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  • XthosXthos Columbus, OHPosts: 2,628Member
    Originally posted by Grailer
    Originally posted by Iadien
    Originally posted by Grailer

    I don't think any MMO even EQNext will provide enough content for players like me who rush to end game and play 24/7

     

    I'm not alone in this because we all know someone is going to post how they got max level in 2 days and that there is no end game content .

     

    They talk about how they are going to make something different but I just cant see how it could be done without creating a boring NW foundry type game which we know will fail .

    Smedley agrees with you! http://www.polygon.com/2012/12/18/3777814/planetside-2-is-just-the-start-of-sony-online-entertainments-free

    "Our opinion is that today's MMOs, and I'd include ours in that mix, are stagnant and stuck in this model that we frankly helped create with EverQuest, where we put new content in the game, and they go through it at an incredibly fast rate because of sites like Thottbot and that kind of stuff," Smedley said."

    "We need to change the way we do this," Smedley said. "We're building a sandbox and giving players the tools to help shape the world that they're in. That's the direction we're going in with EverQuest Next; trying to make a world that players create while being a living, breathing world around them. It's not just a prop for them to walk around in, which is really what all of today's MMOs are. Their worlds are nothing more than a movie set."

    This doesn't make sense .  Is he saying they aren't giving us a game but the tools to make a game ? Or is the game making the game ?

     

     

    What would really make you think from reading that, that they weren't giving you a game?  You will get a game, how much players can shape/create/change the game we will have to see.

     

    Everyone has to wait till August 2-3-4 to find out information, and then supposedly information will come out fast, and their will be a lot of interaction.  I would expect a beta date or time frame to probably be announced and not that far off the reveal.  No sense in taking something out of the black box, if you are not going to be ready to release within 4-6 months total.

     

    If it was going to be longer, I would think they would keep it in the box, and had a reveal later imo.

     

  • nerovipus32nerovipus32 dublinPosts: 2,735Member
    Provide proper game features and mechanics and you'll never run out of content. if the game is a loot whore based game you'll never be able to created enough content to keep the locusts happy. The world and other players are your content not some stupid instanced raid boss.
  • EQN13EQN13 huntsville, ALPosts: 11Member

    racing through a game to get max level is so useless. You miss 90% of the content the game offers. 

    people like you get max level then complain that you have nothing to do.

    Most people have a life that includes responsibilities: a  Job,  house payments, bills, kids. 

    [mod edit]

  • hockeyplayrhockeyplayr Middlesex, NJPosts: 604Member Uncommon
    If it is a sandbox, the amount of stuff you have to do is what you make of it.  Played rs for 5 years and always had something to do
  • WizardryWizardry Ontario, CanadaPosts: 8,454Member Uncommon

    It is not all about content,it is about game design and so far SOE EQ team does NOT get it.

    IMO there may be more to it,perhaps they do get it but don't care.Maybe they are just operating like a business trying to make money and do it quickly and cost effectively.

    Example,they could have made crafting a lot more in depth as it started,but they chose to stream line it down and make it faster.So why would they do that?Why would  they create linear questing that easily pushes players forward?I think they are i mentioned as well as catering to the hand holding,they figure,just let the players have it easy and they will come back.

    look how often you would go out and have all your bags full of crap loot from just a couple hours of playing.They again figure,just give them lots of loot and that will keep them happy,again give them stuff easy.Also lots of loot supports our cash shop idea of forcing players  to upgrade bag space.

    I would much rather have some puzzled content added into MUCH fewer quests.I want to see a quest that is so long and so well laid out,you get a nice choice of loot.

    I also want to see a better game world example,i want to see the first developer to bring us an eco system.I know in EQ2 they have mobs fighting each other sometimes but there seems to be no purpose to it.Have mobs die and not re spawn for a very long time.The same for harvesting,most of the harvesting items should come from the creatures,so if they are inside an Eco system,they become valuable resources not just hubs for completing linear quests.


    Samoan Diamond

  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDPosts: 16,912Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by BearKnight
    Originally posted by Grailer

    I don't think any MMO even EQNext will provide enough content for players like me who rush to end game and play 24/7

     

    I'm not alone in this because we all know someone is going to post how they got max level in 2 days and that there is no end game content .

     

    They talk about how they are going to make something different but I just cant see how it could be done without creating a boring NW foundry type game which we know will fail .

    You've never played a true Sandbox title then.

     

    Sandboxes do NOT suffer from "Developer Driven Content" like Themepark titles do. 

     

    Sandbox = developers focus on mechanics & tools to interact with each other and the gameworld. 

     

    Themepark = developers focus on handcrafting scripted events & quests for people to "burn through".

     

    You're wrong :)

    Exactly... Content is nothing more than filler in a sandbox game, the beef of the game is the way in which players shape the world.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

    It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  • TamanousTamanous Edmonton, ABPosts: 2,126Member Uncommon
    I think someone has missed the point.

    You stay sassy!

  • waynejr2waynejr2 West Toluca Lake, CAPosts: 4,476Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by craftseeker
    Originally posted by swedago
    Originally posted by Grailer

    I don't think any MMO even EQNext will provide enough content for players like me who rush to end game and play 24/7

    I'm not alone in this because we all know someone is going to post how they got max level in 2 days and that there is no end game content .

    They talk about how they are going to make something different but I just cant see how it could be done without creating a boring NW foundry type game which we know will fail .

    This is definitely one of the most moronic posts I have seen all month.

    Yep, but he has at least one truth in there.  Some moron (probably many morons) is going to post how they got to max level in 2 days and there is no end game content. 

    .....and I will laugh my socks off at their stupidity.

    PS It may very well be Grailer making one of those posts.

    Running around in a circle as a sandbox feature would also never end.  Doesn't make it special.

  • MukeMuke BredaPosts: 2,172Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Grailer

    I don't think any MMO even EQNext will provide enough content for players like me who rush to end game and play 24/7

     

    I'm not alone in this because we all know someone is going to post how they got max level in 2 days and that there is no end game content .

     

    They talk about how they are going to make something different but I just cant see how it could be done without creating a boring NW foundry type game which we know will fail .

    Fun, a review before the game is even released, yet even before ingame footage or ingame movies have been released.

     

    "going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"

  • DonVadimDonVadim OpolePosts: 45Member

    http://www.tibia.com/

    Contaminated with bots, however try to find a single player who reached max player or ran out of content to do.

  • GrailerGrailer HamiltonPosts: 876Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by DonVadim

    http://www.tibia.com/

    Contaminated with bots, however try to find a single player who reached max player or ran out of content to do.

    yeah that game was awesome but the graphics are a bit outdated these days .

    they don't make games like that anymore  :(

  • IadienIadien Charleston, WVPosts: 638Member
    Originally posted by EQN13

    racing through a game to get max level is so useless. You miss 90% of the content the game offers.

    Making assumptions... never a good idea.

  • itchmonitchmon west islip, NYPosts: 1,714Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Grailer
    End game is all about getting best loot & highest level or skill possible while beating the hardest bosses the game has.
     

    YOUR endgame is all about getting best loot & highest level or skill possible while beating the hardest bosses the game has

     

    that isnt everyone's endgame, it isnt the endgame of most sandboxes and i dont believe its the endgame of EQN.

     

    Play eve and you will experience a COMPLETELY different endgame, and in eve try as you may you cannot literally cannot rush to endgame, because your "exp" is on a timer rather than tuned to how much time you spend playing or overplaying.  Or a game like DF where your loot is temporary to say the least, so loot acquisition takes on a completely new meaning.  Eve's skill gain throttling might actually be a good thing for someone who admittedly plays too much (taking your first post into consideration)

     

    i think people like the OP have inadvertently brought about the dying off of games where the endgame is like the one in quotes.  it obviously takes a lot longer to create a dungeon than it does a group of 24 people who do nothing but play to finish it and begin to whine over not having any content.

     

    (not that i have a problem with people who are disabled and cant do much.  obviously if a game brings you escape and enjoyment from a painful condition please play.  but there is still such a thing as too much playing am i right??)

     

    it should occur to people who whine about content no matter how promptly it is released that the problem with this system might lie with the player instead of the developer.

     

    or, the OP is trolling in which case i tip my hat.

     

    RIP Ribbitribbitt you are missed, kid.

    Currently Playing EVE, DFUW

    Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed.

    Dwight D Eisenhower

    My optimism wears heavy boots and is loud.

    Henry Rollins

  • HrimnirHrimnir Qeynos, COPosts: 1,597Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by William12
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
     
     
    Originally posted by Raunu
    Originally posted by Grailer

    I don't think any MMO even EQNext will provide enough content for players like me who rush to end game and play 24/7

     

    I'm not alone in this because we all know someone is going to post how they got max level in 2 days and that there is no end game content .

     

    They talk about how they are going to make something different but I just cant see how it could be done without creating a boring NW foundry type game which we know will fail .

    No MMO will ever provide enough content for players who like to rush to the end and play 24/7. This is a problem with every MMO that comes out and will continue to be a problem until the end of time.

    Wasnt a problem in EQ1, never became a problem.  The whole idea of "end game" was part of WOW.  When leveling times are literally 500+ hours to get to max, people stop trying to rush to 60 or whatevre the cap is and they enjoy the path along the way.

    The reality is no developer has the balls to do it that way and tell the customers to take it or leave it.  I honestly bet if the rest of the game was good, well made, etc, more people would take it then leave it.

     

     

    Don't think you ever played EQ1 :)  There were end game guilds raiding fear years before wow came out.  EQ had an end game it just wasn't a race it was a marathon lol.

    I played a paladin named Kutark Validus on Mithaniel Marr, and was friends with people in Afterlife, you can look that up on eqplayers if you dont believe me.  Trust me, i know exactly what kind of "end game" raiding guilds there were.

    What you're not getting is that the "IDEA" of an "End Game" did NOT exist prior to WOW.  Nobody ever used that terminology.  You never saw people who were just trying to rush to max level until they got very close to max level.  Yeah, people who were say lev 54 would spend all their time trying to get to 60 as soon as possible because they were actually reasonably close to max level and it was a badge of honor in those days.

    The reason for this is just about everything you did got you a reasonable amount of XP.  There wasn't one pre determined BEST path of leveling like they had in WOW.  Because of that you didnt feel like you were wasting your time by beating your way to the end of some bear cave you happened to stumble upon while out exploring.

    "The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."

    - Friedrich Nietzsche

  • GrailerGrailer HamiltonPosts: 876Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by William12
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
     
     
    Originally posted by Raunu
    Originally posted by Grailer

    I don't think any MMO even EQNext will provide enough content for players like me who rush to end game and play 24/7

     

    I'm not alone in this because we all know someone is going to post how they got max level in 2 days and that there is no end game content .

     

    They talk about how they are going to make something different but I just cant see how it could be done without creating a boring NW foundry type game which we know will fail .

    No MMO will ever provide enough content for players who like to rush to the end and play 24/7. This is a problem with every MMO that comes out and will continue to be a problem until the end of time.

    Wasnt a problem in EQ1, never became a problem.  The whole idea of "end game" was part of WOW.  When leveling times are literally 500+ hours to get to max, people stop trying to rush to 60 or whatevre the cap is and they enjoy the path along the way.

    The reality is no developer has the balls to do it that way and tell the customers to take it or leave it.  I honestly bet if the rest of the game was good, well made, etc, more people would take it then leave it.

     

     

    Don't think you ever played EQ1 :)  There were end game guilds raiding fear years before wow came out.  EQ had an end game it just wasn't a race it was a marathon lol.

    I played a paladin named Kutark Validus on Mithaniel Marr, and was friends with people in Afterlife, you can look that up on eqplayers if you dont believe me.  Trust me, i know exactly what kind of "end game" raiding guilds there were.

    What you're not getting is that the "IDEA" of an "End Game" did NOT exist prior to WOW.  Nobody ever used that terminology.  You never saw people who were just trying to rush to max level until they got very close to max level.  Yeah, people who were say lev 54 would spend all their time trying to get to 60 as soon as possible because they were actually reasonably close to max level and it was a badge of honor in those days.

    The reason for this is just about everything you did got you a reasonable amount of XP.  There wasn't one pre determined BEST path of leveling like they had in WOW.  Because of that you didnt feel like you were wasting your time by beating your way to the end of some bear cave you happened to stumble upon while out exploring.

    End Game in Ultima Online is quite hard to determine because it was a sandbox . But because of the dynamic skill and stat system it was always evolving over the 3 years I played UO before they nerfed pvp .

     

    I think End game began in games like EQ where you had to level your character to max . Then you raid bosses for gear basically .

    While I do experience almost all the content while levelling because I play more than the average gamer I will plow through a months content in days . Funny enough there have always been more people that play more than me even . Usually at least 100 people will be ahead of me in levelling . In WoW I was in the top raiding guilds usually because I was highest level before most other players .

     

    Sadly we looked upon casual players as noobs because by the time they got to end game we were masters at it and they were "noobs" .

     

     

  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Posts: 5,316Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Grailer

    I don't think any MMO even EQNext will provide enough content for players like me who rush to end game and play 24/7

     

    I'm not alone in this because we all know someone is going to post how they got max level in 2 days and that there is no end game content .

     

    They talk about how they are going to make something different but I just cant see how it could be done without creating a boring NW foundry type game which we know will fail .

     Interesting.

    So you like to rush to end-game, skipping all the extra content that is there (side-quests, puzzles, crafting...) and then complain there is not enough content?

    Ya I don't feel sorry for you.  You brought this on yourself by... wait for it... skipping the content.

    Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  • WaterlilyWaterlily parisPosts: 2,973Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by VengeSunsoar

     Interesting.

    So you like to rush to end-game, skipping all the extra content that is there (side-quests, puzzles, crafting...) and then complain there is not enough content?

    Ya I don't feel sorry for you.  You brought this on yourself by... wait for it... skipping the content.

    this is such a tired excuse, many people in MMO are progression players

    almost all current EQ players are purely progression players, they're not going to slow down just because there is not enough content, you might as well not play a progression game then

  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Posts: 5,316Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Waterlily
    Originally posted by VengeSunsoar

     Interesting.

    So you like to rush to end-game, skipping all the extra content that is there (side-quests, puzzles, crafting...) and then complain there is not enough content?

    Ya I don't feel sorry for you.  You brought this on yourself by... wait for it... skipping the content.

    this is such a tired excuse, many people in MMO are progression players

    almost all current EQ players are purely progression players, they're not going to slow down just because there is not enough content, you might as well not play a progression game then

     It's not a tired excuse at all.

    There could be a tonne of content.  Some one deliberately choosing not to do the content that is available, deliberately choosing to ignore that content and rush to endgame IMO has no right to talk about lack of content.  It was there choice to rush. 

    You can't on one hand ask why there is no content, then on the other hand choose not to do the content thats available.  

    YOu make a choice, you live with the consequences of that choice.

    I like to progress too. I recognize that if I rush to the end I have no one to blame for lack of content but myself.. because I rushed.

    Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  • GrailerGrailer HamiltonPosts: 876Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by VengeSunsoar
    Originally posted by Waterlily
    Originally posted by VengeSunsoar

     Interesting.

    So you like to rush to end-game, skipping all the extra content that is there (side-quests, puzzles, crafting...) and then complain there is not enough content?

    Ya I don't feel sorry for you.  You brought this on yourself by... wait for it... skipping the content.

    this is such a tired excuse, many people in MMO are progression players

    almost all current EQ players are purely progression players, they're not going to slow down just because there is not enough content, you might as well not play a progression game then

     It's not a tired excuse at all.

    There could be a tonne of content.  Some one deliberately choosing not to do the content that is available, deliberately choosing to ignore that content and rush to endgame IMO has no right to talk about lack of content.  It was there choice to rush. 

    You can't on one hand ask why there is no content, then on the other hand choose not to do the content thats available.  

    YOu make a choice, you live with the consequences of that choice.

    I like to progress too. I recognize that if I rush to the end I have no one to blame for lack of content but myself.. because I rushed.

    poor game design if they create content that is useless after a few levels .

    Crafting is the most useless time sink ever created unless the items actually break and you need to make that ubersword more than once . Otherwise its always better to get materials and pay a fee to someone else .

    PvP time sink to get gear or points to obtain gear .

    Raiding end game usually time lock out to stop players like myself getting best gear in 1 week .

    Most content in the game is kill X or get Y to get xp or loot .  Not much will change in EQNext because there isn't really another way to do this in RPG  ( well there is but that would require spending a lot more development time and money to make quests really amazing and interesting )

     

     

    Sandboxes like minecraft were really fun , the problem was it got too easy after a while because you got the best armor and basically built traps to trap monsters for fun , they were no threat basically and thus no challenge .

     

     

     

  • DavisFlightDavisFlight Talahasee, FLPosts: 2,556Member
    Originally posted by Grailer

    I don't think any MMO even EQNext will provide enough content for players like me who rush to end game and play 24/7

     

    I'm not alone in this because we all know someone is going to post how they got max level in 2 days and that there is no end game content .

     

    They talk about how they are going to make something different but I just cant see how it could be done without creating a boring NW foundry type game which we know will fail .

    If the game is designed so that there is a linear path of "content" to the "end game" then this won't be worth playing anyway, so nothing lost.

  • hMJemhMJem Marysville, WAPosts: 465Member
    Originally posted by Vunak23
    Sandboxes don't have endgame. Go back to WoW. 

    I don't really like this statement.

     

    Why should people get punished for playing a game they like? If people want to play 4-8 hours everyday, let them.

     

    In fact, developers should be proud players want to play their games that often. So there should be something for them to do.

     

    I mean, it's fair logic. If you get to max level and there is nothing to do (EVEN IN A SANDBOX TITLE) then eventually everyone is going to get to that max level and see there is nothing to do. 

  • evilastroevilastro EdinburghPosts: 4,270Member
    Originally posted by hMJem
    Originally posted by Vunak23
    Sandboxes don't have endgame. Go back to WoW. 

    I don't really like this statement.

     

    Why should people get punished for playing a game they like? If people want to play 4-8 hours everyday, let them.

     

    In fact, developers should be proud players want to play their games that often. So there should be something for them to do.

     

    I mean, it's fair logic. If you get to max level and there is nothing to do (EVEN IN A SANDBOX TITLE) then eventually everyone is going to get to that max level and see there is nothing to do. 

    The point is that there is plenty to do in sandboxes. You shape the world around you. There is no traditional 'end game' though. You won't be rushing to max level then grinding raid bosses for gear if its a true sandbox.

  • hMJemhMJem Marysville, WAPosts: 465Member
    Originally posted by evilastro
    Originally posted by hMJem
    Originally posted by Vunak23
    Sandboxes don't have endgame. Go back to WoW. 

    I don't really like this statement.

     

    Why should people get punished for playing a game they like? If people want to play 4-8 hours everyday, let them.

     

    In fact, developers should be proud players want to play their games that often. So there should be something for them to do.

     

    I mean, it's fair logic. If you get to max level and there is nothing to do (EVEN IN A SANDBOX TITLE) then eventually everyone is going to get to that max level and see there is nothing to do. 

    The point is that there is plenty to do in sandboxes. You shape the world around you. There is no traditional 'end game' though. You won't be rushing to max level then grinding raid bosses for gear if its a true sandbox.

    What if said player doesn't enjoy building houses? So he's just doing PvE faction quests, potentially ganking players, and casting spells to destroy the game world?

     

    If #2 and #3 happen then he has something to do. But if its a game that is protecting its players, than what does he have to do?

  • GrailerGrailer HamiltonPosts: 876Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by hMJem
    Originally posted by evilastro
    Originally posted by hMJem
    Originally posted by Vunak23
    Sandboxes don't have endgame. Go back to WoW. 

    I don't really like this statement.

     

    Why should people get punished for playing a game they like? If people want to play 4-8 hours everyday, let them.

     

    In fact, developers should be proud players want to play their games that often. So there should be something for them to do.

     

    I mean, it's fair logic. If you get to max level and there is nothing to do (EVEN IN A SANDBOX TITLE) then eventually everyone is going to get to that max level and see there is nothing to do. 

    The point is that there is plenty to do in sandboxes. You shape the world around you. There is no traditional 'end game' though. You won't be rushing to max level then grinding raid bosses for gear if its a true sandbox.

    What if said player doesn't enjoy building houses? So he's just doing PvE faction quests, potentially ganking players, and casting spells to destroy the game world?

     

    If #2 and #3 happen then he has something to do. But if its a game that is protecting its players, than what does he have to do?

    Well like I said , there won't be enough content in EQNext , it' sounds like its going to be all player created and if we have to rely on player created content then I cant see this game being successful long term especially after experiencing Neverwinter's foundry .

    Without the carrot there is no motivation .  

  • XasapisXasapis VolosPosts: 5,561Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Grailer
    Originally posted by hMJem
    Originally posted by evilastro
    Originally posted by hMJem
    Originally posted by Vunak23
    Sandboxes don't have endgame. Go back to WoW. 

    I don't really like this statement.

     

    Why should people get punished for playing a game they like? If people want to play 4-8 hours everyday, let them.

     

    In fact, developers should be proud players want to play their games that often. So there should be something for them to do.

     

    I mean, it's fair logic. If you get to max level and there is nothing to do (EVEN IN A SANDBOX TITLE) then eventually everyone is going to get to that max level and see there is nothing to do. 

    The point is that there is plenty to do in sandboxes. You shape the world around you. There is no traditional 'end game' though. You won't be rushing to max level then grinding raid bosses for gear if its a true sandbox.

    What if said player doesn't enjoy building houses? So he's just doing PvE faction quests, potentially ganking players, and casting spells to destroy the game world?

     

    If #2 and #3 happen then he has something to do. But if its a game that is protecting its players, than what does he have to do?

    Well like I said , there won't be enough content in EQNext , it' sounds like its going to be all player created and if we have to rely on player created content then I cant see this game being successful long term especially after experiencing Neverwinter's foundry .

    Without the carrot there is no motivation .  

    I don't know. Is there not enough content in PS2?

    There is an artificial maximum level (BR100), but the game keeps going and ignoring it once you reach it. You don't even get anything particularly useful for doing so.

    Is unlocking all the weapons the completion of the game? Grabbing all the continents for your empire? Getting all auraxium medals?

    Sure, all these are targets that you can artificially set for yourself, but in the end, these are goals that you set for you, not the game sets for you.

    If EQN is anything like PS2, then the longevity will indeed be longer than most mmorpg titles these days. Even if the people that are spoon fed "goals" and "achievements" all these years may dismiss the game because "it will have no purpose".

     

    It would be saner to know a bit more about the game, before commenting on the actual content anyway.

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