Given how the market has grown, sounds like a winning strategy to me.
Winning strategy?
Then tell me why new MMO have such short lifespans?
Because they make money up front and they don't need a long lifespan to be profitable? And players can play many more games (i.e. more variety) because you can finish a game faster.
Sounds like a win-win to me.
First time ive seen someone make an argument FOR quantity over quality.
Now explain to me how making a slight profit over 6 months is better then raking in the millions quality games like World of warcraft, Lineage 2, Aion, Everquest 2 over the past decade?
I didnt realize MMO were about "FInishing the game as fast as possible" so i can move on to the next one. There's my fucking problem! All this time i thought i wanted to experience a virtual world, treat my character as though i was living almost a second life in this grand adventure, instead i shouldve been in a race to rack up as many meaningless achievements as i can as fast as i can so i can upload it on to twitter to fulfill my social needs, then do it again in the next MMO.
I actually want to play a game longer then a month, that is why my genre of choice is MMO, and not single player games. I like paying monthly subs to have the assurance that more content will keep coming for the game i enjoy playing. Thats the problem with todays MMO, they are all designed to be "Finished". Gone are the days of playing a game for 4+ years. I should play for 3 weeks, and then sit trolling forums for 1 to 2 years waiting for the "NEXT" game.
tell me again how it is a win - win for me?
Quotations Those Who make peaceful resolutions impossible, make violent resolutions inevitable. John F. Kennedy
Life... is the shit that happens while you wait for moments that never come - Lester Freeman
Lie to no one. If there 's somebody close to you, you'll ruin it with a lie. If they're a stranger, who the fuck are they you gotta lie to them? - Willy Nelson
First time ive seen someone make an argument FOR quantity over quality.
Now explain to me how making a slight profit over 6 months is better then raking in the millions quality games like World of warcraft, Lineage 2, Aion, Everquest 2 over the past decade?
No. You are confused. I am advocating quality (good fun game) over quantity (longer game).
How? D3 is not a long term game. It sold 12M+ boxes ... making $720M .. more than many long term MMO. Plus, you can use the resource to make ANOTHER game.
So how is a series of short life span, highly quality games not better than one long term mediocre one .. particular when everything gets old and boring at some point.
...like clubs are for people who like to socially interact ..
I wonder how it came about that so many 'graduates' of this club are so terrible at it (interacting with other people).
Being judgmental doesn't tend to be a social positive.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
First time ive seen someone make an argument FOR quantity over quality.
Now explain to me how making a slight profit over 6 months is better then raking in the millions quality games like World of warcraft, Lineage 2, Aion, Everquest 2 over the past decade?
No. You are confused. I am advocating quality (good fun game) over quantity (longer game).
How? D3 is not a long term game. It sold 12M+ boxes ... making $720M .. more than many long term MMO. Plus, you can use the resource to make ANOTHER game.
So how is a series of short life span, highly quality games not better than one long term mediocre one .. particular when everything gets old and boring at some point.
Yeah i bought D3.. out of respect for D1 and D2. Diablo 3 was complete garbage, played it for 2 weeks, made it to inferno in 2 days. Then stopped playing when i refused to spend money to get past the first act in Inferno.
And How the fuck does Quanity = longer while Quality = churning out more and more titles to get quick turn over?
Do you even know what the word quantity means?
If i play a game for 4+ years. ( WoW, Lineage 2, Everquest)
And i play a game for 1 to 3 weeks (everything that has been released in the last 5 years)
Doesnt that mean the games i played for YEARS if of better QUALITY of the games i play for WEEKS? Are you trying to tell me games like star wars the old republic, diablo 3, neverwinter, warhammer online, guild wars 2, the list goes on and on, are so good i just dont know it, and their short retention times are a testament to that? Their QUALITY is measured by the fact that i beat them in 2 weeks instead of 2 years?
Ive seen some nonsense posted on this forum before, but this really takes the cake haha.
Quotations Those Who make peaceful resolutions impossible, make violent resolutions inevitable. John F. Kennedy
Life... is the shit that happens while you wait for moments that never come - Lester Freeman
Lie to no one. If there 's somebody close to you, you'll ruin it with a lie. If they're a stranger, who the fuck are they you gotta lie to them? - Willy Nelson
Given how the market has grown, sounds like a winning strategy to me.
Winning strategy?
Then tell me why new MMO have such short lifespans?
Because they haven't been out as long.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Given how the market has grown, sounds like a winning strategy to me.
Winning strategy?
Then tell me why new MMO have such short lifespans?
Because they haven't been out as long.
I see. I guess SWTOR is a success, or will be. Same goes for neverwinter and guild wars 2.
Wouldnt know, cant actually gauge their progress anymore because htey go off boxes sold and not active subscriptions each month.
Quotations Those Who make peaceful resolutions impossible, make violent resolutions inevitable. John F. Kennedy
Life... is the shit that happens while you wait for moments that never come - Lester Freeman
Lie to no one. If there 's somebody close to you, you'll ruin it with a lie. If they're a stranger, who the fuck are they you gotta lie to them? - Willy Nelson
Yeah i bought D3.. out of respect for D1 and D2. Diablo 3 was complete garbage, played it for 2 weeks, made it to inferno in 2 days. Then stopped playing when i refused to spend money to get past the first act in Inferno.
May be because you are just not that good a player.
I finished inferno without paying a cent. In fact, i made some money off it, and now i have a paragon 100 toon.
And btw, you don't like it does not mean others don't. It is still top 20 on xfire and played by many after more than a year.
Yeah i bought D3.. out of respect for D1 and D2. Diablo 3 was complete garbage, played it for 2 weeks, made it to inferno in 2 days. Then stopped playing when i refused to spend money to get past the first act in Inferno.
May be because you are just not that good a player.
I finished inferno without paying a cent. In fact, i made some money off it, and now i have a paragon 100 toon.
And btw, you don't like it does not mean others don't. It is still top 20 on xfire and played by many after more than a year.
Id almost take that as an insult if it wasnt for the fact that D3 is about rng, an inferno mode was about stat bloating. the jump from nightmare to inferno was ridiculous. Often meant spending way more time in nightmare just to farm something you hope would sell in order to get a weapon with enough damage to get through inferno.
But hey, i came to MMORPG.com to talk about action rpg like diablo 3. Next lets talk about how great call of duty is shall we?
So, my skill in diablo 3 aside, how does that change the fact that MMO are supposed to be persistant worlds, not pit stops, and the goal should be to make a gaming experience that lasts for years, not hours?
Quotations Those Who make peaceful resolutions impossible, make violent resolutions inevitable. John F. Kennedy
Life... is the shit that happens while you wait for moments that never come - Lester Freeman
Lie to no one. If there 's somebody close to you, you'll ruin it with a lie. If they're a stranger, who the fuck are they you gotta lie to them? - Willy Nelson
So, my skill in diablo 3 aside, how does that change the fact that MMO are supposed to be persistant worlds, not pit stops, and the goal should be to make a gaming experience that lasts for years, not hours?
MMOs are not supposed to be anything. It is just a convenient label for a group of games. Genre changes. So what if MMOs are good short term games now. I can enjoy them as such as opposed to ranting about it.
The goal is to entertain. Nothing more, nothing less.
So, my skill in diablo 3 aside, how does that change the fact that MMO are supposed to be persistant worlds, not pit stops, and the goal should be to make a gaming experience that lasts for years, not hours?
MMOs are not supposed to be anything. It is just a convenient label for a group of games. Genre changes. So what if MMOs are good short term games now. I can enjoy them as such as opposed to ranting about it.
The goal is to entertain. Nothing more, nothing less.
But they arent even good short games, they are just cash grabs. publishers are just gong for the quick profit before they shove off and put out the next product. They dont care if people play them for the long run because they only thing they take into account is how many boxes are sold, they dont need you to hang around and sub or even play the game after your initial purchase.
Seems like people are ok with that.
Quotations Those Who make peaceful resolutions impossible, make violent resolutions inevitable. John F. Kennedy
Life... is the shit that happens while you wait for moments that never come - Lester Freeman
Lie to no one. If there 's somebody close to you, you'll ruin it with a lie. If they're a stranger, who the fuck are they you gotta lie to them? - Willy Nelson
I prefer to play an MMO as a social game. I very much prefer group content. It's nice to have a solo option available for those times when no group can be found or when you only have a few minutes to log on and play a bit. But I like the feeling of needing others and being needed in return. It helps the world feel more real to me.
- - "What if the hokey pokey really is what it's all about?" - -
But they arent even good short games, they are just cash grabs. publishers are just gong for the quick profit before they shove off and put out the next product. They dont care if people play them for the long run because they only thing they take into account is how many boxes are sold, they dont need you to hang around and sub or even play the game after your initial purchase.
Seems like people are ok with that.
By that logic, there will be no good Sp game, which is not true. SP games dev don't care if people play them for the long run, and so what? There are plenty of great SP 2 weeks games that are more fun to me than most MMOs.
The key is that to get you to buy the short game, they have to have good content, at least for the initial while.
Originally posted by Raunu I prefer to play an MMO as a social game. I very much prefer group content. It's nice to have a solo option available for those times when no group can be found or when you only have a few minutes to log on and play a bit. But I like the feeling of needing others and being needed in return. It helps the world feel more real to me.
I prefer to play a MMO not as a social game. I very much prefer solo content. It is nice to have a group option available for those times when i am in the mood for someone to play with, or i have longer time to group. But i like the feeling of not needing others nor obligated to help. It helps to make the game more fun to me.
So, my skill in diablo 3 aside, how does that change the fact that MMO are supposed to be persistant worlds, not pit stops, and the goal should be to make a gaming experience that lasts for years, not hours?
MMOs are not supposed to be anything. It is just a convenient label for a group of games. Genre changes. So what if MMOs are good short term games now. I can enjoy them as such as opposed to ranting about it.
The goal is to entertain. Nothing more, nothing less.
Originally posted by nariusseldon
I prefer to play a MMO not as a social game. I very much prefer solo content. It is nice to have a group option available for those times when i am in the mood for someone to play with, or i have longer time to group. But i like the feeling of not needing others nor obligated to help. It helps to make the game more fun to me.
The highlighted portion is always his answer. Too bad it is wrong.
There are many types of MMO's...
MMORPG: MMO Role Playing Games
MMOBA: MMO Battle Arena
MMORTS: MMO Real Time Strategy Games
MMOFPS: MMO First Person Shooter Games
MMOSG(sports): MMO Sports Games
MMOR: MMO Racing Games
MMORG/MMODG: MMO Rythm/Music Games or MMO Dancing Games
MMOMG: MMO Management Games
MMOSG(social): MMO Social Games
MMOBBG/MMOBBRPG: MMO Bulletin Board Games or MMO Bulletin Board Role Playing GamesQuest
MMOPG: MMO Puzzle Games – Three Rings, Puzzle Pirates
MMOCCG: MMO Collectible Card Games
MMO alternate reality games
MMO Turn based Strategy Games
MMO Simulation Games
The reason for this is because they are meant for SOMETHING. That is...to attract a certain type of player that enjoys said type of game as a customer, and to serve as that players/customers entertainment. This is why there are different genres. For different tastes.
Now some of these mix together as well. Such as a MMORPG also has the elements (Or sadly...HAD at one time anyways.) of MMOSG's, MMOBA's, etc. But...for the most part...they are different categories for a purpose.
I agree that MMO's are meant to entertain. But they are meant to entertain in different ways. Some with fast fun, some with long drawn out fun, some with mindless action, others with fun in the form of thinking and figuring things out, etc, etc..
But not all of them should be the same to entertain YOU, as you always seem to drive at. Again, there are different categories of them for a reason. I know it's tough, but try letting that sink in.
Yeah i bought D3.. out of respect for D1 and D2. Diablo 3 was complete garbage, played it for 2 weeks, made it to inferno in 2 days. Then stopped playing when i refused to spend money to get past the first act in Inferno.
May be because you are just not that good a player.
I finished inferno without paying a cent. In fact, i made some money off it, and now i have a paragon 100 toon.
And btw, you don't like it does not mean others don't. It is still top 20 on xfire and played by many after more than a year.
Id almost take that as an insult if it wasnt for the fact that D3 is about rng, an inferno mode was about stat bloating. the jump from nightmare to inferno was ridiculous. Often meant spending way more time in nightmare just to farm something you hope would sell in order to get a weapon with enough damage to get through inferno.
But hey, i came to MMORPG.com to talk about action rpg like diablo 3. Next lets talk about how great call of duty is shall we?
So, my skill in diablo 3 aside, how does that change the fact that MMO are supposed to be persistant worlds, not pit stops, and the goal should be to make a gaming experience that lasts for years, not hours?
Hey DeserttFoxx. I challenge you to boot up D3 again and give it an honest try. They made a lot of changes they allows much more flexibility without forcing AH usage.
If you expected to like the game before, but didn't. perhaps you will now. That would be a much happier ending than being a grumpy, disappointed gamer, don't you think?
So, my skill in diablo 3 aside, how does that change the fact that MMO are supposed to be persistant worlds, not pit stops, and the goal should be to make a gaming experience that lasts for years, not hours?
MMOs are not supposed to be anything. It is just a convenient label for a group of games. Genre changes. So what if MMOs are good short term games now. I can enjoy them as such as opposed to ranting about it.
The goal is to entertain. Nothing more, nothing less.
Originally posted by nariusseldon
I prefer to play a MMO not as a social game. I very much prefer solo content. It is nice to have a group option available for those times when i am in the mood for someone to play with, or i have longer time to group. But i like the feeling of not needing others nor obligated to help. It helps to make the game more fun to me.
The highlighted portion is always his answer. Too bad it is wrong.
There are many types of MMO's...
MMORPG: MMO Role Playing Games
MMOBA: MMO Battle Arena
MMORTS: MMO Real Time Strategy Games
MMOFPS: MMO First Person Shooter Games
MMOSG(sports): MMO Sports Games
MMOR: MMO Racing Games
MMORG/MMODG: MMO Rythm/Music Games or MMO Dancing Games
MMOMG: MMO Management Games
MMOSG(social): MMO Social Games
MMOBBG/MMOBBRPG: MMO Bulletin Board Games or MMO Bulletin Board Role Playing GamesQuest
MMOPG: MMO Puzzle Games – Three Rings, Puzzle Pirates
MMOCCG: MMO Collectible Card Games
MMO alternate reality games
MMO Turn based Strategy Games
MMO Simulation Games
The reason for this is because they are meant for SOMETHING. That is...to attract a certain type of player that enjoys said type of game as a customer, and to serve as that players/customers entertainment. This is why there are different genres. For different tastes.
Now some of these mix together as well. Such as a MMORPG also has the elements (Or sadly...HAD at one time anyways.) of MMOSG's, MMOBA's, etc. But...for the most part...they are different categories for a purpose.
I agree that MMO's are meant to entertain. But they are meant to entertain in different ways. Some with fast fun, some with long drawn out fun, some with mindless action, others with fun in the form of thinking and figuring things out, etc, etc..
But not all of them should be the same to entertain YOU, as you always seem to drive at. Again, there are different categories of them for a reason. I know it's tough, but try letting that sink in.
You just completely proved his point, unless in your world a squares and trapezoids are not quadrilaterals.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
So, my skill in diablo 3 aside, how does that change the fact that MMO are supposed to be persistant worlds, not pit stops, and the goal should be to make a gaming experience that lasts for years, not hours?
MMOs are not supposed to be anything. It is just a convenient label for a group of games. Genre changes. So what if MMOs are good short term games now. I can enjoy them as such as opposed to ranting about it.
The goal is to entertain. Nothing more, nothing less.
Originally posted by nariusseldon
I prefer to play a MMO not as a social game. I very much prefer solo content. It is nice to have a group option available for those times when i am in the mood for someone to play with, or i have longer time to group. But i like the feeling of not needing others nor obligated to help. It helps to make the game more fun to me.
The highlighted portion is always his answer. Too bad it is wrong.
There are many types of MMO's...
MMORPG: MMO Role Playing Games
MMOBA: MMO Battle Arena
MMORTS: MMO Real Time Strategy Games
MMOFPS: MMO First Person Shooter Games
MMOSG(sports): MMO Sports Games
MMOR: MMO Racing Games
MMORG/MMODG: MMO Rythm/Music Games or MMO Dancing Games
MMOMG: MMO Management Games
MMOSG(social): MMO Social Games
MMOBBG/MMOBBRPG: MMO Bulletin Board Games or MMO Bulletin Board Role Playing GamesQuest
MMOPG: MMO Puzzle Games – Three Rings, Puzzle Pirates
MMOCCG: MMO Collectible Card Games
MMO alternate reality games
MMO Turn based Strategy Games
MMO Simulation Games
The reason for this is because they are meant for SOMETHING. That is...to attract a certain type of player that enjoys said type of game as a customer, and to serve as that players/customers entertainment. This is why there are different genres. For different tastes.
Now some of these mix together as well. Such as a MMORPG also has the elements (Or sadly...HAD at one time anyways.) of MMOSG's, MMOBA's, etc. But...for the most part...they are different categories for a purpose.
I agree that MMO's are meant to entertain. But they are meant to entertain in different ways. Some with fast fun, some with long drawn out fun, some with mindless action, others with fun in the form of thinking and figuring things out, etc, etc..
But not all of them should be the same to entertain YOU, as you always seem to drive at. Again, there are different categories of them for a reason. I know it's tough, but try letting that sink in.
You just completely proved his point, unless in your world a squares and trapezoids are not quadrilaterals.
Either I missed his point...or he needs to improve his language skills and explain it better than he ever manages to.
All he ever seems to come across as saying is that MMO's shouldn't be anything, as he did above...which makes no sense. And that all MMO's should basically be fast paced, instanced, lobby games. Because it doesn't matter if your talking about MMORPG's, or any of the other types listed above...he always has the same answer and outlook.
As explained above...yes...some can intertwine...HOWEVER, for the most part they ARE defined in different categories for a reason...because they stand out with certain features for certain playerbases, which means they are meant for something. That being a particular playerbase, hence, a label that puts them in a category that those playerbases can identify them. But they ARE different.
Guess this would be a MUCH easier conversation if it were in person or via phone/mic...because in forum conversations...things can get lost in comprehension differences and demeanor interpretation.
EQ 1 had the best solo/grouping game play ever, its like clubs are for people who like to socially interact yet a person goes there just to dance by themselves its stupid, you don't go to the nightclub and say this club is just for people to dance by themselves, the club doesn't revolve around a person that is by themselves its for a group of people to interact dance and have fun together
That is how a mmorpg should be, a mmorpg should be about bringing people together to socially interact if you do not like to socially interact their are certain classes with solo capabilities to help you solo, like EQs necro and druid the classes were for soloist but EQ did not revolve around the soloist mindset.
You seem to be getting solo playing and self sufficiency mixed up. Arguably, the two greatest sandbox mmorpgs that I've ever played (UO and SWG) did not require a group to advance your progression, but enhance it. In fact I did most of my daily task as a master ranger alone. And when I felt the need to socialize I headed to town or grabbed a challenging mission. That's the beauty of a virtual world rather than a virtual race.
I couldn't have put it better myself.
I was also a Master Ranger and I would be out doing my own thing when i would get a random tell from some Jedi who wanted to hire me to find a Peko Peko Albatross for him.....and just that quick, the environmental immersiveness and social immersiveness became one.
Originally posted by Gorwe Meh. After all the massive words and all the suggestions, I had an epiphany:
How about you develop both contents and just let players have FUN? In whatever way they see it. Isn't it why we are playing GAMES anyhow?
Thank you, Mr. Koster. You can sit back down now.
Have you seen this man?
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
EQ 1 had the best solo/grouping game play ever, its like clubs are for people who like to socially interact yet a person goes there just to dance by themselves its stupid, you don't go to the nightclub and say this club is just for people to dance by themselves, the club doesn't revolve around a person that is by themselves its for a group of people to interact dance and have fun together
That is how a mmorpg should be, a mmorpg should be about bringing people together to socially interact if you do not like to socially interact their are certain classes with solo capabilities to help you solo, like EQs necro and druid the classes were for soloist but EQ did not revolve around the soloist mindset.
You seem to be getting solo playing and self sufficiency mixed up. Arguably, the two greatest sandbox mmorpgs that I've ever played (UO and SWG) did not require a group to advance your progression, but enhance it. In fact I did most of my daily task as a master ranger alone. And when I felt the need to socialize I headed to town or grabbed a challenging mission. That's the beauty of a virtual world rather than a virtual race.
I couldn't have put it better myself.
I was also a Master Ranger and I would be out doing my own thing when i would get a random tell from some Jedi who wanted to hire me to find a Peko Peko Albatross for him.....and just that quick, the environmental immersiveness and social immersiveness became one.
SWG pre cu was the best. Hands down.
I'm afraid we'll never see a game like that again and that's a shame and great loss to every MMOer.
LFG systems like so many things were a two edged sword. On the one hand groups became easier to find, but also more random in nature. On the whole though they have been a good step forward. You can as has been mentioned do both, I have seen this done and it can work even in raids.
Yeh. It is working in wow raids. In fact, most players complete raids on LFR, than normal or hard mode.
Personally i quit wow long time ago, and came back because of LFR (until i quit again last Dec). It makes raiding more fun.
And yes, groups are more random but you also have control. You can easily just quit if there is anything you don't like about the group.
Hang on, I thought WoW was still P2P? That means you were paying for a MMO. The F2P lovers on here are going to brand you a traitor and burn you for heresy.
Not according to an obvious group on these forums. Sad what they've become. There is almost no difference between them and console games now...other than the other players assume the role of NPC's for the most part.
Oh of course there are differences ...
1) You can't show off your gear to other humans in console games.
2) Console games don't have AH.
3) Console games don't have some of the unique settings of some MMOs (like STO).
And other players are better NPCs than programmed ones. So there is a win there.
You're missing the biggest Key to MMO. Persistence. As much as I love games like Skyrim or Darksiders, the games inevitably come to a conclusion. Persistence is the only reason why I play MMO's, it's nice knowing something will never end and in the long run it means I get more bang for my buck.
I also started out playing MMO's in 1999, with Asheron's Call. One of the original "big 3" that founded this genre and the only MMO that espoused that solo play was just as important as group play. Neither were mutually exclusive of one another. The whole notion that the world is massively doesn't mean I "have" to play with others, it just meant the world was alive and virtual. I think the key the OP is missing here is you can build a game that is solo friendly but still give incentives for group play as well.
Random Forum Poster: I want an MMO that is different, original and fun.
Me: So you want something like EQN
Them: Nah dude, I want a Holy Trinity, Tab Target combat, Instanced Raiding, and Rigid classes.
LFG systems like so many things were a two edged sword. On the one hand groups became easier to find, but also more random in nature. On the whole though they have been a good step forward. You can as has been mentioned do both, I have seen this done and it can work even in raids.
Yeh. It is working in wow raids. In fact, most players complete raids on LFR, than normal or hard mode.
Personally i quit wow long time ago, and came back because of LFR (until i quit again last Dec). It makes raiding more fun.
And yes, groups are more random but you also have control. You can easily just quit if there is anything you don't like about the group.
Hang on, I thought WoW was still P2P? That means you were paying for a MMO. The F2P lovers on here are going to brand you a traitor and burn you for heresy.
uh .. didn't you read what i said?
I quite for 9 months by now. Plus, even last year i am not really paying to pay WOW, it was the Diablo annual pass that i have to finish up. So i have not paid for a MMO for a long time.
Comments
First time ive seen someone make an argument FOR quantity over quality.
Now explain to me how making a slight profit over 6 months is better then raking in the millions quality games like World of warcraft, Lineage 2, Aion, Everquest 2 over the past decade?
I didnt realize MMO were about "FInishing the game as fast as possible" so i can move on to the next one. There's my fucking problem! All this time i thought i wanted to experience a virtual world, treat my character as though i was living almost a second life in this grand adventure, instead i shouldve been in a race to rack up as many meaningless achievements as i can as fast as i can so i can upload it on to twitter to fulfill my social needs, then do it again in the next MMO.
I actually want to play a game longer then a month, that is why my genre of choice is MMO, and not single player games. I like paying monthly subs to have the assurance that more content will keep coming for the game i enjoy playing. Thats the problem with todays MMO, they are all designed to be "Finished". Gone are the days of playing a game for 4+ years. I should play for 3 weeks, and then sit trolling forums for 1 to 2 years waiting for the "NEXT" game.
tell me again how it is a win - win for me?
Quotations Those Who make peaceful resolutions impossible, make violent resolutions inevitable. John F. Kennedy
Life... is the shit that happens while you wait for moments that never come - Lester Freeman
Lie to no one. If there 's somebody close to you, you'll ruin it with a lie. If they're a stranger, who the fuck are they you gotta lie to them? - Willy Nelson
No. You are confused. I am advocating quality (good fun game) over quantity (longer game).
How? D3 is not a long term game. It sold 12M+ boxes ... making $720M .. more than many long term MMO. Plus, you can use the resource to make ANOTHER game.
So how is a series of short life span, highly quality games not better than one long term mediocre one .. particular when everything gets old and boring at some point.
Doesn't fix anything. GW1 was like that. Sorry - been tried before.
I wonder how it came about that so many 'graduates' of this club are so terrible at it (interacting with other people).
Being judgmental doesn't tend to be a social positive.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Yeah i bought D3.. out of respect for D1 and D2. Diablo 3 was complete garbage, played it for 2 weeks, made it to inferno in 2 days. Then stopped playing when i refused to spend money to get past the first act in Inferno.
And How the fuck does Quanity = longer while Quality = churning out more and more titles to get quick turn over?
Do you even know what the word quantity means?
If i play a game for 4+ years. ( WoW, Lineage 2, Everquest)
And i play a game for 1 to 3 weeks (everything that has been released in the last 5 years)
Doesnt that mean the games i played for YEARS if of better QUALITY of the games i play for WEEKS? Are you trying to tell me games like star wars the old republic, diablo 3, neverwinter, warhammer online, guild wars 2, the list goes on and on, are so good i just dont know it, and their short retention times are a testament to that? Their QUALITY is measured by the fact that i beat them in 2 weeks instead of 2 years?
Ive seen some nonsense posted on this forum before, but this really takes the cake haha.
Quotations Those Who make peaceful resolutions impossible, make violent resolutions inevitable. John F. Kennedy
Life... is the shit that happens while you wait for moments that never come - Lester Freeman
Lie to no one. If there 's somebody close to you, you'll ruin it with a lie. If they're a stranger, who the fuck are they you gotta lie to them? - Willy Nelson
Because they haven't been out as long.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I see. I guess SWTOR is a success, or will be. Same goes for neverwinter and guild wars 2.
Wouldnt know, cant actually gauge their progress anymore because htey go off boxes sold and not active subscriptions each month.
Quotations Those Who make peaceful resolutions impossible, make violent resolutions inevitable. John F. Kennedy
Life... is the shit that happens while you wait for moments that never come - Lester Freeman
Lie to no one. If there 's somebody close to you, you'll ruin it with a lie. If they're a stranger, who the fuck are they you gotta lie to them? - Willy Nelson
May be because you are just not that good a player.
I finished inferno without paying a cent. In fact, i made some money off it, and now i have a paragon 100 toon.
And btw, you don't like it does not mean others don't. It is still top 20 on xfire and played by many after more than a year.
Id almost take that as an insult if it wasnt for the fact that D3 is about rng, an inferno mode was about stat bloating. the jump from nightmare to inferno was ridiculous. Often meant spending way more time in nightmare just to farm something you hope would sell in order to get a weapon with enough damage to get through inferno.
But hey, i came to MMORPG.com to talk about action rpg like diablo 3. Next lets talk about how great call of duty is shall we?
So, my skill in diablo 3 aside, how does that change the fact that MMO are supposed to be persistant worlds, not pit stops, and the goal should be to make a gaming experience that lasts for years, not hours?
Quotations Those Who make peaceful resolutions impossible, make violent resolutions inevitable. John F. Kennedy
Life... is the shit that happens while you wait for moments that never come - Lester Freeman
Lie to no one. If there 's somebody close to you, you'll ruin it with a lie. If they're a stranger, who the fuck are they you gotta lie to them? - Willy Nelson
MMOs are not supposed to be anything. It is just a convenient label for a group of games. Genre changes. So what if MMOs are good short term games now. I can enjoy them as such as opposed to ranting about it.
The goal is to entertain. Nothing more, nothing less.
But they arent even good short games, they are just cash grabs. publishers are just gong for the quick profit before they shove off and put out the next product. They dont care if people play them for the long run because they only thing they take into account is how many boxes are sold, they dont need you to hang around and sub or even play the game after your initial purchase.
Seems like people are ok with that.
Quotations Those Who make peaceful resolutions impossible, make violent resolutions inevitable. John F. Kennedy
Life... is the shit that happens while you wait for moments that never come - Lester Freeman
Lie to no one. If there 's somebody close to you, you'll ruin it with a lie. If they're a stranger, who the fuck are they you gotta lie to them? - Willy Nelson
- - "What if the hokey pokey really is what it's all about?" - -
By that logic, there will be no good Sp game, which is not true. SP games dev don't care if people play them for the long run, and so what? There are plenty of great SP 2 weeks games that are more fun to me than most MMOs.
The key is that to get you to buy the short game, they have to have good content, at least for the initial while.
I prefer to play a MMO not as a social game. I very much prefer solo content. It is nice to have a group option available for those times when i am in the mood for someone to play with, or i have longer time to group. But i like the feeling of not needing others nor obligated to help. It helps to make the game more fun to me.
The highlighted portion is always his answer. Too bad it is wrong.
There are many types of MMO's...
Hey DeserttFoxx. I challenge you to boot up D3 again and give it an honest try. They made a lot of changes they allows much more flexibility without forcing AH usage.
If you expected to like the game before, but didn't. perhaps you will now. That would be a much happier ending than being a grumpy, disappointed gamer, don't you think?
Yikes. No more seamless worlds for you then, eh?
You just completely proved his point, unless in your world a squares and trapezoids are not quadrilaterals.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Either I missed his point...or he needs to improve his language skills and explain it better than he ever manages to.
All he ever seems to come across as saying is that MMO's shouldn't be anything, as he did above...which makes no sense. And that all MMO's should basically be fast paced, instanced, lobby games. Because it doesn't matter if your talking about MMORPG's, or any of the other types listed above...he always has the same answer and outlook.
As explained above...yes...some can intertwine...HOWEVER, for the most part they ARE defined in different categories for a reason...because they stand out with certain features for certain playerbases, which means they are meant for something. That being a particular playerbase, hence, a label that puts them in a category that those playerbases can identify them. But they ARE different.
Guess this would be a MUCH easier conversation if it were in person or via phone/mic...because in forum conversations...things can get lost in comprehension differences and demeanor interpretation.
I couldn't have put it better myself.
I was also a Master Ranger and I would be out doing my own thing when i would get a random tell from some Jedi who wanted to hire me to find a Peko Peko Albatross for him.....and just that quick, the environmental immersiveness and social immersiveness became one.
Thank you, Mr. Koster. You can sit back down now.
Have you seen this man?
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
SWG pre cu was the best. Hands down.
I'm afraid we'll never see a game like that again and that's a shame and great loss to every MMOer.
Hang on, I thought WoW was still P2P? That means you were paying for a MMO. The F2P lovers on here are going to brand you a traitor and burn you for heresy.
You're missing the biggest Key to MMO. Persistence. As much as I love games like Skyrim or Darksiders, the games inevitably come to a conclusion. Persistence is the only reason why I play MMO's, it's nice knowing something will never end and in the long run it means I get more bang for my buck.
I also started out playing MMO's in 1999, with Asheron's Call. One of the original "big 3" that founded this genre and the only MMO that espoused that solo play was just as important as group play. Neither were mutually exclusive of one another. The whole notion that the world is massively doesn't mean I "have" to play with others, it just meant the world was alive and virtual. I think the key the OP is missing here is you can build a game that is solo friendly but still give incentives for group play as well.
Random Forum Poster: I want an MMO that is different, original and fun.
Me: So you want something like EQN
Them: Nah dude, I want a Holy Trinity, Tab Target combat, Instanced Raiding, and Rigid classes.
Me: Double Facepalm.
uh .. didn't you read what i said?
I quite for 9 months by now. Plus, even last year i am not really paying to pay WOW, it was the Diablo annual pass that i have to finish up. So i have not paid for a MMO for a long time.