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Do you guys ever feel guilty for playing F2P MMOS and not spending a dime?

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  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by TheHavok

    Sure, you can spend nothing. But don't complain when that company falls on hard times. Don't complain when fewer and fewer games start to be published. Why not support the games that give you enjoyment?

    Because whales are doing that just fine, and there are more important things to spend money on than F2P MMOs?

  • whisperwyndwhisperwynd montreal, QCPosts: 1,479Member
    Originally posted by Doogiehowser
    Originally posted by whisperwynd

     Nope.

    And guilt should not be felt at all here. Why not spend your paycheck on World Vision or Unicef or charities like that if your conscience is bothering you.

    Real issues of the world take a back seat but those poor devs offering a free game where, and this is the kicker...should you wish to, spend real money to buy something and support them to your heart's content is worthy of guilt for those not buying anything?!

     Why not just come out and say to those who pay nothing, "Shame on you, you selfish ingrates!" because in the end, are you really trying to gauge what posters here think to assuage your own feelings or is it a confirmation of an already established conviction?!

    Morally aware indeed...

     

    And you know how i don't do my part with real issues in the world? you don't know me and i have no reason to plug my contribution to social causes here on gaming forums.

    I see that you love to assume a lot about people. My reply about being more morally aware has nothing to do with calling you a selfish ingrates. If that is how you felt then i can assure you the problem is with you , don't try to project your own thoughts on me and try to twist the meaning of my post. No idea why you are so bitter though.

     Then pray explain what you meant by 'Morally aware' if not to disassociate yourself from those opposite of that?

    I don't assume anything, i go with what is there. If you wish not to be called out on something, define it better then there wouldn't be any misunderstandings. I can respect one's point of view even if i don't agree with it. Just be concise.

     My 'problem' is seeing people seemingly present themselves or their ideals as the only viable way to be. The world is too diverse to be have only one way of being, thinking, acting. If that's really what you weren't doing then of course I apologize. Understand though that it can be construed as such.

    I'm not bitter. I love a good discussion, so long as it doesn't degrade into squabbles and condescension.

     

  • rojoArcueidrojoArcueid hell, NJPosts: 6,787Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Loke666

    Just vote with your money. If you love something but never pay anything you don't really have the right to complain if they change it or close it down.

    Nah .. there is free speech in this country. You always have the right to whine, but the devs have the right to ignore you.

    then why is Justin Carter still in jail facing up to 8 years in prison for a bad joke comment on facebook? The FoS is quickly fading away in this country. We started to see beginnings of dictatorship for a while now.

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  • CalibanvovCalibanvov Fuquay Varina, NCPosts: 191Member

    I've been helping out Trion a lot between Rift and Defiance,  but I havnt paid for NW yet.  The $20 for a char slot, bag slot, is just too steep.

     

     

  • SnarlingWolfSnarlingWolf Thereiam, ARPosts: 2,697Member
    Originally posted by rojo6934
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Loke666

    Just vote with your money. If you love something but never pay anything you don't really have the right to complain if they change it or close it down.

    Nah .. there is free speech in this country. You always have the right to whine, but the devs have the right to ignore you.

    then why is Justin Carter still in jail facing up to 8 years in prison for a bad joke comment on facebook? The FoS is quickly fading away in this country. We started to see beginnings of dictatorship for a while now.

     Yes, someone threatening to shoot up a kindergarten and watch the blood rain down is someone we should all pity and should be used to represent the lack of free speech.

     

    Oh yeah, death threats are a serious thing and can result in being tossed in jail to protect others. Just thought you might want to know that. It would clearly be better to ignore all death threats because some moron doesn't know what not to joke about and allow all the more serious ones to end in someone's death instead.

     

    He's also currently in jail because he is awaiting trial where he could be proven innocent and let go. There is a bond option, he just can't afford it. But overall your statements show a gross misunderstanding of how laws work and an exaggeration that there is no FoS because of this one douche.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by rojo6934
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Loke666

    Just vote with your money. If you love something but never pay anything you don't really have the right to complain if they change it or close it down.

    Nah .. there is free speech in this country. You always have the right to whine, but the devs have the right to ignore you.

    then why is Justin Carter still in jail facing up to 8 years in prison for a bad joke comment on facebook? The FoS is quickly fading away in this country. We started to see beginnings of dictatorship for a while now.

    Because he didn't only whine about MMOs?

  • JemcrystalJemcrystal Champaign, ILPosts: 1,559Member Uncommon

     "Do you guys ever feel guilty for playing F2P MMOS and not spending a dime?"

     

    No guilt.  I think of f2p as an unlimited trial.  If I like what they have and they update often I will invest.  

    I might spend more on the f2p than what I would a p2p if I really like what they have - pets usually.

    I'm not a gambler so I don't pay for any "chance to have" items.  I refuse to buy anything limited with an expiration timer.  I will not play pay-to-advance games like Dungeons and Dragons Online even tho I loved that game to death.  In other words I had better be able to advance just as easily as a paying player does or I'll quit your f2p.

    I also will not use a credit card online for ANY reason.  No game card no purchases.


  • ZebladeZeblade Colorado Springs, COPosts: 926Member

    Lol now this is a funny thread.

    Shows how many have no clue what FREE TO PLAY means. These are not little kids were talking about. They are men and women working hard yes yet not one (that I know of) has ever wanted one person to feel guilty if you never spend a dime.

    One were talking REAL MONEY and guilt. We have over 25,000 children die each day and I know most of us never give it a second thought. So trust me the devs here will be ok.

    So expect something for your money.

  • nickster29nickster29 Holmen, WIPosts: 486Member

    If I spend money on a F2P game, it is because I have enjoyed the game and see myself continuing to enjoy the game.  If I do not spend money on a F2P game, it is because the game was bad and I do not bother to continue playing said game.

     

    If you really enjoy a F2P game and get a great deal of enjoyment out of it, support the company.  The employees have to get payed somehow.

  • DoogiehowserDoogiehowser ParisPosts: 1,873Member
    Originally posted by whisperwynd
    Originally posted by Doogiehowser
    Originally posted by whisperwynd

     Nope.

    And guilt should not be felt at all here. Why not spend your paycheck on World Vision or Unicef or charities like that if your conscience is bothering you.

    Real issues of the world take a back seat but those poor devs offering a free game where, and this is the kicker...should you wish to, spend real money to buy something and support them to your heart's content is worthy of guilt for those not buying anything?!

     Why not just come out and say to those who pay nothing, "Shame on you, you selfish ingrates!" because in the end, are you really trying to gauge what posters here think to assuage your own feelings or is it a confirmation of an already established conviction?!

    Morally aware indeed...

     

    And you know how i don't do my part with real issues in the world? you don't know me and i have no reason to plug my contribution to social causes here on gaming forums.

    I see that you love to assume a lot about people. My reply about being more morally aware has nothing to do with calling you a selfish ingrates. If that is how you felt then i can assure you the problem is with you , don't try to project your own thoughts on me and try to twist the meaning of my post. No idea why you are so bitter though.

     Then pray explain what you meant by 'Morally aware' if not to disassociate yourself from those opposite of that?

    I don't assume anything, i go with what is there. If you wish not to be called out on something, define it better then there wouldn't be any misunderstandings. I can respect one's point of view even if i don't agree with it. Just be concise.

     My 'problem' is seeing people seemingly present themselves or their ideals as the only viable way to be. The world is too diverse to be have only one way of being, thinking, acting. If that's really what you weren't doing then of course I apologize. Understand though that it can be construed as such.

    I'm not bitter. I love a good discussion, so long as it doesn't degrade into squabbles and condescension.

     

    You go with what? from those two words somehow you know me and about my personal life?

    I am on gaming forums talking about games. Please tell me why would i start talking about my contribution and involvements in social causes? 

    As far as being more morally aware, i already explained it in earlier post. For me i feel i am taking advantage of someones hard work by not contributing  as little as 15 bucks if i had thousands of hours of fun out of something. I would do the same for any other product whether it is games, music or movies. Everything is easily avilable for consumption and that too for free in this age of internet but if i enjoy something it is my way of saying thank you and supporting the hard work of people involved in making of these products.

    Way to overreact man and trying to twist my post into something it wasn't. Stop taking everything so damn personally. 

    "The problem is that the hardcore folks always want the same thing: 'We want exactly what you gave us before, but it has to be completely different.'
    -Jesse Schell

    "Online gamers are the most ludicrously entitled beings since Caligula made his horse a senator, and at least the horse never said anything stupid."
    -Luke McKinney

    image

  • whisperwyndwhisperwynd montreal, QCPosts: 1,479Member
    Originally posted by Doogiehowser

    You go with what? from those two words somehow you know me and about my personal life?

    I am on gaming forums talking about games. Please tell me why would i start talking about my contribution and involvements in social causes? 

    As far as being more morally aware, i already explained it in earlier post. For me i feel i am taking advantage of someones hard work by not contributing  as little as 15 bucks if i had thousands of hours of fun out of something. I would do the same for any other product whether it is games, music or movies. Everything is easily avilable for consumption and that too for free in this age of internet but if i enjoy something it is my way of saying thank you and supporting the hard work of people involved in making of these products.

    Way to overreact man and trying to twist my post into something it wasn't. Stop taking everything so damn personally. 

    First, nowhere did I request for you to explain about your contributions in social causes, way to read something not there. I don't care about your personal life, just what you posted about the guilt feeling towards F2P games.

    Second, saying you wish to pay back into a company because you feel they deserve it is fine. More than fine, you certainly did not need to add that it was because you were 'maybe morally aware'. Again, it can be seen as insulting to those who feel no guilt at not giving any money. Just saying. It does seem however that it is you overreacting here as I did not attack you and even apologized in the event that it wasn't a condescending remark on your part.

    Thirdly, I'm not taking it personal and did not twist anything you said. Hope this clarifies things.

    Cheers!

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by Doogiehowser

    As far as being more morally aware, i already explained it in earlier post. For me i feel i am taking advantage of someones hard work by not contributing  as little as 15 bucks if i had thousands of hours of fun out of something. I would do the same for any other product whether it is games, music or movies. Everything is easily avilable for consumption and that too for free in this age of internet but if i enjoy something it is my way of saying thank you and supporting the hard work of people involved in making of these products.

     

    I don't see a problem taking advantage of devs who want to give me free stuff. it is not like they are doing it out of the goodness of their hearts.

     

  • theAsnatheAsna AsnatownPosts: 321Member
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Doogiehowser

    As far as being more morally aware, i already explained it in earlier post. For me i feel i am taking advantage of someones hard work by not contributing  as little as 15 bucks if i had thousands of hours of fun out of something. I would do the same for any other product whether it is games, music or movies. Everything is easily avilable for consumption and that too for free in this age of internet but if i enjoy something it is my way of saying thank you and supporting the hard work of people involved in making of these products.

     

    I don't see a problem taking advantage of devs who want to give me free stuff. it is not like they are doing it out of the goodness of their hearts.

     

     

    There is a saying: "You get what you pay for".

  • furbansfurbans Tinbucktwo, IAPosts: 965Member

    Not at all because F2P games tend to dupe players all the time.  NW is a perfect example.  Founder's pack no way near qualified the price but people were buying em left n right because it had the Twarpzzit race or beta access.  Then there were massive amounts of chargebacks that mods had to make posts on in hopes to deter some chargebacks.  Then there was everywhere you looked it was Zen this Zen than or AD this AD that that was way too intrusive on a pos game.

    I have very low tolerance for games that use deceptive tactics to generate revenue where they charge you every little thing and it's become a Pay 2 Enjoy.

  • DrakynnDrakynn The Pas, MBPosts: 2,030Member
    Originally posted by theAsna
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Doogiehowser

    As far as being more morally aware, i already explained it in earlier post. For me i feel i am taking advantage of someones hard work by not contributing  as little as 15 bucks if i had thousands of hours of fun out of something. I would do the same for any other product whether it is games, music or movies. Everything is easily avilable for consumption and that too for free in this age of internet but if i enjoy something it is my way of saying thank you and supporting the hard work of people involved in making of these products.

     

    I don't see a problem taking advantage of devs who want to give me free stuff. it is not like they are doing it out of the goodness of their hearts.

     

     

    There is a saying: "You get what you pay for".

    Actually in this case he's getting what others pay for.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by Drakynn
    Originally posted by theAsna
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Doogiehowser

    As far as being more morally aware, i already explained it in earlier post. For me i feel i am taking advantage of someones hard work by not contributing  as little as 15 bucks if i had thousands of hours of fun out of something. I would do the same for any other product whether it is games, music or movies. Everything is easily avilable for consumption and that too for free in this age of internet but if i enjoy something it is my way of saying thank you and supporting the hard work of people involved in making of these products.

     

    I don't see a problem taking advantage of devs who want to give me free stuff. it is not like they are doing it out of the goodness of their hearts.

     

     

    There is a saying: "You get what you pay for".

    Actually in this case he's getting what others pay for.

    Exactly. I have my free fun. Whales have p2w. Devs have money. A win-win-win for all.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by furbans

    Not at all because F2P games tend to dupe players all the time.  NW is a perfect example.  Founder's pack no way near qualified the price but people were buying em left n right because it had the Twarpzzit race or beta access.  Then there were massive amounts of chargebacks that mods had to make posts on in hopes to deter some chargebacks.  Then there was everywhere you looked it was Zen this Zen than or AD this AD that that was way too intrusive on a pos game.

    I have very low tolerance for games that use deceptive tactics to generate revenue where they charge you every little thing and it's become a Pay 2 Enjoy.

    I would not want the word "dupe". It is not like they lie about the Twarpzzit race or beta access. If they can sell nothing for money, without lying, more power to them.

    Actually i play NWO a bit .. there is no need to pay even a dime to enjoy it.

     

  • sumdumguy1sumdumguy1 avondale, AZPosts: 962Member Uncommon
    I used to feel guilty until I saw how much some people spend in the stores.  They make more than their share of money a lot fo the time.  One game I played, a guy in my guild spend almost 1k in the game store.  I think the game was Long or something like that.
  • SeloSelo falkenbergPosts: 90Member

    most "f2p" games (not counting nw and non mmos like lol) are very competative oriented, like the browser mmos such as Wartune etc.

    To be competative in those, you need to spend thousand and thousand of dollars. Its quite insane.

    If anyone tried Business Tycoon Online, they had achievements for spending 100k dollars XD

  • ArglebargleArglebargle Austin, TXPosts: 1,419Member Uncommon

    In a ftp game, you are providing a valuable resource....you're part of the game's playerbase, helping them avoid the dreaded 'No one plays this any more...' complaint.   They should pay you...  ;)

     

    If I really like a ftp game, I will eventually spend something, to reward them for it being fun.  Especially if they don't have an abusive cash shop.

     

    If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.

  • Panther2103Panther2103 Edmonds, WAPosts: 2,365Member Uncommon
    It really depends. If I'm playing an F2P game that has an obnoxiously greedy cash shop, then no I will not feel guilty. It all depends on who made it and how much I play it and how the cash shop is set up. If it's pay to win, and I'm enjoying it and not needing to spend money then no I will not pay a dime on that and I won't feel any guilt whatsoever. If it's made by some indie company, and it's free, and I've spent countless hours in it, I'll most likely spend money because I feel like they need it, and they have earned it. The only way I will spend money in a pay to win game is if it is made by an indie company, and I've spent enough time playing it to know the game is worth it.
  • OG_ZorvanOG_Zorvan Fresno, CAPosts: 615Member
    Originally posted by SnarlingWolf
    Originally posted by rojo6934
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Loke666

    Just vote with your money. If you love something but never pay anything you don't really have the right to complain if they change it or close it down.

    Nah .. there is free speech in this country. You always have the right to whine, but the devs have the right to ignore you.

    then why is Justin Carter still in jail facing up to 8 years in prison for a bad joke comment on facebook? The FoS is quickly fading away in this country. We started to see beginnings of dictatorship for a while now.

     Yes, someone threatening to shoot up a kindergarten and watch the blood rain down is someone we should all pity and should be used to represent the lack of free speech.

     

    Oh yeah, death threats are a serious thing and can result in being tossed in jail to protect others. Just thought you might want to know that. It would clearly be better to ignore all death threats because some moron doesn't know what not to joke about and allow all the more serious ones to end in someone's death instead.

     

    He's also currently in jail because he is awaiting trial where he could be proven innocent and let go. There is a bond option, he just can't afford it. But overall your statements show a gross misunderstanding of how laws work and an exaggeration that there is no FoS because of this one douche.

    If all death threats are to be taken serious, than 3/4 of the Xbone Live userbase should be in jail by now.

    Followed by 3/4 of the internet populace in general.

     

    Originally posted by Murugan

    I think the people you should feel bad for are not the developers but the poor "whales" who subsidize your play by spending hundreds-thousands of dollars on virtual junk.

     

    These people are spending far more than they ever would have before in a P2P MMORPG just to get all the game has to offer.  Please google what being a "whale" in a "f2p" MMORPG really means.

     

    There are stories of wives spending all of their families money on pointless f2p crap, emptying out entire bank accounts.  Kids running up their parents credit card bills.  It is a serious problem, and I just wish the f2p community was more aware of it.

     

    These are people too, and you are hurting them with your support of a model that exploits them.  Now you may say they are just weak willed, but have a heart and try to remember when you could genuinely enjoy a virtual world.  Now imagine if someone had placed microtransactions at every turn to prevent you from playing how you wanted.  Maybe then you will understand how these poor souls are suckered into spending so much money in cash shops.

    I feel as bad for those "whales" as I do the idiots losing their houses and shirts next to me in the casino in Vegas, as I walk out after having spent my pre-determined and budgeted limit.

    As in, not at all.

    EA CEO John Riccitiello's on future microtransactions: "When you are six hours into playing Battlefield and you run out of ammo in your clip, and we ask you for a dollar to reload, you're really not very price sensitive at that point in time...We're not gouging, but we're charging."

  • TheHavokTheHavok San Jose, CAPosts: 2,399Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by TheHavok

    Sure, you can spend nothing. But don't complain when that company falls on hard times. Don't complain when fewer and fewer games start to be published. Why not support the games that give you enjoyment?

    Because whales are doing that just fine, and there are more important things to spend money on than F2P MMOs?

    This is incredibly short sighted.  This mentality forces producers to cater sales to the whales along with devs who make systems that cater to whales.  It only furthers the pay to win mentality which is bad for any game (unless you are a whale and want to have all the power).

  • TheMaahesTheMaahes Marlborough, MAPosts: 185Member
    Originally posted by Doogiehowser

    I have had thousands of hours worth of fun lately playing games like NW, STO and AION. More than i ever had while playing sub MMOS. But i felt bad for not spending a dime and felt really cheap and thought it is like taking advantage of someone's hard work.  After all these devs don't work for free and have bills to pay and their families to take care of. 

    Was i being selfish? cheap? (i did spend some money in cash shop of Aion and bought some zen for STO / NW just to show my support)

     

     

    I did feel guilty. I played LotR:O completely free for a number of months and gave them a donation afterwards because I felt it was completely unfair of me to do so.

  • Dixi01Dixi01 Cupertino, CAPosts: 31Member Uncommon

    Very rarely I think that "it could be nice to donate a little, since the game is good". But most of time I'm not completely satisfied by the game so the question about payment do not appear in my mind.

    I very rarely use payed services in F2P games. Usually none at all. Sometimes I pay once for skill respec or character transfer.

    In whole I miss good subscription based MMORPGs like in old times much more.

    In last years market is flooded by F2P games of less then average quality - and that's a problem.

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