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Does the combat get better?

MasterfuzzfuzzMasterfuzzfuzz United States, NCPosts: 169Member
My mage literally stands in front of monsters a full level or two above me and just spams 1111111111111111111111111111. and I win. And that's it. I'm level 10 but 10 levels of that garbage is pretty dumb. Does it ever change or will I always be able to cast 1 spell and win? This game feels like every other game I've played in the past 4 years, what makes it different?
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Comments

  • CalypsxCalypsx Brentwood, CAPosts: 38Member

    If you don't like it now, it's probably best to leave.

    I like the combat, but the game isn't for everyone, no game is for everyone, it's that simple.

    Yoshi himself even says "Everyone has their own preferences."  and understands not everyone will enjoy the game, because that is simply an unrealistic expectation. However people like myself and a few others do enjoy the combat and will be staying.

    There's a lot of mmorpgs on the market that might suit your needs. You can find numerous other titles on this very website to try if you consider the combat "garbage" in your words.

    The best part about mmorpgs is there's so many, there is a game out there for everyone. 

  • bigbudzbigbudz O Fallon, ILPosts: 52Member
    Keep hitting 1!

    Current PC Build

    http://pcpartpicker.com/b/p8RBD3


    Present: Current offerings are low quality or soloable

    Past:AoC, DCUO, FFXI,FFXIV 1.0 and ARR,WoW,Fallen Earth, Tabula Rasa, TSW, SWTOR, Rift, Aion, WAR, Darkfall, STO, CoH/CoV, GW2, Diaspora, EQ2, DDO, and a bunch of forgettable ftp games

  • aesperusaesperus Hamshire, NVPosts: 5,128Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Masterfuzzfuzz
    My mage literally stands in front of monsters a full level or two above me and just spams 1111111111111111111111111111. and I win. And that's it. I'm level 10 but 10 levels of that garbage is pretty dumb. Does it ever change or will I always be able to cast 1 spell and win? This game feels like every other game I've played in the past 4 years, what makes it different?

    Which mage r you talking about? In groups, that's basically how CNJ works (assuming 1 is your heal). Though you occasionally have to press 2 for Medica (AoE heal) and eventually get other things.

    For THM, if you are spamming 1 button, you are ABSOLUTELY doing it wrong. Even at the early lvls you will, at minimum, be pressing 2-3 buttons. The basic rotation =

    Spam Fire (your 1) until you're out of mana, swap stacks to Ice (if you have that skill); or start spamming blizzard until your MP is full again.

    In dungeons (lvl 15+) my rotation was basically:

    - sleep (if needed during the pull)

    - spam fire / fire II (depending on single target or AoE) until out of mana

    - transpose (converts fire/astral stacks to ice/umbral stacks) to start my mana regen

    - cast Blizzard / Blizzard II once to get the 2nd stack of umbral for increased regen

    - Cast Thunder/ Thunder II and Aero[CNJ] for dots (by then my mana is usually full)

    - go back to spamming Fire.

    Essentially the way this game works (with all classes), is that unlike most other MMOs, you're skills rarely ever become obscelete. They all serve a purpose, though some will become much less useful later on (i.e. Thunder & Thunder II stack for dmg, but later on you may want to stop using Thunder or Aero. By then you will also probably have BLM soul, so you're skills will change drastically).

    Because of this, the early lvls are extremely repetative, as you generally only have a few skills to use. The easiest way to change this, is to lvl up more than 1 class at the start, and use some of those subclass points to equip skills from other classes on your main. For example, on my THM I run cure, protect, aero, and raise for group support.

    Other than that..the basic combat dynamics don't change much, they just get more compound / complex. So if you hate the base dynamics, this just isn't the game for you.

  • MuruganMurugan D, COPosts: 1,494Member
    Originally posted by Masterfuzzfuzz
    My mage literally stands in front of monsters a full level or two above me and just spams 1111111111111111111111111111. and I win. And that's it. I'm level 10 but 10 levels of that garbage is pretty dumb. Does it ever change or will I always be able to cast 1 spell and win? This game feels like every other game I've played in the past 4 years, what makes it different?

    ARR is set in the Final Fantasy universe.  It tasks players with a storyline where you set out to save Eorzea from the Garlean empire, Bahamut, and other threats to its peaceful existence.  Adventurers as we are called are free to play any and every role, and pursue any ambition we choose. 

     

    From one day to the next they might be balancing the forces of reckless destruction and replenishment as a thaumaturge or mastering the transition between forms and exploiting weaknesses you create in your enemy as a Pugilist.  As we learn new skills many of them stay with us, able to be used to aid us when we try on another role.  As we advance in our mastery of a weapon we get the chance to take on a more defining and classic job. 

     

    This unique definition of jobs like Monk, Black mage, White Mage, Paladin etc. are balanced to rely on and thrive off of the strength of others.  This synergy comes in handy when we are fighting something we can't possibly handle alone, something which we are asked to do often.  As we are fighting together we gain access to a limit break which when used by a group member grants a protective wall to shield the group, raises all your dead allies, summons a meteor to devastate a large area, or a single focused attack to devastate one target.  Enemies are capable of a great many abilities and methods to try and prevent us from winning the battle, we have to constantly find ways to overcome them but that is where the fun is.

     

    Or in other words:

     

    LITERALLY you just stand there and press 111111111111111111111111111111111111111 until you win.  Literally that is all you do, all you ever do, one spell or ability is all you need.  Anyone who can't play this way is terrible at MMORPG's I mean we have been playing these games for literally 4 years now, get with the program.  Garbage, it's dumb, literally dumb garbage.  You'd hate it.

  • ZizouXZizouX Burbank, CAPosts: 670Member

    Oh How I wish I could show you guys some lvl 50 videos of my Warrior fighting lvl 47+ Sahagin.

     

    I've made videos for my linkshell friends under private settings on youtube, but I can't trust strangers that you would keep the videos private.   As soon as NDA is lifted... I will post videos.

     

    Lvl 50, I used every single ability, including cross class abilities.  The Abilities, compared to the weapon skills, are off the global cooldown, which means you're using abilities in between the global cooldown.  It's a lot of fun.  AS a warrior, I don't have directional attacks since tanking means hitting the mob head on.... but I can imagine using mnk and drg at 50 will require positioning and constant use of abilities to augment your skills.

     

    As soon as we get open beta... i will link the video.

  • Vector_ArrowVector_Arrow Los Angeles, CAPosts: 18Member
    Yes, it gets better. Once you're a higher level with access to more skills you'll find the spamming to go away. Anyone else who tells you otherwise is either lying to you or doesn't know what they're doing.
  • spikers14spikers14 las vegas, NVPosts: 362Member Uncommon

    Run into a swarm of agro mobs and tell me how well spamming 1 does for ya. If THM, have you attained Sleep yet? Try it, you may find it useful. Also, have you leveled any other class to acquire other abilities? Even at low levels you can accomplish this.

    Also, if you look at your skill book, it lists the skills you are going to get and at what level. You may want to look in there to see what future capabilities your class will have. 

    I have seen very few MMORPG's where you start with a full compliment of spells and/or talents. FFXIV is no different, but does add cross class skills to liven up the mix. 

  • wonkayangwonkayang sacramento, CAPosts: 4Member
    Originally posted by Masterfuzzfuzz
    My mage literally stands in front of monsters a full level or two above me and just spams 1111111111111111111111111111. and I win. And that's it. I'm level 10 but 10 levels of that garbage is pretty dumb. Does it ever change or will I always be able to cast 1 spell and win? This game feels like every other game I've played in the past 4 years, what makes it different?

    I think the game is only like that at the start. I mean ive only gotten to level 15 on my glad, but I already have to start watching how I use my tp. I just cant spam 1 move over and over ill run out of tp. I also have to choose what skill I want to use cause the glad has a mana regen skill but doesn't generate additional agro and some of his agro skill takes mana or high tp.

  • ZizouXZizouX Burbank, CAPosts: 670Member
    Originally posted by wonkayang
    Originally posted by Masterfuzzfuzz
    My mage literally stands in front of monsters a full level or two above me and just spams 1111111111111111111111111111. and I win. And that's it. I'm level 10 but 10 levels of that garbage is pretty dumb. Does it ever change or will I always be able to cast 1 spell and win? This game feels like every other game I've played in the past 4 years, what makes it different?

    I think the game is only like that at the start. I mean ive only gotten to level 15 on my glad, but I already have to start watching how I use my tp. I just cant spam 1 move over and over ill run out of tp. I also have to choose what skill I want to use cause the glad has a mana regen skill but doesn't generate additional agro and some of his agro skill takes mana or high tp.

    Take this idea by Wonkayang and multiple it x10 and you have an idea what things you have to weigh/balance at 50.... Now add cross class abilities....and harder content to boot.

  • neobahamut20neobahamut20 ste-julie, QCPosts: 336Member
    at level 30, it was still 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1

    Boycotting EA. Why? They suck, even moreso since 2008.

  • simsalabim77simsalabim77 Somewhere, CAPosts: 628Member Uncommon
    You get more buttons to press at 50. If you think having more buttons to press more often will make the combat more enjoyable, then yes, it gets better. 
  • wirawan1234wirawan1234 JakartaPosts: 8Member
    Originally posted by Masterfuzzfuzz
    My mage literally stands in front of monsters a full level or two above me and just spams 1111111111111111111111111111. and I win. And that's it. I'm level 10 but 10 levels of that garbage is pretty dumb. Does it ever change or will I always be able to cast 1 spell and win? This game feels like every other game I've played in the past 4 years, what makes it different?

    yep stil 111111, either you win or you die first 

  • drivendawndrivendawn montgomery, ALPosts: 1,253Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Masterfuzzfuzz
    My mage literally stands in front of monsters a full level or two above me and just spams 1111111111111111111111111111. and I win. And that's it. I'm level 10 but 10 levels of that garbage is pretty dumb. Does it ever change or will I always be able to cast 1 spell and win? This game feels like every other game I've played in the past 4 years, what makes it different?

    Lets put it this way if your in my party fighting a boss and we have to raise you for not getting out of aoe's or other mechanics all the time you would be kicked.  Also would be the same if you use only one skill over and over, making us have to pick up the slack for you.

  • HyanmenHyanmen KolkkalaPosts: 5,354Member Uncommon

    I can tell you the magic trick to these kind of opinions, if some of you are wondering.

    It's called "go in thinking it sucks - it will!"

    Also included in the handbook of "How to Not Enjoy Anything", written by Old Grumpy People

    "Housing is standard in most mmo's."
    - yolteotl79

  • simsalabim77simsalabim77 Somewhere, CAPosts: 628Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Hyanmen

    I can tell you the magic trick to these kind of opinions, if some of you are wondering.

    It's called "go in thinking it sucks - it will!"

    Also included in the handbook of "How to Not Enjoy Anything", written by Old Grumpy People

     

    I have a different theory. Hear me out, it's going to get a little crazy. 

    What if the player didn't actually enjoy pressing one button while doing mundane fetch/kill quests for the first several hours of the game? Now, I know that is extremely far fetched, but it IS another explanation. 

     

    Seriously though, the first several hours of ARR make a very poor first impression in terms of gameplay. If a player is completely new to the game, I could very easily see them turning their backs on the game within the first five or so hours. I can't say as though I completely blame them. I'm not really interested in "playing a game until it gets good" anymore. Pacing is one thing, but ARR really keeps the training wheels on for an excessive amount of time, and it leads to a very stale and off-putting experience(especially for folks who have been around this genre for awhile) until a good while later.  

  • VolgoreVolgore Posts: 2,212Member Uncommon

    Press 1 to kill stuff.

    If stuff doesn't die fast enough, press 1 harder.

    image
  • HyanmenHyanmen KolkkalaPosts: 5,354Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by simsalabim77

    I have a different theory. Hear me out, it's going to get a little crazy. 

    What if the player didn't actually enjoy pressing one button while doing mundane fetch/kill quests for the first several hours of the game? Now, I know that is extremely far fetched, but it IS another explanation. 

    Oh man, you might have something going on there!

    I have another theory to build off of yours.

    I don't actually enjoy that much driving a poor car in Gran Turismo 5 for the first few hours, nor doing the tutorials meant for new players.

    I don't actually enjoy that much fighting with a crowbar and a pistol with 5 ammo in Half-Life for the first few hours, fighting little critters and learning how to play an FPS.

    I don't let that hinder my enjoyment for the rest of the game, as I know this is how games are developed - to let new players get used to the mechanics at the start of the game, regardless of how important you think you are that the game should just throw you all it has from the get-go since you are elite pro MMO gamer enough.

    ITT: MMORPG teaches new players how to play, veterans are butthurt.

    "Housing is standard in most mmo's."
    - yolteotl79

  • simsalabim77simsalabim77 Somewhere, CAPosts: 628Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Hyanmen
    Originally posted by simsalabim77

    I have a different theory. Hear me out, it's going to get a little crazy. 

    What if the player didn't actually enjoy pressing one button while doing mundane fetch/kill quests for the first several hours of the game? Now, I know that is extremely far fetched, but it IS another explanation. 

    Oh man, you might have something going on there!

    I have another theory to build off of yours.

    I don't actually enjoy that much driving a poor car in Gran Turismo 5 for the first few hours, nor doing the tutorials meant for new players.

    I don't actually enjoy that much fighting with a crowbar and a pistol with 5 ammo in Half-Life for the first few hours, fighting little critters and learning how to play an FPS.

    I don't let that hinder my enjoyment for the rest of the game, as I know this is how games are developed - to let new players get used to the mechanics at the start of the game, regardless of how important you think you are that the game should just throw you all it has from the get-go since you are elite pro MMO gamer enough.

    ITT: MMORPG teaches new players how to play, veterans are butthurt.

     

    I did mention that I understood deliberately slow pacing in games, but apparently you missed that part. All I'm saying is that ARR does not make a great first impression due to the extremely slow pacing when it comes to introducing the player to the complexities of the game. 

  • DivonaDivona WellingtonPosts: 175Member
    Originally posted by simsalabim77
    Originally posted by Hyanmen
    Originally posted by simsalabim77

    I have a different theory. Hear me out, it's going to get a little crazy. 

    What if the player didn't actually enjoy pressing one button while doing mundane fetch/kill quests for the first several hours of the game? Now, I know that is extremely far fetched, but it IS another explanation. 

    Oh man, you might have something going on there!

    I have another theory to build off of yours.

    I don't actually enjoy that much driving a poor car in Gran Turismo 5 for the first few hours, nor doing the tutorials meant for new players.

    I don't actually enjoy that much fighting with a crowbar and a pistol with 5 ammo in Half-Life for the first few hours, fighting little critters and learning how to play an FPS.

    I don't let that hinder my enjoyment for the rest of the game, as I know this is how games are developed - to let new players get used to the mechanics at the start of the game, regardless of how important you think you are that the game should just throw you all it has from the get-go since you are elite pro MMO gamer enough.

    ITT: MMORPG teaches new players how to play, veterans are butthurt.

     

    I did mention that I understood deliberately slow pacing in games, but apparently you missed that part. All I'm saying is that ARR does not make a great first impression due to the extremely slow pacing when it comes to introducing the player to the complexities of the game. 

    I find FF XIV:ARR does better at introducing player to the complexities of the game than EVE Online. When they decided to introducing the player to the complexities of the game at fast pace, it tend to ended in overwhelming of information overload.

  • CymdaiCymdai Raleigh, NCPosts: 1,083Member

    Unfortunately, no. Combat never really gets better, as far as I've seen. 

    It's unfortunate because the producer apparently believes leveling should be a tutorial, whereas end-game content is where the challenge should arrive. It's a bit puzzling how they forgot about 49 levels worth of grinding being boring, though.

    Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...

  • SephirosoSephiroso Marietta, GAPosts: 1,160Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Cymdai

    Unfortunately, no. Combat never really gets better, as far as I've seen. 

    It's unfortunate because the producer apparently believes leveling should be a tutorial, whereas end-game content is where the challenge should arrive. It's a bit puzzling how they forgot about 49 levels worth of grinding being boring, though.

    Just another case of fail-wow-clone from the sounds of it. Make endgame the meat of the game, but forget WoW is super fast and easy to level to max so you can jump right into the end game, thus fail wow-clone.

    image
    Be the Ultimate Ninja! Play Billy Vs. SNAKEMAN today!

  • MuruganMurugan D, COPosts: 1,494Member
    Originally posted by Cymdai

    Unfortunately, no. Combat never really gets better, as far as I've seen. 

    It's unfortunate because the producer apparently believes leveling should be a tutorial, whereas end-game content is where the challenge should arrive. It's a bit puzzling how they forgot about 49 levels worth of grinding being boring, though.

    Yeah an RPG with progressing difficulty.  RIDICULOUS!  UNHEARD OF!

     

    Who is this mad producer with his zany theories that end game should be more challenging than low level content, which itself should increase in difficulty as a player levels up?

     

    I understand that some people are tired of the old "same old, blech garbage trash MMORPG's" they feverishly hate so much but this is actually fairly typical of them.  I guess we'll see if there is still a market for it.  Or if it is just an outdated concept everyone agrees is boring.

     

    Boring grind?  There is quite a bit of content you are calling grind.  Is it because it is so easy all you have to do is press 1111111111111?  Because a lot of people I guess are struggling with that concept since they don't always beat the first major solo encounter (main story level 15), and people wipe/die at dungeons regularly even though they aren't "as difficult as endgame".

     

    Do you really expect endgame from level 1?  Is that your ideal MMO?  Good luck with that, but usually in these games there is a learning curve not a flat line, to me that is not an RPG at all.

  • XatshXatsh Columbia, TNPosts: 126Member Uncommon

    For trash mobs yea you can get away with spaming 1 button on either mage class honestly. Just like in WoW, Tera, Aion, GW2, and so on and so on you can spam 1 ability and win vs trash mobs. Trash mobs are simply that... trash mobs.

     

    ON Thm/Blm at 50

    you have multiple thunder spells (which all have a 5% chance per dmg tick to trigger an ability that allows you to instacast thunder 3 for about 600-700 dmg with no mp, dot dmg is also around 240-260 per tick with all 3 on, pretty high)

    You have 3 tiers of fire. Fire 1 has a chance to make fire 3 insta cast and cost no mp. Fire 2 is AOE.

    Flare is a high dmg aoe which cost all your remaining mp. (Dmg is not based on mp used... so 1 mp or 3k the damage is the same. Use when you are on fire attunement with low mp then use the ability to change to ice and quickly regen mp)

    You have blizzard (Heavy)

    Blizzard 2 (Aoe bind)

    Blizzard 3 (Moderate dmg and instant Tier 3 Ice buff) <= will make you regen your whole mp pool in 2 ticks basically

    You are using the buff that switches you between fire and ice. One massive mp regen but low dmg, one no mp regen and massive dmg.

    Combine that with dmg negating abilities, instant cast abilities, abilities from other classes that reduce enmity (Hate/threat) generation and increase dmg.

    If you are thm and not blm you have several other dmg increasing spells, healing/self buffs, and various other skills.

    So if you really want to maximize blm/thm at higher levels you honestly will probally use almost all the spells you learn from level 1 until 50 + some from other classes. So maby 20-24buttons or so.

    Conj is sorta the same, but quite not as involved. They are primarily designed to be healers after all. Have not personally done a whole lot of testing on whm though. The one job I didn't test in this last phase.

     

    The above goes for almost every job at higher levels the amount of actions you use continually gets higher and higher. Mnk cycles through 3-4 sets of combos more or less attacking from all different sides.

    Combine that with gear as you get higher that reduces the cooldowns and increases spell casting and the battle system gets much faster and much more involved.

  • CymdaiCymdai Raleigh, NCPosts: 1,083Member
    Originally posted by Murugan
    Originally posted by Cymdai

    Unfortunately, no. Combat never really gets better, as far as I've seen. 

    It's unfortunate because the producer apparently believes leveling should be a tutorial, whereas end-game content is where the challenge should arrive. It's a bit puzzling how they forgot about 49 levels worth of grinding being boring, though.

    Yeah an RPG with progressing difficulty.  RIDICULOUS!  UNHEARD OF!

     

    Who is this mad producer with his zany theories that end game should be more challenging than low level content, which itself should increase in difficulty as a player levels up?

     

    I understand that some people are tired of the old "same old, blech garbage trash MMORPG's" they feverishly hate so much but this is actually fairly typical of them.  I guess we'll see if there is still a market for it.  Or if it is just an outdated concept everyone agrees is boring.

    It's not progressive. That's the problem with it.

    It's literally "Here's the game. Force your way through it." and once you hit 50 ---> "End game? The game is just getting started!"

    A game should scale naturally. That's the point of progress. Level 10 should be harder than level 1, level 20 should be harder than level 10, etc and so forth. But you're essentially spamming the same few skills for 30 levels. I can't say 31-49 will be the same, but come on... what evidence is there to suggest it won't be more of the same?

    Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...

  • simsalabim77simsalabim77 Somewhere, CAPosts: 628Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Divona
    Originally posted by simsalabim77
    Originally posted by Hyanmen
    Originally posted by simsalabim77

    I have a different theory. Hear me out, it's going to get a little crazy. 

    What if the player didn't actually enjoy pressing one button while doing mundane fetch/kill quests for the first several hours of the game? Now, I know that is extremely far fetched, but it IS another explanation. 

    Oh man, you might have something going on there!

    I have another theory to build off of yours.

    I don't actually enjoy that much driving a poor car in Gran Turismo 5 for the first few hours, nor doing the tutorials meant for new players.

    I don't actually enjoy that much fighting with a crowbar and a pistol with 5 ammo in Half-Life for the first few hours, fighting little critters and learning how to play an FPS.

    I don't let that hinder my enjoyment for the rest of the game, as I know this is how games are developed - to let new players get used to the mechanics at the start of the game, regardless of how important you think you are that the game should just throw you all it has from the get-go since you are elite pro MMO gamer enough.

    ITT: MMORPG teaches new players how to play, veterans are butthurt.

     

    I did mention that I understood deliberately slow pacing in games, but apparently you missed that part. All I'm saying is that ARR does not make a great first impression due to the extremely slow pacing when it comes to introducing the player to the complexities of the game. 

    I find FF XIV:ARR does better at introducing player to the complexities of the game than EVE Online. When they decided to introducing the player to the complexities of the game at fast pace, it tend to ended in overwhelming of information overload.

     

    That's like comparing an apple to a cow. EVE and ARR are so far apart in terms of game design that they can't even be compared. 

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