hilarious it would be in your first dungeon or fight against a dragon or other monstrous creature when the "tank" goes rushing in to aggro the boss and plants his feet to begin a dps/aggro rotation only to to get bit in half, sent flying and shattered by a tail swipe, or stomped into paste by a limb.

     

    Then again the creature would have to have some really solid AI to adjust to player positions, damage, and what it is programmed to understand as a threat (Fire, magic, clanging pots and pans lol)

    image
  • Kevyne-ShandrisKevyne-Shandris Member UncommonPosts: 2,077
    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard

    Don't get me wrong, I raided in trinity games, notably 8 years of WoW, and had fun. But just standing there while (e.g.) Onyxia was pounding on me (I was tank), when she could actually have swallowed me whole without breaking a sweat, always seemed cheesy to.

     

    You weren't standing there alone. You had off tanks picking up adds. You had a team of healers keeping you alive. You had DPS there making sure you weren't dragon food, too.

     

    Beauty of the trinity model is it supports role playing classes/sub-classes. Where they couldn't do ABC by themselves, but with others they can. It supports the grouping model in MMOs.

     

    Soloing has it place for the hero aspect and character development, but a tank isn't much of a tank by himself nor a healer.

  • Kevyne-ShandrisKevyne-Shandris Member UncommonPosts: 2,077
    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard

    Fact remains, Onyxia can swallow a human in one piece... so when she doesn't do it, and stand there like a dumb moron (which she isn't according to her story like, by the way) instead while an army of weaker character beat her on the ankles, it looks cheesy.

     

    Well, if you don't respect the player being a hero, yeah, it would look cheesy.

     

    If you did respect it, you are invincible even to dragons.

     

    To me it's not cheesy, it's to be expected.

  • BetaguyBetaguy Member UncommonPosts: 2,627
    Originally posted by Barrikor

    The bravest, most heroic way possible:


    Roll a bolder over the entrance to the dragons lair, come back when it's starved to death.

    ;)

    "The King and the Pawn return to the same box at the end of the game"

  • Kevyne-ShandrisKevyne-Shandris Member UncommonPosts: 2,077
    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
    Originally posted by UNATCOII
    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard

    Fact remains, Onyxia can swallow a human in one piece... so when she doesn't do it, and stand there like a dumb moron (which she isn't according to her story like, by the way) instead while an army of weaker character beat her on the ankles, it looks cheesy.

    Well, if you don't respect the player being a hero, yeah, it would look cheesy.

    If you did respect it, you are invincible even to dragons.

    To me it's not cheesy, it's to be expected.

    The highlighted parts are quite contradictory to me.

    And I suppose you meant "expect" and not "respect".

    Actually, someone invincible is not a hero, it's a god. The point of being a hero is to overcome your own weaknesses and win. If the dragon can actually swallow you, but you manage to dodge his bites and survive, then yeah, you're a hero.

     

    The hero in RPGs is invincible. He's indomitable. He is essentially Jesus Christ.

     

    A man god.

     

  • ReizlaReizla Member RarePosts: 4,092
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by iixviiiix

    How we defeat a dragon in a MMORPG ?

     

    Send the tank in to keep aggro. DPS players nuke. Healers try to keep everyone alive.

    How else?

    Send tank in for aggro..? Are you nuts? That tactic is not working in Neverwinter. Instead the tank should keep aggro on the random spawns and keep them away from the healer while the DPSers keep their focus on the dragon...

    http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xzlcvt_neverwinter-lair-of-the-mad-dragon_videogames

  • Mr.KujoMr.Kujo Member Posts: 383

    Killing a dragon

     

    The realistic approach:

    • You poison it's food
    • You drown the fcker in it's cave with magic
    • You bring trees to the cave entrance, set them on fire and seal it to suffocate the sucker with smoke
    • You put it to sleep with magic and cut it's head off.

    Would it work in mmorpg: Hell no, no effort and boring as hell (kinda ironic it is the realistic way to kill godly beast)

     

    The unrealistic action packed method:

    • You bring together a bunch of superheroes that are almost invincible and they hit it's toes so hard it bleeds out through them.
    • You shoot the fcker with catapults, while he stands in one spot and tries to kill the little humans that scratch it's toes.

    Would it work in mmorpg: Nope, way to stupid, illogical, immersion breaking and boring (ironic that it is in most current mmo's)

     

    The unrealistic strategic method:

    • You pick the strongest hero in the land, you send him with strong mages, healers and archers to support in battle. Mages fill the warrior with powerful magic that makes him almost invincible. Warrior approaches the dragon and uses his magical ability to taunt it into attacking only him, while mages and archers blow everything they got into dragon from a safe range, and healers do everything in their power to keep the warrior alive.
    Would it work in mmorpg: Just read it, it sound much more convincing then the action method. It feels more like watching a movie, it is fantasy but keeps that logic of fictional world (was used in games but people don't like it anymore)
     
     
    My proposition of a strategic + action method:
     
    • You pick the strongest heroES, you send them with strong mages etc. etc. you know the drill. Heroes get packed with magic and go nuts on the dragon in a shadow of colossus + god of war style, running all over the monster, hitting its weak spots and drawing its attention away from casters, while mages and archers shoot everything they got at fucker in a guitar hero style, where you have to bash hard key sequences incredibly fast to pull of a skill, and healers try to keep hero alive by throwing healing rays at him fps style,  while he moves extremely fast all around monster.
     
    Would this work in mmorpg: I have no idea, would be cool though. Should satisfy all types of players, but probably only in theory and in reality would get flamed like hell :D
  • EnrifEnrif Member UncommonPosts: 152

    Use siege weapons to bring the dragon down/incapacitate and then hit its head until its dead!

  • Kevyne-ShandrisKevyne-Shandris Member UncommonPosts: 2,077
    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
    He can resurrect, but he isn't invincible. Unless you play games with cheats, in any existing MMORPG or even RPG, your character can be defeated (aka fail).

     

    He can rise again, as he can never truly die.

     

    Thus, he is invincible. Indomitable. Incredible.

     

    He's the hero, the man god.

  • Mr.KujoMr.Kujo Member Posts: 383
    Originally posted by UNATCOII
    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
    He can resurrect, but he isn't invincible. Unless you play games with cheats, in any existing MMORPG or even RPG, your character can be defeated (aka fail).

     

    He can rise again, as he can never truly die.

     

    Thus, he is invincible. Indomitable. Incredible.

     

    He's the hero, the man god.

     

    I think I lost your point, but in the universe you are playing, he is not a god. You have a fantasy world, where everyone can rise from the dead, so it is not godly there but normal. And in that world player is defeated, when he looses battle, not when he dies. He is a hero, he can loose, he can be defeated, but defeat is not a matter of death.

    So from the games point of view he is not invincible, he can loose. It is just not by dying like in real world, it is just a matter of different words and different laws of the fictional world. There is nothing godly about a hero in a game. Of course this is theory, in real life games are so easy you can't be defeated too xD

  • Mr.KujoMr.Kujo Member Posts: 383
    Originally posted by DMKano

    The real question why would you?

    If the dragon is not messing with you or your village, let it be. It is not going to drop mithril underwear of epicness, it doesn't have any loot.

    Find a way to coexist.

    It depends on lore. In almost every legend possible, whether it is Christian, Greek, Slavic or Chinese it is always depicted as malevolent. It always has bad intentions, it is always evil, and always wants to conquer new territory. And in every myth there is a hero that needs to defeat it. And games took the idea from all that.

    If you make a lore, where dragons can coexist with humans, then it would be possible.

    But for any other myth and lore in this world, the answer to your question "why would you" would be because it is either you or a dragon.

  • NitthNitth Member UncommonPosts: 3,904


    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
    Fact remains, Onyxia can swallow a human in one piece... so when she doesn't do it, and just stands there like a dumb moron (which she isn't according to her story line, by the way) while an army of weaker character beat her on the ankles, it looks cheesy.

    Soo...what your trying to say here is onixa should of just 1 shot you, then moved to the next player and continued down the line?

    Trying to use logic in a fantasy universe is illogical..

    image
    TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development

  • VaporsVapors Member UncommonPosts: 407
    The first dragonfight in SKYRIM, just awesome and very cool made just like a movie, with a tower u can hide with a whole army with arrows and bows, fighting him while the dragon enrages the whole area keep killing some of the army, while u can steal their arrows and keep shooting him aswell after a few he comes down u can try to behead him with ur meele weapon:D pretty much enjoyed that fight even I must admit, some others may experienced it bit easier to more lame, I just had no equip or anything so I could not even tank 2 fire breaths.
  • Kevyne-ShandrisKevyne-Shandris Member UncommonPosts: 2,077
    Originally posted by Mr.Kujo
    Originally posted by UNATCOII
    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
    He can resurrect, but he isn't invincible. Unless you play games with cheats, in any existing MMORPG or even RPG, your character can be defeated (aka fail).

     

    He can rise again, as he can never truly die.

     

    Thus, he is invincible. Indomitable. Incredible.

     

    He's the hero, the man god.

     

    I think I lost your point, but in the universe you are playing, he is not a god. You have a fantasy world, where everyone can rise from the dead, so it is not godly there but normal. And in that world player is defeated, when he looses battle, not when he dies. He is a hero, he can loose, he can be defeated, but defeat is not a matter of death.

    So from the games point of view he is not invincible, he can loose. It is just not by dying like in real world, it is just a matter of different words and different laws of the fictional world. There is nothing godly about a hero in a game. Of course this is theory, in real life games are so easy you can't be defeated too xD

     

    Azerorth would not exist without the hero. If the hero was a weakling, what player would want to play anyhow? If there wasn't any players...SWG anyone?

     

    So the hero's story goes without saying, as that's for the player to fill in. Short of the permadeath likers, you bet the hero is a man god and treated as much. ;)

  • NitthNitth Member UncommonPosts: 3,904


    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
    Originally posted by Nitth   Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard Fact remains, Onyxia can swallow a human in one piece... so when she doesn't do it, and just stands there like a dumb moron (which she isn't according to her story line, by the way) while an army of weaker character beat her on the ankles, it looks cheesy.
    Soo...what your trying to say here is onixa should of just 1 shot you, then moved to the next player and continued down the line?   Trying to use logic in a fantasy universe is illogical..
    What I'm saying is that a player shouldn't be able to simple stand there when a creature the size and strength of a dragon bashes his face. Some games manage to do this just fine. It's (e.g.) having to dodge when the dragon opens his jaws to try to eat you or cut you in two tasty dead parts to feed his whelps.

    What you say makes no more logical sense than using a tank.

    If a dragon can: swipe-cleave, smash, stomp, bite, clonal fire and tail swipe with unknown dexterity, How do you rationally think you could just "dodge" out the way?

    Also putting limiters on a dragon so it "doesn't want to" or "Should not" issue a killing blow is even more absurd then a dragon attacking the person its most angry at.

    image
    TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development

  • Kevyne-ShandrisKevyne-Shandris Member UncommonPosts: 2,077
    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
    Originally posted by Nitth

     


    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
    Fact remains, Onyxia can swallow a human in one piece... so when she doesn't do it, and just stands there like a dumb moron (which she isn't according to her story line, by the way) while an army of weaker character beat her on the ankles, it looks cheesy.


    Soo...what your trying to say here is onixa should of just 1 shot you, then moved to the next player and continued down the line?

     

    Trying to use logic in a fantasy universe is illogical..

    What I'm saying is that a player shouldn't be able to simple stand there when a creature the size and strength of a dragon bashes his face. Some games manage to do this just fine. It's (e.g.) having to dodge when the dragon opens his jaws to try to eat you or cut you in two tasty dead parts to feed his whelps.

     

    But those games tend to be single player, not with an army to back him up.

     

    Your logic here is faulty, because you're seeing it as 1 player against 1 dragon, when in that situation of Oxynia, you are being supported by a raid of 9 to 24 others.

     

    You're not fighting that dragon alone.

  • Four0SixFour0Six Member UncommonPosts: 1,175

    1. Use a massive asteroid from space to cause an extinction level event on the planet. Worked to end the era of the dinosaurs.

    2. Stop believing in dragons. Then they will go the way of all the lessor gods and fall into myth and legend.

  • NitthNitth Member UncommonPosts: 3,904


    Originally posted by Four0Six
    2. Stop believing in dragons. Then they will go the way of all the lessor gods and fall into myth and legend.

    image

    Pretty much summarized the plot of the NES.

    image
    TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development

  • Kevyne-ShandrisKevyne-Shandris Member UncommonPosts: 2,077


    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard

    Agro based tanks are the most nonsensical combat mechanic ever introduced to games. Good AI would make a mob turn to the most dangerous foe


     


    Huh?

    Why would the dragon only see the bits of metal with a shield, and not the mage that serves Chinese take out? lol

  • Mr.KujoMr.Kujo Member Posts: 383

    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard

    There are exceptions, though.

     

    I was referring to legends, where the whole idea of dragon originated. I agree that in current literature they got pacified.

     

    Originally posted by Vapors
    The first dragonfight in SKYRIM, just awesome and very cool made just like a movie, with a tower u can hide with a whole army with arrows and bows, fighting him while the dragon enrages the whole area keep killing some of the army, while u can steal their arrows and keep shooting him aswell after a few he comes down u can try to behead him with ur meele weapon:D pretty much enjoyed that fight even I must admit, some others may experienced it bit easier to more lame, I just had no equip or anything so I could not even tank 2 fire breaths.

     

    It's better than most fights out there, but still ridiculous. No sane creature with wings would attack ground enemy that can't even reach it first instead of attacking the enemy that is shooting at it, hurting it. There is no taunt as far as I know, so it is basically a retarded dragon attacking units that can't harm him. You would also think that every flying carnivore would just grab victim, flew high up and drop it, not just stand there and take hits. It is done in some games, and that is awesome.

    In terms of immersion skyrim dragon battle was bad, in terms of mindless action it was decent.

     

    Originally posted by Nitth

    What you say makes no more logical sense than using a tank.

    If a dragon can: swipe-cleave, smash, stomp, bite, clonal fire and tail swipe with unknown dexterity, How do you rationally think you could just "dodge" out the way?

    Also putting limiters on a dragon so it "doesn't want to" or "Should not" issue a killing blow is even more absurd then a dragon attacking the person its most angry at.

     

    The difference between standing still taking blows and dodging is that dodging is less boring and gives the feeling of danger, which is a good thing for a game. You should be busy, the times of chatting in global while fighting dragon should be over by now.

  • ElikalElikal Member UncommonPosts: 7,912
    Why do you guys always want to kill Dragons? That's not nice! :(

    People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by Reizla
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by iixviiiix

    How we defeat a dragon in a MMORPG ?

     

    Send the tank in to keep aggro. DPS players nuke. Healers try to keep everyone alive.

    How else?

    Send tank in for aggro..? Are you nuts? That tactic is not working in Neverwinter. Instead the tank should keep aggro on the random spawns and keep them away from the healer while the DPSers keep their focus on the dragon...

    http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xzlcvt_neverwinter-lair-of-the-mad-dragon_videogames

    I would suggest you look up the word "sarcasm".

    (BTW, this reply is ALSO sarcastic. Please don't reply by "i have already learn that word in elementary school")

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