Originally posted by Mtibbs1989 Ugh, I'm definitely not for almost completely solo able gameplay. That just screams me sitting at my computer playing the game by myself. Why do developers make these games so easy? Why must all of the hardest content be locked away at the end of the game? That article definitely makes me turn away from ESO as a potential purchase for me as it screams easy for veteran MMO players. Thanks for the unwelcoming post
Well, this comes from a person whom thinks that "easy" and "hard" only differ from one another depending on the enemy's healthbar and damage. I'm going to guess that it is due to WoW's system. So I'll compare TESO and WoW for you.
WoW is a hotbar focused combat MMO, where you almost constantly have five skills on cooldown at any given combat scenario. Since the only difficult obstacle is to follow a hotbar skill pattern that is more effective than your opponent, the only real difficulty comes from the amount of HP and Damage the mob has.
TESO on the other hand has action oriented combat, and most people whom have played it have agreed that it is quite tricky to kill mobs straight away. Often if you get two or three mobs on you, you can't juggle them at the same time. Hence instead of learning a hotbar pattern you react realtime to their actions by blocking and/or using power attacks including some of your skills you might have acquired. The AI defines the difficulty in TESO, not the healthbar/damage of the mob.
Most MMO's are soloable. About 90% of all the content can be done solo in any given MMO.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Originally posted by Kyleran I dunno, since I pretty much don't like the way modem "MMOS" are designed, perhaps a game that isn't much like them will be an improvement.
Truthfully I don't want to group with the average rush, rush, min-maxing gamer that seems to dominate the player base today.
So a mostly solid solo experience with options to group with friends is probably OK.
I couldn't agree with you more
When I first read that Zenimax quote, my heart sank a little. Not sure why though....but then I realized that I had already created an expectation. And well seeds of expectation lead to resentment!! Thats not the best way to be, so I'm just gonna enjoy what comes from TESO, and hope it keeps me interested. Leaving wow after 8 years subbing so I might just need to avoid rush rush loot loot.
All I have to say is context. Take a few words out of any conversation and you can make anyone say just about anything. Step back and think about this.
1. Many instanced and open world dungeons for 5 man teams
2. Public Quests that are for large number of players.
3. Phased events for end game that will require large number of players working together to get done.
4. AvA designed for large scale battles to get large objectives done.
Most MMOs have lots of solo content. Leveling to top level is 60-80% of the content. This is not a normal MMO where raiding will be a staple but this is still filled with tones of play with your friends content.
Yeah instanced pve (4 man) group dungeons, 24 player group pve content, persistent pve world with thousands of other players and 2k player pvp battleground.
How is that not an MMO? Or is it just PR speak because they fear the word MMO will put off a lot of the tes fans that have never played one before? I vote the latter tbh
I really don't get this dev philosophy.... We're going to make mmorpg but we'll take out few most important parts of the mmorpgs and we'll adjust the game so it fits solo-RPG gamers a little bit more.
The question which pops up is, "why the hell would you want to make mmorpg if you'll focus on solo play and call it "multiplayer-rpg"!?"
"Happiness is not a destination. It is a method of life." -------------------------------
Originally posted by Kyleran I dunno, since I pretty much don't like the way modem "MMOS" are designed, perhaps a game that isn't much like them will be an improvement.
Truthfully I don't want to group with the average rush, rush, min-maxing gamer that seems to dominate the player base today.
So a mostly solid solo experience with options to group with friends is probably OK.
Agree with Kyleran on this. I am tired of grouping and especially being forced to group with ADHD pubescents that have have no patience or communication skills.
There is going to be a feature that is going to be a little forum,so to speak, that you fill out, about your play style(s) preferences. And then the Game/server will put you on a shard with people of like mindedness.
So If you prefer solo play more than likely you will be put into a shard with soloers..so ya wont be bothered. And same goes if you prefer playing with people/ socializing.
We all need to get past the "OMG you can solo to the endgame" attitude and realize that games and especially online games need to cater to a WIDE variety of players/play styles, AND especially with a Elder Scrolls game that is an MMO. So they have 3 crowds to make a game for. ES fans, MMO fans, and ES/MMO fans.
Oh the big one for me, My buddy is excited and so am I. We both love ES games and MMOs. So if TESO is at least fun, engaging and allows us to have fun as friends. We could care less about certain features added,not in,etc etc. The fact they are focusing on Exploration, character/Class customization, and minimal UI is the BIGGEST one for us. Studios/Devs spend all this time making these awesome,beautiful world to explore only to be cluttered by a bunch of krap on the screen.
There is going to be a feature that is going to be a little forum,so to speak, that you fill out, about your play style(s) preferences. And then the Game/server will put you on a shard with people of like mindedness.
So If you prefer solo play more than likely you will be put into a shard with soloers..so ya wont be bothered. And some goes if you prefer playing with people/ socializing.
We all need to get past the "OMG you can solo to the endgame" attitude and realize that games and especially online games need to cater to a WIDE variety of players/play styles, AND especially with a Elder Scrolls game that is an MMO. So they have 3 crowds to make a game for. ES fans, MMO fans, and ES/MMO fans.
Oh the big one for me, My buddy is excited and so am I. We both love ES games and MMOs. So if TESO is at least fun, engaging and allows us to have fun as friends. We could care less about certain features add,not in,etc etc. The fact they are focusing on Exploration, character/Class customization, and minimal UI is the BIGGEST one for us. Studios/Devs spend all this time making these awesome,beautiful world to explore only to be cluttered by a bunch of krap on the screen.
+1 this is exactly how my Skyrim playing friends feel.
I really don't get this dev philosophy.... We're going to make mmorpg but we'll take out few most important parts of the mmorpgs and we'll adjust the game so it fits solo-RPG gamers a little bit more.
The question which pops up is, "why the hell would you want to make mmorpg if you'll focus on solo play and call it "multiplayer-rpg"!?"
Being forced to group with annoying people isn't my thing, I would like to do other stuff ingame too except sitting in some main city spamming their chat "LFG" every 10 secs like you ppl do.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
I really don't get this dev philosophy.... We're going to make mmorpg but we'll take out few most important parts of the mmorpgs and we'll adjust the game so it fits solo-RPG gamers a little bit more.
The question which pops up is, "why the hell would you want to make mmorpg if you'll focus on solo play and call it "multiplayer-rpg"!?"
Being forced to group with annoying people isn't my thing, I would like to do other stuff ingame too except sitting in some main city spamming their chat "LFG" every 10 secs like you ppl do.
Grouping with strangers is hardly ever as much fun as grouping with your buddy you've known since preschool. But sometimes, like when you go into Cyrodiil it'l be a better option than the alternative. And just maybe you might meet someone new that you actually like...you never know.
Of course, another option is to never go to Cyrodiil.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
If it has a persistent, shared world that thousands of players can play in, regardless of whether they are there all at the same time, and the character development follows some of the RPG staples, then it's an MMORPG.
All it really needs to be an MMO is for the thousands of people to be able to play together in some sort of shared world. The world doesn't need to be persistent.
Everything else is a matter of taste. There is no "false" MMORPG, only MMORPGs with different features.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
Grouping with strangers is hardly ever as much fun as grouping with your buddy you've known since preschool. But sometimes, like when you go into Cyrodiil it'l be a better option than the alternative. And just maybe you might meet someone new that you actually like...you never know.
Of course, another option is to never go to Cyrodiil.
I like to have a choice in a game, if I want to play that lone wanderer, or hunter in the woods or the guy that needs others to succeed, I would like to have that choice.
Many games do not give that choice, you can only play the game 10%, if you want to go any further you are forced to group up every minute that follows. Devs should give that freedom, many do not as they are all stuck in the "MMO need to be based on the grouphugging principle" that they use for their themeparks.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
Grouping with strangers is hardly ever as much fun as grouping with your buddy you've known since preschool. But sometimes, like when you go into Cyrodiil it'l be a better option than the alternative. And just maybe you might meet someone new that you actually like...you never know.
Of course, another option is to never go to Cyrodiil.
I like to have a choice in a game, if I want to play that lone wanderer, or hunter in the woods or the guy that needs others to succeed, I would like to have that choice.
Many games do not give that choice, you can only play the game 10%, if you want to go any further you are forced to group up every minute that follows. Devs should give that freedom, many do not as they are all stuck in the "MMO need to be based on the grouphugging principle" that they use for their themeparks.
I'd say ESO will give you that option much more than most.
But what the rest of the social world doesn't enjoy is hearing lone wolves complain about not being able to do 100%
Some shit is for groups...we like it that way.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
At least we know what to expect from this single player co-op game. So this means the game will be B2P a la GW2? No way I will pay a monthly sub after reading that article.
Originally posted by IridescentOrk At least we know what to expect from this single player co-op game. So this means the game will be B2P a la GW2? No way I will pay a monthly sub after reading that article.
First, they haven't announced the payment model. Second, you already said you weren't playing on 5/27. Does this mean you might play afterall...which I know you will be anyway? lol
Originally posted by Mtibbs1989 Ugh, I'm definitely not for almost completely solo able gameplay. That just screams me sitting at my computer playing the game by myself. Why do developers make these games so easy? Why must all of the hardest content be locked away at the end of the game? That article definitely makes me turn away from ESO as a potential purchase for me as it screams easy for veteran MMO players. Thanks for the unwelcoming post
I agree, this will be interesting how it plays out.
....Being Banned from MMORPG's forums since 2010, for Trolling the Trolls!!!
The interview with Matt Firor left me with the impression that most group dungeons can be soloable and that choosing to go their with your alies is mostly to make things faster and easier? If that is true then I suppose that content oriented for pve groups is mostly the adventure zones (I believe public dungeons are for pvp content in Cyrodiil).
Comments
Well, this comes from a person whom thinks that "easy" and "hard" only differ from one another depending on the enemy's healthbar and damage. I'm going to guess that it is due to WoW's system. So I'll compare TESO and WoW for you.
WoW is a hotbar focused combat MMO, where you almost constantly have five skills on cooldown at any given combat scenario. Since the only difficult obstacle is to follow a hotbar skill pattern that is more effective than your opponent, the only real difficulty comes from the amount of HP and Damage the mob has.
TESO on the other hand has action oriented combat, and most people whom have played it have agreed that it is quite tricky to kill mobs straight away. Often if you get two or three mobs on you, you can't juggle them at the same time. Hence instead of learning a hotbar pattern you react realtime to their actions by blocking and/or using power attacks including some of your skills you might have acquired. The AI defines the difficulty in TESO, not the healthbar/damage of the mob.
Most MMO's are soloable. About 90% of all the content can be done solo in any given MMO.
Smart tricky move by zenimax try getting the zealot fanboi's like me in there game.
Well zenimax this ain't gonne do it for me your way to much themepark limited freedom mmo still for me.
Sandbox, total freedom and im in OK:)
Truthfully I don't want to group with the average rush, rush, min-maxing gamer that seems to dominate the player base today.
So a mostly solid solo experience with options to group with friends is probably OK.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I couldn't agree with you more
When I first read that Zenimax quote, my heart sank a little. Not sure why though....but then I realized that I had already created an expectation. And well seeds of expectation lead to resentment!! Thats not the best way to be, so I'm just gonna enjoy what comes from TESO, and hope it keeps me interested. Leaving wow after 8 years subbing so I might just need to avoid rush rush loot loot.
If you watch this video, they start out saying it's an MMORPG......
http://www.gametrailers.com/videos/mzrc2w/the-elder-scrolls-online-bringing-the-scrolls-to-mmo
All I have to say is context. Take a few words out of any conversation and you can make anyone say just about anything. Step back and think about this.
1. Many instanced and open world dungeons for 5 man teams
2. Public Quests that are for large number of players.
3. Phased events for end game that will require large number of players working together to get done.
4. AvA designed for large scale battles to get large objectives done.
Most MMOs have lots of solo content. Leveling to top level is 60-80% of the content. This is not a normal MMO where raiding will be a staple but this is still filled with tones of play with your friends content.
Yeah instanced pve (4 man) group dungeons, 24 player group pve content, persistent pve world with thousands of other players and 2k player pvp battleground.
How is that not an MMO? Or is it just PR speak because they fear the word MMO will put off a lot of the tes fans that have never played one before? I vote the latter tbh
Stop trolling or provide a source or a reason why they would lie.
There Is Always Hope!
You have more patience than me lol.
There Is Always Hope!
I really don't get this dev philosophy.... We're going to make mmorpg but we'll take out few most important parts of the mmorpgs and we'll adjust the game so it fits solo-RPG gamers a little bit more.
The question which pops up is, "why the hell would you want to make mmorpg if you'll focus on solo play and call it "multiplayer-rpg"!?"
"Happiness is not a destination. It is a method of life."
-------------------------------
Agree with Kyleran on this. I am tired of grouping and especially being forced to group with ADHD pubescents that have have no patience or communication skills.
There is a medication for that now.
Lets see your Battle Stations /r/battlestations
Battle Station
Again if people would do more research.
There is going to be a feature that is going to be a little forum,so to speak, that you fill out, about your play style(s) preferences. And then the Game/server will put you on a shard with people of like mindedness.
So If you prefer solo play more than likely you will be put into a shard with soloers..so ya wont be bothered. And same goes if you prefer playing with people/ socializing.
We all need to get past the "OMG you can solo to the endgame" attitude and realize that games and especially online games need to cater to a WIDE variety of players/play styles, AND especially with a Elder Scrolls game that is an MMO. So they have 3 crowds to make a game for. ES fans, MMO fans, and ES/MMO fans.
Oh the big one for me, My buddy is excited and so am I. We both love ES games and MMOs. So if TESO is at least fun, engaging and allows us to have fun as friends. We could care less about certain features added,not in,etc etc. The fact they are focusing on Exploration, character/Class customization, and minimal UI is the BIGGEST one for us. Studios/Devs spend all this time making these awesome,beautiful world to explore only to be cluttered by a bunch of krap on the screen.
+1 this is exactly how my Skyrim playing friends feel.
There Is Always Hope!
Being forced to group with annoying people isn't my thing, I would like to do other stuff ingame too except sitting in some main city spamming their chat "LFG" every 10 secs like you ppl do.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
Grouping with strangers is hardly ever as much fun as grouping with your buddy you've known since preschool. But sometimes, like when you go into Cyrodiil it'l be a better option than the alternative. And just maybe you might meet someone new that you actually like...you never know.
Of course, another option is to never go to Cyrodiil.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
If it has a persistent, shared world that thousands of players can play in, regardless of whether they are there all at the same time, and the character development follows some of the RPG staples, then it's an MMORPG.
All it really needs to be an MMO is for the thousands of people to be able to play together in some sort of shared world. The world doesn't need to be persistent.
Everything else is a matter of taste. There is no "false" MMORPG, only MMORPGs with different features.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
I like to have a choice in a game, if I want to play that lone wanderer, or hunter in the woods or the guy that needs others to succeed, I would like to have that choice.
Many games do not give that choice, you can only play the game 10%, if you want to go any further you are forced to group up every minute that follows. Devs should give that freedom, many do not as they are all stuck in the "MMO need to be based on the grouphugging principle" that they use for their themeparks.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
I'd say ESO will give you that option much more than most.
But what the rest of the social world doesn't enjoy is hearing lone wolves complain about not being able to do 100%
Some shit is for groups...we like it that way.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
gameplay > graphics
First, they haven't announced the payment model. Second, you already said you weren't playing on 5/27. Does this mean you might play afterall...which I know you will be anyway? lol
There Is Always Hope!
I agree, this will be interesting how it plays out.
....Being Banned from MMORPG's forums since 2010, for Trolling the Trolls!!!