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Originally posted by shirlnt I've tried WoW a few times (at least three occassions, not sure which expansion it was on the last time I tried it). I've never been able to play it for more than a couple of months at a time. While WoW is not my ideal for an MMO, I understand that many people enjoy it and I don't have a problem with it. My problem with WoW? People (including developers/game companies) do not recognize WoW for what it was in the MMO industry. It blew the top off what would have been considered at the time acceptable number of subscribers for an MMO. It was like the student that makes a 100 on a test that everyone else in the class makes no higher than an 80 in a college class in which the professor adjusts grades according to highest grade (if the one person with the 100 was taken out of the equation, everyone would have 20 points added to test score). Although WoW's number was off the chart, companies saw a possibility in that number. People adjusted their definition of success based on that one number from one MMO. As a result, games seem to follow the "recipe" of WoW (yes many of those features existed before WoW). Until recently, very few MMOs have ventured away from leveled players, leveled zones, one class from start to finish, big emphasis on end game style. Even if people want to argue that anything else is "niche," that doesn't mean that money can't be made from it; it just may not be as large an amount of money and it may occur over a longer period of time as players stay around and keep paying for the game (GW2 is b2p but I "finished" that game in less than two months as in I hit level 80 and got to the end of the storyline although I didn't complete the last quest in storyline; SWG was subscription and I played it for about a year and a half before the NGE hit and had three subscriptions for nearly a year of that time.....no telling how much longer I would have played if things had gone differently....and pre-CU there was no way to "finish" the game). Fortunately, there are games in development that will break the "mold" of WoW....and NO I did not say they would be "WoW killers," because they may not get anywhere near WoW's numbers, but they will offer something different, and why do we need a "WoW killer" anyway? People need to realize there is room for a variety of MMOs and that everyone would enjoy having at least one well-done MMO in the genre they enjoy whether it be PvE or PvP, themepark or sandbox, console or PC, f2p or b2p or p2p, and combinations of each (no, not everyone that wants sandbox also wants ffa pvp).
I think what you were trying to say is grading with a curve. Also, break up those paragraphs a bit. It will make it easier to read :-)
This site never got over the frustration that the MMO scene was dominated for all these years by just ONE game.
That was not the game's fault, but the complete failure of this industry to offer an alternative in the fantasy based sector.
It is typical that the only game that thought "outside of the box" stayed around as the only subscription based game besides WOW and that's EVE.
ALL the rest are and were just bad copycats of the Blizzard elephant in the room.
Looking back it is no wonder all these hyped "wannabees" failed utterly in keeping up subscriptions.
9 years already and the laugh is ... it is still going strong.
I think you missed one; Cash shop + Sub. That to me is a double dip on customers. I understand the 'just cosmetics' argument, but it does not fly with me because developer resources are taken up creating cash shop content. These developers could be working on things or content that you could earn in game.
Edit: Box Price + Sub + Cash Shop + Expansions... Just realized there is more to wow than just sub + cash shop.
Often lurking, rarely posting
Originally posted by sportsfan This site never got over the frustration that the MMO scene was dominated for all these years by just ONE game. That was not the game's fault, but the complete failure of this industry to offer an alternative in the fantasy based sector. It is typical that the only game that thought "outside of the box" stayed around as the only subscription based game besides WOW and that's EVE. ALL the rest are and were just bad copycats of the Blizzard elephant in the room. Looking back it is no wonder all these hyped "wannabees" failed utterly in keeping up subscriptions. 9 years already and the laugh is ... it is still going strong.
So true... and sad.
"Increasingly we find ourselves preferring to go play Diablo 3 or some other game simply to escape the daily grind."
You find ur self leaving a grind game, for D3 a total grind game? really? huh? wtf!!!!
you just lost all credibility with that statement. what a moronic statement.
Haters gonna hate, right?
ya, we gonna hate, on shit blizzard north.
The game has been dumbed down, and in 10 years it will be more? how can it be, its already ez mode. they just going to give the boss gear for just entering a raid instance next?
Lol, wow still running strong, because of the fact it was so big in the first place, and so well known, not because its good still. Its like the entry into mmo world, thats super dumb down, so why wouldn't new players entering the market, try it out, its like the start of mmo era, beside the few that came before it and didn't reach it success. I think someone needs to learn what marketing is.......
I'm sorry author but this was a piss poor article and you should not even be writing for mmorpg. what a disgrace. i have plenty more i could say but why waste my time. kkthxbye
When I was playing SWG and DDO, I was told many times how awefull WoW was, turns out WoW was a a great product , well worth the time and money put into it and far superior than the competition.
It's bad now but still far superior than the competition!
This is the ONLY reason you listed that caused me to quit.
4) The Stupification of WoW Since Vanilla
But it wasn't Vanilla, The dumbing down started with patch 2.3
One of the more popular complaints when it comes to WoW is that it's gotten ridiculously stupified since the "good ol' vanilla days" of yore. Honestly, there is merit to this contention coming from the standpoint of someone who only recently began to play. Good times were had by all when it came to having to actually go out and achieve something.
"You would have loved the days when you had to go out questing for your first mount and then it was ridiculously expensive." my friend Shelassa has told me.
She's right too. World of Warcraft has been 'dumbed down' from that standpoint but that's not all bad. It's easy to look back on the good old days through the filtered vision of rose-colored glasses. There's no question that there were many complaints and many reasons why Blizzard has chosen the path it has when it comes to the current iteration of WoW. In another 10 years, we'll all look back on today's version with nostalgia as well.
The original formula steadily brought in 10M players in the 1st 3 years. and I seriously doubt I will be nostalgic about the last 2 expansions.
Originally posted by itchmon the reason that MMO gamers don't like WoW is that people who are NOT MMO gamers like WoW. that is reason 1, 2, and 3 in my book. beer snob syndrome if you will. look at eve. (for a long long time i played both wow and eve). Its pretty universally considered a good game, but its model of accessability is the opposite of wow's . you NEED to be the kind of person who will pre-research your decisions, read forums, and not give up after the first dozen or so hours of gameplay before eve really grows on you. in other words you need to e a gamer. wow is also a good game but you can literally play it to some capacity even if all you have played in the past is bejeweled, learning as you go if you are so inclined to learn.
I'm a gamer - an old gamer. I like WoW just fine.
I played EQ the year of release - I hadn't even played bejeweled and I did just fine with it - by the end, you would even say I was 'uber'.
I played EVE and thought it was mind numbingly boring. I'm glad it turns people on - but not me. That doesn't mean I'm not a real gamer. I go to forums, research my decisions and don't give up after the first dozen hours or so of any game I play - even WoW. Some car enthusiasts get into classic muscle cars. Some get into antiques. Some get into car building kits. They are all car enthusiasts - the one's working on formula 1 racers aren't necessarily the 'real' ones.
I totally resent it when people act as if I'm not a 'real' gamer, because I like WoW. I don't think you have to be 'leet' to play EVE, but I think a lot of people who do think they are - but to the rest of us, you are still just playing a fantasy outer space video game - no need to be cocky about it.
For me, it is all about:
"#4) The Stupification of WoW Since Vanilla"
I don't hate on WoW even now, but when I am critical of it, and the reason I no longer play it, is all about how stupidly easy the whole game got. I'm still bitter about it too. I think many old vanilla players are bitter in that regards. Something we really enjoyed got changed to the point we no longer enjoy it. So of course it comes across as "hate" sometimes. Bitterness and hate are hard to distinguish.
"In another 10 years, we'll all look back on today's version with nostalgia as well."
Even as a retired hardcore raider I still go back once and a while to see what's happening.
This same amount of anger has been going on for like 6 years, at least some of you guys are persistent. Persistent and failing.
I think a lot of you guys should learn to live with the fact, that WoW is still the most popular MMO, even over F2P garbage. Some of you have been complaining about WoW for over 5 years, or ferociously defending your game to get people to try it. Amusing effort, nothing gained. You guys lost this fight years ago, live with it!
I enjoyed WoW through the first 2 expansions. But for some reason, when Cata launched, I felt it was time to go.
How many times does this have to be said; Popular does not always equal quality. Is McDonalds food high quality? Are garbage tv like Kardashians high quality?
Hell no! WoW may be popular but a high quality MMO, it is not. It is dumbed down POS, catering to the lazy, ignorant masses.
This article seems to forget the hate of kids too young (cause Blizzard doesnt care to enforce the 13 years or older policy and let 6 years old fuck around the dongeons) and the monthly fees and expensive expansions... WoW is a milking machine for the bank account. THAT is the reason why I quit after so long. Just doing the math (over 3000$ over 5 years) made me taste puke in my mouth. If only Blizzard could come with a better plan for the next game maybe I'll reconsider playing a monthly fee, but wow is never getting back on my computer anytime soon.
That is if you're gullible enough to believe they have 7 million subs.
When I left, my server was practically empty as well another server I had alts on and this was a month or two before that stupid dumb panda garbage came out. Since then even more players have abandoned that sinking ship.
So, to believe they have 7 million subs is to believe you'll get wings to fly.
Originally posted by neosparkk And they have yet to offer balanced pvp.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
There are a couple of things I would like to add:
1) Love it or Hate it any mention of WoW, ANYWHERE on gaming sites, sparks conversation and debate. There is a reason for that
2) Like it or not, WoW introduced an entirely new player base to the genre. Which IMO would have died out by now if now for World of Warcraft
3) WoW was / is a very good game. Doesn't mean its for everyone but anyone who says a game that controlled, and still controls the MASSES, isn't good is just being biased and not looking at it objectively. No game has ever done what WoW has done in terms of online subscription gaming; there is a reason for that
4) Before you go off the deep end on me; I hate casuals
Originally posted by Rawiz Even as a retired hardcore raider I still go back once and a while to see what's happening. This same amount of anger has been going on for like 6 years, at least some of you guys are persistent. Persistent and failing. I think a lot of you guys should learn to live with the fact, that WoW is still the most popular MMO, even over F2P garbage. Some of you have been complaining about WoW for over 5 years, or ferociously defending your game to get people to try it. Amusing effort, nothing gained. You guys lost this fight years ago, live with it!
I'm a retired hardcore raider myself...I still watch the progression races every single tier! I don't like what WoW is now so I don't play it anymore but that doesn't mean it still isn't a great game for millions of other players. All the hate this game gets is completely uncalled for.
Originally posted by Icewhite Originally posted by neosparkk And they have yet to offer balanced pvp.
Guild Wars 1 came pretty damn close
Kickstarter: Stuff I'm supporting
Originally posted by GeezerGamer This is the ONLY reason you listed that caused me to quit. 4) The Stupification of WoW Since Vanilla But it wasn't Vanilla, The dumbing down started with patch 2.3
i remember that patch
Many elite creatures and quests in the level 1-60 experience have been changed to accommodate solo play.
LOL. Let me stop you right there. That was funny.
The only thing I hate about WoW is that I can't go back in time and start fresh. The first time I went to Darnassus and saw someone riding a tiger blew my mind.
Blizzard has tried to keep up with the times. They steal almost every good idea that other games come up with and implement it into Warcraft. They did get lazy with the daily quest hubs, or that could be because they listened to the die-hard addicts that praise everything Blizzard does. "I can do unlimited dailies over and over? Thanks Blizz!" Sound familiar?
I hope they stop listening to the addicts and make the game a little more fun with the next expansion. Don't let WoW addicts beta test. The response will always be the same: "Great job Blizz!"