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[Column] DUST 514: Ashes to Ashes...

SBFordSBFord Associate Editor - News ManagerThe Land of AZPosts: 16,637MMORPG.COM Staff Uncommon

Our intrepid Tourist is ready to take us on a journey through the EVE-connected world of DUST 514. See what he discovered about the world, the game and much more in this week's The Tourist. Leave us your thoughts in the comments!

When CCP first revealed DUST 514, I was more than a little excited. As much as I love MMORPGs, first-person shooters will always be my second love. The idea of one even remotely like EVE Online was music to my ears. For years, shooters have moved closer to the persistence of MMOs, so why shouldn't CCP, legendary in that space, be the ones to make it happen? I had faith and today I am sorely let down. DUST is the result of over-ambition and, I believe, a touch of arrogance that console players would simply accept what they were offering. In short, it's just not very good. Today, I'm here to talk about DUST's fundamental problems and why even a move to PC may not be enough.

Read more of Chris Coke's The Tourist: Ashes to Ashes...

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Associate Editor: MMORPG.com
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Comments

  • rojoArcueidrojoArcueid hell, NJPosts: 6,779Member Uncommon
    i really want to keep playing this game but i will not keep my PS3 for one f2p game. When i get my PS4 im done with PS3. I hope this game becomes successful enough so they port it to next gen. Maybe on next gen they can even make bigger matches. They jsut need to fix a lot of problems

    image
  • uidCausticuidCaustic acworth, GAPosts: 128Member
    When they break down and realize console games have no lasting player base per game and bring it to PC, I'll worry about it then.
  • GruugGruug Chillicothe, ILPosts: 1,311Member Uncommon
    Too bad this game is only available to one type of gaming system. It sort of negates interest by those that do not own that gaming  system.

    Let's party like it is 1863!

  • BelegStrongbowBelegStrongbow Pasadena, MDPosts: 281Member
    a big push onto ps4 with new features and bigger battles,  might save the title.  Its just not on the same scale as Planetside 2.  And PS2 is coming to PS4,  it should be a really good port.
  • Tsar_BombaTsar_Bomba Moonbase Alpha, TXPosts: 11Member

    And the PC users laugh and only want to know one thing...

     

    Where's the grave so I can desecrate it.

     

    Ignore us at your peril.

  • KyleranKyleran Tampa, FLPosts: 20,008Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Tsar_Bomba

    And the PC users laugh and only want to know one thing...

     

    Where's the grave so I can desecrate it.

     

    Ignore us at your peril.

    Or at least dance on it.

    Sure wish they had decided to ashcan this dead duck and go forward on WOD with more gusto.

     

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.
    "I don't have one life, I have many lives" - Grunty
    Still currently "subscribed" to EVE, and only EVE!!!
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  • PhaserlightPhaserlight Boca Raton, FLPosts: 867Member Uncommon
    Fundamental Problem #1 seems the most obvious, knowing little else about either game; there doesn't seem to be enough reason for a console FPS gamer to participate in the Eve universe, or vice-versa, as the design currently stands.

    "To be what you are not, experience what you are not." -Saint John of the Cross
    Authored 110 missions in Vendetta Online
    Check it out on Steam

  • moondragomoondrago saint john, NBPosts: 47Member

    you really hit the nail on the head with this  post  .. i  went out and bought a  ps3 just for this  game  and then  after  2 months of   play  and  about  $150 bucks  later  ... i realize  i just   c ould not  keep my self into this  game  ... the  main  thing i  dislike  was  the  HIGH lvl  of  skill points needed to  lvl  stuff ... i was  a  sniper and   for  lvl  5  of  the  skill it was  like  1.2 million  skill points ... ..you win a  match you get  about  5ooo  ... and  its not  really mmo  ..your  post  was  right on the money ...

    p.s. do you know anyone that  wants to buy a ps3 :)

    its a GoOd dAy to diE !!

  • RobokappRobokapp Dublin, OHPosts: 5,206Member Uncommon

    i'll play it when they'll let me install on my pc.

     

    p.s. has anyone made a ps emulator yet ?

     

    if you can make a mac run windows and a pc run mario...

    image

  • orbitxoorbitxo fort lauderdale, FLPosts: 1,408Member Uncommon

    "however, the players most likely to enjoy the game will be watching from the sidelines as CCP pioneers forward without them."

     

    - you nailed it there!

  • RemyVorenderRemyVorender Riverside, RIPosts: 3,266Member Uncommon
    PS3 Gamer 1: Hey man want to play Dust 514? It'san FPS based on EVE Online.

    PS3 Gamer 2: What's an EVE Online?


    PC Gamer 1: Hey man want to play Dust 514?

    PC Gamer 2: Ya EVE is awesome! Let me fire up my PC.

    PC Gamer 1: it's only on the PS3...

    PC Gamer 2: dafuq?......

    Played: AA, AC1, AC2, Aion, AO, AoC, CO, CoX, DAoC, DCUO, DN, EVE, EQ1, EQ2,
    ESO, FE, FFXI, FFXIV, FF, GW1, GW2, Istaria, L2, LoTRO, MO, MxO, NW, Rift, RoE,
    Ryzom, SB, SWG, SWTOR, TERA, TSW, WAR, WoW, WURM...

  • cosycosy ColentinaPosts: 3,304Member


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  • NodboNNodboN glen burnie, MDPosts: 44Member
    i would of gave it an honest try if it had been on pc, and might have liked it, hell i play combat arms and any shooter is a step up from that. 
  • rodingorodingo Posts: 2,346Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by NodboN
    i would of gave it an honest try if it had been on pc, and might have liked it, hell i play combat arms and any shooter is a step up from that. 

    I gave it an honest run on the PS3 and it's really waste of HD space.  PC players who want to play Dust 514 really have a superior choice already with Planetside 2.

    "If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor

  • maplestonemaplestone Ottawa, ONPosts: 3,099Member

    How much of this boils down to a culture gap over risk management - EvE philosophy revolves around "don't fly anything you can't afford to lose, don't fight fights you can't win".  Do these concepts exist in DUST?

  • OzmodanOzmodan Hilliard, OHPosts: 7,191Member Uncommon

    " It's a PS3 exclusive. In fairness, they probably got a boatload of money to make it that way. "

    That quote immediately told me that this guy rarely uses the internet search feature to research his articles so you can read what he writes with a skeptical eye.  Just for you edification Mr. Coke, the game was initially going to be on the xbox, but due to restrictions that CCP could not live with from Microsoft, was switched to the PS3.  They intentionally did not do a PC version because they did not want it conflicting with Eve.

    Anyone who follows Eve would know this, hence I really have to question your ability to be qualified to write this article at all.

    What the author did do, was point out the major problems with this game.  From a console player's perspective this is a poorly written FPS.  It is pay-to-win.  I am not sure why CCP decided they should get into the console business, but they should have hired some designers with console FPS experience.  They really need to change how they fund this game, as it stands I would never recommend it to anyone.

  • GameByNightGameByNight Columnist / Podcast Host Rochester, NYPosts: 122Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Ozmodan

    " It's a PS3 exclusive. In fairness, they probably got a boatload of money to make it that way. "

    That quote immediately told me that this guy rarely uses the internet search feature to research his articles so you can read what he writes with a skeptical eye.  Just for you edification Mr. Coke, the game was initially going to be on the xbox, but due to restrictions that CCP could not live with from Microsoft, was switched to the PS3.  They intentionally did not do a PC version because they did not want it conflicting with Eve.

    Anyone who follows Eve would know this, hence I really have to question your ability to be qualified to write this article at all.

    What the author did do, was point out the major problems with this game.  From a console player's perspective this is a poorly written FPS.  It is pay-to-win.  I am not sure why CCP decided they should get into the console business, but they should have hired some designers with console FPS experience.  They really need to change how they fund this game, as it stands I would never recommend it to anyone.

    So, let me get this straight, you're discrediting my article because of one tiny, almost indisputable line and using the other 90% to support your own argument? And you believe that because CCP didn't hop on a forum and spell out that Sony paid them that it didn't happen? Pull that blanket a little tighter over your head.

     

    I guarantee you Sony paid them for an exclusivity contract. It's how console exclusives work: Sony pays developers to make console exclusives because it helps them sell consoles.  The funding is why developer's agree to it because by tying themselves to a single platform, they limit their sales. Why would studios like Naughty Dog ever agree to console exclusivity otherwise? If you only pay attention to the MMO space, you may not know that, but if you seriously believe CCP is keeping DUST on PS3 to "not compete with EVE" -- a game so incredibly different that they are literally in two different genres --  you're naive. Nevermind that Sony also dumped loads of money into trade show time for CCP. It wasn't out of the goodness of their hearts, it was because they were invested and were trying to earn their return.

     

    I do my research. Do you?

     
     

    Writer of the RPG Files
    Official Podcast Host
    Blogger at GameByNight.com

  • PhryPhry HampshirePosts: 6,296Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by rodingo
    Originally posted by NodboN
    i would of gave it an honest try if it had been on pc, and might have liked it, hell i play combat arms and any shooter is a step up from that. 

    I gave it an honest run on the PS3 and it's really waste of HD space.  PC players who want to play Dust 514 really have a superior choice already with Planetside 2.

    Planetside 2 is going to be on the PS4, which means that Dust will probably be officially dead at that point.

    the only thing that MIGHT save Dust now is a PC port, but honestly, its probably already far too late for that anyway.  Its dead jim, no need to take it out back and shoot it, just dig a hole and drop it in.image

  • LeGrosGamerLeGrosGamer Canada, QCPosts: 210Member
    I've always been a huge fan of CCP, but doing Dust 514 for console only is probably their dumbest (Or 1st stupid move) ever.
  • GameByNightGameByNight Columnist / Podcast Host Rochester, NYPosts: 122Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Phry
    Originally posted by rodingo
    Originally posted by NodboN
    i would of gave it an honest try if it had been on pc, and might have liked it, hell i play combat arms and any shooter is a step up from that. 

    I gave it an honest run on the PS3 and it's really waste of HD space.  PC players who want to play Dust 514 really have a superior choice already with Planetside 2.

    Planetside 2 is going to be on the PS4, which means that Dust will probably be officially dead at that point.

    the only thing that MIGHT save Dust now is a PC port, but honestly, its probably already far too late for that anyway.  Its dead jim, no need to take it out back and shoot it, just dig a hole and drop it in.image

     

    My guess is that the exclusivity deal is timed. I don't see any other reason why CCP would agree to it knowing that the PS4 was coming. When it's done, we'll see a PC port. The game may actually have a shot when it can get where it belonged in the first place.

    Writer of the RPG Files
    Official Podcast Host
    Blogger at GameByNight.com

  • PhryPhry HampshirePosts: 6,296Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by GameByNight
    Originally posted by Phry
    Originally posted by rodingo
    Originally posted by NodboN
    i would of gave it an honest try if it had been on pc, and might have liked it, hell i play combat arms and any shooter is a step up from that. 

    I gave it an honest run on the PS3 and it's really waste of HD space.  PC players who want to play Dust 514 really have a superior choice already with Planetside 2.

    Planetside 2 is going to be on the PS4, which means that Dust will probably be officially dead at that point.

    the only thing that MIGHT save Dust now is a PC port, but honestly, its probably already far too late for that anyway.  Its dead jim, no need to take it out back and shoot it, just dig a hole and drop it in.image

     

    My guess is that the exclusivity deal is timed. I don't see any other reason why CCP would agree to it knowing that the PS4 was coming. When it's done, we'll see a PC port. The game may actually have a shot when it can get where it belonged in the first place.

    There is such a low uptake even on the PS3 for this title, there was only a few thousand players, not even tens of thousands, whether the deal is timed now or not, it probably doesnt matter, Sony have probably moved on, and with focus now on the upcoming PS4, i doubt whether they'll be too bothered about continuing support for a PS3 game with such a small playerbase. Which means either CCP focuses on creating a PS4 client, and/or they create a PC client for the game, but at this point, what most PC players are interested in, future wise, from CCP is World of Darkness, and possibly extending WiS to a more 'meaningful' experience. But Dust... im expecting them to walk away from this one. image

  • LoktofeitLoktofeit Stone Mountain, GAPosts: 13,672Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by GameByNight
    Originally posted by Ozmodan

    " It's a PS3 exclusive. In fairness, they probably got a boatload of money to make it that way. "

    That quote immediately told me that this guy rarely uses the internet search feature to research his articles so you can read what he writes with a skeptical eye.  Just for you edification Mr. Coke, the game was initially going to be on the xbox, but due to restrictions that CCP could not live with from Microsoft, was switched to the PS3.  They intentionally did not do a PC version because they did not want it conflicting with Eve.

    Anyone who follows Eve would know this, hence I really have to question your ability to be qualified to write this article at all.

    What the author did do, was point out the major problems with this game.  From a console player's perspective this is a poorly written FPS.  It is pay-to-win.  I am not sure why CCP decided they should get into the console business, but they should have hired some designers with console FPS experience.  They really need to change how they fund this game, as it stands I would never recommend it to anyone.

    So, let me get this straight, you're discrediting my article because of one tiny, almost indisputable line and using the other 90% to support your own argument? And you believe that because CCP didn't hop on a forum and spell out that Sony paid them that it didn't happen? Pull that blanket a little tighter over your head.

    I guarantee you Sony paid them for an exclusivity contract. It's how console exclusives work: Sony pays developers to make console exclusives because it helps them sell consoles.  The funding is why developer's agree to it because by tying themselves to a single platform, they limit their sales. Why would studios like Naughty Dog ever agree to console exclusivity otherwise? If you only pay attention to the MMO space, you may not know that, but if you seriously believe CCP is keeping DUST on PS3 to "not compete with EVE" -- a game so incredibly different that they are literally in two different genres --  you're naive. Nevermind that Sony also dumped loads of money into trade show time for CCP. It wasn't out of the goodness of their hearts, it was because they were invested and were trying to earn their return.

    I do my research. Do you?

     

    Then during your research you found that CCP wanted to do both XBox and PS3, but the XBox side didn't pan out, right?

     

    There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
    "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre

  • GameByNightGameByNight Columnist / Podcast Host Rochester, NYPosts: 122Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Loktofeit
    Originally posted by GameByNight
    Originally posted by Ozmodan

    " It's a PS3 exclusive. In fairness, they probably got a boatload of money to make it that way. "

    That quote immediately told me that this guy rarely uses the internet search feature to research his articles so you can read what he writes with a skeptical eye.  Just for you edification Mr. Coke, the game was initially going to be on the xbox, but due to restrictions that CCP could not live with from Microsoft, was switched to the PS3.  They intentionally did not do a PC version because they did not want it conflicting with Eve.

    Anyone who follows Eve would know this, hence I really have to question your ability to be qualified to write this article at all.

    What the author did do, was point out the major problems with this game.  From a console player's perspective this is a poorly written FPS.  It is pay-to-win.  I am not sure why CCP decided they should get into the console business, but they should have hired some designers with console FPS experience.  They really need to change how they fund this game, as it stands I would never recommend it to anyone.

    So, let me get this straight, you're discrediting my article because of one tiny, almost indisputable line and using the other 90% to support your own argument? And you believe that because CCP didn't hop on a forum and spell out that Sony paid them that it didn't happen? Pull that blanket a little tighter over your head.

    I guarantee you Sony paid them for an exclusivity contract. It's how console exclusives work: Sony pays developers to make console exclusives because it helps them sell consoles.  The funding is why developer's agree to it because by tying themselves to a single platform, they limit their sales. Why would studios like Naughty Dog ever agree to console exclusivity otherwise? If you only pay attention to the MMO space, you may not know that, but if you seriously believe CCP is keeping DUST on PS3 to "not compete with EVE" -- a game so incredibly different that they are literally in two different genres --  you're naive. Nevermind that Sony also dumped loads of money into trade show time for CCP. It wasn't out of the goodness of their hearts, it was because they were invested and were trying to earn their return.

    I do my research. Do you?

     

    Then during your research you found that CCP wanted to do both XBox and PS3, but the XBox side didn't pan out, right?

     

    Yes. Just like other MMOs in the past. I didn't consider it relevant because the end result is still the same: PS3 exclusive.

    Writer of the RPG Files
    Official Podcast Host
    Blogger at GameByNight.com

  • xaritscinxaritscin CaliPosts: 349Member

    as i said in a thread at the EVE official forums, "DUST514 should've been part of EVE instead of a standalone."

    and by that extension, a part of WiS, which in that case should be improved and made more deep in terms of gameplay, the excuse that it would enter in conflict with spaceship gameplay is bullshit TBH.

  • RodentofdoomRodentofdoom NottinghamPosts: 273Member

    If you are going to review a game product, do it properly.

    re: Fundamental Problem #3 -- I could equally be reading a review for Planetside 2 or Battle Field with this, PS2 uses certificates for upgrades, BF uses specific weapon kills, D514 uses SP. It's the same mechanism for all three games.

    re: Gear loss on death .. your a clone. when your killed, a new clone is activated. it's not you ..... it's "you 2.0" . theres a book called Templar One it's explained there.

    re: Fundamental Problem #4 -- Dust & Eve are tied via the Planetary Interaction system. ATM only Temperate planets in Faction Warfare enabled lo-sec space are activated for dust battlegrounds ... its less than 5% of the planets in eve, afaik there are plans for D514 conflicts to be enabled in other areas of New Eden over time

     

    re: Fundamental Problem #5 -- Battle Field and Planetside 2 are equally full of Pay to Win weapons, boosters and other useful equipment.

    to be brutally honest, getting a positive k/d ratio with 'militia' grade equipment isn't hard and if your focusing on your k/d ratio your playing dust wrong. win/loss ratio is far more important.

    Squad play is more important. want to Rambo it up .. CoD is that way ---->

     

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