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AoW: A Great Example of Why Sandbox Titles Don't Work in the West

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  • LoktofeitLoktofeit Stone Mountain, GAPosts: 14,247Member Rare
    Originally posted by Slampig

    So, if sandbox games dropped tutorials then they would become huge hits in the west? What!?

    Don't try, man. This is the 2+2=5 thread of gamer logic. :/

    There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
    "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre

  • thetimesthetimes Roseville, MIPosts: 49Member
    Originally posted by terroni
    Originally posted by thetimes
    The only game that was not made like WoW. You want would pvp ok. You want guild wars ok. You what a game that takes a long time. You guys don't want that. You say you do. You want themepark.

    Not a dig at this person, but another good reason Wushu is failing to attract players. A large percentage of the population doesn't speak English, or as a second or third language.

    It's a poorly ported game with terrible customer support, half-implemented systems, and a botting problem unlike you have ever seen in any game ever...except maybe silkroad online.

    You might be the problem. You do not understand what I'm saying? Too much effort? What systems you talking about?

  • BrownAleBrownAle fantasyland, MEPosts: 399Member

    Its not a sandbox.  That, for one, may be the issue here.

     

  • CallinCallin Florence, SCPosts: 99Member

    Figured I would give this game a shot.

     

    Horrible Tutorial. Unimmersive game. I honestly could not tell you a thing I did in this game. Click the green name and auto run there. Auto Pick Up the Item, or click through the (to me) unresponsive combat. Auto Run back. All while being able to just surf Face Book or a few forums. 

     

    Trying to find anything on the UI was what finally did it in for me. Could not navigate the thing and find the different sections. The spam bots in the villages were horrible, but I guess thats the way it is in any game now a days. 

     

  • thetimesthetimes Roseville, MIPosts: 49Member
    Tutorial is boring. We knew that. How was script stealing? How was the crafting.

    What school did you join? Did you make it that far, or did you lose attention?
  • ArakaziArakazi OxfordPosts: 910Member Uncommon
    AoW is more sim than sanbox. Just my opinion though.
  • BurntvetBurntvet Baltimore, MDPosts: 3,258Member Uncommon
    On top of all the other problems, I was fairly offended by the cash shop / buy currency funneling, even when you had a VIP (subscription) acct. It's fine if they want to stick it to "free" players, but there was just way too much needed stuff in the cash shop (or else grind, forever and rent a mounts? Lol) even if you were already paying for a sub. Typical Snail mentality, I guess. Not a particularly good game, and much worse "for the money".
  • MidBossMidBoss Blank, WIPosts: 93Member

    This game really gives me a FF13 vibe, at least from it's fan base. 

     

    Just play for 14 more hours! It'll turn into the best game ever! you'll see!

    Yeah...no.

  • AzothAzoth montreal, QCPosts: 785Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by thetimes
    Tutorial is boring. We knew that. How was script stealing? How was the crafting.

    What school did you join? Did you make it that far, or did you lose attention?

    If a game can't keep the players attention for more than a couple hours it certainly has issues.

    You can spin it every way you want. The first hours of a game are the most important to make a judgement. It will decide if you will keep playing or not.

  • thetimesthetimes Roseville, MIPosts: 49Member
    Originally posted by Azoth
    Originally posted by thetimes
    Tutorial is boring. We knew that. How was script stealing? How was the crafting.

    What school did you join? Did you make it that far, or did you lose attention?

    If a game can't keep the players attention for more than a couple hours it certainly has issues.

    You can spin it every way you want. The first hours of a game are the most important to make a judgement. It will decide if you will keep playing or not.

    I don't need fast food. I need something I can eat for years. Been eating fast food mmorpgs for years.

     

     

    First 3-4 Hours is turotial lots of quest. After that no more quest. All other games you keep questing. If you can't pay attention for 3-4 hours, your loss.

  • terroniterroni Ya, INPosts: 935Member
    Originally posted by thetimes

     

    First 3-4 Hours is turotial lots of quest. After that no more quest. All other games you keep questing. If you can't pay attention for 3-4 hours, your loss.

    So you don't do spy missions (quests)

    You don't school patrol (quest)

    You don't run instances/faction/dungeons?

    What about your daily crafting bejeweled?

    Quest for arrays, quest for inner skills?

    What do you do exactly?

    Drop the next-gen marketing and people will argue if the game itself has merit.

  • akiira69akiira69 San Diego, CAPosts: 590Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by fat_taddler

    I just started playing AoW and absolutely love the game so far.   For the first time since the launch of SWG back in 2003,  I have "that feeling" of immersion and wonder that I've been missing for all of these years.  

     

    What I also realized during my initial few hours in the game and from reading many forum posts, is that most of the current crop of MMO players have not and probably will not make it through the tutorial aspects of this game.   

     

    This is a real shame because there is a ton of potential in this game but it seems that most will never get to see it because the tutorial is "boring." 

     

    We see so many people on these forums clamoring for sandbox titles yet there is barely any support for this title.   Why not?   If you are so desperately seeking a sandbox experience, here's a great title to try.   The best part is that it's free, you just need to invest some time and patience to learn the game. 

     

    Unfortunately,  I think a lot of players enjoy the idea of a sandbox style game but so far it seems that most can't or won't even play one. 

     

     

    I love how people like the OP speak as if their opinion is gospel fact. Keep thinking your opinion is shared by everyone maybe one day it will be true.

    "Possibly we humans can exist without actually having to fight. But many of us have chosen to fight. For what reason? To protect something? Protect what? Ourselves? The future? If we kill people to protect ourselves and this future, then what sort of future is it, and what will we have become? There is no future for those who have died. And what of those who did the killing? Is happiness to be found in a future that is grasped with blood stained hands? Is that the truth?"

  • STYNKFYSTSTYNKFYST Sacramento, CAPosts: 290Member
    Originally posted by akiira69
    Originally posted by fat_taddler

    I just started playing AoW and absolutely love the game so far.   For the first time since the launch of SWG back in 2003,  I have "that feeling" of immersion and wonder that I've been missing for all of these years.  

     

    What I also realized during my initial few hours in the game and from reading many forum posts, is that most of the current crop of MMO players have not and probably will not make it through the tutorial aspects of this game.   

     

    This is a real shame because there is a ton of potential in this game but it seems that most will never get to see it because the tutorial is "boring." 

     

    We see so many people on these forums clamoring for sandbox titles yet there is barely any support for this title.   Why not?   If you are so desperately seeking a sandbox experience, here's a great title to try.   The best part is that it's free, you just need to invest some time and patience to learn the game. 

     

    Unfortunately,  I think a lot of players enjoy the idea of a sandbox style game but so far it seems that most can't or won't even play one. 

     

     

    I love how people like the OP speak as if their opinion is gospel fact. Keep thinking your opinion is shared by everyone maybe one day it will be true.

    If your opinion isn't gospel to you...why would you have one? Why would you post it? Seems to me it's just the OP's opinion for you to read...not fact that they are speaking in truths.

  • GrailerGrailer Posts: 891Member Uncommon
    AoW does appear to be a sandbox  and it's just plain horrible ,but I guess if you are into kung fu games 
  • GandoresGandores Lachine, QCPosts: 55Member Uncommon

    Age of wushu seems to be a game of extremes and polarize ppl as such. Don't listen to the guys

    that says lol button-mashing, lol quest-hubs auto-pathing, they really have no clue  and as Almareth said, they obviously dont play the game. 

    Nor is it a game only for elites!

     

    - Terrific pvp but terrible pve

    - Levels yet no levels

    - There are classes but you can learn every other school skill (even if you can't max them, they still very useful)

    - Vertical progression and horizontal also

    - Immersive world yet immersion breaking quests and dialogs.

    - Strangely well-balanced pvp :O 

    - Awesome and innovative features but such a poor western port

    - Cash shop yet  lively player driven economy

    - Tab target but extremely skill-based (after a while, good plays can overcome huge power gaps)

    - Cash shop yet extremely skill-based xD

    - Can be f2p/p2w or simply p2p (v.i.p. and slowly lvl up, most ppl do this i think and you will become quite strong)

    - Can be played either hardcore or casual, fun to be had everywhere if you look (just dont quest)

    - Sandboxy yet themeparkish

     

    A very unique game, not ur typical asian grinder by any means.  AoW biggest problems stems from the fact thats its a pvp game about kung fu with not-so serious politics, and for ur 1st real fight, pits you against 2 badly animated wild dogs -.- and explains itself amidst bouts of semi-comprehensible text.  What a bad tutorial.. and this thread stands as a testament to the importance of the 1st impression.

  • GandoresGandores Lachine, QCPosts: 55Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by terroni
    Originally posted by thetimes

     

    First 3-4 Hours is turotial lots of quest. After that no more quest. All other games you keep questing. If you can't pay attention for 3-4 hours, your loss.

    So you don't do spy missions (quests)

    You don't school patrol (quest)

    You don't run instances/faction/dungeons?

    What about your daily crafting bejeweled?

    Quest for arrays, quest for inner skills?

    What do you do exactly?

     I do

    - My daily spy quest (pvp, sometimes fun sometimes boring)                                    

    - i run instances, dungeons

    - i quest for inners and stuff

    - i craft (farm, manufacture, sell)

    - i duel/arena

    - i farm mini instances

    - i do battlegrounds

    - i script steal

    - i do school wars

    - i do guild wars

    - i do pvp guild roams agaisnt enemies

    - i do solo batman hunts agaisnt enemies

    - i just do the tourist sometimes

    - i run escorts

    - i help guildies (especially when they get attacked during escorts)

    - i sometimes get drunk and make a nuisance of myself (bit of trolling during spy quests never hurt anyone)

    - tp

    - hell i even get an itch and just plain quest sometimes

     

    i dont 

    - do my daily bejeweled

    - pointlessly murder

    - rob escort

    - patrol

    - protect scripts

    - do random/miracle encounters

    - play the market

    - beg and spit booze on ppl

    - scam

     

    on WoW i : 

    - duel/arena

    - daily quests (pve, always boring)

    - Battlegrounds

    - Raid/instance

    - Craft (much less)

    - quest (only when lvling up)

    Thats it :/

  • jesadjesad Posts: 844Member Uncommon

    Not going to read through 17 pages of BS in order to chime in and agree with the OP.  Age of Wushu is one of the most crazy deep, eat your life, innovative games I've ever played, and you don't have to have internet radio playing in the background to keep you interested.  At the same time it is fairly easy to get in there, even with the current localization, and learn what you need to learn to get started.

    But oh boy the freaking tears that are being cried at the first concept of a real life gritty emmersive MMO that everyone can't just get in and grind to the top and beat.  Sure, that game is there, but there is SOOOOOOO much more going on too, and you just can have what you want today.

    The slurs range from racist to full on BS, complaining about the interface, complaining about the game mechanics, complaining about the localization, complaining because there are no white people HAHA (and that one is a real lark because for YEARS I have been complaining about the lack of black people in a lot of titles and getting told that I am the racist, hows that shit feel now?)  I even read a guy complaining because he couldn't just log into the game and catch up with all the veterans who had been playing for weeks and/or months ahead of him.

    It's like the sound of the lamentation of the women that the guy in Conan talked about.

    Meanwhile I'm over here dissecting this like like a toad in 6th grade.  I'm trying to figure out why some factions respect me and some, like my own school, dislike me.  I'm trying to figure out how to continue eating without selling out and rolling an alt that can cook.  I want the good food, damn that bun!  I'm trying to work out what penalty I'm really going to have to pay for hanging out with people from the moral schools.  How to make this one chick like me, and if it's even worth it.

    I gotta spy as much as I can, patrol as much as I can, and basically blow the master of the school so I can get my interals right when they become available.  I gotta get my meridans straight.  I gotta get my weapon right.  Gotta upgrade my armor, figure out how to make this freaking ingredient they say I need.

    Sick, sick, sick, like EQ was sick, and guess what?  I didn't understand a lot of what was going on the first time I went into THAT game either.

    What we are seeing is the ultimate calling of all of the bluffs of the majority of loudmouths on this site.  A real, innovative, sandboxy, themparkie, live your life in the game peice of work, and all you can hear now are the excuses of why all of these so called MMO gamers aren't going to play.

    Bottom line is that anyone who complains about this game, and doesn't delete the complaint soon after so that no one can pull it up in their history, pretty much doesn't have a right to complain about MMORPG's anymore because this game has just about everything in it I've ever seen put into an MMORPG.

    And I do not work for sorry assed Snail, and I do not work for whoever programmed the thing.  I'm just some dude just like the rest of you, who wants to play with my electric dolls.....oh I'm sorry, action figures.

    image
  • DeathsdollDeathsdoll Beltsville, MDPosts: 3Member Uncommon

     Have been playing games for many years and at 1st I liked this game sandbox no but, you could see there was something there. If u read even some of the post there is not just 1 thing about this game that killed it in there mind but a few.

     

     Im not going to post a long reason this game is not working it has all been said and from the very people they want to play there game. But for me and here it is... There was at the time I played it " NO Helpline Phone Number"  I could find, that alone should have sent up a red flag but I kept playing sucked in and all. The straw was the more I played the less I could? 

     

     Everything is Limited everything!!! Ohh pay for V.I.P did that lol you don't feel v.i.p at all just a tiny bit less limited but still. I get that ftp is not ftp what is free today. So I don't mind putting a bit of money in they have to eat to. I could add a few thing but as I said above already done.

    "Opinions Are Like Azz Holes, Everyone Has One and Some Peoples are One"...

    DeathsDoll

  • STYNKFYSTSTYNKFYST Sacramento, CAPosts: 290Member

    " Everything is Limited everything!!!"

    Is why not to....Only reason I need. Then I see more.....but don't need to beat the dead horse

  • MalviousMalvious Knoxville, TNPosts: 206Member Uncommon
    You know i am probably going to offend a lot of people saying this, but hey who cares right this is the internet. : today's mmo players are just to dumb to play sandbox games.

    Fine, we'll compromise. I'll get my way & you'll find a way to be okay with that.

  • AzothAzoth montreal, QCPosts: 785Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by thetimes
    Originally posted by Azoth
    Originally posted by thetimes
    Tutorial is boring. We knew that. How was script stealing? How was the crafting.

    What school did you join? Did you make it that far, or did you lose attention?

    If a game can't keep the players attention for more than a couple hours it certainly has issues.

    You can spin it every way you want. The first hours of a game are the most important to make a judgement. It will decide if you will keep playing or not.

    I don't need fast food. I need something I can eat for years. Been eating fast food mmorpgs for years.

     

     

    First 3-4 Hours is turotial lots of quest. After that no more quest. All other games you keep questing. If you can't pay attention for 3-4 hours, your loss.

    Who said anything about fast food ? I don't need to wait for the desert to enjoy a 6 services diner. The entrée must be good also, or it's a bad meal.

    I never said I want to be done with the game or have experienced everything in the first hour. Just saying it have to be fun and engaging from the start.

     

  • rodingorodingo Posts: 2,531Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Azoth
     

    Who said anything about fast food ? I don't need to wait for the desert to enjoy a 6 services diner. The entrée must be good also, or it's a bad meal.

    I never said I want to be done with the game or have experienced everything in the first hour. Just saying it have to be fun and engaging from the start.

     

    Shssssshhhhh,... "fun" is a buzz word that doesn't go over to well by some forum posters.

    "If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor

  • bcbullybcbully Westland, MIPosts: 8,706Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by rodingo
    Originally posted by Azoth
     

    Who said anything about fast food ? I don't need to wait for the desert to enjoy a 6 services diner. The entrée must be good also, or it's a bad meal.

    I never said I want to be done with the game or have experienced everything in the first hour. Just saying it have to be fun and engaging from the start.

     

    Shssssshhhhh,... "fun" is a buzz word that doesn't go over to well by some forum posters.

    lol The game has a soul. Full of ups and downs. Good times and bad times abound through gameplay. 

     

    She's a real lady, not some over made up gold digger image

  • jesadjesad Posts: 844Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by bcbully
    Originally posted by rodingo
    Originally posted by Azoth
     

    Who said anything about fast food ? I don't need to wait for the desert to enjoy a 6 services diner. The entrée must be good also, or it's a bad meal.

    I never said I want to be done with the game or have experienced everything in the first hour. Just saying it have to be fun and engaging from the start.

     

    Shssssshhhhh,... "fun" is a buzz word that doesn't go over to well by some forum posters.

    lol The game has a soul. Full of ups and downs. Good times and bad times abound through gameplay. 

     

    She's a real lady, not some over made up gold digger image

    Well she's all you'd ever want,
    She's the kind they'd like to flaunt and take to dinner.
    Well she always knows her place.
    She's got style, she's got grace, She's a winner.
    She's a Lady. Whoa whoa whoa, She's a Lady.
    Talkin' about that little lady, and the lady is mines!!!

    image
  • Temp1234Temp1234 Montreal, QCPosts: 43Member

                The reason why this wont last in the west is not because its a sandbox, its because its infested with bots and hacking. The game itself is amazing but it currently suffers from kidnap/gathering/script event/spy/sect master voting bots. 

                As for hacking, we have infinite rage/speed/lag/cooldown and flight energy hacks. All these have been present since launch but have become very blatant as of late due to the massive drop in population. People dont even bother hiding it anymore, school position fights are essentially just rage spam right from the get go.

               I sincerly hope that Age of Wulin learns from Snails mistakes and at least tries to control these practices to an extent, because all the griefers/hackers will probably be moving over to Age of Wulin and wont be staying with the US version. Even though it means i wont be able to play the EU version, i hope they implement IP restrictions so the game survives. (not meant to be insulting, it is what it is.) I for one am done with Snail, it was fun while it lasted :( .

     

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