If Arena Net was not doing good with Guild Wars 2 would they have a hire list as shown here. No they would not they would be letting go of alot of the 200+ employees.
A hiring list can be indicative of a lot of things and isn't always a sign of how a company is doing. ArenaNet is known to have a large turnover rate. It also pays less than a lot of major studios. Read their profile on glassdoor.com. I am not saying that it is doing bad either so don't jump to that conclusion.
James T. Kirk: All she's got isn't good enough! What else ya got?
It was the chinese publisher of GW2, people that anet are in business with, people that are directly tied to the chinese release of gw2. The 2.5million logins a week was very telling though... based on common mmo habits that puts the game at approximately 300-600k active players, which basically matches up with what my sources have told me.
Actually the NCSoft deals with the Chinese publisher.
And if you don't know to release a MMORPG in China there are some strict constraints, including who can publish it - that is why NCSoft or Blizzard don;t publish their own games directly in China.
Second, what sources do you have? Who are you? Without credentials your sources are worth 0.
Of course you believe GW2 has retention rate of 10% based on third party tools that you believe are accurate.
I hope you aren't talking about tools like XFire that show WoW lost some 80% of its players in the last 2 years or show that GW2 has around half of the players of WoW (which would mean something like 1.5-2 million players) or 4 times the players of EVE (which would make mean GW2 had something like 1.6-2 million players).
Or tools like Raptr that show that Rift is bigger than WoW (lol at that).
Do you have any actual proof that ncsoft is the one dealing with the publisher? You can't have it both ways, you can't argue that NCsoft has a very hands off approach to gw2, and then just assume that ncsoft is behind anything shady related to the game. Was ncsoft also responsible for the manifesto?
Why would I compromise my sources? No one with any integrity compromises such things... All I can do is put information out there, people will either absorb it, look at the evidence, and get a better understanding of how things actually are, or they will ignore things and have their own inaccurate perception of how things are.
300-600k is 10-20% retention rate, please don't talk in hyperbole and just assume the worst number. My sources are people... not "tools" the third party tools that people use to evaluate mmo popularity, just happen to line up with what is being said, which isn't surprising, because those tools are more often than not, pretty accurate at gauging the health of an mmo.
GW2 could very well have half of the players that WoW has, in the west, where Xfire is used. Most of wow's players are in asia right now.
Rift had a promotion with raptr. But anyway, your examples are true in what they say, but obviously subject to interpretation... Anything is subject to interpretation, it just depends how realistic you want to be. A 20% drop in sales from q1 to q2 is not a good thing... you can interpret it as one, or try to find some convoluted theory as to why it might be a good thing, but the reality of it is that it is NEVER a good thing.
Isn't that you?
I even see under 10%.
Of course it is NCSoft that deals with the Chinese market, just like they deal with the Korean market.
Western Market you have NCSoft West and NCSoft Europe.
Everything publishing related is NCSoft, that owns Arenanet 100%.
The manifesto is Arenanet and most of it, especially the older written one (https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/guild-wars-2-design-manifesto/), seems to be a fair description of the game. Of course there are always stuff that change from initial idea to end product or that don't work so well. The video one was clearly something to cause impact and it did, including I suspect much of the visceral hate some players have for the game since how can someone dare to say that the games they have been playing for years have problems.
Currently playing: GW2 Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
If Arena Net was not doing good with Guild Wars 2 would they have a hire list as shown here. No they would not they would be letting go of alot of the 200+ employees.
A hiring list can be indicative of a lot of things and isn't always a sign of how a company is doing. ArenaNet is known to have a large turnover rate. It also pays less than a lot of major studios. Read their profile on glassdoor.com. I am not saying that it is doing bad either so don't jump to that conclusion.
Sorry I I dont see where that site plays into the fact there hiring all the time that site has 12 reviews by people and nothing else. And If thats the case look at Wal-marts turn over rate I know this well 3 to 6 people a day at most stores and I know that for fact.
As for the rest if you are not making income you don't hire period you lay off till you get your finances right I ran serveral buisnesses before not huge companies but like a smaller and not once did I hire when profits were down.
Sherman's Gaming
Youtube Content creator for The Elder Scrolls Online
It was the chinese publisher of GW2, people that anet are in business with, people that are directly tied to the chinese release of gw2. The 2.5million logins a week was very telling though... based on common mmo habits that puts the game at approximately 300-600k active players, which basically matches up with what my sources have told me.
Actually the NCSoft deals with the Chinese publisher.
And if you don't know to release a MMORPG in China there are some strict constraints, including who can publish it - that is why NCSoft or Blizzard don;t publish their own games directly in China.
Second, what sources do you have? Who are you? Without credentials your sources are worth 0.
Of course you believe GW2 has retention rate of 10% based on third party tools that you believe are accurate.
I hope you aren't talking about tools like XFire that show WoW lost some 80% of its players in the last 2 years or show that GW2 has around half of the players of WoW (which would mean something like 1.5-2 million players) or 4 times the players of EVE (which would make mean GW2 had something like 1.6-2 million players).
Or tools like Raptr that show that Rift is bigger than WoW (lol at that).
Do you have any actual proof that ncsoft is the one dealing with the publisher? You can't have it both ways, you can't argue that NCsoft has a very hands off approach to gw2, and then just assume that ncsoft is behind anything shady related to the game. Was ncsoft also responsible for the manifesto?
Why would I compromise my sources? No one with any integrity compromises such things... All I can do is put information out there, people will either absorb it, look at the evidence, and get a better understanding of how things actually are, or they will ignore things and have their own inaccurate perception of how things are.
300-600k is 10-20% retention rate, please don't talk in hyperbole and just assume the worst number. My sources are people... not "tools" the third party tools that people use to evaluate mmo popularity, just happen to line up with what is being said, which isn't surprising, because those tools are more often than not, pretty accurate at gauging the health of an mmo.
GW2 could very well have half of the players that WoW has, in the west, where Xfire is used. Most of wow's players are in asia right now.
Rift had a promotion with raptr. But anyway, your examples are true in what they say, but obviously subject to interpretation... Anything is subject to interpretation, it just depends how realistic you want to be. A 20% drop in sales from q1 to q2 is not a good thing... you can interpret it as one, or try to find some convoluted theory as to why it might be a good thing, but the reality of it is that it is NEVER a good thing.
Isn't that you?
I even see under 10%.
Of course it is NCSoft that deals with the Chinese market, just like they deal with the Korean market.
Western Market you have NCSoft West and NCSoft Europe.
Everything publishing related is NCSoft, that owns Arenanet 100%.
The manifesto is Arenanet and most of it, especially the older written one (https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/guild-wars-2-design-manifesto/), seems to be a fair description of the game. Of course there are always stuff that change from initial idea to end product or that don't work so well. The video one was clearly something to cause impact and it did, including I suspect much of the visceral hate some players have for the game since how can someone dare to say that the games they have been playing for years have problems.
Yes that is referring to the third party metrics... which imply the game has less than 10% retention rate... Notice I say "decently" accurate and don't actually claim less than 10% as my own opinion. I'm just glad some people knew immediately that 2.5million active players claim was bogus... but sad that many thought it was even feasible.
Well i'd ask you for proof that ncsoft is the one that went into contractual talks with the chinese publisher, but I know you simply won't have any.
As for your opinion on the manifesto, the video manifesto was horribly inaccurate and deceptive... sure that's only my opinion but the game is my proof. You were still collecting wolf tails though, that's for sure! You didn't really foster any significant change in the world, that's for sure, and the personal story was not even close to what they acted like it would be.
If Arena Net was not doing good with Guild Wars 2 would they have a hire list as shown here. No they would not they would be letting go of alot of the 200+ employees.
A hiring list can be indicative of a lot of things and isn't always a sign of how a company is doing. ArenaNet is known to have a large turnover rate. It also pays less than a lot of major studios. Read their profile on glassdoor.com. I am not saying that it is doing bad either so don't jump to that conclusion.
Sorry I I dont see where that site plays into the fact there hiring all the time that site has 12 reviews by people and nothing else. And If thats the case look at Wal-marts turn over rate I know this well 3 to 6 people a day at most stores and I know that for fact.
As for the rest if you are not making income you don't hire period you lay off till you get your finances right I ran serveral buisnesses before not huge companies but like a smaller and not once did I hire when profits were down.
Maybe they are hiring all of the time because they have such a turnover rate lol. Ding
If Arena Net was not doing good with Guild Wars 2 would they have a hire list as shown here. No they would not they would be letting go of alot of the 200+ employees.
A hiring list can be indicative of a lot of things and isn't always a sign of how a company is doing. ArenaNet is known to have a large turnover rate. It also pays less than a lot of major studios. Read their profile on glassdoor.com. I am not saying that it is doing bad either so don't jump to that conclusion.
Sorry I I dont see where that site plays into the fact there hiring all the time that site has 12 reviews by people and nothing else. And If thats the case look at Wal-marts turn over rate I know this well 3 to 6 people a day at most stores and I know that for fact.
As for the rest if you are not making income you don't hire period you lay off till you get your finances right I ran serveral buisnesses before not huge companies but like a smaller and not once did I hire when profits were down.
That is just one site. You can google and find others. They seem to treat their people well though. The second statement you made isn't necessarily true either. Especially in a company that relies on a sole product as their revenue stream. I worked in a company that tried to save itself by hiring more people and improving our product. We were a subsidiary of one of the largest defense contractors in the US. We increased our company size by almost 50%, We made the necessary breakthroughs, but unfortunately for us, our competitors did it sooner and we lost our contract which ironically enough went to a small German company. Again, I am not saying that the company is doing bad, but things aren't always what they seem. People here make arguments based on conjecture or their personal experiences mixed with opinions. No one will ever know what is really going on until Anet releases the actual numbers.
James T. Kirk: All she's got isn't good enough! What else ya got?
Originally posted by Faelsun Well according to press releases and financial statements, after the initial sales Lineage 2 is outselling GW2 in Asian Markets and GW2 sales dropped so much in NM that L2 also is making more profit than GW2. Lets see L2 has a population of a little under a million players. So let me take a wild guess and say GW2 is dealing with less than half that.
Dude, stop comparing to Lineage. There are only 1 western published mmorpg more profitable than lineage for the last 10 years. That's called wow.
So fill free to dismiss GW2 because it is less profitable than lineage. You might as well dismiss every single mmorpg made in the US or Europe, because no game compare to lineage.
For the last 10 years, the most profitable mmorpg look something like this. First is Wow, the rest are some crappy f2p chinese mmoprg you never heard of, and lineage. That is the actually truth.
The most profitable mmorpg except wow are actually games no one in this forum actually heard of. Because the chinese market are so big, they can make any game with cashshop and be more profitable. Lineage probably stays top 5 in the most profitable mmorpg for the last decade every year.
It was the chinese publisher of GW2, people that anet are in business with, people that are directly tied to the chinese release of gw2. The 2.5million logins a week was very telling though... based on common mmo habits that puts the game at approximately 300-600k active players, which basically matches up with what my sources have told me.
Actually the NCSoft deals with the Chinese publisher.
And if you don't know to release a MMORPG in China there are some strict constraints, including who can publish it - that is why NCSoft or Blizzard don;t publish their own games directly in China.
Second, what sources do you have? Who are you? Without credentials your sources are worth 0.
Of course you believe GW2 has retention rate of 10% based on third party tools that you believe are accurate.
I hope you aren't talking about tools like XFire that show WoW lost some 80% of its players in the last 2 years or show that GW2 has around half of the players of WoW (which would mean something like 1.5-2 million players) or 4 times the players of EVE (which would make mean GW2 had something like 1.6-2 million players).
Or tools like Raptr that show that Rift is bigger than WoW (lol at that).
It is also interesting that somehow GW2 is a dishonest company that doesn't release number of players, but somehow it gave the numbers to the Chinese publishers that were so impressed with what apparently is 300K-600K active players, based on some formula that tells how many times a person logs in a game.
It is also very interesting that all the other translated bits by google translator seem fine and even ?????? translate as weekly active users, but the ?? that translate as people by the same google translator is wrong and someone said it was "hits" instead.
Dude, stop believe anything the Chinese mmorpg marketing tell you. They always publish the most misleading information ever.
And please stop imagining any game actually have a good retention rate. They don't.
How many people do you think actually play wow for 10 years. Stop imagine that. At best it just mean they recoup or people return at a stable rate.
For everyone who bought a GW2 box, a high percent stopped playing. Just like in every single mmorpg. Even wow have a low retention rate.
Think of it this way, I see people spreading rumors how wow sold like 100 million copies, but how many people actually play wow now? Maybe 3 million? (I didn't count chinese, because chinese players only need to pay by time, they don't need to pay for the initial box).
Blizzard never want to release their box sales number, because they don't want you to know they dont' have a high retention rate too. That's why they only publish their sub number.
Originally posted by Faelsun Well according to press releases and financial statements, after the initial sales Lineage 2 is outselling GW2 in Asian Markets and GW2 sales dropped so much in NM that L2 also is making more profit than GW2. Lets see L2 has a population of a little under a million players. So let me take a wild guess and say GW2 is dealing with less than half that.
Dude, stop comparing to Lineage. There are only 1 western published mmorpg more profitable than lineage for the last 10 years. That's called wow.
So fill free to dismiss GW2 because it is less profitable than lineage. You might as well dismiss every single mmorpg made in the US or Europe, because no game compare to lineage.
For the last 10 years, the most profitable mmorpg look something like this. First is Wow, the rest are some crappy f2p chinese mmoprg you never heard of, and lineage. That is the actually truth.
The most profitable mmorpg except wow are actually games no one in this forum actually heard of. Because the chinese market are so big, they can make any game with cashshop and be more profitable. Lineage probably stays top 5 in the most profitable mmorpg for the last decade every year.
That is sort of exactly my point, GW2 is just like every other sub par not quite good as L1 or L2 or even Aion battling it out with the other backbencher mmorpgs fighting over 200 to 300k subs. Its your average themepark.
That is sort of exactly my point, GW2 is just like every other sub par not quite good as L1 or L2 or even Aion battling it out with the other backbencher mmorpgs fighting over 200 to 300k subs. Its your average themepark.
Seems to me if you like GW2 you are happy playing the game and spend your time doing so ....if you dislike GW2 you spend your time playing the forums and worrying about the folks playing GW2. The fact you pulled a number like 200 to 300k subs doesn't seem to add to anything in regards to GW2 ? I'm not even sure what you are trying to say but perhaps the fact that you nothing better to do then play the forums is more of a reflection on you than GW2
ya well, keep complaining how every single mmorpg is bad. You can try the mmorpg general forum. Many people share your taste there.
The point is GW2 is so bad, very few western published mmorpg is even better.
You keep comparing it to eastern published mmorpg. But they have such an easier time because their market is so big. And western publisher have a hard time getting in the east part of the globe.
It was the chinese publisher of GW2, people that anet are in business with, people that are directly tied to the chinese release of gw2. The 2.5million logins a week was very telling though... based on common mmo habits that puts the game at approximately 300-600k active players, which basically matches up with what my sources have told me.
Actually the NCSoft deals with the Chinese publisher.
And if you don't know to release a MMORPG in China there are some strict constraints, including who can publish it - that is why NCSoft or Blizzard don;t publish their own games directly in China.
Second, what sources do you have? Who are you? Without credentials your sources are worth 0.
Of course you believe GW2 has retention rate of 10% based on third party tools that you believe are accurate.
I hope you aren't talking about tools like XFire that show WoW lost some 80% of its players in the last 2 years or show that GW2 has around half of the players of WoW (which would mean something like 1.5-2 million players) or 4 times the players of EVE (which would make mean GW2 had something like 1.6-2 million players).
Or tools like Raptr that show that Rift is bigger than WoW (lol at that).
It is also interesting that somehow GW2 is a dishonest company that doesn't release number of players, but somehow it gave the numbers to the Chinese publishers that were so impressed with what apparently is 300K-600K active players, based on some formula that tells how many times a person logs in a game.
It is also very interesting that all the other translated bits by google translator seem fine and even ?????? translate as weekly active users, but the ?? that translate as people by the same google translator is wrong and someone said it was "hits" instead.
Dude, stop believe anything the Chinese mmorpg marketing tell you. They always publish the most misleading information ever.
And please stop imagining any game actually have a good retention rate. They don't.
How many people do you think actually play wow for 10 years. Stop imagine that. At best it just mean they recoup or people return at a stable rate.
For everyone who bought a GW2 box, a high percent stopped playing. Just like in every single mmorpg. Even wow have a low retention rate.
Think of it this way, I see people spreading rumors how wow sold like 100 million copies, but how many people actually play wow now? Maybe 3 million? (I didn't count chinese, because chinese players only need to pay by time, they don't need to pay for the initial box).
Blizzard never want to release their box sales number, because they don't want you to know they dont' have a high retention rate too. That's why they only publish their sub number.
I just don't trust any translations from it on top of not trusting whatever they wrote on their website.
I know some people stopped playing GW2 after launch.
I also know that GW2 not having subscription mean anyone can just easily return, while returning to WoW mean you need to open your wallet again.
Currently playing: GW2 Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
It was the chinese publisher of GW2, people that anet are in business with, people that are directly tied to the chinese release of gw2. The 2.5million logins a week was very telling though... based on common mmo habits that puts the game at approximately 300-600k active players, which basically matches up with what my sources have told me.
Actually the NCSoft deals with the Chinese publisher.
And if you don't know to release a MMORPG in China there are some strict constraints, including who can publish it - that is why NCSoft or Blizzard don;t publish their own games directly in China.
Second, what sources do you have? Who are you? Without credentials your sources are worth 0.
Of course you believe GW2 has retention rate of 10% based on third party tools that you believe are accurate.
I hope you aren't talking about tools like XFire that show WoW lost some 80% of its players in the last 2 years or show that GW2 has around half of the players of WoW (which would mean something like 1.5-2 million players) or 4 times the players of EVE (which would make mean GW2 had something like 1.6-2 million players).
Or tools like Raptr that show that Rift is bigger than WoW (lol at that).
Do you have any actual proof that ncsoft is the one dealing with the publisher? You can't have it both ways, you can't argue that NCsoft has a very hands off approach to gw2, and then just assume that ncsoft is behind anything shady related to the game. Was ncsoft also responsible for the manifesto?
Why would I compromise my sources? No one with any integrity compromises such things... All I can do is put information out there, people will either absorb it, look at the evidence, and get a better understanding of how things actually are, or they will ignore things and have their own inaccurate perception of how things are.
300-600k is 10-20% retention rate, please don't talk in hyperbole and just assume the worst number. My sources are people... not "tools" the third party tools that people use to evaluate mmo popularity, just happen to line up with what is being said, which isn't surprising, because those tools are more often than not, pretty accurate at gauging the health of an mmo.
GW2 could very well have half of the players that WoW has, in the west, where Xfire is used. Most of wow's players are in asia right now.
Rift had a promotion with raptr. But anyway, your examples are true in what they say, but obviously subject to interpretation... Anything is subject to interpretation, it just depends how realistic you want to be. A 20% drop in sales from q1 to q2 is not a good thing... you can interpret it as one, or try to find some convoluted theory as to why it might be a good thing, but the reality of it is that it is NEVER a good thing.
Isn't that you?
I even see under 10%.
Of course it is NCSoft that deals with the Chinese market, just like they deal with the Korean market.
Western Market you have NCSoft West and NCSoft Europe.
Everything publishing related is NCSoft, that owns Arenanet 100%.
The manifesto is Arenanet and most of it, especially the older written one (https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/guild-wars-2-design-manifesto/), seems to be a fair description of the game. Of course there are always stuff that change from initial idea to end product or that don't work so well. The video one was clearly something to cause impact and it did, including I suspect much of the visceral hate some players have for the game since how can someone dare to say that the games they have been playing for years have problems.
Yes that is referring to the third party metrics... which imply the game has less than 10% retention rate... Notice I say "decently" accurate and don't actually claim less than 10% as my own opinion. I'm just glad some people knew immediately that 2.5million active players claim was bogus... but sad that many thought it was even feasible.
Well i'd ask you for proof that ncsoft is the one that went into contractual talks with the chinese publisher, but I know you simply won't have any.
As for your opinion on the manifesto, the video manifesto was horribly inaccurate and deceptive... sure that's only my opinion but the game is my proof. You were still collecting wolf tails though, that's for sure! You didn't really foster any significant change in the world, that's for sure, and the personal story was not even close to what they acted like it would be.
We believe earnings will be driven by overseas sales from 2H13. In China, the company is planning to launch Blade & Soul (via a publishing agreement with Tencent) in 3Q13 and Guild Wars 2 in 4Q13 (via a publishing agreement with Kong Zhong).
NCSoft owns Arenanet and GW2.
The third party metrics are the same that shows WoW lost 90% of their population and we know that is false.
About the manifesto.
"So if you love MMORPGs, you should check out Guild Wars 2. But if you hate traditional MMORPGs, then you should really check out Guild Wars 2. Because, like Guild Wars before it, GW2 doesn’t fall into the traps of traditional MMORPGs. It doesn’t suck your life away and force you onto a grinding treadmill; it doesn’t make you spend hours preparing to have fun rather than just having fun; and of course, it doesn’t have a monthly fee."
True.
"The original Guild Wars was known for the level of storytelling it brought to online RPGs, so with GW2 we obviously wanted to take it to the next level. In GW you experience the story of the world, but the story in GW2 is the personal story of your character as well. You fill out a biography at character creation time that defines your background and your place within the world, and that starts you on your path. Then the choices you make will take the story in different directions. Each time you play through the game, you can experience a different storyline."
True, although the ending is the same.
"Some games mostly tell story through quest text. But we’ve all clicked so many exclamation points and accepted so many quests in our lives that we’re pretty immune to quest text at this point. GW2 tells story by allowing the player to befriend and adventure with key characters, by presenting him with moral dilemmas that will impact the lives of the people around him, and by having him live through world-changing events and all the key moments of the storyline."
True as well. Note people in this case refer to the NPCs of your personal story.
In addition to great storyline and important player choices, another hallmark of great RPGs is that they create a world that feels real and alive. Let’s say a village is being terrorized by bandits. You don’t want to find out about that because there’s a villager standing there motionless with an exclamation mark over his head who says when you click on him, “Help, we’re being terrorized by bandits.” You want to find out like you would in GW2: because the bandits are attacking, chasing villagers through the streets, slaying them and setting their houses on fire. You can stand up for the villagers, or you can watch their village burn to the ground and then deal with the consequences. We’ve worked hard to create a living, dynamic world for you, where there’s always something new to do.
It happens like that.
I guess bandits won't go burn your real life house as a consequence though, so I guess some people are disappointed with that.
MMOs are social games. So why do they sometimes seem to work so hard to punish you for playing with other players? If I’m out hunting and another player walks by, shouldn’t I welcome his help, rather than worrying that he’s going to steal my kills or consume all the mobs I wanted to kill? Or if I want to play with someone, shouldn’t we naturally have the same goals and objectives, rather than discovering that we’re in the same area but working on a different set of quests?
Other players are always welcomed.
With traditional MMOs you can choose to solo or you can find a good guild or party to play with. With GW2 there’s a third option too: you can just naturally play with all the people around you. I personally spend a big chunk of my time in traditional MMOs soloing, but when I play GW2 I always find myself naturally working with everyone around me to accomplish world objectives, and before long we find ourselves saying, “Hey, there’s a bunch of us here; let’s see if we can take down the swamp boss together,” without ever having bothered to form a party.
Yeah, true as well.
GW2 shares this flexible skill system. The big difference is that now skills are much more visual in explaining what they do. The process of actually discovering combos, or understanding them when they’re used against you, is a lot more clear, because you can visually see how skills combo with each other. An Elementalist can cast Fire Wall next to an opponent, and then switch to Water attunement, which freezes all enemies around him. Using the concussive force of Water Trident, he can slam his frozen enemy into the Fire Wall, leaving him to roast in the flames.
Some will say too much visual.
Then we add environmental weapons to mix up combat even more. In the original GW you’d sometimes find a catapult or trebuchet that you could take over and fire at enemies. That’s one type of environmental weapon, and in GW2 we have dozens more. If a Stone Elemental throws a boulder at you, pick it up and throw it back. Or as an Elementalist, use that boulder to create a meteor storm. If you’re fighting an Oakheart with an axe and you manage to hack off a branch, pick up the branch and try using it as a weapon. If you meet a beekeeper outside town, buy a jar of bees from him and see what happens when you lob it at nearby enemies. If you come across a stash of powder kegs, don’t just blow them up in place, but try moving them to where they can do the most damage. If a centaur wheels a siege machine up to the outskirts of a village, don’t just destroy it; take it over and use it to turn the tide of battle.
And while you’re discovering new opportunities, new weapons, new combos, and new strategies, you’re surrounded by the pure visceral joy of combat. Smash a monster with a plank and watch him fly through the air. Avoid the Oakheart’s roots as they creep out of the ground looking to entangle you. Launch yourself on a sweeping attack that takes you behind your enemy. Smash open the garrison gate and begin your assault. Dodge out of the way before the Drake Broodmother unleashes her fire attack.
Happen as well.
Guess this is a case of the book being better than the movie, since they had to cut a few bits and made some bits more dramatic in the manifesto video.
Currently playing: GW2 Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
It was the chinese publisher of GW2, people that anet are in business with, people that are directly tied to the chinese release of gw2. The 2.5million logins a week was very telling though... based on common mmo habits that puts the game at approximately 300-600k active players, which basically matches up with what my sources have told me.
Actually the NCSoft deals with the Chinese publisher.
And if you don't know to release a MMORPG in China there are some strict constraints, including who can publish it - that is why NCSoft or Blizzard don;t publish their own games directly in China.
Second, what sources do you have? Who are you? Without credentials your sources are worth 0.
Of course you believe GW2 has retention rate of 10% based on third party tools that you believe are accurate.
I hope you aren't talking about tools like XFire that show WoW lost some 80% of its players in the last 2 years or show that GW2 has around half of the players of WoW (which would mean something like 1.5-2 million players) or 4 times the players of EVE (which would make mean GW2 had something like 1.6-2 million players).
Or tools like Raptr that show that Rift is bigger than WoW (lol at that).
Do you have any actual proof that ncsoft is the one dealing with the publisher? You can't have it both ways, you can't argue that NCsoft has a very hands off approach to gw2, and then just assume that ncsoft is behind anything shady related to the game. Was ncsoft also responsible for the manifesto?
Why would I compromise my sources? No one with any integrity compromises such things... All I can do is put information out there, people will either absorb it, look at the evidence, and get a better understanding of how things actually are, or they will ignore things and have their own inaccurate perception of how things are.
300-600k is 10-20% retention rate, please don't talk in hyperbole and just assume the worst number. My sources are people... not "tools" the third party tools that people use to evaluate mmo popularity, just happen to line up with what is being said, which isn't surprising, because those tools are more often than not, pretty accurate at gauging the health of an mmo.
GW2 could very well have half of the players that WoW has, in the west, where Xfire is used. Most of wow's players are in asia right now.
Rift had a promotion with raptr. But anyway, your examples are true in what they say, but obviously subject to interpretation... Anything is subject to interpretation, it just depends how realistic you want to be. A 20% drop in sales from q1 to q2 is not a good thing... you can interpret it as one, or try to find some convoluted theory as to why it might be a good thing, but the reality of it is that it is NEVER a good thing.
Isn't that you?
I even see under 10%.
Of course it is NCSoft that deals with the Chinese market, just like they deal with the Korean market.
Western Market you have NCSoft West and NCSoft Europe.
Everything publishing related is NCSoft, that owns Arenanet 100%.
The manifesto is Arenanet and most of it, especially the older written one (https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/guild-wars-2-design-manifesto/), seems to be a fair description of the game. Of course there are always stuff that change from initial idea to end product or that don't work so well. The video one was clearly something to cause impact and it did, including I suspect much of the visceral hate some players have for the game since how can someone dare to say that the games they have been playing for years have problems.
Yes that is referring to the third party metrics... which imply the game has less than 10% retention rate... Notice I say "decently" accurate and don't actually claim less than 10% as my own opinion. I'm just glad some people knew immediately that 2.5million active players claim was bogus... but sad that many thought it was even feasible.
Well i'd ask you for proof that ncsoft is the one that went into contractual talks with the chinese publisher, but I know you simply won't have any.
As for your opinion on the manifesto, the video manifesto was horribly inaccurate and deceptive... sure that's only my opinion but the game is my proof. You were still collecting wolf tails though, that's for sure! You didn't really foster any significant change in the world, that's for sure, and the personal story was not even close to what they acted like it would be.
We believe earnings will be driven by overseas sales from 2H13. In China, the company is planning to launch Blade & Soul (via a publishing agreement with Tencent) in 3Q13 and Guild Wars 2 in 4Q13 (via a publishing agreement with Kong Zhong).
NCSoft owns Arenanet and GW2.
The third party metrics are the same that shows WoW lost 90% of their population and we know that is false.
About the manifesto.
"So if you love MMORPGs, you should check out Guild Wars 2. But if you hate traditional MMORPGs, then you should really check out Guild Wars 2. Because, like Guild Wars before it, GW2 doesn’t fall into the traps of traditional MMORPGs. It doesn’t suck your life away and force you onto a grinding treadmill; it doesn’t make you spend hours preparing to have fun rather than just having fun; and of course, it doesn’t have a monthly fee."
True.
"The original Guild Wars was known for the level of storytelling it brought to online RPGs, so with GW2 we obviously wanted to take it to the next level. In GW you experience the story of the world, but the story in GW2 is the personal story of your character as well. You fill out a biography at character creation time that defines your background and your place within the world, and that starts you on your path. Then the choices you make will take the story in different directions. Each time you play through the game, you can experience a different storyline."
True, although the ending is the same.
"Some games mostly tell story through quest text. But we’ve all clicked so many exclamation points and accepted so many quests in our lives that we’re pretty immune to quest text at this point. GW2 tells story by allowing the player to befriend and adventure with key characters, by presenting him with moral dilemmas that will impact the lives of the people around him, and by having him live through world-changing events and all the key moments of the storyline."
True as well. Note people in this case refer to the NPCs of your personal story.
In addition to great storyline and important player choices, another hallmark of great RPGs is that they create a world that feels real and alive. Let’s say a village is being terrorized by bandits. You don’t want to find out about that because there’s a villager standing there motionless with an exclamation mark over his head who says when you click on him, “Help, we’re being terrorized by bandits.” You want to find out like you would in GW2: because the bandits are attacking, chasing villagers through the streets, slaying them and setting their houses on fire. You can stand up for the villagers, or you can watch their village burn to the ground and then deal with the consequences. We’ve worked hard to create a living, dynamic world for you, where there’s always something new to do.
It happens like that.
I guess bandits won't go burn your real life house as a consequence though, so I guess some people are disappointed with that.
MMOs are social games. So why do they sometimes seem to work so hard to punish you for playing with other players? If I’m out hunting and another player walks by, shouldn’t I welcome his help, rather than worrying that he’s going to steal my kills or consume all the mobs I wanted to kill? Or if I want to play with someone, shouldn’t we naturally have the same goals and objectives, rather than discovering that we’re in the same area but working on a different set of quests?
Other players are always welcomed.
With traditional MMOs you can choose to solo or you can find a good guild or party to play with. With GW2 there’s a third option too: you can just naturally play with all the people around you. I personally spend a big chunk of my time in traditional MMOs soloing, but when I play GW2 I always find myself naturally working with everyone around me to accomplish world objectives, and before long we find ourselves saying, “Hey, there’s a bunch of us here; let’s see if we can take down the swamp boss together,” without ever having bothered to form a party.
Yeah, true as well.
GW2 shares this flexible skill system. The big difference is that now skills are much more visual in explaining what they do. The process of actually discovering combos, or understanding them when they’re used against you, is a lot more clear, because you can visually see how skills combo with each other. An Elementalist can cast Fire Wall next to an opponent, and then switch to Water attunement, which freezes all enemies around him. Using the concussive force of Water Trident, he can slam his frozen enemy into the Fire Wall, leaving him to roast in the flames.
Some will say too much visual.
Then we add environmental weapons to mix up combat even more. In the original GW you’d sometimes find a catapult or trebuchet that you could take over and fire at enemies. That’s one type of environmental weapon, and in GW2 we have dozens more. If a Stone Elemental throws a boulder at you, pick it up and throw it back. Or as an Elementalist, use that boulder to create a meteor storm. If you’re fighting an Oakheart with an axe and you manage to hack off a branch, pick up the branch and try using it as a weapon. If you meet a beekeeper outside town, buy a jar of bees from him and see what happens when you lob it at nearby enemies. If you come across a stash of powder kegs, don’t just blow them up in place, but try moving them to where they can do the most damage. If a centaur wheels a siege machine up to the outskirts of a village, don’t just destroy it; take it over and use it to turn the tide of battle.
And while you’re discovering new opportunities, new weapons, new combos, and new strategies, you’re surrounded by the pure visceral joy of combat. Smash a monster with a plank and watch him fly through the air. Avoid the Oakheart’s roots as they creep out of the ground looking to entangle you. Launch yourself on a sweeping attack that takes you behind your enemy. Smash open the garrison gate and begin your assault. Dodge out of the way before the Drake Broodmother unleashes her fire attack.
Happen as well.
Guess this is a case of the book being better than the movie, since they had to cut a few bits and made some bits more dramatic in the manifesto video.
The third party metrics for WoW are for the western audience of WoW, which is very low relative to previous years... it does not claim to track the chinese users at all.
Just because NCsoft owns anet doesn't mean they handle every decision by anet. Sort of like vivendi didn't handle publishing contracts for blizzard in EVERY region.
As for your manifesto responses, those are just biased opinions.
The game made me spend hours preparing to have fun, and in the end it still wasn't even fun. People that loved traditional MMORPGs didn't like GW2 very much. So that first paragraph, objectively, is false.
Each time you play through the game you may not experience a different story line, the game doesn't have infinite story lines. So that part is false.
GW2 actually has you clicking NPCs with markers over your head, in the personal story... so this paragraph is also false.
The npcs are pretty static, the dynamic events are static in where and how they happen so that paragraph is false in what it is trying to market the game as.
GW2 events are easy mode, I find that there is never really any socializing because the persistent world content is so easy.... So it is pretty much soloing, you aren't actually there working with each other consciously. So again false...
Flexible is subjective, I will say that GW2's system is less flexible than other big MMOs, there are less ways to deviate in how you play your class. So again, objectively speaking, another false claim.
I dunno what to tell you man, you are biased, watch the manifesto video, ask yourself honestly if they achieved what they were trying to advertise there.
Their dynamic events aren't dynamic, you as an individual can not change the game world. They are trying to fix some of their lies now, but too little too late.
The third party metrics for WoW are for the western audience of WoW, which is very low relative to previous years... it does not claim to track the chinese users at all.
Just because NCsoft owns anet doesn't mean they handle every decision by anet. Sort of like vivendi didn't handle publishing contracts for blizzard in EVERY region.
As for your manifesto responses, those are just biased opinions.
The game made me spend hours preparing to have fun, and in the end it still wasn't even fun. People that loved traditional MMORPGs didn't like GW2 very much. So that first paragraph, objectively, is false.
Each time you play through the game you may not experience a different story line, the game doesn't have infinite story lines. So that part is false.
GW2 actually has you clicking NPCs with markers over your head, in the personal story... so this paragraph is also false.
The npcs are pretty static, the dynamic events are static in where and how they happen so that paragraph is false in what it is trying to market the game as.
GW2 events are easy mode, I find that there is never really any socializing because the persistent world content is so easy.... So it is pretty much soloing, you aren't actually there working with each other consciously. So again false...
Flexible is subjective, I will say that GW2's system is less flexible than other big MMOs, there are less ways to deviate in how you play your class. So again, objectively speaking, another false claim.
I dunno what to tell you man, you are biased, watch the manifesto video, ask yourself honestly if they achieved what they were trying to advertise there.
Their dynamic events aren't dynamic, you as an individual can not change the game world. They are trying to fix some of their lies now, but too little too late.
So now you are saying that WoW lost 90% of their western audiance, which is estimated to be somewhere between 2.5 and 4 millions.
NCSoft handle every publishing decision.
And your opinions of the manifesto are even more biased.
Currently playing: GW2 Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
Retention rate means people who bought the game continue playing it.
Just because wow manage to keep a constant estimate ~3 million(or something like that) western players dont' mean it have a 100% retention rate.
Wow probably do have a very low retention rate, mainly because it's a 10 year game.
Most players just buy games, try it, don't like it and stop playing. Only 1/3rd of wow trial actually subscribe, and 1/10th of those in eve trial actually continue playing. (of course, there are all those people claim those people on trial account are all gold sellar).
Get the fact straight. In the mmorpg market, a huge percent of player who bought the game never make pass the 1month mark.
I haven't posted here for quite a long time but there is so much bullshit in here...
Fact is that there is no trusted data that shows the amount of active players and it's pretty pointless to try to make up facts by looking at box sales and such.
For me the game became a bit boring a few month after release but the april update got me back into the game and the new content, updates and fixes are all really good. My experience is that there are still a lot of people playing (Riverside(DE)). I almost see more people arround than a few weeks after the release. Most zones that are of interest to lv60's are packed. WvWvW is still full even in the night. Lions Arch and updated content still make very good use of overflow servers.
I took the liberty to quickly take a few screenshots to show how it looks ingame
As you cana see there are people all over the world. Those screenshots obviously don't show box sales, game growth or anything but why should i give a fuck about box sales going down or concerns about retention rates when it looks like this ingame and i get content updates every 2 weeks?
Awesome! ty for the SS too!
There are so many people playing that it never gets boring. Even if I want to take off on my own and do my own thing, I am usually grouped sooner or later because of all the people.
Loving the game and the way it is always evolving and changing. I also really enjoy WoW, but it is pretty much what there is just like any other game of it's clone. I play even rift and the world seems stamped into a shape and that is what you play on. When you clear an area, you rarely if ever go back. In GW2 level 80s are mixed with level 15s. I just finished killing a champion ooze with a level 80! It was very challenging because I'm playing a 22 elementalist. It took a while but it was a blast, and it is just a tiny portion of a wonderfully built title.
After almost a year of playing, I would have thought the population would have died a bit more, but in the last few weeks I honestly believe it has increased as the OP has stated.
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
I've pretty much stopped playing. But I still log in every few days or so to catch any friends online and see what's going on. Last night, LA was about as full as I've ever seen it. So what does that mean? It means LA was about as full as I've ever seen it. Nothing more, nothing less. GW2 has players. It has plenty of players logging in every day. No one is short on getting into content due to a low player base.
Any other concept, idea, theory, or guess, is nothing more than speculation. There is only one fact known. GW2 sold fewer boxes in the past 2 quarters than in the quarters before. If you attach any other statements to those facts, you are pulling them out of your ass. (And that goes both ways too)
so, no, you cannot say definitively that GW2 is losing player retention. You have no numbers. Conversely, You cannot look at one server and say GW2 is getting bigger. That's just as much bullshit. You have no numbers. If your server had 1000 players on line when you logged in last week, yesterday it had 500 players when you logged in, and today, there are 700, you can't say that's growth. It's just how many are logged in. You also have no way to account for how many of those are transferring from other servers into yours. Especially if you are on one of the higher populated servers to begin with.
These threads need to stop. Until ANET releases numbers with actual populations and active members, all this speculations is nothing but BS.
Too many posters on both sides of the fence desperately trying to prove something they cannot.
Edit:
I'm going to amend my statement here. In OPs defense, I do think it's appropriate to claim that a server seems to have more players then before. That's definitely valid. But I don't necessarily agree that it automatically translates into a growing populations since there are so many other factors to be accounted for that there is simply no info released.
for the record, I personally consider GW2 to be one of the more successful MMOs out there. Even if it's not a perfect match for me.
I haven't posted here for quite a long time but there is so much bullshit in here...
Fact is that there is no trusted data that shows the amount of active players and it's pretty pointless to try to make up facts by looking at box sales and such.
For me the game became a bit boring a few month after release but the april update got me back into the game and the new content, updates and fixes are all really good. My experience is that there are still a lot of people playing (Riverside(DE)). I almost see more people arround than a few weeks after the release. Most zones that are of interest to lv60's are packed. WvWvW is still full even in the night. Lions Arch and updated content still make very good use of overflow servers.
I took the liberty to quickly take a few screenshots to show how it looks ingame
As you cana see there are people all over the world. Those screenshots obviously don't show box sales, game growth or anything but why should i give a fuck about box sales going down or concerns about retention rates when it looks like this ingame and i get content updates every 2 weeks?
Awesome! ty for the SS too!
There are so many people playing that it never gets boring. Even if I want to take off on my own and do my own thing, I am usually grouped sooner or later because of all the people.
Loving the game and the way it is always evolving and changing. I also really enjoy WoW, but it is pretty much what there is just like any other game of it's clone. I play even rift and the world seems stamped into a shape and that is what you play on. When you clear an area, you rarely if ever go back. In GW2 level 80s are mixed with level 15s. I just finished killing a champion ooze with a level 80! It was very challenging because I'm playing a 22 elementalist. It took a while but it was a blast, and it is just a tiny portion of a wonderfully built title.
After almost a year of playing, I would have thought the population would have died a bit more, but in the last few weeks I honestly believe it has increased as the OP has stated.
Amjoco you know I feel the same way about the game its great and alot of those saying any old school player wont touch this most people I meet have or started with games like UO or EQ and then I met some that started in WoW its crazy how many played DaOC. But I also feel the player base seems to grow cause with the content coming in every 2 weeks yeah not all of it has been perfect but I think like all companies you have to find a way to do it that works. I also on a lot of my 80 travel around to different maps and help player with things if I see a big even going on I jump in and I can help and don't have to wait for someone to get the first hit type thing.
Sherman's Gaming
Youtube Content creator for The Elder Scrolls Online
the only mmo that i still got on my hard drive. When it first came out, i wasnt interested at all, but got it for christmas, played for a month and got borred. Dont know why but i still logging in to play 2 -3 hours at list twice a week. Maybe cause it doesnt force you to group, but at the same time gives a lot of opportunities to do so if you choose. Or maybe cause it dosnt punish you if you decide to play solo.
I haven't posted here for quite a long time but there is so much bullshit in here...
Fact is that there is no trusted data that shows the amount of active players and it's pretty pointless to try to make up facts by looking at box sales and such.
For me the game became a bit boring a few month after release but the april update got me back into the game and the new content, updates and fixes are all really good. My experience is that there are still a lot of people playing (Riverside(DE)). I almost see more people arround than a few weeks after the release. Most zones that are of interest to lv60's are packed. WvWvW is still full even in the night. Lions Arch and updated content still make very good use of overflow servers.
I took the liberty to quickly take a few screenshots to show how it looks ingame
As you cana see there are people all over the world. Those screenshots obviously don't show box sales, game growth or anything but why should i give a fuck about box sales going down or concerns about retention rates when it looks like this ingame and i get content updates every 2 weeks?
Awesome! ty for the SS too!
There are so many people playing that it never gets boring. Even if I want to take off on my own and do my own thing, I am usually grouped sooner or later because of all the people.
Loving the game and the way it is always evolving and changing. I also really enjoy WoW, but it is pretty much what there is just like any other game of it's clone. I play even rift and the world seems stamped into a shape and that is what you play on. When you clear an area, you rarely if ever go back. In GW2 level 80s are mixed with level 15s. I just finished killing a champion ooze with a level 80! It was very challenging because I'm playing a 22 elementalist. It took a while but it was a blast, and it is just a tiny portion of a wonderfully built title.
After almost a year of playing, I would have thought the population would have died a bit more, but in the last few weeks I honestly believe it has increased as the OP has stated.
Amjoco you know I feel the same way about the game its great and alot of those saying any old school player wont touch this most people I meet have or started with games like UO or EQ and then I met some that started in WoW its crazy how many played DaOC. But I also feel the player base seems to grow cause with the content coming in every 2 weeks yeah not all of it has been perfect but I think like all companies you have to find a way to do it that works. I also on a lot of my 80 travel around to different maps and help player with things if I see a big even going on I jump in and I can help and don't have to wait for someone to get the first hit type thing.
I understand! I too love the old games like UO! It was my first love of mmorpgs. Some folks have a problem with doing more than one thing or game at a time. I am excited about the new WoW patch coming up. The trailer for the new patch kind of sparked my interest in joining again!
Anyway, for those who can't mix it up with some of the old, and some of the new, I don't think they can consider themselves true MMORPG Champions!
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
Comments
A hiring list can be indicative of a lot of things and isn't always a sign of how a company is doing. ArenaNet is known to have a large turnover rate. It also pays less than a lot of major studios. Read their profile on glassdoor.com. I am not saying that it is doing bad either so don't jump to that conclusion.
James T. Kirk: All she's got isn't good enough! What else ya got?
Isn't that you?
I even see under 10%.
Of course it is NCSoft that deals with the Chinese market, just like they deal with the Korean market.
Western Market you have NCSoft West and NCSoft Europe.
Everything publishing related is NCSoft, that owns Arenanet 100%.
The manifesto is Arenanet and most of it, especially the older written one (https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/guild-wars-2-design-manifesto/), seems to be a fair description of the game. Of course there are always stuff that change from initial idea to end product or that don't work so well. The video one was clearly something to cause impact and it did, including I suspect much of the visceral hate some players have for the game since how can someone dare to say that the games they have been playing for years have problems.
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
Sorry I I dont see where that site plays into the fact there hiring all the time that site has 12 reviews by people and nothing else. And If thats the case look at Wal-marts turn over rate I know this well 3 to 6 people a day at most stores and I know that for fact.
As for the rest if you are not making income you don't hire period you lay off till you get your finances right I ran serveral buisnesses before not huge companies but like a smaller and not once did I hire when profits were down.
Sherman's Gaming
Youtube Content creator for The Elder Scrolls Online
Channel:http://https//www.youtube.com/channel/UCrgYNgpFTRAl4XWz31o2emw
Yes that is referring to the third party metrics... which imply the game has less than 10% retention rate... Notice I say "decently" accurate and don't actually claim less than 10% as my own opinion. I'm just glad some people knew immediately that 2.5million active players claim was bogus... but sad that many thought it was even feasible.
Well i'd ask you for proof that ncsoft is the one that went into contractual talks with the chinese publisher, but I know you simply won't have any.
As for your opinion on the manifesto, the video manifesto was horribly inaccurate and deceptive... sure that's only my opinion but the game is my proof. You were still collecting wolf tails though, that's for sure! You didn't really foster any significant change in the world, that's for sure, and the personal story was not even close to what they acted like it would be.
Maybe they are hiring all of the time because they have such a turnover rate lol. Ding
That is just one site. You can google and find others. They seem to treat their people well though. The second statement you made isn't necessarily true either. Especially in a company that relies on a sole product as their revenue stream. I worked in a company that tried to save itself by hiring more people and improving our product. We were a subsidiary of one of the largest defense contractors in the US. We increased our company size by almost 50%, We made the necessary breakthroughs, but unfortunately for us, our competitors did it sooner and we lost our contract which ironically enough went to a small German company. Again, I am not saying that the company is doing bad, but things aren't always what they seem. People here make arguments based on conjecture or their personal experiences mixed with opinions. No one will ever know what is really going on until Anet releases the actual numbers.
James T. Kirk: All she's got isn't good enough! What else ya got?
Dude, stop comparing to Lineage. There are only 1 western published mmorpg more profitable than lineage for the last 10 years. That's called wow.
So fill free to dismiss GW2 because it is less profitable than lineage. You might as well dismiss every single mmorpg made in the US or Europe, because no game compare to lineage.
For the last 10 years, the most profitable mmorpg look something like this. First is Wow, the rest are some crappy f2p chinese mmoprg you never heard of, and lineage. That is the actually truth.
The most profitable mmorpg except wow are actually games no one in this forum actually heard of. Because the chinese market are so big, they can make any game with cashshop and be more profitable. Lineage probably stays top 5 in the most profitable mmorpg for the last decade every year.
And what's the big deal. I don't think you realize how successful lineage is.
Also you are comparing a B2P game to a subscription game(depend on the region).
But you are right to an extend. GW2 probably have less people than lineage.
Dude, stop believe anything the Chinese mmorpg marketing tell you. They always publish the most misleading information ever.
And please stop imagining any game actually have a good retention rate. They don't.
How many people do you think actually play wow for 10 years. Stop imagine that. At best it just mean they recoup or people return at a stable rate.
For everyone who bought a GW2 box, a high percent stopped playing. Just like in every single mmorpg. Even wow have a low retention rate.
Think of it this way, I see people spreading rumors how wow sold like 100 million copies, but how many people actually play wow now? Maybe 3 million? (I didn't count chinese, because chinese players only need to pay by time, they don't need to pay for the initial box).
Blizzard never want to release their box sales number, because they don't want you to know they dont' have a high retention rate too. That's why they only publish their sub number.
That is sort of exactly my point, GW2 is just like every other sub par not quite good as L1 or L2 or even Aion battling it out with the other backbencher mmorpgs fighting over 200 to 300k subs. Its your average themepark.
Off topic: No culling stress test seems to be running great!
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
Seems to me if you like GW2 you are happy playing the game and spend your time doing so ....if you dislike GW2 you spend your time playing the forums and worrying about the folks playing GW2. The fact you pulled a number like 200 to 300k subs doesn't seem to add to anything in regards to GW2 ? I'm not even sure what you are trying to say but perhaps the fact that you nothing better to do then play the forums is more of a reflection on you than GW2
ya well, keep complaining how every single mmorpg is bad. You can try the mmorpg general forum. Many people share your taste there.
The point is GW2 is so bad, very few western published mmorpg is even better.
You keep comparing it to eastern published mmorpg. But they have such an easier time because their market is so big. And western publisher have a hard time getting in the east part of the globe.
Typical Friday night in WvW. Yeah... they got me. Sigh...
Oderint, dum metuant.
Awesome! I guess if you are dead you have time for a screenshot!
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
I just don't trust any translations from it on top of not trusting whatever they wrote on their website.
I know some people stopped playing GW2 after launch.
I also know that GW2 not having subscription mean anyone can just easily return, while returning to WoW mean you need to open your wallet again.
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
For example from
http://www.kdbdw.com/bbs/board/message/view.do?messageId=182267&messageNumber=25&messageCategoryId=0&startId=zzzzz~&startPage=1&curPage=1&searchType=2&searchText=NCSoft&searchStartYear=2011&searchStartMonth=12&searchStartDay=30&searchEndYear=2012&searchEndMonth=12&searchEndDay=29&lastPageFlag=&categoryId=76
We believe earnings will be driven by overseas sales from 2H13. In China, the company is planning to launch Blade & Soul (via a publishing agreement with Tencent) in 3Q13 and Guild Wars 2 in 4Q13 (via a publishing agreement with Kong Zhong).
NCSoft owns Arenanet and GW2.
The third party metrics are the same that shows WoW lost 90% of their population and we know that is false.
About the manifesto.
"So if you love MMORPGs, you should check out Guild Wars 2. But if you hate traditional MMORPGs, then you should really check out Guild Wars 2. Because, like Guild Wars before it, GW2 doesn’t fall into the traps of traditional MMORPGs. It doesn’t suck your life away and force you onto a grinding treadmill; it doesn’t make you spend hours preparing to have fun rather than just having fun; and of course, it doesn’t have a monthly fee."
True.
"The original Guild Wars was known for the level of storytelling it brought to online RPGs, so with GW2 we obviously wanted to take it to the next level. In GW you experience the story of the world, but the story in GW2 is the personal story of your character as well. You fill out a biography at character creation time that defines your background and your place within the world, and that starts you on your path. Then the choices you make will take the story in different directions. Each time you play through the game, you can experience a different storyline."
True, although the ending is the same.
"Some games mostly tell story through quest text. But we’ve all clicked so many exclamation points and accepted so many quests in our lives that we’re pretty immune to quest text at this point. GW2 tells story by allowing the player to befriend and adventure with key characters, by presenting him with moral dilemmas that will impact the lives of the people around him, and by having him live through world-changing events and all the key moments of the storyline."
True as well. Note people in this case refer to the NPCs of your personal story.
In addition to great storyline and important player choices, another hallmark of great RPGs is that they create a world that feels real and alive. Let’s say a village is being terrorized by bandits. You don’t want to find out about that because there’s a villager standing there motionless with an exclamation mark over his head who says when you click on him, “Help, we’re being terrorized by bandits.” You want to find out like you would in GW2: because the bandits are attacking, chasing villagers through the streets, slaying them and setting their houses on fire. You can stand up for the villagers, or you can watch their village burn to the ground and then deal with the consequences. We’ve worked hard to create a living, dynamic world for you, where there’s always something new to do.
It happens like that.
I guess bandits won't go burn your real life house as a consequence though, so I guess some people are disappointed with that.
MMOs are social games. So why do they sometimes seem to work so hard to punish you for playing with other players? If I’m out hunting and another player walks by, shouldn’t I welcome his help, rather than worrying that he’s going to steal my kills or consume all the mobs I wanted to kill? Or if I want to play with someone, shouldn’t we naturally have the same goals and objectives, rather than discovering that we’re in the same area but working on a different set of quests?
Other players are always welcomed.
With traditional MMOs you can choose to solo or you can find a good guild or party to play with. With GW2 there’s a third option too: you can just naturally play with all the people around you. I personally spend a big chunk of my time in traditional MMOs soloing, but when I play GW2 I always find myself naturally working with everyone around me to accomplish world objectives, and before long we find ourselves saying, “Hey, there’s a bunch of us here; let’s see if we can take down the swamp boss together,” without ever having bothered to form a party.
Yeah, true as well.
GW2 shares this flexible skill system. The big difference is that now skills are much more visual in explaining what they do. The process of actually discovering combos, or understanding them when they’re used against you, is a lot more clear, because you can visually see how skills combo with each other. An Elementalist can cast Fire Wall next to an opponent, and then switch to Water attunement, which freezes all enemies around him. Using the concussive force of Water Trident, he can slam his frozen enemy into the Fire Wall, leaving him to roast in the flames.
Some will say too much visual.
Then we add environmental weapons to mix up combat even more. In the original GW you’d sometimes find a catapult or trebuchet that you could take over and fire at enemies. That’s one type of environmental weapon, and in GW2 we have dozens more. If a Stone Elemental throws a boulder at you, pick it up and throw it back. Or as an Elementalist, use that boulder to create a meteor storm. If you’re fighting an Oakheart with an axe and you manage to hack off a branch, pick up the branch and try using it as a weapon. If you meet a beekeeper outside town, buy a jar of bees from him and see what happens when you lob it at nearby enemies. If you come across a stash of powder kegs, don’t just blow them up in place, but try moving them to where they can do the most damage. If a centaur wheels a siege machine up to the outskirts of a village, don’t just destroy it; take it over and use it to turn the tide of battle.
And while you’re discovering new opportunities, new weapons, new combos, and new strategies, you’re surrounded by the pure visceral joy of combat. Smash a monster with a plank and watch him fly through the air. Avoid the Oakheart’s roots as they creep out of the ground looking to entangle you. Launch yourself on a sweeping attack that takes you behind your enemy. Smash open the garrison gate and begin your assault. Dodge out of the way before the Drake Broodmother unleashes her fire attack.
Happen as well.
Guess this is a case of the book being better than the movie, since they had to cut a few bits and made some bits more dramatic in the manifesto video.
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
The third party metrics for WoW are for the western audience of WoW, which is very low relative to previous years... it does not claim to track the chinese users at all.
Just because NCsoft owns anet doesn't mean they handle every decision by anet. Sort of like vivendi didn't handle publishing contracts for blizzard in EVERY region.
As for your manifesto responses, those are just biased opinions.
The game made me spend hours preparing to have fun, and in the end it still wasn't even fun. People that loved traditional MMORPGs didn't like GW2 very much. So that first paragraph, objectively, is false.
Each time you play through the game you may not experience a different story line, the game doesn't have infinite story lines. So that part is false.
GW2 actually has you clicking NPCs with markers over your head, in the personal story... so this paragraph is also false.
The npcs are pretty static, the dynamic events are static in where and how they happen so that paragraph is false in what it is trying to market the game as.
GW2 events are easy mode, I find that there is never really any socializing because the persistent world content is so easy.... So it is pretty much soloing, you aren't actually there working with each other consciously. So again false...
Flexible is subjective, I will say that GW2's system is less flexible than other big MMOs, there are less ways to deviate in how you play your class. So again, objectively speaking, another false claim.
I dunno what to tell you man, you are biased, watch the manifesto video, ask yourself honestly if they achieved what they were trying to advertise there.
Their dynamic events aren't dynamic, you as an individual can not change the game world. They are trying to fix some of their lies now, but too little too late.
So now you are saying that WoW lost 90% of their western audiance, which is estimated to be somewhere between 2.5 and 4 millions.
NCSoft handle every publishing decision.
And your opinions of the manifesto are even more biased.
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
Retention rate means people who bought the game continue playing it.
Just because wow manage to keep a constant estimate ~3 million(or something like that) western players dont' mean it have a 100% retention rate.
Wow probably do have a very low retention rate, mainly because it's a 10 year game.
Most players just buy games, try it, don't like it and stop playing. Only 1/3rd of wow trial actually subscribe, and 1/10th of those in eve trial actually continue playing. (of course, there are all those people claim those people on trial account are all gold sellar).
Get the fact straight. In the mmorpg market, a huge percent of player who bought the game never make pass the 1month mark.
Awesome! ty for the SS too!
There are so many people playing that it never gets boring. Even if I want to take off on my own and do my own thing, I am usually grouped sooner or later because of all the people.
Loving the game and the way it is always evolving and changing. I also really enjoy WoW, but it is pretty much what there is just like any other game of it's clone. I play even rift and the world seems stamped into a shape and that is what you play on. When you clear an area, you rarely if ever go back. In GW2 level 80s are mixed with level 15s. I just finished killing a champion ooze with a level 80! It was very challenging because I'm playing a 22 elementalist. It took a while but it was a blast, and it is just a tiny portion of a wonderfully built title.
After almost a year of playing, I would have thought the population would have died a bit more, but in the last few weeks I honestly believe it has increased as the OP has stated.
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
I've pretty much stopped playing. But I still log in every few days or so to catch any friends online and see what's going on. Last night, LA was about as full as I've ever seen it. So what does that mean? It means LA was about as full as I've ever seen it. Nothing more, nothing less. GW2 has players. It has plenty of players logging in every day. No one is short on getting into content due to a low player base.
Any other concept, idea, theory, or guess, is nothing more than speculation. There is only one fact known. GW2 sold fewer boxes in the past 2 quarters than in the quarters before. If you attach any other statements to those facts, you are pulling them out of your ass. (And that goes both ways too)
so, no, you cannot say definitively that GW2 is losing player retention. You have no numbers. Conversely, You cannot look at one server and say GW2 is getting bigger. That's just as much bullshit. You have no numbers. If your server had 1000 players on line when you logged in last week, yesterday it had 500 players when you logged in, and today, there are 700, you can't say that's growth. It's just how many are logged in. You also have no way to account for how many of those are transferring from other servers into yours. Especially if you are on one of the higher populated servers to begin with.
These threads need to stop. Until ANET releases numbers with actual populations and active members, all this speculations is nothing but BS.
Too many posters on both sides of the fence desperately trying to prove something they cannot.
Edit:
I'm going to amend my statement here. In OPs defense, I do think it's appropriate to claim that a server seems to have more players then before. That's definitely valid. But I don't necessarily agree that it automatically translates into a growing populations since there are so many other factors to be accounted for that there is simply no info released.
for the record, I personally consider GW2 to be one of the more successful MMOs out there. Even if it's not a perfect match for me.
Amjoco you know I feel the same way about the game its great and alot of those saying any old school player wont touch this most people I meet have or started with games like UO or EQ and then I met some that started in WoW its crazy how many played DaOC. But I also feel the player base seems to grow cause with the content coming in every 2 weeks yeah not all of it has been perfect but I think like all companies you have to find a way to do it that works. I also on a lot of my 80 travel around to different maps and help player with things if I see a big even going on I jump in and I can help and don't have to wait for someone to get the first hit type thing.
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I understand! I too love the old games like UO! It was my first love of mmorpgs. Some folks have a problem with doing more than one thing or game at a time. I am excited about the new WoW patch coming up. The trailer for the new patch kind of sparked my interest in joining again!
Anyway, for those who can't mix it up with some of the old, and some of the new, I don't think they can consider themselves true MMORPG Champions!
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.