OHHH but Everquest NEVER had guns and Ninjas *whine whine*. Oh yes? But it never had VOXELs or Action Combat or no levels or sandbox. It's called CHANGE. Things do that ya know. Sheesh.
Do games really have to be set in stone like the tablets of the 10 commandments?
Guns are cool.
Ninjas are cool.
So MORE guns and Ninjas I say!
The voice of reason! I agree
I see no reason archaic or magical guns can't be written into a fantasy setting. I see no reason ninjas can't also be written in to the story. These things add depth and new elements to the lore, not to mention expanding possibilities for gameplay mechanics. A whole new crafting line in tinkering and chemistry for creating guns and ammo. A different continent in Norrath where strange people practice different fighting techniques and call themselves "ninjas," stealthy warriors who emerge from the shadows and kill without making a sound.
Sometimes people resist change with so much fervor, that they forget to see and recognize other possibilities.
I'd rather not have either, but I could possibly bend on the guns issue. Although, I would limit that to only musket type secondary weapons. Absolutely NO repeating fire!! One-Shot and Done. Out of Combat Reloads Only.
Personally, I feel they should keep in the spirit of Classic Fantasy. Pirates with pistols...I can handle. Taurens riding Harleys and Gnomes flying around on Rockets...I cannot...and that's why I left that "other" game.
I'm gonna have a hard enough time getting past the "TWITCHING the Spastic-Fantastic" Action that's gonna kill MY immersion. Throw in a couple hundred fcktrds running around, trying to blow holes through everything in sight just to get to the hell that lies beneath and it's..."Hello, Kiddie-Land!"...No Thanks!
Sorry, SOE, but your Key-Demographic is too busy spending what little money they've earned on Bubble Gum & Acne-Cleanser!
"Walk soft on the Paths of Society...For Subtlety is the Blessing of Sanctuary."
Am I the only one who found it wierd that they linked guns and ninjas ? You have one that starts in about 1400-1600 (depending on your usage of "gun") and another that is up to a two thousand years before guns.
They're so far apart when it comes to the question of "fitting" in high fantasy that it just didn't make sense.
I have a major problem with "guns" being in high-fantasy MMOs, and I blame WoW for the growing usage of them. Even primitive guns don't make sense.
Ninja's on the other hand..they fit just fine. Not sure why anyone would be so against it. I'd be happy for EQN not to be so strictly Euro-high fantasy and include other elements like they did with DoN and a few things in Eq2...you already have monks that are most definitely not "European"
I have a major problem with "guns" being in high-fantasy MMOs, and I blame WoW for the growing usage of them. Even primitive guns don't make sense.
Ninja's on the other hand..they fit just fine. Not sure why anyone would be so against it. I'd be happy for EQN not to be so strictly Euro-high fantasy and include other elements like they did with DoN and a few things in Eq2...you already have monks that are most definitely not "European"
Guns were a part of the Warcraft fantasy universe. Its not like they pulled them out of their ass and placed them in WoW!
The one thing the poll questions, and dev opinions on those polls, show me is how incredibly early this game still is in development. It still seems like it's in the planning stage in so many ways. Scary how many people are hailing this the second coming already at this point with posts like "EQN FOR LIFE!!!!!" and such. wow
I have a major problem with "guns" being in high-fantasy MMOs, and I blame WoW for the growing usage of them. Even primitive guns don't make sense.
Ninja's on the other hand..they fit just fine. Not sure why anyone would be so against it. I'd be happy for EQN not to be so strictly Euro-high fantasy and include other elements like they did with DoN and a few things in Eq2...you already have monks that are most definitely not "European"
The first devices identified as guns appeared in china around 1000AD, and by the 12th century the technology was spreading through the rest of Asia, and into Europe by the 13th century.
Ninjas didnt really appear till the 17th century.
So historicly speaking... guns would make more sense then ninja's.
I have a major problem with "guns" being in high-fantasy MMOs, and I blame WoW for the growing usage of them. Even primitive guns don't make sense.
Ninja's on the other hand..they fit just fine. Not sure why anyone would be so against it. I'd be happy for EQN not to be so strictly Euro-high fantasy and include other elements like they did with DoN and a few things in Eq2...you already have monks that are most definitely not "European"
What doesn't make sense about early guns?
A lot of high fantasy games borrow a lot of their design, in terms of armour and weapons, from the late middle ages, mainly the 15th and 16th century. Things like full suits of plate armour (Gothic/Milianese styles), sword designs, etc.
This is around the time you had Matchlock guns and Wheelock guns, the mid 15th century and 16th century.
So to me I don't see how it makes no sense for them to be in a high fantasy game that borrows a lot of designs from the late middle ages.
I guess when many people hear AND/OR see the words or suggestions involving guns, they think modern rather than WoW, GW2, powder, magic, crystalized, and etc. Not to mention that from research, gnomes where in EQ1, now from my understanding they made some advance things, I asked my friends who have played eq1 and 2 if guns could make sense in next, didn't take long from comming to the conclusion that it'd make sense even lore wise.
Guns like rifles and pistols/dual pistols would bring in more variety to the table aswelll.
As for ninja, I believe it could be used for like thief or something, more universal word at least.
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
I have a major problem with "guns" being in high-fantasy MMOs, and I blame WoW for the growing usage of them. Even primitive guns don't make sense.
Ninja's on the other hand..they fit just fine. Not sure why anyone would be so against it. I'd be happy for EQN not to be so strictly Euro-high fantasy and include other elements like they did with DoN and a few things in Eq2...you already have monks that are most definitely not "European"
The first devices identified as guns appeared in china around 1000AD, and by the 12th century the technology was spreading through the rest of Asia, and into Europe by the 13th century.
Ninjas didnt really appear till the 17th century.
So historicly speaking... guns would make more sense then ninja's.
Ohhhhh SNAP!!!!
Seems like one thing after another that SOE does to make one more weary of EQN. Seriously.... are they that lost that they can't come up with their class desicions? It's not like they have a wide array to chose from and what about the "40 classes" they tooted their horns about? Sounds like they are throwing ninjas in there for the sole reason to attract more to EQN as ninjas have always been a popular thing.
I guess when many people hear AND/OR see the words or suggestions involving guns, they think modern rather than WoW, GW2, powder, magic, crystalized, and etc. Not to mention that from research, gnomes where in EQ1, now from my understanding they made some advance things, I asked my friends who have played eq1 and 2 if guns could make sense in next, didn't take long from comming to the conclusion that it'd make sense even lore wise.
Guns like rifles and pistols/dual pistols would bring in more variety to the table aswelll.
As for ninja, I believe it could be used for like thief or something, more universal word at least.
If that's the case then why even bother with a poll? Seems like EQN is too worried bout stepping on peoples toes even when they are in the full right. Makes me worry that they'll just do whatever the masses cry for, NOT a trait you want in a company imo. Rather see companies stick to their guns but not conceited enough to refuse to take criticism and re-evaluate decisions when needed.
I have a major problem with "guns" being in high-fantasy MMOs, and I blame WoW for the growing usage of them. Even primitive guns don't make sense.
Ninja's on the other hand..they fit just fine. Not sure why anyone would be so against it. I'd be happy for EQN not to be so strictly Euro-high fantasy and include other elements like they did with DoN and a few things in Eq2...you already have monks that are most definitely not "European"
The first devices identified as guns appeared in china around 1000AD, and by the 12th century the technology was spreading through the rest of Asia, and into Europe by the 13th century.
Ninjas didnt really appear till the 17th century.
So historicly speaking... guns would make more sense then ninja's.
Ohhhhh SNAP!!!!
Seems like one thing after another that SOE does to make one more weary of EQN. Seriously.... are they that lost that they can't come up with their class desicions? It's not like they have a wide array to chose from and what about the "40 classes" they tooted their horns about? Sounds like they are throwing ninjas in there for the sole reason to attract more to EQN as ninjas have always been a popular thing.
Seems another person doesnt quite know what a ninja actually is.. they are not what holywood trows at us, the so called.. stealth assassins only where a very small fraction of the ninja life.
So while the actual ninja clans didnt truely arise around 17th century, the poor-man's clans did excist long before them. That and.. historics wherent all that interested in he peasants and focussing more on nobility and aristocrats. This is why its so hard when actual ninja clans formed up.
Funny isnt it how the history books are swinging both ways
Not to mention it really isnt all that hard to come up with 40 classes, especially considering a class doesnt have to be a combat class per say.
Im sorry but to me you seem to grasping for straws to ..dislike
I guess when many people hear AND/OR see the words or suggestions involving guns, they think modern rather than WoW, GW2, powder, magic, crystalized, and etc. Not to mention that from research, gnomes where in EQ1, now from my understanding they made some advance things, I asked my friends who have played eq1 and 2 if guns could make sense in next, didn't take long from comming to the conclusion that it'd make sense even lore wise.
Guns like rifles and pistols/dual pistols would bring in more variety to the table aswelll.
As for ninja, I believe it could be used for like thief or something, more universal word at least.
If that's the case then why even bother with a poll? Seems like EQN is too worried bout stepping on peoples toes even when they are in the full right. Makes me worry that they'll just do whatever the masses cry for, NOT a trait you want in a company imo. Rather see companies stick to their guns but not conceited enough to refuse to take criticism and re-evaluate decisions when needed.
thats all in the eye of the beholder, it seems more like they want to give people the feeling their ideas and oppinions DO matter. Its a safe bet that they know what ever they deside there will be more then enough people being unhappy with the decisions being made.
Originally posted by tkreep You would think normal human beings and other sentient creatures without power and physical advantage surrounded by people that can throw fireballs and oversized savage monsters would be trying to develop technology and weapons beyond blades and bow and arrows to oppose all of that.
Yea sure normal people. But gnomes? Come on man nothing is normal about them, even in EQ1 they were making giant sized cog wheels instead of using teleport spells like sane people....crazy buggers.
I for one wouldn't mind a ninja like class, it pretty much sums up what the rogue has become in most MMO's anyway...someone above said ninjas are different than thieves because they have teleports and invisibility....um....isn't that on the action bar of 99% of the rogues out there?
edit: notice I said ninja like...as in something with a totally different lore but still a secretive group of killers...they should not live in a pagoda...
Comments
I think something like this could fit in EQN
If they are going to have pirates and ninjas I herby DEMAND lumberjack commandos!
(I voted no BTW.)
We should all chip in and send this guy into SOE's HQ to "clean up" EQN.
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO
Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall
Currently Playing: ESO
The voice of reason! I agree
I see no reason archaic or magical guns can't be written into a fantasy setting. I see no reason ninjas can't also be written in to the story. These things add depth and new elements to the lore, not to mention expanding possibilities for gameplay mechanics. A whole new crafting line in tinkering and chemistry for creating guns and ammo. A different continent in Norrath where strange people practice different fighting techniques and call themselves "ninjas," stealthy warriors who emerge from the shadows and kill without making a sound.
Sometimes people resist change with so much fervor, that they forget to see and recognize other possibilities.
I'd rather not have either, but I could possibly bend on the guns issue. Although, I would limit that to only musket type secondary weapons. Absolutely NO repeating fire!! One-Shot and Done. Out of Combat Reloads Only.
Personally, I feel they should keep in the spirit of Classic Fantasy. Pirates with pistols...I can handle. Taurens riding Harleys and Gnomes flying around on Rockets...I cannot...and that's why I left that "other" game.
I'm gonna have a hard enough time getting past the "TWITCHING the Spastic-Fantastic" Action that's gonna kill MY immersion. Throw in a couple hundred fcktrds running around, trying to blow holes through everything in sight just to get to the hell that lies beneath and it's..."Hello, Kiddie-Land!"...No Thanks!
Sorry, SOE, but your Key-Demographic is too busy spending what little money they've earned on Bubble Gum & Acne-Cleanser!
"Walk soft on the Paths of Society...For Subtlety is the Blessing of Sanctuary."
- anonymous
Am I the only one who found it wierd that they linked guns and ninjas ? You have one that starts in about 1400-1600 (depending on your usage of "gun") and another that is up to a two thousand years before guns.
They're so far apart when it comes to the question of "fitting" in high fantasy that it just didn't make sense.
I have a major problem with "guns" being in high-fantasy MMOs, and I blame WoW for the growing usage of them. Even primitive guns don't make sense.
Ninja's on the other hand..they fit just fine. Not sure why anyone would be so against it. I'd be happy for EQN not to be so strictly Euro-high fantasy and include other elements like they did with DoN and a few things in Eq2...you already have monks that are most definitely not "European"
And it's not gonna stop either. I'm convinced this is going to be a kiddie game. SOE will give a whole new definition to the term Nerfing my MMO.
No to ninjas....but if the poll said Assassin....or Shadow Warrior, or NightBlade....everyone would be like HELL YEAH !
Its the same lol
but GUNS? NO NO NO
Guns were a part of the Warcraft fantasy universe. Its not like they pulled them out of their ass and placed them in WoW!
There is no reason guns can't be fantasy.
Guns i don't like but Ninja was probably one of the most interesting classes and definitely the most fun tank class in all of FFXI.
Elemental ninjutsu debuffs and nukes with fast attacking dual katanas? What's not to like?
oohhhhhhh bada bing!
The first devices identified as guns appeared in china around 1000AD, and by the 12th century the technology was spreading through the rest of Asia, and into Europe by the 13th century.
Ninjas didnt really appear till the 17th century.
So historicly speaking... guns would make more sense then ninja's.
There is class roles and trinity is still in the game, stop being misinformed.
http://www.reddit.com/r/EQNext/comments/1kd1pe/class_roles_think_lol_vs_ai_bots/
smokejumper is Dave Georgeson and he comfirmed what the poster wrote about is what they are planning to do.
What doesn't make sense about early guns?
A lot of high fantasy games borrow a lot of their design, in terms of armour and weapons, from the late middle ages, mainly the 15th and 16th century. Things like full suits of plate armour (Gothic/Milianese styles), sword designs, etc.
This is around the time you had Matchlock guns and Wheelock guns, the mid 15th century and 16th century.
So to me I don't see how it makes no sense for them to be in a high fantasy game that borrows a lot of designs from the late middle ages.
I guess when many people hear AND/OR see the words or suggestions involving guns, they think modern rather than WoW, GW2, powder, magic, crystalized, and etc. Not to mention that from research, gnomes where in EQ1, now from my understanding they made some advance things, I asked my friends who have played eq1 and 2 if guns could make sense in next, didn't take long from comming to the conclusion that it'd make sense even lore wise.
Guns like rifles and pistols/dual pistols would bring in more variety to the table aswelll.
As for ninja, I believe it could be used for like thief or something, more universal word at least.
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
Ohhhhh SNAP!!!!
Seems like one thing after another that SOE does to make one more weary of EQN. Seriously.... are they that lost that they can't come up with their class desicions? It's not like they have a wide array to chose from and what about the "40 classes" they tooted their horns about? Sounds like they are throwing ninjas in there for the sole reason to attract more to EQN as ninjas have always been a popular thing.
If that's the case then why even bother with a poll? Seems like EQN is too worried bout stepping on peoples toes even when they are in the full right. Makes me worry that they'll just do whatever the masses cry for, NOT a trait you want in a company imo. Rather see companies stick to their guns but not conceited enough to refuse to take criticism and re-evaluate decisions when needed.
Seems another person doesnt quite know what a ninja actually is.. they are not what holywood trows at us, the so called.. stealth assassins only where a very small fraction of the ninja life.
So while the actual ninja clans didnt truely arise around 17th century, the poor-man's clans did excist long before them. That and.. historics wherent all that interested in he peasants and focussing more on nobility and aristocrats. This is why its so hard when actual ninja clans formed up.
Funny isnt it how the history books are swinging both ways
Not to mention it really isnt all that hard to come up with 40 classes, especially considering a class doesnt have to be a combat class per say.
Im sorry but to me you seem to grasping for straws to ..dislike
thats all in the eye of the beholder, it seems more like they want to give people the feeling their ideas and oppinions DO matter. Its a safe bet that they know what ever they deside there will be more then enough people being unhappy with the decisions being made.
Yea sure normal people. But gnomes? Come on man nothing is normal about them, even in EQ1 they were making giant sized cog wheels instead of using teleport spells like sane people....crazy buggers.
I for one wouldn't mind a ninja like class, it pretty much sums up what the rogue has become in most MMO's anyway...someone above said ninjas are different than thieves because they have teleports and invisibility....um....isn't that on the action bar of 99% of the rogues out there?
edit: notice I said ninja like...as in something with a totally different lore but still a secretive group of killers...they should not live in a pagoda...