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Religious and LGBT Guilds, Yay or Nay?

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  • SwaneaSwanea Vegas, NVPosts: 2,368Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by immodium

    What I find unusual is why someone would play a game and think "I need to get my sexual orientation/religious/political views involved somehow"

    As someone else said, It's no different then wanting to play with a Hardcore PvP group, a RP guild, or a guild of persons older then let's say 50.

    People can feel right at home with people who share their interests.  Makes the game a lot more fun.  Plus, unlike those other groups I mentioned, they will much more comfy and accepted among people who share their certain attribute.

  • Mr_MechanicalMr_Mechanical RIVERSIDE, CAPosts: 88Member
    Originally posted by drakolas
    Many people, including myself, play MMOs for the social aspect. They aren't fun without friends imo, whether you're playing with friends you've met in person or online. If you are enthusiastic about a specific thing, why not find some other people to play with that are also enthusiastic about that or show a little bit of pride. I don't understand how this is difficult to grasp for anyone. As long as they aren't a hate group or forcing things on other people, who cares?

    who draws that line?

    Who decides that the White Pride or Black Pride or Brown Pride Asian Pride or Gay Pride or Straight Pride guilds are hateful or non-hateful?  

    That's the main problem here.   These subjects aren't typically 'welcomed' into public/casual conversation and other such scenarios for a reason.   Same goes for an online videogame where thousands and even millions of other people are all enclosed in one large "PUB" -- all of them exposed to everyone else's chatter and antics.   How to get everyone to play nice when they start forming "pride" cliques? 

     

  • Four0SixFour0Six Missoula, MTPosts: 1,181Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by immodium

    What I find unusual is why someone would play a game and think "I need to get my sexual orientation/religious/political views involved somehow"

    I was thinking about this, and you may be surprised to find out how many players feel safer in-game, and are more likely to express themselves. All sides considered.

  • kturockkturock loxahatchee, FLPosts: 16Member

    City of Heroes had posted on they page an all gay SuperGroup pic that posted from theSg's site. The entire SG was on at the same time and had a screenshot taken. ALl wearing their SG colors.

    So it's nothing new and shouldn't be anything special>

    There are churches and pastors that sponsor gaming nights for Heroclix and Pathfinder, why not for MMO's?

  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member


    Originally posted by kturock
    City of Heroes had posted on they page an all gay SuperGroup pic that posted from theSg's site. The entire SG was on at the same time and had a screenshot taken. ALl wearing their SG colors.So it's nothing new and shouldn't be anything special>There are churches and pastors that sponsor gaming nights for Heroclix and Pathfinder, why not for MMO's?

    The only time I think groups should not be allowed is if it is not for game play purposes, but for recruitment or spreading a message of some sort. If a church had a bunch of players join the game and start a guild for the purpose of getting more people to join the church, that should be something that isn't allowed. I don't guess that would really apply to a LGBT guild, but what if the U.S. military or FBI decided to start recruiting people through MMORPGs, that kind of thing should be shut down quickly.

    That's really all I can think of.

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • ropeniceropenice Lake Worth, FLPosts: 587Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
    Originally posted by immodium

    What I find unusual is why someone would play a game and think "I need to get my sexual orientation/religious/political views involved somehow"

    This. /thread.

    Games are not tools for religious, political or sexual propaganda, and anyone trying to use them as such should get a well deserved ban. I don't play game to have to endure the bullshit that is already plaguing "real world".

    Some people just feel better being around others like them or understands them. I say the more the merrier. I doubt they would go around rubbing it in others faces, It would be away for them to meet more people with their views/values, etc.

  • ropeniceropenice Lake Worth, FLPosts: 587Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by lizardbones

     


    Originally posted by kturock
    City of Heroes had posted on they page an all gay SuperGroup pic that posted from theSg's site. The entire SG was on at the same time and had a screenshot taken. ALl wearing their SG colors.

     

    So it's nothing new and shouldn't be anything special>

    There are churches and pastors that sponsor gaming nights for Heroclix and Pathfinder, why not for MMO's?



    The only time I think groups should not be allowed is if it is not for game play purposes, but for recruitment or spreading a message of some sort. If a church had a bunch of players join the game and start a guild for the purpose of getting more people to join the church, that should be something that isn't allowed. I don't guess that would really apply to a LGBT guild, but what if the U.S. military or FBI decided to start recruiting people through MMORPGs, that kind of thing should be shut down quickly.

    That's really all I can think of.

     

    As long as they aren't annoyingly spamming over chats or bothering people that don't want to be bothered, i don't care what they do.

  • Ocalypse0Ocalypse0 United States, CTPosts: 18Member

    I have no issues with such guilds existing in the games that I play or being in such guilds, as long as it does not infringe on (my) gameplay. I knew of a guild in WoW that did not allow people to play Warlocks due to demonic magic or something as such, so obviously since I am a progression minded end game raider that would not be a guild that I would be interested in being in due to actual gameplay impact.

     

    I would never judge someone for having a respective boyfriend or girlfriend nor would I judge someone for their choice of faith.

     

    Truth be told, I would rather be in a guild of mixed people and personalities under the general banner of "don't be an asshat". 

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  • Ansel09Ansel09 Madison, TNPosts: 5Member
    I've been playing mmo's for a few years now and I never really liked to associate myself with any sort of specified interest group guilds. I'm gay but never like to bring it up in a game because of the usual hate that follows. Although, as more time passes I just can't feel comfortable anymore with the so called "mature" guilds that keep using the word gay and fag every minute in their conversations. This has brought me to join a LGBT friendly guild that will let me freely express my opinion without worrying about who in the guild is uncomfortable with my sexuality. Though before you bring up what does me being gay have anything pertinent in a game setting, well their hasn't been a guild yet that I've joined where its members do not like discussing their girlfriends, marriages, their taste in women and so on. If I were to bring up my life or tastes, I would just get the usual response as to why should you bring up your sexuality in game. So as you can see it's just a double standard on the usual (straight) gamers mentality. To add to that thought, I never had a problem with guild mates discussing their lives freely but I don't like feeling like walking on eggshells, so to speak, when speaking about my life so they won't feel uncomfortable. LGBT friendly guilds are nothing more than a relaxed environment where people don't have to feel judged for being who they are.
  • isslingissling San Francisco, CAPosts: 157Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by immodium

    What I find unusual is why someone would play a game and think "I need to get my sexual orientation/religious/political views involved somehow"

    Because if we don't we end up in a guild where they just talk shit about us not even knowing where in the same guild. Have you even thought about that!

  • sado2020sado2020 elizabethtown, KYPosts: 112Member
    doesn't matter to me if what the guild focuses on, especially if it doesn't affect my gameplay like others said.  If a guild is upfront about their code of conduct or their purpose or whatever up front before recruiting players I think that is good as well.  I remember being in charge of a guild in Warhammer and telling a new member up front; hey we're pretty immature and we say off color stuff in chat all the time. Then one day they wanted me to censor language or comments in chat because what was said, though minor did not agree with their core values and I had to tell them that's not how we operate.  So in the end I think if the GM and guild ads say what their about up front the buyer is aware of what that guild is about :)

    Playing: TSW, D&D NW, Defiance (more the tv show than game >.> ) LotRO, DCUO

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  • SovrathSovrath Boston Area, MAPosts: 18,462Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by lizardbones



    So, what do you think? Do religious guilds ruin your immersion in a game? What about LBGT guilds?

    I don't care.

    If someone is in vent and mentions that he is going to see his boyfriend or "she" is going to see her girlfriend or if someone mentions that they can't raid late because they have Church in the morning I expect that a "themed" guild that represents their lifestyle might be fitting.

    If people want to get together and not feel stress because they don't need to hide  their life or keep it under wraps then more power to them.

    guilds are supposed to be about like minded people who can talk and be themselves. If someone says they need to attend a bat mitvah and that they are a little excited because it reminds them of their bat mitvah I expect they won't want to be grilled by anti-religion folks.

     

     

     

  • isslingissling San Francisco, CAPosts: 157Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by CommoX

    Personally I believe guilds should be themed within the games atmosphere, there's a very broad spectrum to that, but by blocking yourself off into little chunks/groups your just hurting yourself and your group.

    Religion - Sure, All praise No'donn! A good number of people can get behind what No'donn is about.

    Sexual Orientation - Gundabar's Fabulously Ranged Rangers. Why not, Rangers, ranged weapons, the chance to be epically fabulous, hell, I'm down for lookin down right deadly on a scouting mission.

    It highly amuses me when people who don't want to be segregated, looked at as different or sorted into a specific category do it to themselves and then cry foul.

    "Dear me, I've cordoned myself behind my differences and can't be bothered to look past them to see that we are all just people who might all enjoy a hobby together."

    Personal preference is just that, personal. If your friends/acquaintances can't see past that, it might be time to find some new ones.

    Everyone wants to be accepted, but they refuse to accept anyone else.

    Boggling

    It must be nice to join in any guild you want? Well try and be different In a so called normal guild and have them call everything gay or faggot every other sentence and see how fast you look for other people of your kind! Nice living in your word I bet:( 

  • austriacusaustriacus limaPosts: 611Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by issling
    Originally posted by immodium

    What I find unusual is why someone would play a game and think "I need to get my sexual orientation/religious/political views involved somehow"

    Because if we don't we end up in a guild where they just talk shit about us not even knowing where in the same guild. Have you even thought about that!

    >To you and the other guy who said something similar, are you afraid of who you are? is it so hard to say "please, im (insert group) and what you are saying offends me, i would apreciate if you stop talking like that"

    IF the guild responds in a bad way....well, it wasnt a good guild to begin with.

  • isslingissling San Francisco, CAPosts: 157Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by austriacus
    Originally posted by issling
    Originally posted by immodium

    What I find unusual is why someone would play a game and think "I need to get my sexual orientation/religious/political views involved somehow"

    Because if we don't we end up in a guild where they just talk shit about us not even knowing where in the same guild. Have you even thought about that!

    >To you and the other guy who said something similar, are you afraid of who you are? is it so hard to say "please, im (insert group) and what you are saying offends me, i would apreciate if you stop talking like that"

    IF the guild responds in a bad way....well, it wasnt a good guild to begin with.

    Really that's your answer? So I'm afraid of who I am and have to listen to these post once again. I have been listening to this stuff since I was in third grade and I am afraid of who I am nice way to sum us up. 

  • IcewhiteIcewhite Elmhurst, ILPosts: 6,403Member

    The problem with politicizing your agendas is you subsequently lose any sense of humor.

    It gets tiresome as hell, tippy-toeing around the eggshells that people insist on strewing in every path.

    Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  • austriacusaustriacus limaPosts: 611Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by issling
    Originally posted by austriacus
    Originally posted by issling
    Originally posted by immodium

    What I find unusual is why someone would play a game and think "I need to get my sexual orientation/religious/political views involved somehow"

    Because if we don't we end up in a guild where they just talk shit about us not even knowing where in the same guild. Have you even thought about that!

    >To you and the other guy who said something similar, are you afraid of who you are? is it so hard to say "please, im (insert group) and what you are saying offends me, i would apreciate if you stop talking like that"

    IF the guild responds in a bad way....well, it wasnt a good guild to begin with.

    Really that's your answer? So I'm afraid of who I am and have to listen to these post once again. I have been listening to this stuff since I was in third grade and I am afraid of who I am nice way to sum us up. 

    Then why dont you tell people who you are and that you arent comfortable with them talking like that, its better than listening to them. Make it clear to them, stop listening in silence(thats the kind of thing your post seems to say you are doing).

  • isslingissling San Francisco, CAPosts: 157Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Icewhite

    The problem with politicizing your agendas is you subsequently lose any sense of humor.

    It gets tiresome as hell, tippy-toeing around the eggshells that people insist on strewing in every path.

    I think the OP's Topic is Troll Bait! There was no agenda on anybody's part other then his or hers. There are different kinds of guides out there and that is all there is to it:) 

  • KhalathwyrKhalathwyr Denton, TXPosts: 3,138Member
    Originally posted by Icewhite

    The problem with politicizing your agendas is you subsequently lose any sense of humor.

    It gets tiresome as hell, tippy-toeing around the eggshells that people insist on strewing in every path.

    Then find new material to make jokes from?

    Seriously there are a plethora of jokes for people that are not white/male/heterosexual. So that would be a great place to start (WMH) one could start testing their humor to see if it broke any eggshells.

    Thus, to is why there are these types of guilds. The WMHs don't have to worry about (those that even think about it that is) stepping on eggshells and those in the possibly offended groups don't have to listen to their crap.

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  • LoktofeitLoktofeit Stone Mountain, GAPosts: 13,674Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Xssiv
    Originally posted by immodium

    What I find unusual is why someone would play a game and think "I need to get my sexual orientation/religious/political views involved somehow"

    I don't think they are trying to impose their views on people in game, they probably just want to hang with like-minded players.

    That seems to be the case. It's why they are usually advertised as "[interest]-friendly".

    There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
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  • isslingissling San Francisco, CAPosts: 157Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by austriacus
    Originally posted by issling
    Originally posted by austriacus
    Originally posted by issling
    Originally posted by immodium

    What I find unusual is why someone would play a game and think "I need to get my sexual orientation/religious/political views involved somehow"

    Because if we don't we end up in a guild where they just talk shit about us not even knowing where in the same guild. Have you even thought about that!

    >To you and the other guy who said something similar, are you afraid of who you are? is it so hard to say "please, im (insert group) and what you are saying offends me, i would apreciate if you stop talking like that"

    IF the guild responds in a bad way....well, it wasnt a good guild to begin with.

    Really that's your answer? So I'm afraid of who I am and have to listen to these post once again. I have been listening to this stuff since I was in third grade and I am afraid of who I am nice way to sum us up. 

    Then why dont you tell people who you are and that you arent comfortable with them talking like that, its better than listening to them. Make it clear to them, stop listening in silence(thats the kind of thing your post seems to say you are doing).

    We do say something but its in people's nature to act this way. That's why we seek out like minded people and then we have to read topics that we are afraid of who we are and can't voice our selves and if we say something it all goes away. Just leave us alone for god sakes. We have no agenda and just want to game like the rest of you.

  • LoktofeitLoktofeit Stone Mountain, GAPosts: 13,674Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by issling
    Originally posted by austriacus
    Originally posted by issling
    Originally posted by immodium

    What I find unusual is why someone would play a game and think "I need to get my sexual orientation/religious/political views involved somehow"

    Because if we don't we end up in a guild where they just talk shit about us not even knowing where in the same guild. Have you even thought about that!

    >To you and the other guy who said something similar, are you afraid of who you are? is it so hard to say "please, im (insert group) and what you are saying offends me, i would apreciate if you stop talking like that"

    IF the guild responds in a bad way....well, it wasnt a good guild to begin with.

    Really that's your answer? So I'm afraid of who I am and have to listen to these post once again. I have been listening to this stuff since I was in third grade and I am afraid of who I am nice way to sum us up. 

    I have to agree here. Gamers don't really have a track record for tolerance of other people's views, so that approach would more than likely just make it an uncomfortable environment for more people than just the one who's views are being ridiculed or under fire.

    I'm hoping the  "are you afraid of who you are" thing was simply a passive aggressive poke, and not just total cluelessness on his/her part.

     

     

    There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
    "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre

  • evilastroevilastro EdinburghPosts: 4,270Member
    Its a bit unfair to group those two together as well. LGBT guilds do not exclude heterosexuals, they just ask that they be respectful. Most of my MMO experience has been in EQ1 and EQ2 raiding guilds and no one cared about my sexual orientation, but EQ has always had more mature players in general. Not everyone is as assertive as me though and I can understand the need for people to hang out in an accepting community during their downtime from real life, especially in social games like MMOs which are conductive to chatting. I don't really expect any heterosexuals to understand fully or be able to empathise because you do not have to justify or hide the way you were born on a daily basis. And we all know the internet brings out the inner troll in many people.
  • NagelRitterNagelRitter fewefw, CTPosts: 607Member

    While I have not myself been a member of one of these, I can definitely understand why they exist. In a similar vein, I can understand why women-only guilds and groups exist. These groups are often an afterthought in gaming communities, sometimes even something negative. The average gamer is expected to be white, male, straight, and an atheist. Little consideration is given for people who do not fit that bill. Jokes about "fags", about rape are commonplace. It's normal to openly deride religion. Some people get tired of such things and want a refuge from them, especially since they may be playing a video game exactly for that reason - to get away from all the garbage.

    One may ask, why not simply make a guild where people are mature and behave. That is really not an easy task at all. I've seen some very strange results when such attempts were made. Who defines where the line is? I've been a guild leader, myself, it's very hard to police people to behave; players can get defensive very quickly if you mention that their remarks are inappropriate, comments about being "PC" and lacking a sense of humor are bound to happen. Nor is there any reason for people you want to come to your guild per se: again, everyone has a different idea of what mature behavior is.

    This is a simpler method. Openly mark your guild as LGBT-friendly or Christianity-friendly, all others need not apply, and most of the people you don't want will stay very far away from your guild.

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  • BatCakezBatCakez None O''ya Business, CAPosts: 127Member
    Who cares? Honestly, it's their community and their entertainment time. They can choose to use it however they wish. So long as I'm not playing an MMO and being chased by a bible thumper, hey, I'm fully supportive.
This discussion has been closed.