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Okay, first off I dislike griefers as much as any other player.
What I do want is a well-designed AAA mmo title built today that gives us something similar to pre-trammel Ultima Online or Asheron's Call on the Darktide server back in the day. Where players who want to player kill another player risk a bounty on their head or turning red and not being given the luxury of being able to enter towns any longer.
Look at the mainstream mmo games today...
Warrior tough guy foolishly enters a higher level instant dungeon all alone and gets killed within seconds. So he goes and buys a CASH pay-to-win sword and armor and re-enters without leveling up or finding a buddy to help out. Dead again. Rinse and repeat 14 times. The guy is being utterly foolish and using no skill what so ever, no strategy in the constantly spamming the same hot bar spell/attack button over and over.
There is really no way he can survive this instanced dungeon alone unless he levels up or gets help because there really is no skill involved period. But he foolishly re-enters this instance 14 times in a row.
Where is the penalty for being stupid or making a mistake??
Most games today will give this goof ball some experience for failure as well. So eventually he will gain a level and by mashing the same hot bar button 100 times, he will WIN! YAY!
..But my question is Where is the self-satisfaction in THIS??
Not to mention, nobody wants to experience the world built for them anymore. Nobody reads the lore, the quests, or takes time to appreciate the attention to detail in the beautifully designed graphics, the flowing river, or the 100 foot waterfall in the distance. Nobody appreciates the puffy and realistic looking clouds. Its just this silly mentality to "WIN NOW, GET GET GET ME ME ME MORE MORE MORE"
I just don't get it. I haven't understood this for years.
Lets take a popular multi-player game on the consoles to compare. With the consoles, at least people are playing online shooter games and using real skill and fast reflexes to try and out skill, out think, and out-wit other players to win. - I can get this and appreciate it.
So in comparison, where does any self satisfaction come from in these way too easy, never lose anything mmo games? Why even play if there is never a penalty (besides minor exp loss or time) for being stupid or making a dumb mistake?
See, real satisfaction comes from knowing you survived something that was actually a challenge. And with that comes other players. No matter how advanced they might make the AI of mobs in an mmo, it will never be anywhere close to what other players can present.
No death consequence games with no PvP can't possibly offer the racing heart excitement that came with games like Ultima Online back in the late 1990s. By comparison look at most WoW players today. They sit back in their big desk chair and are half asleep, bored to death just mashing the same hot bar keys over and over... Never any real excitment. Nothing to make anyone sweat, or to make their heart beat faster. How is this FUN?!?!
I'd love to have a real conversation and honesty from you players that say you hate PvP games. Have you EVER felt your heart race with excitement in a game without PvP? Yes I know some of these games offer PvP in zones, but even that is just who has the best gear and who mashes the hot bar buttons fastest. The fireballs hit the other player regardless of their movement. There is no way to really dodge, or out manuever the other player. It's stats vs stats, period. The outcome is already per-decided. The same two players fight 100 times, the same player will will 99 or 100 times out of 100 unless some stats change to change that outcome. There just is no skill involved, or sure, a little maybe. Something stupid low like 5% skill and 95% stat based outcomes. Hell rolling dice would be more entertaining because at least then you'd have some level of surprise.
Yes, the graphics are prettier in Rift then they are in Asheron's Call or Ultima Online. I get that! But the depth of the games now is like a front yard mud hole filled with rain water compared to the Pacific ocean when compared against mmo's from 15 years ago, the mmos that paved the way for all these pretty, shiny things we have today.
What's sadder is when anyone even suggests or says that hope a new AAA game offers some PvP with death consequence, that person instantly gets 100 people crying and screaming NOOOO!!! WAAAA!! - like it would be a crime to actually have an all new TRIPLE A MMO TITLE made today that gave us what pre-Trammel Ultima Online offered back in the day. It's like they just want yet another Rift, World of Warcraft, or other overly simple, overly streamlined for the masses mmo. Because the 500 of those now isn't enough. This is what baffles me even more. And if you don't believe what I say in this paragraph just take a look at the few threads where someone 'hoped' Everquest Next would offer some level of challenging PvP in the EQ Next forums.
Anyhow, just my two copper.