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I dont know what is the big deal if a game goes B2P at launch.
Buy the game get the month out of it . And if you think its great sub for another $15. If not dont sub. only cost you the amount you pay for the game.
If you dont want to buy try to get into open beta or something.
ASUS G74sxi7 quad core16gb ddr3 ram3gb ram Nvidia 560M 240GB SSD & 750GB
Originally posted by gr0und3d Originally posted by Vinterkrig In the form of :::::DRUM ROLL::::::: EXPANSION PACKS! For a one time low price of $29.99
I dont see your point. $29.99 every year/2yr is really not expensive......
My point is that he said subscription based games get updated content, and it's BS.. most of the time they get balance patches and a little bit of fluff, but you really don't much content added unless its in the form of a $30.00 expansion. I'm not broke, I can afford the box fee (that is actually a digital download go figure) and subscription x 2 for my wife and I.. and the expansion packs.. but you know why these subscription based games keep going F2P... because they aren't putting that $$$ flow into the game, they're recouping their losses and handing us fluff crap.
Hell even GUILD WARS 2 has failed by far to hold anything true to its name... it's a PVE game / weapon skin collection simulator (akin TF2's hat collection simulator) .. the WvW and sPVP are an afterthought to useless fluff PVE content. There are server zergs and bored arena players... but at least if I wanna jump in for a bit and play, I don't have to pay them for fluff content that doesn't interest me.
The biggest problem with the subscription model these days is several factors:
1. Most new MMO's are crap. At least with a no box fee and cash shop you spend what you believe the game is worth. Whether that is nothing or $15 per month (most F2P has subscription options still).
2. There are NUMEROUS MMO's to choose from that are free. If I had to choose between a free game that is entertaining and one that cost $60 plus $15 a month I am going the free route every time UNLESS the game in question is something of the next evolution of MMO's which 99% are not.
Quote me now.. WildStar will offer a F2P option within a year. For that matter ESO will be F2P within a year. Why? Again, because there are so many other F2P options and MMO's coming out there is no brand loyalty anymore unless you are WoW and even they are dwindling rapidly.
Let me state this to. I am not a F2P fan. I think the type of community it draws is not as.. mature or committed as a subscription based game. BUT I've been burned too many times to trust game companies these days that are out for the almighty dollar instead of delivering a good and stable product. So I will only try MMO's if they have some sort of free trial or are F2P. Again, unless they are something evolutionary which WildStar and ESO are simply not.
I don't care how many subs WoW is bleeding, still over 8 million, at 15 a month, yup HOLY crap tons and tons of cash.
Maybe WS will be the WoW killer and get those. Who knows? Who Cares?
Nice read on giving a game a chance based on the game itself and not its business model.
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." - John F. KennedyAnd for MMORPGs ever so true...
The only thing I've yet to understand is how much ones wallet may influence the economy. As from what I understand there is a two way currency exchange. Know what I always love in my escape from the reality of a market society, playing a market society simulator.
I really hope Wildstar has something incredibly interesting going for it, because if it doesn't it'll more than likely follow every other uninteresting stale money grab game that has been regurgitated by this industry.
um im sorry Mr.Lashley,
- but i like to know where my good hard earn money goes.
with F2p( cash shops, etc) i get to spend my money 'where i want it and how i want it' i customize my game time, i like to spend my money and see results instantly. as a casual player i divide my time in multiple games- back in the day when there were only 2 mmos= it might of been ok- but nowadays the choices are limitless that just dosent work anymore...
i wont pay a subscription fee, and wait months to see what develops for the game-those are called expansion packs.
Subscriptions maybe alright by you- but iam ok with my F2p games!
“We’re not watching the competition at all, really…. Because a business model does have an impact, but in general good games do well. And we know what we have is good and worth that value. But more importantly the elder game needs to be there, all the content needs to be there, the features list needs to be full. If we have those things, and we do, we’ll be fine.”
Sorry but I just don't believe they are not watching the competition. That would be very bad business practice. Perhaps Jeremy Gaffney does not do this personaly but I am 100% sure someone or some people in the company do look for what the competition is doing. How else could they make a decision and know their game is good enough to be sub-based. You need reference to make such a asumtion...right?
Besides that, I am still looking forward to Wildstar even more so due to it's sub-fee.
But it will be a pretty big gamble they are going to take with their sub-fee cause let's face it F2P games are not anymore what they used to be and are becoming better and better especially for F2P games. I'ts no longer low quality games that are F2P, better and higher quality games are going there too. Take Right, take Neverwinter, DCUO as a few example, and it doesn't matter if people like or dislike those games there is simply no denying they are of higher quality compared to F2P games of before them.
Paying $60 bucks for a game and only being able to play it for 1 month, then having to pay $14.99 a month at the promise that a new company with a new game provides content updates every month, with no accountability or "refund" if they fuck up and don't deliver? Oh yeah... NCSOFT?
Good luck with that. I'll see you in game when they go B2P. Enjoy your chat icon, "founder" title and thank you for being a mark and funding the content I'll probably get to play at box price.
Originally posted by FlyByKnight Paying $60 bucks for a game and only being able to play it for 1 month, then having to pay $14.99 a month at the promise that a new company with a new game provides content updates every month, with no accountability or "refund" if they fuck up and don't deliver? Oh yeah... NCSOFT? Good luck with that. I'll see you in game when they go B2P. Enjoy your chat icon, "founder" title and thank you for being a mark and funding the content I'll probably get to play at box price. Sincerely, History
I'll wait 6 months longer than you do and play it for free.......
Originally posted by ZoeMcCloskey I am very motivated to give support to one of these P2P games as I think the model just makes for a better game.
So by your definition if Hello Kitty Online charged 30 dollars a month then it would be the best game on the market?.....The p2p model is terrible...I paid for both EQ1 and 2 for years because we had no other options....I saw little to no improvement month after month yet we had to keep giving them 15 bucks for the privilege of playing their game......What if every game ever released used this model?....Would people pay 15 a month to play all of them? no...... With p2p you are basically paying around 200 bucks a year (if there was a box price to) to play a video game where many of them are either free or considerably less if you have to buy the game.
Originally posted by Theocritus Originally posted by ZoeMcCloskey I am very motivated to give support to one of these P2P games as I think the model just makes for a better game.
If Hello Kitty was a quality game with all the features of an MMO, including PvP, then its worth a sub of 12-15 dollars.
There are no games with a sub for 30 bucks..... were you by chance in the Dram club, in high school?
Thank you Rob! It's so nice to know I'm not alone!
If a game is worth the sub I'm happier to pay a sub and get the full game then deal with the F2P scam that happens.
Being a pessimist is a win-win pattern of thinking. If you're a pessimist (I'll admit that I am!) you're either:
A. Proven right (if something bad happens)
B. Pleasantly surprised (if something good happens)
Either way, you can't lose! Try it out sometime!
It's only temporary anyway.
First, they make people buy buttloads of money for the box. That is, all those people who want to start right away. As soon as the hype is still around, they will make people charge subscription fees too. Later, when people start leaving, they'll change to a free 2 play / pay 2 win / shop thingy system, to make people return.
Let's play Fallen Earth (blind, 300 episodes)
Let's play Guild Wars 2 (blind, 45 episodes)
Originally posted by InFlamestwo No, i hope they fail and learn the hard lesson of choosing P2P. It's time to move on.
Hehe. I agree, not hoping they fail, but it is time to move on.
Being 20 years old, I can't imagine you've run many game development companies. I'm also going to go out on a limb and say you haven't done any real market research outside of maybe glancing at a few pretty graphs without even questioning the information behind them or the company that was hired to prove something specific in the study. Just because you want entertainment services provided to you free of charge, which I find abhorrent behavior, doesn't mean it's the correct choice for every single game that comes out.
But as you started out, there is a buy to play option. Other companies do gated content where you pay for additional content as you want it. I would support that before a box price AND subscription. There are too many MMOs coming out these days, and many of them disappoint. Yes, WoW and Eve still have box prices with subs, but both also have (small) cash shops and are the exception to the rule.
WildStar is aiming for the WoW crowd, and maybe they are still new and generally inexperienced enough with the genre to think that's their only option for good games. I might work, but it didn't work for RIFT and that had a lot of fast, high quality content patches that I quickly felt outpaced the features in WoW (I'll still argue that WoW is trying to catch up to RIFT in that aspect). RIFT is now free to play, and still a great game (one I've returned to more than WoW), but it does illustrate how much of a fight it is to do the box + sub game.
The media seems to love The Secret World and it followed a similar path, but went buy to play instead. That game, I feel, really did mix things up, while WIldStar is just trying to make small adjustments. I think both these examples plus the fact that Carbine is hiding things I feel are basic information for new MMOs (races that many of us already could easily find on the internet, classes that aren't exactly revolutionary, still waiting on how PvPers are supposed build war plots if they don't want to raid) make me feel uneasy about the finished product. Without getting to try the game first, I can't see myself falling for the box price + sub trap. It didn't work on FF14 for me, and it was building interest for me. WildStar, by comparison, has been losing my interest ever since E3.
The question isn't whether they are worth playing if they aren't worth paying for. The question is HOW MUCH are they worth to play. You're combining a $60 purchase price with another $180 a year in monthly subscription fees just to play something that will remain mostly unchanged in terms of overall gameplay during that time.
The appeal of the current games with various "freemium" models is that you can play casually without being required to maintain a monthly payment. And if you want something extra, whether it's a new content pack or class or whatever, you can get it when you want and not have to worry about constant payments in order to play the game.